The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: ExurbanKevin on August 11, 2014, 11:04:20 AM
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We just moved to Missouri, so we drove the family in my wife's car into St. Louis yesterday to look at the Arch and Mississippi. I'd heard about the shooting in Ferguson on the news, but didn't think that it'd boil over into anything big.
Whoops (http://www.lawofficer.com/article/news/looting-and-arson-st-louis-sub).
We didn't hear any sirens or see any smoke, but as I found out this morning, a full-on riot was happening 20 minutes away from where my family and I were yesterday.
Because I had my Shield with me (along with a bunch of pointy-stabby things), I had to wait outside of the visitor's center while my wife took the boys inside. This was a pain at the time and something my youngest didn't fully understand, but in retrospect, the pain was worth it.
To make matters worse, my "get home" bag and trunk gun (a Kel-Tec SU-16C) were in the trunk. The trunk of MY car back home, 100 miles away, not in the trunk of my wife's car. Might as well have been in Arizona for all the good they did me there.
Next time, I'll do more intel work before heading into the big city and make sure I have something more than a subcompact 9mm with me. Lesson learned.
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Glad you are okay, Kevin. Haven't really seen the news this weekend and was only vaguely aware of something going on in SL.
I've put off assembling Bugout or GetHome bags, but the wife has been insisting lately we be better prepared. Both to stay here and to bugout. But sometimes we forget about the "get home" aspect.
I was planning on two bags, short term emergency, and long term. I think the short term bag should go with us when we travel. Eh?
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Thanks Alf. I highly recommend you build one. I've got a 3 Day Bag in the back of my car along with the rifle, and I was test-driving a
man-purse ummn, messenger bag :D option yesterday for friend's "prepping" website that allowed me to have such things as a bigger knife, an Israeli bandage, first-aid kit and a bottle of water in the park. Glad I didn't have to put it to the test!
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Hi;
I have a BOB in a backpack set up (31 lbs ), and then I have a Bug Out Camping Bag ( 36 lbs )set up ready to go. It is for a 3 day away from home if needed items.
For the guy with kids, depending on thier ages, getting a BOB set up for them is a semi annual repack and inventory of thier items in the bag.
I expect to stay at a local motel if SHTF for a day or 2 - but anything after that is reassesed daily. Normally, flooding to keep me from the house only lasts 1-2 days.
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Setup the tread mill in the basement and the wife is walking every night. I reload or tinker on my guns in the other room. I've relayed Kevin's adventure in STL to her, so when she finishes walking she comes over and asks to see the ammo supply.
Now I've generally got 500-1000 rounds in every major caliber I own. After surveying my stock she says, ... (wait for it) ... (wait for it) ... (wait for it) ... "WE NEED MORE!"
Yes! Yes! W I N N E R
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May help explain why SHE got the Cabela's flyer . ;D
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Poor Alf..or any man who ends up with a wife who is never satisfied.
;D ;D ;D ;D
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some ideas for a vehicle carry kit... I have a 72+ hour remain overnight kit in the SUV, but when I travel out of town include a Jansport bag that holds a G17 with TLR-1, extra mag, and Surefire 6P with a LED upgrade to 650lumens... in the external pouch a few trauma supplies... 4" Israeli bandage, SOF tourniquet, QuickClot sponge, Kerlix gauze, petroleum gauze, irrigation syringe, tape,gloves
(http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz180/LesSnyder/DSC00446_zps709e8f59.jpg) (http://s825.photobucket.com/user/LesSnyder/media/DSC00446_zps709e8f59.jpg.html)
(http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz180/LesSnyder/DSC00489_zpsc8c791f0.jpg) (http://s825.photobucket.com/user/LesSnyder/media/DSC00489_zpsc8c791f0.jpg.html)
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a high profile murder trial in Florida persuaded me to upgrade my compact firepower.....I'm a game player but also a realist, and assumed it might be advantageous to have a relatively compact firearm that extends practical range to 150m or so... my solution was a 10 1/2" AR "pistol" in 5.56.... a friend offered me a Mk18 upper, so looking at the ATF rulings from their technical division at the time, decided that would be the platform (disclaimer.... make sure you look up the proper ATF requirements and don't rely on me for your information)... the way I read the law, (1) as to not make a short barreled rifle (SBR) was that first it had to be a rifle, so purchased a new receiver and had the ATF4473 marked as "other" (2) the ruling that any receiver extension( buffer tube) could be used, but that a stock could not be readily available... I shoot nose to charging handle so a carbine buffer tube could be used that would get me close, but still a little too close (3) a rubber crutch tip type end cap was allowed, and this added a little anti slip for my purpose.... I chose a commercial "pistol" buffer tube and W2 buffer as to not have the adjustable holes associated a carbine stock (if I had used an adjustable carbine buffer tube, I had planned on adding a sling swivel to prevent the addition of a stock)... (4) with the Sig Brace ruling, I replaced the shorter pistol tube with a slightly longer tube from KAK, and with the addition of a SigBrace puts my nose to charging handle... a linear comp helps push the blast away from the shooter... it accomplishes what I wanted without the expense and time required for a revocable living trust and tax stamp for a SBR.... Les
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There was a quote on a recent podcast that I'm going to butcher, but it was something to the effect that the point of a defensive long arm, be it rifle or shotgun, was to move the fight off your front porch. The BLR Project, my SU-16C, an AR pistol, even a "mare's leg" lever gun all extend the fight out beyond bad-breath range.
