The Down Range Forum
Member Section => The Leather Shop => Topic started by: garand4life on February 02, 2010, 04:47:22 PM
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I have a Galco summer comfort holster for my M&P and I worried that I need to do something to the inside lining. After carrying the gun for 8 hours I pull it out to see the slide with a heavy grey/white discoloration. I run some Rem Oil on a rag on the slide and it's back to normal. Is there something I need to do to moisturize the leather on the inside of the holster where is rough for retention. The outside is perfect like when I bought it. I don't have any leather cleaning supplies so home remedies would be great.
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A very small ammount of glycerin rubbed in on the inside works. galco even sells it.
on the plus side it also gives off that "leather smell" which I dig.
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Where would I find glycerin? Is it something you would normally have laying around the house? I'm not well versed in chemicals I guess you could say, sorry.
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Where would I find glycerin? Is it something you would normally have laying around the house? I'm not well versed in chemicals I guess you could say, sorry.
Should be able to find it in most drug stores....try the first aid section.
If that fails, try a craft store because it is a chief ingredient in homemade soap.
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Saddle soap works good, found at tack and feed stores. Small dab on a terry cloth or cotton towel light rubbing in circles.
Should have a leather resin, for horse bridles, reigns, leather saddle straps, that is a great moisturizer. Kinda like shoe polish, can;t remember the name of it from my ol' horse days...
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Saddle soap works good, found at tack and feed stores. Small dab on a terry cloth or cotton towel light rubbing in circles.
Should have a leather resin, for horse bridles, reigns, leather saddle straps, that is a great moisturizer. Kinda like shoe polish, can;t remember the name of it from my ol' horse days...
Justin makes one called "Boot Balm" or "Leather Balm"....any good boot store ar farm supply should have something similar.
http://www.lbswesternstore.com/bosuca.html
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most gun shops that sell lots of holsters also have it. Trackor supply, most feed stores, etc etc
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Lexol... a leather oil/ treatment./color]
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Careful, as most leather products, make the leather softer, and limper, and it will lose it's shape and character. I use Silicon spray, not the lubricant which is greasy. Works wonders. Keep treating the firearm with rust preventers.
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I wouldn't mind too much if the leather loosened up. It's a really tight fit on my M&P.
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Gents,
A little goes a long way with the leather care products. " A dab 'll do ya"...... I fix a ton of mistakes that people make with over-caring for the leather (usually oils and greases).
Saddle soap for cleaning and then something to add moisture and emollients to the leather.
Andy (leather guy)
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There is a fine line between leather preservation and leather integrity, as a high power competitor, and handgun competitor, things like the aforementioned Lexol, and or neats foot oil, are great for making leather supple and looking good, but bad for allowing leather to keep it's shape, and support. Too much neats foot on a sling will make it limp and lifeless, not allowing the support you need. Same thing with leather holsters, it will lose its form, become too loose, a good leather holster, will have a definite hardness to it, the shape will remain, and the stiffness, silicon allows for good retention, but once the pistol moves, it is like lightning. I love leather over Kydex, but, Kydex is king, especially if suede lined and silicon treated..
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For those of you who have used a leather a while. Does this white dulling effect sound like a lack of moisture in the leather. I am talking about the inner lining the rough area. When I remove the gun I wipe it down with rem oil and the gun looks fine but I just want to stop this wear on the gun as to prevent any finish damage.
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My problem is the creaking noise my Crossbreed holster for my M&P is making when I Move any suggestions to quite it down? ???
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Garand,
re: Finish wear.
You are always going to have some wear on a gun in a holster, the constant movement of the holster material against your finish will abrade it away, sometimes slowly, sometimes quickly depending on finish and materials used. There is not much you can do to stop holster wear other than not carrying your gun!
Let me get some photos of my GSP up, it is shiny in spots from riding in my CCW and my Duty rigs.
NOTE: Watch out for suede lined holsters, some are great some are not. I have seen some serious finish damage from suede lined rigs. The suede acts like a dirt/dust sponge and then is like sandpaper up against your pistol giving premature wear and tear.
Andy
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Don't know if anyone else has tried it, but Mink Oil (comes in a shoe-polish-type can) has worked well for me in maintaining a decent finish and eliminating the "creak" some holsters have. It doesn't take much, just a little worked in with a piece of rag. Let it sit for awhile and buff it some to remove any excess. Also tends to seal the leather against water and stains, but it will darken light leathers slightly. And keep it away from suede.
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Gents, Be really careful applying products, I have had to fix waaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyy too many holsters that were overlubed/overwaxed/over-messed-up .....I tend to stick with a decent cleaning when needed then a dab 'o polish for the outside, MAYBE some lexol for the inside.
Andy
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I agree with Andy...don't overkill the lubricants and conditioners...
