The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Handguns => Topic started by: billt on December 05, 2017, 01:31:52 PM
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I got this E-Mail from them. I thought about getting one. But not any longer. They're making it far too great of a PITA. It's a 1911 for God's sake. It was easier purchasing the house I'm living in. The CMP is far too ridden with regulations for what they're offering. And I'm sure the prices will be no bargain either. Especially when you consider all the new 1911's that are out there from some very good companies. History isn't worth that much. Especially in today's economy. And there are plenty of WW II battle 1911's out there, without so much nonsense attached to purchasing them.
Anyway, if you still want one, here is what you're in for.
To all CMP constituents:
The CMP Board of Directors has discussed at length how the sales of 1911s would be handled, if the CMP were to ever receive them from the United States Army.
Some preliminary decisions further clarified:
1.) Decisions concerning the grade and pricing of the 1911s will not be made until inspection has occurred of a substantial quantity which will take an estimated 150 days post receipt.
2.) All laws pertaining to the sale of 1911s by CMP will be strictly obeyed.
3.) Potential purchasers will have to provide to CMP a new set of documents exhibiting: 1) proof of U.S. Citizenship, 2) proof of membership in a CMP affiliated club, 3) proof of participation in a marksmanship activity, 4) a new form 2A with notary, 5) a signed copy of the 01 Federal Firearms License in which the 1911 will be transferred to.
4.) A NICS background check will be performed by CMP on the customer to assure the customer is eligible to purchase prior to shipment to the FFL licensed dealer. The customer must receive a "proceed" from NICS prior to shipment of the pistol to the FFL licensed dealer.
5.) The CMP customer will be required to complete a form 4473 in person at the FFL dealers place of business, successfully passing a NICS check performed by the FFL holder, before the pistol can be transferred. This is a second NICS check performed on the customer.
Qualified CMP customer will only be allowed to purchase one 1911 per calendar year.
6.) No 1911s available in the CMP stores, or on line, only mail order sales.
7.) CMP will set the date in which it will accept orders for the 1911s. The date will be posted to the world.
Orders will only be accepted via mail order delivery.
8.) Orders will only be accepted post marked on the date or after, no early orders.
9.) Once CMP receives 10,000 orders, customer names will be loaded into the Random Number Generator.
10.) The Random Number Generator will provide a list of names in sequence order through a random picking process to CMP.
Customers will be contacted in the sequence provided by the Random Number Generator.
11.) When the customer is contacted a list of 1911 grades and pricing options that are available will be offered for selection of one.
12.) As CMP proceeds down the sequenced list less grade and pricing options will be available. Again, this done completely random.
13.) Note: 1911 type pistols purchased from CMP cannot be transferred to 03 FFL (curio and relic) license. BATF and the United States Army prefer the second background check be performed by a "store front" FFL dealer. Each customer purchasing a 1911 type pistol from CMP will be subjected to two NICS background checks, one performed by CMP and the other performed by the FFL dealer the pistol is being shipped to.
Mark Johnson
Chief Operating Officer
Civilian Marksmanship Program
www.thecmp.org
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Proof of membership in a CMP affiliated club and proof of participation in a marksmanship activity would count me out. I've never been a member of a gun club. Too many hoops to jump through when I could just walk into a local gun store, whip out a credit card, and walk out with a brand new pistol.
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What the CMP is overlooking, is that nice 1911 pistols are a dime a dozen in today's market. And at very good prices like most other guns today. And nothing from the CMP ever appears to be much of a bargain. So my guess is you'll be able to buy a much nicer 1911, a whole lot cheaper and easier elsewhere. In fact, I don't see how they could make the purchase any more complicated. People should just pass it up, and let them know why. Watch how fast they'll streamline the purchases if they're not getting any. The CMP is, after all, a business.
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They have hyped them up so much over the last few week maybe they figure there will be a BIG rush and BIG demand on these??? There might be by newbie's or uneducated. I myself would LOVE to have one but alas I will have to settle for one of the 11 I already own. (2) 22cal, (2) 9mm, (1) 10mm, (6) single stack .45 (1) Double stack Para. The hoops they want you to jump through combined with the anticipated price of $1000.00 to $1200.00 just doesn't make it worth it to me.
I do so love 1911's (and other pistols as well).
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I'm the same way. I have many 1911's, and love the platform. What I don't like is someone else who I don't even know, picking out my well used gun for me. I know a lot of people who are into firearms. And I can't think of a single one who would agree to purchase terms like that. Really nice 1911's are simply too plentiful..... Especially when you start getting over the $1K mark.