Heck, Alf and I can tell you that something as simple as a red-dot on your pistol helps you get good hits at 50 yards. :D
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Okay, I've had some literature on this and finally, with Miss Kitty's insistence, have decided to act. We visited "Going Gear" (the actual store, goinggear.com) today for ideas.
Besides the long term stay at home stuff we've already been putting aside. Here's my plan for "Go Kits"
Car Kit: One in each car. Just to tide us over overnight. This happens in ATL in the winter. You get stuck and can't get home. Spend the evening in a school, gym, store or car. We have some basics in each car anyway. As well as our carry guns.
Get Home Bag: This one is has added things to help us "get home". Designed for travel more than an hour or more away from the house. Hopefully will sustain you for a couple of days. Added ammo, gun, enough to camp out overnight.
Total Bug Out: While the other scenarios assume you're headed home, the Bug Out is when staying home is no longer a viable option. The bag is contains what you need to sustain you for a couple of days and to perhaps be the basis for a long term camp out. Grab it and go. Of course if we have more time there are a list of other things we can also load in the car.
Each Kit supplements the other. I've got a list for the other kits, but first I'm just going to work on the Car Kit.
So with that plan in mind, I did research and decided to buy the Car Kits commercially. While we have some things in the car already, some of the items duplicate what's already in the car. The car stuff is extra and nice, but if you have to leave the car you just grab the bag and go. Below is what the commercial kits contain. The second list are the additional items I'm going to add to them.
Stock Car Kit
1 Rubber Flashlight (D)
2 Light Stick 8 hours
1 AM/FM Radio
2 Mylar Reflecitve Blanket
2 Plastic Pancho
1 Tube Tent
12 Water Pouch 4.2oz
1 Multi-Tool
1 Duct Tape
1 Whistle/Flint/Mirror Combo
1 Utility Rope 50ft
2 N95 Breathing Mask
1 Work Gloves
1 Deck of Cards
1 Gi Can Opener
1 Pencil
First Aid Kit
15 Bandages 3/8x1.5
15 Bandages 0.65x3
2 Sterile Sponge 2x2
6 Alcohol Pads
2 Antiseptic Towelettes
2 Butterfly Closures
10 Qtips
1 Iodine Pad
Add to Kit
1 Toilet Paper
2 Food Bars
2 Sporks
2 Collapsible Cups
4 Coffee/Tea
1 Surgical Tape
1 Tweezers
1 Insect Repellent
1 Sun Screen
1 Quality Folding Knife
1 LED Work Light(AA)
4 AA Batteries
2 D Batteries
1 Blanket
1 Large Towel
2 Hand Towels
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On the AM/FM radio, I have one that also has a built-in lantern and the whole thing is powered by a hand crank....no batteries needed. If not using the lantern, you get about 1 hour of radio from two minutes of cranking.
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It surprised me how much of this I already have at home. The hand-crank radio/light, and a small folding stove and several cans of Sterno, for example.
I just listed the Car Kits I'm buying and supplementing. They only support an overnight stay. Just the basic first aid and comfort stuff. I'll post my other kit ideas later as I build them out.
The other kits will contain the longer term items, like the hank crank, real cooking items, meals, etc. My idea is that each kit is for more serious levels of survival and they supplement each other.
One thing becomes obvious, you have to balance the bulk and weight against the portability. Not to mention the costs. We had 20% of coupons at the Going Gear store but still thought a lot of it was too expensive. Going Gear is more for the serious hiker/camper (a lot of which is the same as survival). I love the UST Camp Lantern (500+ lumens), though. Hoping Cabela's will have more reasonably priced alternatives.
I want to minimize the number of types of batteries. Yeah, a Streamlight tactical would be nice, but do I want to have to stock 123's as well as AA, AAA, D, C, 9V? I'm trying to have everything run on AA and D cells only. That way each year I only have to rotate two types of batteries.
http://goinggear.com/flashlights/led-lanterns/ultimate-survival-technologies-glow-in-the-dark-60-day-508-lumen-led-lantern.html (http://goinggear.com/flashlights/led-lanterns/ultimate-survival-technologies-glow-in-the-dark-60-day-508-lumen-led-lantern.html)
To bring this back to G U N S. I carry a 9mm with spare mag. And that's good for every day. My first choice for the Get Home bag will be my 6" .357. That and additional 9mm ammo/mags for my carry gun. A carbine, might be in the third kit, along with a second 9mm hand gun. I'm leaning towards keeping the carbine in 9mm to minimize the variety of ammo. I also plan that all the ammo in these kits, as well as my carry ammo, be commercial manufacture. Not that I don't trust my reloads, but why take a chance.
So many choices, so many options. You could take the kitchen sink if you had the space. But I think one should plan for the idea that you may not have a vehicle as well. That's why I'm doing this in stages. First got to see what all the things I listed work out to in bulk and weight one kit at a time.
MORE TO COME.
