The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: ericire12 on December 10, 2009, 04:21:16 PM
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http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jvfD1QMzNyAm2iykQtY5tuhyjrkgD9CGN31G0
NEW YORK — A plainclothes cop chased a scam artist through sidewalks crowded with holiday shoppers and tourists Thursday in the heart of Times Square, killing the suspect near a landmark Broadway hotel after a gunfight that shattered box office and gift shop windows, police said.
No one else was injured.
The 25-year-old suspect and his brother were trying to dupe tourists into buying CDs and movies along Broadway and 46th Street just before noon when he was recognized by a sergeant who runs a task force that monitors aggressive panhandling, Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly said.
The officer asked them for their tax identification, which allows peddlers to sell on the streets. But suspect took off running, through to the Marriott Marquis hotel's passenger drop-off area, Kelly said.
The sergeant pursued, and the man turned and fired with a stolen Mac-10 machine pistol that held 30 rounds; he got off two shots before it jammed, police said. The officer fired four times, striking the suspect in the chest and arm and killing him, Kelly said.
"We're lucky the weapon jammed," Kelly said.
The commissioner said the shooting preliminarily appeared to be within department guidelines, which allow for deadly force when an officer's life is threatened.
Dave Kinahan, a tourist from Boston, was parking his car in a spot below street level at the hotel when he saw one man shooting another.
"I was 20 yards away," Kinahan said. He said he thought, "Is this real or this a movie?"
The hotel is located in the Broadway theater district in the heart of Times Square. The Marquis Theatre, where "White Christmas" is now playing, is in the hotel. Bullets from the gunfight shattered the window of the Broadway Baby gift shop and a side window of the box office on the street, police said.
Duncan Stewart, a Broadway casting director for National Artists Management Co., has a 12th-floor office that overlooks Times Square. He said he was on the phone when he heard three loud pops.
Stewart has worked in Times Square for the past three years. He has gotten used to seeing the weird and wacky, but almost never anything violent.
"It's bizarre. It's one thing to see the Naked Cowboy day after day in Times Square, but a shooting is something different altogether," he said.
The slain man was not immediately identified. His brother was in police custody.
Police say the two were working a scam in which they would approach tourists, ask them their names, then write their names on the CDs and movies and demand payment of $10.
The suspect had been wanted for assault in the Bronx. The gun he used in the shooting was reported stolen in Richmond, Va., on Oct. 28, police said.
He also had with him several business cards from gun dealers there, but it's not clear if he was also selling weapons, police said.
One of the cards had a handwritten message on the back: "I just finished watching 'The Last Dragon.' I feel sorry for a cop if he think I'm getting into his paddy wagon," according to police. It's unclear who wrote the message, which apparently references the 1985 martial arts movie.
NYPD spokesman Paul Browne said officers pay special attention to scams and panhandling during the holidays. Specialized units are set up in areas, including Times Square and Canal Street, where stolen goods, knockoffs and scams are prevalent.
"We focus on them this time of the year, because they're preying on tourists during the Christmas holidays," Browne said.
New York City's crackdown on panhandling began under former Mayor Rudy Giuliani, when "zero-tolerance" policing was instituted to curb quality-of-life offenses. Panhandling, public drinking, public urinating, graffiti and disorderly conduct were all part of the crackdown as a way to bring order to the city by sending the message that no crime would be tolerated.
When Mayor Michael Bloomberg first took office in 2002, one of the first things he did was launch "Operation Clean Sweep," aimed at those same quality-of-life problems. By the end of Bloomberg's first term, the program had had resulted in some 33,000 arrests and 350,000 summonses.
A few hours after the shooting, the area had returned to the normal holiday bustle, even as dozens of police officers surrounded the hotel, taping off the valet parking area.
Donna Anderson of Murray, Utah, was staying at the Marquis. She was intrigued by what happened — not scared.
"I wanted to get a picture of the crime scene," she said.
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How can this happen in gun free NY ?
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Goes to show "outlaw guns only outlaws have guns"
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Hell, Bloomburg probably set it up. Another reason to ban guns. :-\ Seriously, tin foil hat aside, you do have to wonder how many panhadlers can afford a mac-10, and how many more would rather shoot it out with the police rather than take a barely there misdemeanor bust for selling CDs without a vending permit. Hell, my roomate and I in college used to play the bagpipes and sell " Scotland Is Not For The Squeamish" T-shirts in DC without a $1000 per head permit. The penalty was a $100 fine. We figured we get busted 19 times and still come out ahead. This whole story does not make sense.