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As my business is making concealed carry holsters let me offer a few suggestions. First the light color on your slide that returns to normal when you oil it is due to the leather absorbing the oil that is on the slide. Nothing to be concerned with. Second it is not a good idea to treat the inside of the holster with anything although a light spray of silicone oil will not hurt the leather. Initially a good leather holster will fit very tight. This is necessary as leather will stretch a small amount with use and the fit will be just right. Wearing the holster with the gun in for a couple of hours will allow it to aclimate to the weapon, your form and how tightly you buckle your belt. This is called breaking in a holster.
Third finish wear from carrying in a holster is inevitable but can be minimized. It does not come from contact with the leather as leather being much softer than gunmetal is not capable of wearing the metal. What causes it is the transfere of primer residue from the gun to the leather mixed with the oil on the surface of the weapon. This makes a mildly abrasive paste when combined with the movement of the weapon in the holster causes finish wear. A close stitchline and detail molding minimizes the movement of the weapon thereby minimizing but not eliminating finish wear. Interesting that soft leather, like suede, traps more of this residue and actually increases wear.
Fourth regarding holster creaking. This comes from breaking down of the fibers in the leather as it learns to be a holster. It will go away on it's own with use.
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Third finish wear from carrying in a holster is inevitable but can be minimized. It does not come from contact with the leather as leather being much softer than gunmetal is not capable of wearing the metal. What causes it is the transfere of primer residue from the gun to the leather mixed with the oil on the surface of the weapon. This makes a mildly abrasive paste when combined with the movement of the weapon in the holster causes finish wear.
Can you show us the science on that? You get holster wear even with kydex, and that does not have anywhere for this formula to adhere.
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Can you show us the science on that? You get holster wear even with kydex, and that does not have anywhere for this formula to adhere.
It's not science it's common sense. Where do you see finish wear on a revolver that's been holster carried? At the muzzle and forward edge of the cylinder. With an auto it is at the muzzle and front of dust cover. Now these are not the only areas that touch the inside of the holster but they are the areas that show the most wear. As to kydex. Particles that can wear steel can imbed in kydex.
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Third finish wear from carrying in a holster is inevitable but can be minimized. It does not come from contact with the leather as leather being much softer than gunmetal is not capable of wearing the metal. What causes it is the transfere of primer residue from the gun to the leather mixed with the oil on the surface of the weapon. This makes a mildly abrasive paste when combined with the movement of the weapon in the holster causes finish wear. A close stitchline and detail molding minimizes the movement of the weapon thereby minimizing but not eliminating finish wear. Interesting that soft leather, like suede, traps more of this residue and actually increases wear.
Not trying to split hairs here, but in my experiences as an industrial mechanic, I have seen multiple instances of softer materials wearing out steel. I've seen a rubber hose wear through the side of a steel hydraulic line and I've witnessed plastic guides wear out hardened steel wheels, while the plastic showed no wear at all.
Friction is the major culprit.............It's just like water carving a canyon out of stone.......it just takes time and movement.
Other than that part, I can't directly argue one way or the other with the rest of your statement. It might make sense that residue on the gun can mix into the leather, thus creating a mild "sandpaper-like" effect and contributing to speeding up wear.
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Sorry, but I think your "theory" is bunk. There are often other areas on a gun which experience the holster wear, consistent with having direct contact with leather (or kydex). Wear from use in a kydex holster clearly shows that your theory is invalid. Holster wear happens just as quickly in either a leather or kydex holster.
The chemical interaction that you report happens well after the holster has been used for some amount of time and the oils have had the time to transfer and imbed themselves in the leather.
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Sorry, but I think your "theory" is bunk. There are often other areas on a gun which experience the holster wear, consistent with having direct contact with leather (or kydex). Wear from use in a kydex holster clearly shows that your theory is invalid. Holster wear happens just as quickly in either a leather or kydex holster.
The chemical interaction that you report happens well after the holster has been used for some amount of time and the oils have had the time to transfer and imbed themselves in the leather.
It's not a chemical interaction it's a mechanical transfere. So you think my theory is "bunk" that's fine. What is your theory on what causes finish wear?
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Friction, i.e., direct contact, with the leather (or kydex) is what causes the holster wear.
Your "mechanical transfer" doesn't occur until long after the holster wear has already occurred/begun. Your theory has a great deal of chemical interaction in it. It's that "paste" interacting with the finish with the gun, especially when the gun is in the holster, don't you think?
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Not trying to split hairs here, but in my experiences as an industrial mechanic, I have seen multiple instances of softer materials wearing out steel. I've seen a rubber hose wear through the side of a steel hydraulic line and I've witnessed plastic guides wear out hardened steel wheels, while the plastic showed no wear at all.