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for your consideration... upgrade your trauma kit over what is in the car kit.. consider a through and through with penetration of thorax...a flat of .5 liter bottled water is easy to rotate (and squeeze for wound irrigation), and the containers can be refilled...wool blankets or sleeping bags ( I know is gets cold in GA) over the mylar blanket... real metal cups not the folding kind...small Sterno type stove to heat water, especially if you throw in a couple of freeze dried, Mountain House, type meals...couple of Bic lighters...if you decide to standardize to AA batteries... I chose the Black Diamond Icon (older version without the red leds), a Gerber Infinity task light, Fenix E21, and Coleman 3AA High tech area light... my selection is specifically directed for hurricane emergency supplies, and Sanyo AA Eneloop rechargeable from a Goal Zero 7w panel or multi source Fujicell SCH808F charger... for a single light, I just upgraded my Solar Force L2M and Surefire 6P with a three intensity version of the LC-XML2 U2 module....
(http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz180/LesSnyder/DSC00309.jpg) (http://s825.photobucket.com/user/LesSnyder/media/DSC00309.jpg.html)
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Les, all good suggestions. Everybody's kit will vary. Remember I'm working out a 3 kit, 3 level system; local travel, regional travel and true bug-out-of-here.
I'm starting with the car bag and it's a comfort-and-just-see-me-through-the-night-cause-the-interstate's-gridlocked-on-my-2.5-mile-commute-home. It's an over nighter at worse. Don't need camp stove, or even meals just for one night. Not looking to replace the FD EMT staff, just basic, low level first aid. Most of the stuff you mention will come later in a true Bug Out bag.
No, I don't commute on the interstate!
Yes, I work a very long 2.5 miles from home. One way! Two traffic lights to boot.
Yes, I've walked it. As well as ridden my bicycle.
Oh, btw, it has been impassable due to ice at times a couple of times. Barely made it through last winter. It was closed for 2 days right after I got home!
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Love the idea of standardizing battery types: One thing to keep in mind is there are now lithium versions of both 9 volt and AA batteries, giving you the long shelf life and extra mileage of a lithium, but with the ability to find batteries on Tycho Crater if you need to. :D
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Speaking of hand cranked radios and batteries, make sure you check them on a regular basis. I have found that many of them don't have a very long shelf life. After a couple of years you don't get the same charge from the crank as you did when they are new. I found this out the hard way but since it also took AA's it wasn't a big deal.
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We like to focus the guns/ammo/first aid stuff but....Don't forget WATER.
Granted, being in a desert this concern is high for me. If you've ever been stuck on an interstate in AZ due to a fatal crash ahead, having some agua is a REALLY good thing. There is always at least a gallon in my vehicle. Even if you live in a rainforest, you still HAVE to drink clean water.
The Best Defense Survival section has some good stuff in it.
Some more linkage with a lot of other links:
http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Backpacking-Water-Filter-Reviews
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Speaking of hand cranked radios and batteries, make sure you check them on a regular basis. I have found that many of them don't have a very long shelf life. After a couple of years you don't get the same charge from the crank as you did when they are new. I found this out the hard way but since it also took AA's it wasn't a big deal.
Thanks for the reminder brushmore. Inside those hand cranks are probably simple ni-cad rechargeables and you're right they don't have infinite shelf life. Something to think about replacing every few years.
The one already have has a solor panel as well as the crank. I may set it outside for a day and see how long it will play that night.
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The FLASHLIGHT Conundrum
One of my objectives is to limit the variety of batteries that need to be stocked and rotated.
I love my Streamlight tactical flashlights. I was a fan of theirs for numerous years. However, this project isn't to put together the best tactical equipment, but to assemble gear that will work under a variety of circumstances. To that end:
[Yes I'm obsessing on this project and it's consuming a lot of my time and attention in the last week or two. And will for the next couple of weeks. My trip to the Cabela's grand opening will be first about reloading powder and then about prepardness. I've got a trip to Jackson, MS coming up for the Southern Regional ICORE and I want to be prepared.]
So after looking at all the UST, NEBO, Streamlight, Surefire, Phonex, Pelican, Nova, Gerber and others, I've decided on Dorcy brand for my bags. I know, they're not the top end, they're not "tactical" and they're not the "coolest". But within a budget, I think they fulfill my requirements for a bug out flashlight. What they are, are "AA", not expensive and each fill a nitch for "bugging out". I've had a couple of the smaller ones at work and they've lasted a lot better than the Nebo's or the MagLights. Below are the 4 that I've ordered; two of each.
First is the basic light. Nothing special, just a basic, small flashlight. 3 AAs, 32 Lumens, 20 hours.
http://www.opticsplanet.com/dorcy-3-aa-size-carabineer-led-flashlight-w-batteries.html (http://www.opticsplanet.com/dorcy-3-aa-size-carabineer-led-flashlight-w-batteries.html)
(http://images2.opticsplanet.com/755-405-ffffff/opplanet-dorcy-carabineer-flashlight-41-2510-01.jpg)
Next is a work light. You know, something to change a tire by! I really love my Larry's from Nebo. They even make a Lucy and a Larry 2. But they're all AAA and I'm trying to limit my battery stock to as few as possible.