FQ13
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With Bloomberg and his contributions to NYC, how could anyone want to commit a crime with a firearm in such a nice, pleasant town.
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Hell, Bloomburg probably set it up. Another reason to ban guns. :-\ Seriously, tin foil hat aside, you do have to wonder how many panhadlers can afford a mac-10, and how many more would rather shoot it out with the police rather than take a barely there misdemeanor bust for selling CDs without a vending permit. Hell, my roomate and I in college used to play the bagpipes and sell " Scotland Is Not For The Squeamish" T-shirts in DC without a $1000 per head permit. The penalty was a $100 fine. We figured we get busted 19 times and still come out ahead. This whole story does not make sense.
FQ13
UPDATE: Bloomberg speaks....... from page 2 of the liberal gun grabber playbook
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jvfD1QMzNyAm2iykQtY5tuhyjrkgD9CH7SGG0
NYC mayor on deadly shootout: `Too many guns'
By COLLEEN LONG and ADAM GOLDMAN (AP) – 2 hours ago
NEW YORK — The mayor railed against gun violence on Friday, one day after a street peddler armed with a machine pistol died in a shootout with police outside a hotel in bustling Times Square.
Mayor Michael Bloomberg was asked about the shooting while appearing at a Manhattan charity event, and he used the question to discuss one of his signature issues — illegal firearms and gun violence in New York and other big cities.
"We've got to stop this," Bloomberg said. "This is one of the great public health threats. And our police officers are clearly in danger."
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That is impossible. You mean criminals dont follow the laws. How could this be.
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I like this:
"We're lucky the weapon jammed," said police Commissioner Raymond Kelly.
Well, actually it was a Mac-10...... it was bound to happen
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I like this:
Well, actually it was a Mac-10...... it was bound to happen
True indeed. A great idea, a .45 caliber sub gun, but piss poor execution. The guy would have been better off with a Kel-tec.
FQ13
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well that was his problem
Quote:
A Times Square bloodbath was narrowly avoided because the machine-pistol-toting thug who fired at a cop flipped the gun on its side like a character out of a rap video, causing the weapon to jam after two shots, law-enforcement sources said yesterday.
When scam artist Raymond "Ready" Martinez held the MAC-10-style gun parallel to the ground, it caused the ejecting shells to "stovepipe," or get caught vertically in the chamber, the sources said. The gun is designed to be fired only in a vertical position
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/side_show_doomed_thug_vct6JLQrWau8DRZpdvdaFO
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from the link i posted before
who would of guess this
Investigators are still trying to figure out where Martinez -- who had a warrant for failing to show in court on charges he beat his wife -- got the high-powered Masterpiece Arms-built weapon.
The gun had been stolen from its owner, a woman named Jordan Kelsey-Stewart, 25, who bought it from Dale's Guns in Powhatan, Va., on Oct. 18, sources said.
It was stolen from Kelsey-Stewart's car on Oct. 28 in Richmond, Va. What happened next is unclear, but the feds want to talk to her to see if she had any connection to the shooter.
Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/side_show_doomed_thug_vct6JLQrWau8DRZpdvdaFO#ixzz0ZfUSkqTP
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Some facts about the gun used in Thursday's Times Square shooting:
The MAC-10 is a handheld submachine gun that weighs about 6 pounds, can hold 30 bullets in its magazine and fire more than 1,000 rounds a minute.
It was developed by Gordon Ingram in 1964 and was used by Special Forces in Vietnam.
It's a favorite of street gangs and movie stars. John Wayne carried one in “McQ,” and so did Bruce Willis in "Pulp Fiction."
The model Raymond Martinez was carrying Thursday was a semi-automatic variation called the Masterpiece Arms 9-mm. MAC-10, which had a closed bolt that improves accuracy.
It was reported stolen on Oct. 28 from a car in Richmond, Va.
(For starters, having the extremely high cyclic rate of at least 1,000 rounds per minute, which actually makes the MAC submachine guns extremely difficult to handle, does not equate to firing 1,000 rounds per minute because the gun uses 30-round magazines, which get depleted rather quickly at that rate. More importantly, the cyclic rate of the original full-auto version has no bearing whatever on its semi-automatic clones. In point of fact, the model in question fired two rounds, then jammed [http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/6783542/New-York-police-shoot-dead-con-artist-scamming-tourists.html]. Other than that… typical yellow journalism from the Daily News.)