Friction is the major culprit.............It's just like water carving a canyon out of stone.......it just takes time and movement.
Other than that part, I can't directly argue one way or the other with the rest of your statement. It might make sense that residue on the gun can mix into the leather, thus creating a mild "sandpaper-like" effect and contributing to speeding up wear.
I take it then that you agree that minimizing movement with a close stitchline and detail molding would minimize wear?
I probably shouldn't have stated that leather being softer than steel is not capable of wearing steel since there is always someone who has to take issue with any absolute statement. After all we know that water under extreme pressure does a good job of cutting steel
In any case all I was trying to do was offer some helpful insight from my experience not start a major controversy.
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Friction, i.e., direct contact, with the leather (or kydex) is what causes the holster wear.
Your "mechanical transfer" doesn't occur until long after the holster wear has already occurred/begun. Your theory has a great deal of chemical interaction in it. It's that "paste" interacting with the finish with the gun, especially when the gun is in the holster, don't you think?
This is starting to get silly. Under your theory then the gun should show wear in multiple areas, essentially anywhere the material contacts the weapon while in the holster. Simply, from observation, this is not what happens. You are certainly entitled to your own theory. As I stated in another post I was only trying to offer some insight, from observation and experience as to the cause of holster wear.
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This is starting to get silly. Under your theory then the gun should show wear in multiple areas, essentially anywhere the material contacts the weapon while in the holster. Simply, from observation, this is not what happens. You are certainly entitled to your own theory. As I stated in another post I was only trying to offer some insight, from observation and experience as to the cause of holster wear.
Silly? Really? There's direct contact at the tip of the barrel, at the beginning edges of the cylinder, at the leading edges of the frame on a revolver under the barrel, around the trigger guard. Those all have direct contact and show holster wear. I've seen holster wear on the sides of the slide, sides of the cylinder as well. Sounds like multiple areas to me. I've seen some guns show wear very quickly, in part because the original finish is so poor. Other guns it takes a bit longer.
My experience is based on having made over 10,000 holsters in the last few years....
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Silly? Really? There's direct contact at the tip of the barrel, at the beginning edges of the cylinder, at the leading edges of the frame on a revolver under the barrel, around the trigger guard. Those all have direct contact and show holster wear. I've seen holster wear on the sides of the slide, sides of the cylinder as well. Sounds like multiple areas to me. I've seen some guns show wear very quickly, in part because the original finish is so poor. Other guns it takes a bit longer.
My experience is based on having made over 10,000 holsters in the last few years....
Obviously our experiences differ. I've only made a little over 4K holsters since I started in business but I carried professionally for 30 years. Interesting that I mostly use real guns for forming holsters and they are in and out of leather constantly and none show any signs of wear. I must be lucky I guess.
You have your opinion I have mine. I think we can agree that for whatever reason carrying in a holster will eventually lead to finish wear and that it can be minimized by minimizing movement. Is that a fair statement?
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I take it then that you agree that minimizing movement with a close stitchline and detail molding would minimize wear?
I probably shouldn't have stated that leather being softer than steel is not capable of wearing steel since there is always someone who has to take issue with any absolute statement. After all we know that water under extreme pressure does a good job of cutting steel
In any case all I was trying to do was offer some helpful insight from my experience not start a major controversy.
I would think that it (close stitchline and detail molding) would definitely help minimize in-holster movement by the gun, and thereby minimize friction wear.
Nothing we can really do to stop the wear from holstering and un-holstering.
And for the record, ALL helpful info and insights into any particular area is welcome here (particularly by myself, and others interested in understanding as much as possible about guns and accessories).
No controversy, as far as what my opinion may count for. That is one problem with the typewritten word versus the spoken word, it makes it hard to emphasize the particulars and sometimes avoid misunderstandings.
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I carried for over 20 years in law enforcement and other environments, and have carried concealed for over 15 years. So again, I have a fair amount of real world experience. I imagine there are folks here who have more experience than I.
I find it hard to believe that none of your guns show holster wear if they're "in and out of the holster constantly." Be that as it may, it is what it is.
And yes, obviously, we each have our own opinion as to how holster wear occurs and the cures for it.
I'll refrain from further comment on this subject. Best of luck to those here in their endeavors to learn the how's and why's of making holsters. 8)
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For the sake of abrading metals with softer materials.
I've seen dozens of examples of cardboard polishing stainless steel to a mirror shine in the past. We built all our ventilation out of 304SS with a #4 finish (think kitchen sink grain) and shipped it wrapped in cardboard cartons. Anywhere the cardboard was in contact with the metal was a problem. We ended up redoing all of our packaging as a result.
I have no doubt that leather would do much the same over time. Personally, holster wear adds character to a gun anyway!