Here's the Dorcy work light, equivelent to the Larry. 3 AAs, 72 Lumens, 2.5 hours. (how long does it take to change a tire?)
http://www.opticsplanet.com/dorcy-72-lumen-3aa-24-led-work-light-flashlight.html (http://www.opticsplanet.com/dorcy-72-lumen-3aa-24-led-work-light-flashlight.html)
(http://images2.opticsplanet.com/755-405-ffffff/opplanet-dorcy-72-lumen-3aa-24-led-work-light-flashlight-41-4227.jpg)
Then there's a "tactical" style light. Something seriously bright if needed to light the way or to monentarily put an intruder on notice. 4AAs, 180 lumens, 5 hours.
http://www.opticsplanet.com/dorcy-4-aa-size-high-flux-led-cyber-light-flashlight-w-batteries.html (http://www.opticsplanet.com/dorcy-4-aa-size-high-flux-led-cyber-light-flashlight-w-batteries.html)
(http://images1.opticsplanet.com/755-405-ffffff/opplanet-dorcy-high-flux-flashlight-41-4750-01.jpg)
Okay, and then for fun there's this little cutie. 4AAs, 45 Lumens, hours vary. It can be a wide area work light, a spot light or a night light.
http://www.opticsplanet.com/dorcy-45-lumens-waterproof-3-way-led-dial-a-light-4aa-size-w-batteries.html (http://www.opticsplanet.com/dorcy-45-lumens-waterproof-3-way-led-dial-a-light-4aa-size-w-batteries.html)
(http://images2.opticsplanet.com/755-405-ffffff/opplanet-dorcy-3-way-flashlight-41-4218-01.jpg)
Remember, I'm not trying to outfit a HRT member. I still have my Streamlight Tacticals at home, but for the road, for all around use, I'm liking this selection.
And when I get to the true, Bug-out-let's-go-camping, I'm still leaning towards the UST 60day lantern. 6 D's, 508 Lumens, 3 days on high, 7 on medium and 30 on low.
http://www.opticsplanet.com/ust-60-day-lantern.html (http://www.opticsplanet.com/ust-60-day-lantern.html)
(http://images2.opticsplanet.com/755-405-ffffff/opplanet-ust-60-day-lantern-20-pln0c6d002-main.jpg)
Oh, yeah, COST. $154 for 2ea of the flashlights and 1 of the lantern. Free shipping and each light comes with one set of batteries.
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Kmitch... I have a shallow well on property and not a lot of agricultural or chemical run off threat (I'm at 32' and not a lot of the town is higher.... with not much of a virus threat (I have stored some calcium hypochlorite and have new Clorox at beginning of hurricane season each year), and have settled on the Sawyer line for my water filtering needs... my first addition was a 5 gallon bucket kit with one of their .1 micron filters... last Christmas I gave some of the .1 micron Sawyer minis as presents along with the Feuerhand lanterns, and kept one for my 72 hour bag... the bucket is pre drilled and covered with tape... filter stored inside
(http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz180/LesSnyder/DSC00410_zps42f225ce.jpg) (http://s825.photobucket.com/user/LesSnyder/media/DSC00410_zps42f225ce.jpg.html)
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Sawyer mini and Feuerhand lantern (which gives a lot of light for a 1/2" wick)
(http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz180/LesSnyder/DSC00526_zps55527583.jpg) (http://s825.photobucket.com/user/LesSnyder/media/DSC00526_zps55527583.jpg.html)
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I know it doesn't help standardize a kit but I got got a free flashlight at Harbor Freight today. It takes 3 AAA batteries which are already installed. They also had them on sale for $1.99 each or 2 for $3.49. My friends and I have them in our ATVs and I tossed another one in the glove box of my truck. If the bulb burns out you can consider the light disposable it's so cheap.
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-12-in-9-led-mini-flashlight-69111.html
http://www.harborfreight.com/led-flashlight-mini-2-piece-9-led-3-12-69112.html
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Thanks Les!
With that system and small bit of bleach, one should be GTG.
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Re: Flashlights... Don't forget a headlamp. Massively useful, as it keeps both hands free for work.
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Keep the stuff on water purification coming. That'll be one of the next nuts to crack as to what's best for Kitty and I. We already have what we need at home for hunkering down. What this whole project is about is "on-the-road". What do I put in the "Get Back Home" bag and the "Bug Out" kit?
JUMBO: I'm a sucker for flashlights. I have numerous Nebos I throw in the car, as well as the quality Streamlights by each gun in the house. I love the Nebo Larry light as a work light. Have several around the house and at work. If there's a free light giveaway with some purchase I'm on it. Especially with free batteries. But the ones in these kits won't get used much, mainly checked out when I change the batteries yearly. And I'm trying limit the stock of batteries in these kits to only two types. And so, while around the house I've got flashlights with AA, AAA, C, D, 123, NiCad, NiMH, and lead acid, when the shift* happens all of those will pretty much be abandoned for what's in the bags.
* Shift: I'm proposing that as a PC way of saying SHTF. It also happens to coincide with a campaign (unrelated to end times) at work
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alfsauve... I went with the Sawyer mini in my remain overnight bag in the car because of it's versatility...the threads are the same pitch as a typical 1/2 liter water bottle with a full length cap (not one of the short ones in the picture).. in a multi pack they came out to around $16 each
http://www.amazon.com/Sawyer-Products-SP128-Filtration-System/dp/B00FA2RLX2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1408505169&sr=8-1&keywords=sawyer+mini+filter
prior to this hurricane season, I expanded my on hand water with the purchase of two Scepter containers to augment my 10+ year old Aquatainer and Coleman blue containers... manageable enough to grab and go
(http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz180/LesSnyder/001_zpsb78887ae.jpg) (http://s825.photobucket.com/user/LesSnyder/media/001_zpsb78887ae.jpg.html)
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If I had to do it all over again (and God willing, I never will...), in addition to having a rifle in the car with me, I'd have spent 5 minutes on Twitter before we went it.