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2 NICS. Really?
No C&R. Really?
Only Alabama residents could by OTC anyway. But why not let out of staters select their gun in the store, then ship it to their FFL.
BTB, I've never had a NICS, ever. GA is one of the states where a Concealed Carry let's you bypass the NICS. I've had CCW in GA since 1976. Granted there have been the every 5 year background check for the CCW, but never NICS.
I wonder if they factor that in the gun sales statistics?
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Proof of membership in a CMP affiliated club and proof of participation in a marksmanship activity would count me out. I've never been a member of a gun club. Too many hoops to jump through when I could just walk into a local gun store, whip out a credit card, and walk out with a brand new pistol.
You could shoot a GSSF match on the cheap. $35 for membership (25 if current or ret public safety) $25 for 1 entry. That would be your CMP club and activity.
Of course all the other BS that CMP is adding on doesn't really make it any more worth it.
Haven't they noticed that there are a umpteen-bajillion 1911s for sale?
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2 NICS. Really?
No C&R. Really?
Only Alabama residents could by OTC anyway. But why not let out of staters select their gun in the store, then ship it to their FFL.
BTB, I've never had a NICS, ever. GA is one of the states where a Concealed Carry let's you bypass the NICS. I've had CCW in GA since 1976. Granted there have been the every 5 year background check for the CCW, but never NICS.
I wonder if they factor that in the gun sales statistics?
That's probably why for the NICS because your CCW check isn't up to the minute in todays CYA. I wouldn't mind getting one of the 1911s as I've carried them in Haiti in 95', Iraq in 03-08' and Afghanistan in 14'. Still a few on duty in Astan today with some of my fellow SF brethen (I now work as a SOCOM small arms repair/instructor).
CD
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These guns are not going to be anywhere near the $ 2K and $ 3.5K G.I. guns you see at high end gun shops. That come with documentation, and are in the 90% finish range. From the research I've been doing, the CMP is going to be pricing most of these things in the $ 1,000.00 to $ 1,200.00 price range. That's insane for a used up G.I. 1911. And there is only just so much gunsmith time the CMP can invest in these things.
And as Alf pointed out, what's with having to go through 2 NICS checks? What useful purpose does that serve? And on top of that, have to go through an FFL. Because they've decided in their infinite wisdom, they won't let them go on a C&R. I'm not understanding this overcomplicated reasoning. My 1971 Colt Gold Cup NRA Centennial Edition is on the C&R list for God's sake.
Most of these things are going to be well used and worn, mil-surp rattletraps. Remember, you can buy a brand new G.I. model from both Springfield Armory, and Rock Island Armory for less than half of that. And you don't have to fill out more forms, and produce more information, than if you go long form at tax time owning 4 businesses.
Today $ 1,200.00 puts you in brand new Colt Gold Cup territory. Nice 1911 pistols are a dime a dozen in todays depressed, overstocked firearms market. It's too bad they have to take something that could not only be good, but a real bargain for the average American citizen, and complicate it by turning it into an overpriced, bureaucratic nightmare. But such is the world we now live in.
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Too many hoops to jump through when I could just walk into a local gun store, whip out a credit card, and walk out with a brand new pistol.
Exactly. I doubt these things are going to move anywhere near as fast as the CMP thinks they are. Most people would rather sink $1000 - $1400 in a new gun than a mixmaster used gun you can't even choose yourself.
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I read the terms and they made perfect sense to me. They will only get 8k or so a year for two years to start, so the numbers are quite limited. Out of 100 million gun owners I could see 8k 1911 relics going pretty fast, just to history buffs. I think they'll sell them, but I also think they're subtly telling us that you'd have to be pretty lucky to get a shooter...they're historical artifacts.
I think they'll sell out within a year. If they don't they'll lower the price, but I think there's little to no expectation that these will be decent guns.
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CMP recognizes SASS membership as one of the qualifiers. For any of Y'all that are members. I agree that they are asking way too much for what most likely will be a worn out gun.
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If I want to shoot an old worn-out 1911 I'll get my Para-Ordnance 13+1 kit gun out. And if I want one in decent shape I'll go to a gun shop and get one for half the price of the CMP guns. Sure, collectors will buy them but I doubt anyone else will for the price they're asking.
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So, let me get this straight...
They are going to GIVE you 2 1911s, one for backup, 5 spare magazines each and 10,900 rounds of practice ammo and you are complaining about having to jump through a few hoops????
;) ;) ;)