Because I lived in Calgary and Phoenix for the past few decades (two cities not known for riots) gave me blinders about what might be happening in St. Louis, so I didn't even think to check on things.
Next time, 10 minutes on Twitter searching for what's trending near me will save me a few grey hairs.
An example: A few years ago, I came downstairs to see the chandelier over the dining room table swinging back and forth. Knowing that my boys were playing in the room just a few minutes earlier, I was about to come down on them like Sherman on Georgia when I noticed the chandelier in the front hallway was doing the same.
"Earthquake", I figured, and got out my phone and checked Twitter. Within two minutes, I had figured out the epicenter (Ensenada) and the strength and that California was still in existence. Meanwhile, my wife turned on CNN, and 10 minutes later, after the commercials and latest updates on what Kanye was doing, they mentioned they were beginning to hear reports of an earthquake near California and would update with more info as they got it.
Info that I already had.
We have a real-time public intel source in Twitter, and I didn't use it last week. Whoops.
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Can't speak for Canada, but Phoenix has had a few "uprisings" in the last century. Small skirmishes but it can pop up anywhere, and it's not "small" if you're in the middle of it.
Didn't think of Twitter as a primary source of newsfeed, but it is like one big party line.
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You can also make a cheap temporary lantern from a flashlight and a bottle of water. This works OK for times when you need scattered light (like in a small tent area) instead of a focused beam like so many lights provide these days.
Keep in mind that the more filtered and pure the water, the brighter the light refraction.
I have used my pocket carry 120 lumen light to demo this for others and it is much brighter than what you see on the videos I've posted below.
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Cool trick, Chuck,
You've seen the videos (India I think) where they cut holes in the roofs of hovels and insert drink bottles to provide lighting inside the house.
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Yep.
I guess I could do that in my small camper to save power...... ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Keep in mind that the more filtered and pure the water, the brighter the light refraction.
I stuck a lightbulb and a couple of batteries in a water jug and it didn't do squat. :P
Should I watch the video?
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I stuck a lightbulb and a couple of batteries in a water jug and it didn't do squat. :P
Should I watch the video?
You need more power......try using an extension cord. :o :o :o
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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You need more power......try using an extension cord. :o :o :o
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
LOL
1/4 cup of salt will help too. ;D ;D ;D
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Here's a video of plastic bottles used for lighting.
[Sorry about that, see post below]
PEGLEG: Maybe the batteries are too weak. Put your tongue across the end of the extension cord. See if that don't light things up. ;)
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Alf, your link was invalid.
Here is the original video I saw about solar lighting via bottles:
And another on the inventor of the concept:
**As to the tongue on the cord, I won't fall for that...... BUT, I have it on good authority (from a guy who was a summer maintenance flunky as a teenager) that using a sponge that is "too saturated with soapy water" to wipe down tile walls in bathrooms will electrify one's day if passed firmly over a wall outlet. :o
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How do the bottles do on an overcast day?
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Don't know, but still probably more light than nothing.
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Don't know, but still probably more light than nothing.
True...in the video, I did wonder why no one had more than one light in the room...except the shot of the inventor who had maybe 8 of them
Maybe something like "In the land of no lights, the one light room is king"
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True...in the video, I did wonder why no one had more than one light in the room...except the shot of the inventor who had maybe 8 of them
Maybe something like "In the land of no lights, the one light room is king"
May be. ;)
On an unrelated note: That sounds like the "big gov't" mindset the libtards have concerning guns, eh??
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May be. ;)
On an unrelated note: That sounds like the "big gov't" mindset the libtards have concerning guns, eh??
Yeah.... The whole world is at risk from being destroyed by the one gun you have, why would anyone need more than that.
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Yeah.... The whole world is at risk from being destroyed by the one gun you have, why would anyone need more than that.
That...and the "In the land of no guns, OUR gun is the biggest."
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Using this thread to continue my BugOut/GetHome/CarKit ideas:
I'm composing a full length treatise for posting in a separate thread, which we go into more detail on the rational for carrying or not carrying some things. But for now I thought I'd update this thread on each of the three steps.
For my travel and life style, I need three bags: An everyday Car Kit, good mainly for overnight comfort and safety in bad weather. A Get Home Bag for trips outside my local area which will support us for several days till we get back home. Finally, a true Bug Out Bag for when home must be abandoned.
Here's the final Car Kit, utilizing a base kit from prepareWise preparewise.com (http://preparewise.com). It's their Essential 2-Person Survival Kit. I've added a few things and substituted a better flashlight for their model.
Stock Car Kit
1 Back pack
1 Rubber Flashlight (D)
2 Light Stick 8 hours
1 AM/FM Radio (AAA)
2 Mylar Reflecitve Blanket
2 Plastic Pancho
1 Tube Tent
12 Water Pouch 4.2oz
1 Multi-Tool
1 Duct Tape
1 Whistle/Flint/Mirror Combo
1 Utility Rope 50ft
2 N95 Breathing Mask
1 Work Gloves
1 Deck of Cards
1 Gi Can Opener
1 Pencil
First Aid Kit
15 Bandages 3/8x1.5
15 Bandages 0.65x3
2 Sterile Sponge 2x2
6 Alcohol Pads
2 Antiseptic Towelettes
2 Butterfly Closures
10 Qtips
1 Iodine Pad
Added to Car Kit
1 Surgical Tape
1 Tweezers and small scissors
1 Dental Floss
1 Toilet Paper
8 Hand Sanitizer Packets
2 Socks and underwear
1 Large Towel
2 Hand Towels
4 Food Bars
2 Sporks
2 Metal cups
4 Instant Coffee, tea bags, instant drink mixes
1 Insect Repellent
1 Sun Screen
1 Quality Folding Knife
2 Tea Candles
1 Bic lighter, water proof matches
1 LED Tactical Light (AA) (Dorcy HiFlux)
1 LED Work Light(AA) – (Dorcy 72)
Of course, I have my CCW and there are some other things in the car, like extra blanket and towels, but the kit is designed to grab and go if the car is abandoned. There are so many things that could be added, but I think this will keep us save and comfortable if stuck around town. I actually put together two of these, one for each car. Trying to also keep it under 10 pounds. Simplify. Simplify. Simplify is the key word. I've taken out a number of things from when I first started. For example there's no need for spare batteries because of the short duration.
The other kits will compliment and add to the capabilities. This one is just for an overnight interruption while driving around town.
Working on getting the next Get Home (long distance travel) kit assembled before I go to the Southern Regional Revolver Championships next month.
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I don't see anything to use the can opener or spork on... :-X
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I don't see anything to use the can opener or spork on... :-X
Good observation. Nor do you see sugar or creamer. The spork and opener are to take advantage of any food found or offered. Feeling is that for a single night it's not worth stocking or carrying food, but it's nice to be able to eat it, comfortably, if you find it.
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If nothing else you should at least add some packages of instant oatmeal.
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Looks good. Didn't see anything for dealing with GSW's or other major trauma, or maybe I just missed it. I like to keep a C.A.T. tourniquet, Israeli bandage and a small Quikclot bandage in my car and in my range bag, just in case.
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you may find some ideas here... LDS has been doing this for a long time
http://lds.about.com/od/preparednessfoodstorage/a/72hour_kit.htm
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Les, I hadn't read anything from LDS, because I tend to think of them as "stay-at-home prepardness" not so much "bug-out". I will though with your link. Thanks.
Kevin, I debate back and forth about what goes in each level and what doesn't. Israeli bandages are so neat, you're probably right. Never thought about putting one in my range bag. Good idea.
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At Kevin, and several others prodding I've rethought the first aid issues.
1) I've never carried anything in my range bag, but have ordered a basic first-aid kit and will add to it 2 Israeli bandages and 2 QuikClot sponges.
2) The first aid kit in the car glove box needs updating, so I've order two more basic kits and will put an Israeli bandage and QuikClot sponge in each.
3) I've moved more of the first-aid supplies from the long term, Get Home Bag to the Car Kits. I'll add Israeli Bandages and QuikClots to the Car Kits as well.
(For those confused, the "Car Kit" is not to be used as an everyday, got a hangnail-kid-scraped-his-knee, situation. The first-aid kit in the glove box is for that purpose. "Car Kit" is for being stranded, or a serious car accident, etc.)
One thing I overlooked was an antihistamine, so that will be added to the Car Kit.
Found good deals on Israeli Bandages at Amazon and QuiKClot at MidwayUSA.
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Quikclot and Israeli bandages are good, but a coworker of mine who's spent some time overseas in Tier 1.5 groups both publicly and privately funded recommended the C.A.T. tourniquet as the first thing to gone on after a GSW. Israeli bandages, he said, are more of a compress than a tourniquet. I picked up three of the "black stripe" variety with the plastic twisters for a very reasonable sum, and there's now one each in my go bag, daily carry bag and range bag.
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you might try Chinook medical... no affiliation
http://www.chinookmed.com/
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Wow. Much better prices at Chinnok.
They need to hire a social media expert, because they never came up in the first couple of pages on my searches.
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Way back on the first page of this thread, I mentioned I had a day pack with me in St. Louis that I was trying out for an article for a friend's prepping website.
Finished the article (http://www.smartsuburbansurvival.com/one-more-day/). The only thing I've added since them is some cash is varying denominations, an umbrella and a small roll of duct tape.
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And I am a big, big fan of using the modern smartphone as a disaster survival tool, which is why I have things like a spare battery and charging cords with me at all limes. 9/11 showed us that text messages can go thru when voice calls fail (makes sense, as a text is a much smaller packet of data than a digital voice call), and having smart phone means you have access to severe weather alerts, a police scanner, a first aid manual, GPS, compass, flashlight, heck, I even have the good ol' Army survival manual stored as an e-book on my phone.
Massively useful, as the saying goes.
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Except for the E books, none of that will do you a bit of good if the towers go down.
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Since electronics have entered the topic, here is a product that interested me, but I didn't see a good "niche" for it in most survival plans, but maybe someone here might find it useful.
It seems too heavy for a daily backpacking environment, but it might have a place in an extended stay off the grid base camp where charging is needed. There are wood burning camp stoves that are cheaper and lighter and there are hand powered generators for charging available also, though I see some poor ratings on reliability for the cranks and time it takes to get a charge, so maybe this might work out...but have no idea about it's reliability..
Here is a link, if interested
http://www.biolitestove.com/
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Actually, the first aid manual, compass, flashlight are all integral to the phone. They'll work as long as I have juice.
True, if the all towers go down, I'm in a bad spot, but it's the best we've got, short of learning shortwave. I may be wrong (and I'll take my lumps if I am) but cell phones generally worked during Katrina, the Boston bombing, 9/11... in just about ever disaster since the turn of the century, cell phones have generally worked, and when they haven't worked, restoring service was right up there with getting the power turned back on and due to their dispersed and network nature, they're a bit more resilient than land lines. Katrina was a wake-up call to the industry (http://www.njslom.org/cell-towers-fcc-ruling.html), and they've been putting in backup batteries and generators left, right and center. In my car kit, I've got more comm gear, but for 24 hours away from home, which is the purpose of that bag, a cell phone should do just fine.
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I don't know about the others, but I know for a fact that during the aftermath of the Marathon bombing there was no cell service in the Boston Metro area. I was sitting beside a friend of mine while he tried to call relitives and friends to check on his Grand daughter at Tuft's University .
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Cell phones often fail when lines are overloaded with calls. Service is often spotty at major sporting events, and a disaster will be worse.
During the big ice storm in KY in 2009, almost all phones, cell and land, were down.
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I don't know about the others, but I know for a fact that during the aftermath of the Marathon bombing there was no cell service in the Boston Metro area. I was sitting beside a friend of mine while he tried to call relitives and friends to check on his Grand daughter at Tuft's University .
I've not looked into this, Tom but, they may have shut the towers down around Boston to prevent remote activation of more IED's. It makes sense, at least in my feeble little brain...
I lived 50 miles from Boston and we had no problems at that time.
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There is a system that allows only designated priority users of the cell systems access. Think first responders, public service hierarchy, and various emergency agencies.
I know it was widely discussed some years ago but I don't know if they implemented it or if so whether it has been activated for things like the Boston bombing.
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Kevin... good article... I would suggest an LED headlamp, even an inexpensive one, and a dedicated task light to save the phone batteries...I EDC a Fenix E05 on a key chain and the 2014 version has 85/25/8 lumen options, but am most impressed with the Solar Force L2 series of flashlight bodies for CR123 batteries... with one of their XM-L2 U2 LED modules you get a 540/150/15 lumen three mode option... for about $30 less batteries ... I'm giving some EDC oriented gifts this year for Christmas...
Fenix E01, US Shelby P38, and Acme 636 whistle ... and a pill fob when I find a suitable one
(http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz180/LesSnyder/001_zps740dc7e2.jpg) (http://s825.photobucket.com/user/LesSnyder/media/001_zps740dc7e2.jpg.html)
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P38 :D :D :D
I carry one I've had for 46 years :D
Pry bar, screwdriver - both flat and philips, scraper, chisel ...hmm..something else too...ahh can opener
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P38 :D :D :D
I carry one I've had for 46 years :D
Coming up on 40 years for mine..... Mine's steel...never corrodes, tough little sucker...
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re P38... still have a Shelby and carry a Speaker from the JSPC chow hall at Torii Station, Okinawa 1971... I had to search to find real US Shelby,O production for the gifts...
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I've still got a couple P-38's around, used to always have one between my dog tags rubber banded together.
Now I carry a Swiss Army knife, Saw, scissors, magnifying glass, punch/reamer,2 flat tip &1 phillips screw driver, can and bottle openers, cork screw, 2 blades, and a couple things I don't know what the hell they're for.
Never had any use for them till I got one in the early 90's . I took it to work and after I used the magnifier and tweezers on metal slivers, and cut banding with the scissors I decided it was a pretty good tool . I'm still carrying the same one as a key fob 20 years later.
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Well, we're going into St. Louis again tomorrow, this time to visit the Science Museum, and yes, I will be taking the truck gun and the get-home bag with us.
Lesson learned.
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Any recommendations on a backpack? I have most everything I need but lugging it in a cheap pack or duffle is tedious...
I'm looking at the Condor 3 day pack at about 1-3/4 cubic ft.
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I think something with a hydration bladder would be a good option... I don't plan on going anywhere, but if necessary, the contents of this Blackhawk HydraStorm I got off the prize table at a 3 gun match could be lightened and still have the water transport... pack and contents are around 17# without water... I use the pack to keep the stuff in my car organized... the crate holds heavier gear, and the dry box is my car FAK
(http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz180/LesSnyder/DSC00435_zps13f4d7bc.jpg) (http://s825.photobucket.com/user/LesSnyder/media/DSC00435_zps13f4d7bc.jpg.html)
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Yes, the Condor and the 5.11 Tactical have a bladder compartment as well and a bit less cost. 80-140 bucks...
Curious if anyone here has tried either?
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Something this AM got me thinking about having a couple of gallon ziplock bags in the vehicles.
Phx got historic rain last night...as in, the most in one day EVER since they started keeping records.
I-17, I-10, US60, SR 51, 202, 303, 143 basically EVERY freeway/highway around the valley, all had areas of closures due to flooding. A-DOT says the 'magic' number for the pumps to fail is 1" in one hour. Phx got almost 4" from midnight to 0300. I-10 was a lake with cars nearly submerged. SUVs had water up to the door handles or higher.
Fustercluck!
If my truck got stuck, smashed, whatever and I had to bail in the wet, I would want to keep my wallet. phone, radar detector and I-pod dry. The guns don't care and neither do the mags but the electro gizmos are worth too much to buy again.
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The guns and mags care when the water is from the sea! I carry several in both vehicles.
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Toss in a few bags of silica gel as well, KM. One thing I found out the hard way in my move to the midwest from the desert is that more water = more moisture in the air = more rust.
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I won't steal from Kevin's Facebook post about the rain in Phoenix. But here's one from the last rain you had.
(http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/89/ab/22/89ab22bdff78f05c79a2f495ac4da00e.jpg)
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Well, as I just stole YOUR image and posted it on Facebook... :D
(http://www.exurbanleague.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/10614318_10152773115291614_2523074880825206984_n.jpg)
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Toss in a few bags of silica gel as well, KM. One thing I found out the hard way in my move to the midwest from the desert is that more water = more moisture in the air = more rust.
Like me, you must have had a/c when you lived here. I once lived in a house in Phx that only had a swamp cooler (really sucked!!) and found that Wow, you really do have to have oil on steel.
The guns and mags care when the water is from the sea! I carry several in both vehicles.
If there is sea water in AZ, things just got really really bad.
(or CA fell off and things just got much better ;D)
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If there is sea water in AZ, things just got really really bad.
(or CA fell off and things just got much better ;D)
I found sharks teeth in the high mesas of NM back in the 60's, ya never know!!!
;)
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Back on survival. Tell me what you think about this definition.
I'm writing a thesis on this and one of my points is the kits I am making are for "disasters" not for everyday knee scrapes and bee stings. You should have an "everyday" first aid kit in the home and in the car for that, totally separate from the Get Home or Bug Out bag
So what is the definition of a "disaster"? How does that differ from a 48 car pile up on the interstate with multiple deaths and serious injuries?
A true disaster is when 911 is not going to come to your aid. It is when you can’t call emergency services, or if you do reach them, they can’t possible get to you.
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I think that is to localized to be called a disaster in the SHTF sense of the word, though it is a disaster for those involved.
I'd call that a bad accident and an emergency.
I think 100s of motorists stranded on a highway during a 3+ day blizzard is closer.
I think it is the element of no chance of imminent assistance that makes the difference.
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The quoted definition from Alf is pretty spot on...
Those of us in New England can have a number of disaster situations in a given year. Hurricanes, blizzards, the occasional tornado and as evidenced after the Marathon Bombing, the complete and utter suspension of the US Constitution!
Calling 911 during a blizzard is pointless, hurricanes somewhat questionable for service. Combine a late season hurricane with cold weather and it's a real fustercluck here regardless of preparation.
I've never been much of a "prep for disaster" kind of guy. Most of what's been mentioned I have and will certainly augment further. The situation in the middle east is most disturbing and has given more to be concerned about than natural disaster. Damn scary how a small suitcase of nastiness can be dragged onto our soil and let loose on the populous.
Grindage for the grey matter... (food for thought) ;)
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For me, it's a disaster is when I'm out of bourbon. :D
Something like the flooding in Phoenix is a royal pain in the assets, but since the water supply or the basic necessities of life weren't affected, it's an annoyance, but not a disaster.
From, it's a disaster if it affects water, food, shelter, oxygen (can you say Bhopal?) or security, the same thing that I'm concerned about if I get stranded out in the wilderness. Lose any one of those, and it's a disaster.
Anyone remember what the levels of disaster/social dislocation that Michael used on Best Defense Survival?
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Anyone remember what the levels of disaster/social dislocation that Michael used on Best Defense Survival?
I've got quite a few of those queued up but haven't watched. How about a summary?
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The trip to Jackson, MS was instructive last week. Took not only my Car Kit, but the Get Home bag as well. Of course self defense wasn't a problem since I took three guns to the competition and about 600 rounds of ammo.
At several people's suggestion, I added major trauma items to my first aid kits. Actually, I went a little overboard and order more Israeli bandages than I needed. But now each car has two bandages and two clotting sponges for everyday emergencies. Plus each Car Kit and the Get Home bag have an additional two of each. And at Kevin's suggestion I now carry some in my range bag.
I bring this up because at the ICORE Southern Regionals (no, nobody was shot) one of the ROs was setting up safety areas and incurred a major puncture wound from a broken table leg. I offered my bandages, but he opted for his own plain gauze and tape. (After thoroughly cleaning the wound of course.) While mine wasn't needed, it's scary how quickly an injury can occur from regular activities, and comforting that I was ready if needed.
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More settlers in the West died from things like broken legs or cutting themselves with an axe than all the Indian raids combined.
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I've got quite a few of those queued up but haven't watched. How about a summary?
It was (and I'm going off of faded memory here) something like:
Green: Minor Social Disruption (1 day-ish)
Yellow: Serious Social Disruption (3 days)
Red: Katie, bar the door (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catherine_Douglas)! (1 week or more).
The actual samples he used in the series escapes me, but I remember Katrina as being a Red level event.