The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Defense and Tactics => Topic started by: mzmtg on February 10, 2010, 10:07:38 AM
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My wife's coworker interrupted a number of people burglarizing her home yesterday afternoon. She walked up on one of the perps coming around the corner of her house carrying her son's rifle he had just stolen. Thankfully, the gun wasn't loaded and the perp was more interested in escaping than having any sort of confrontation.
No one was hurt, but the story got me thinking.
I usually keep my daily carry gun (and a flashlight) in a concealed & accessible position near my nightstand when I go to bed at night. I keep a loaded Sport Utility Rifle in the closet as well. We don't have any kids in the house, so that type of unauthorized access is not a concern right now.
But, if someone broke into my house while we weren't home, they would quickly find a loaded rifle ready for their use.
So I'm trying to think of a better way to set things up. I'm thinking of keeping the rifle in the closet, but keeping the loaded magazine in a separate, concealed location that is still easy to access quickly. I'm also looking for ideas on storing the rifle with the magazine inserted, but in a more concealed location that is still quickly accessible.
Anyone have any suggestions?
???
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Great question, I look forward to seeing other responses. One of my thoughts was that if you have a small pistol safe that it should be bolted in place so someone breaking in could not take it and then find a way to open it and get a gun they could use in future crimes later.
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I have young kids (4) in my house so that is always a concern of mine because I DO have loaded weapons accessible to my wife and I. How to store them is a constant concern and under constant scrutiny, mainly from the wife.
I have a small safe with an electronic keypad that I can get into quickly and have considered one of those 'in the wall' safes that fit between the wall studs to install somewhere like the closet for the AR. I feel that I could get to that in a reasonable time frame. While not exactly hidden, it would not be quickly apparent to an intruder.
I know that it won't be fast enough for MY tastes but at least it is better than being locked in the safe room downstairs. With kiddos in the house I can't have weapons around unlocked, no matter how much training/education I try to give them. 4 years old is still 4 years old.
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This is about what I was thinking of.
http://wallsafestore.com/riflewallsafe.htm
:)
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I belive they covered this on TBD. Mounting the gun overhead above the closet door inside the closet is a good place. Most thieves would never bother to look there and its too high for kids to get to. I plan on employing this technique at my house, and could be adapted for both long gun and handgun applications.
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Talked to the Truck Vault people at Shot Show about this. (they make other stuff too :))
They have a product called the Shot Lock that attaches to your wall and holds a shotgun or similar long gun. It has a key lock and/or a push button combo lock to open it. Looked and functioned great at the show. No idea on the price. www.truckvault.com although I looked and didn't find it on their website yet.
Other ideas: I'll preface this by saying I do have small children in the house. I keep a small pistol inside of a large hollowed out book on the bookshelf next to my bed. Left unloaded with mag inside the box too. my kids are small enough that they can't manipulate the slide even if they happened to find it.
All other guns are in a huge safe in the garage. I'd pay the bad guys just to watch them try and carry that thing away.
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How about the wall clocks that open to hold a pistol? I thought of having one right by the door we come in just in case someone beats us home.
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How about the wall clocks that open to hold a pistol? I thought of having one right by the door we come in just in case someone beats us home.
They make something similar to conceal an AR too.
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How about the wall clocks that open to hold a pistol? I thought of having one right by the door we come in just in case someone beats us home.
A Clock by the door may or may not work.
If you saw a clock in a similar location at a friend house, would you think it was out of place?
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I belive they covered this on TBD. Mounting the gun overhead above the closet door inside the closet is a good place. Most thieves would never bother to look there and its too high for kids to get to. I plan on employing this technique at my house, and could be adapted for both long gun and handgun applications.
I know the experts on TBD know best, but I would never assume that a child could not get to a gun over a closet, there are very ingenious and determined. Personally, I would not consider "out of reach" or "hidden" as a safe way to store a loaded firearm with children in the house (barring infants of course.) Bottom line, I would rather take my chances needing more time to get a gun than take my chances with a child finding a loaded gun.
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This is a problem I have been wrestling with for a while now I and I guess I am not smart enough to figure it out yet :-\. I use gunvaults for my handguns, two firearms upstairs and two down. But I have not figured out something for long guns.
We have a hope chest in our bedroom that is just the right size for my Stoegar side by side that I use in CAS. However since we have youngins come to our house regularly I am little leary about having it there. The kids are from a home that has no guns and the parents think that guns are bad so educating them is not really an option even though it would solve the problem.
One friend did come up with an interesting solution however. He got some wall lockers from a school when they fixed it up and after a fresh coat of paint they went into his basement workout room/laundry room. A civilian legal M4 fits in there perfectly. He keeps the rifle in there with acouple of magazines ready to go. His living room in his basement as well so the family does spend a lot of time down there and now they have easy access to a long gun. Little kids are forbidden to go into a laundry room and what child wants to do laundry anyway? Yet the weapon is easy to get to in case something does go wrong.
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I am a big fan of the GunVault Products for quick access to defensive guns. I use them on the shows and DVDs because I use them at home.
-RJP
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Rob,
As I read reviews written by people that have purchased Gun Vault I see a lot of comments that once the batteries need replacing the electronic locks don't work correctly any more. Comments like they can hear it click, but it doesn't open without a key.
Have you experienced this, heard of this, or is this a case of we need to be smarter than the safe?
I just don't want to invest a hundred dollars in a fancy box that doesn't stand up.
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Rob,
As I read reviews written by people that have purchased Gun Vault I see a lot of comments that once the batteries need replacing the electronic locks don't work correctly any more. Comments like they can hear it click, but it doesn't open without a key.
Have you experienced this, heard of this, or is this a case of we need to be smarter than the safe?
I just don't want to invest a hundred dollars in a fancy box that doesn't stand up.
The Deluxe versions of GunVault safes have a battery low audible alert.
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The Deluxe versions of GunVault safes have a battery low audible alert.
I left out a key thing they posted - After they replace the batteries the lock clicks, but the door doesn't open unless they use the key.
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A "personal" gun safe to locate a gun in the house is a secondary protection for children of age to understand the implications of weapons. For children below the age of understanding, keeping loaded weapons out of reach is primary protection for children...a safe may be one way of doing this.
Primary protection for children who have understanding is education. Firing a weapon into a watermellon at close range is quite graphic. I had my boys shoot when they were quite young. First they got to shoot the rimfire and learn not to fear the weapon, then I progressed upwards to mild centerifire. Once they were happy with the mild centerfire I made them shoot a few full power roundhouse loads at close targets...like water jugs and watermelons. Not one round an quit...but about a dozen....enough where they would not forget the unpleasantness of full power rounds at a young age.
Immediately they shot the rimfire rounds to "get back in the groove". They still like shooting and it impressed upon them the seriousness of picking up a weapon. Your mileage will vary, this worked for us.
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Great method, Rastus
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Another option that no one has mentioned is jobsite tool storage boxes.
Depending on your application, this may be a less obvious way to store a firearm than a gun safe that screams, "Guns inside!"
Tool storage boxes are somewhat secure if locked and chained in place, but are slow to access for primary weapons.
They are relatively inexpensive compared to a real gun safe...although, clearly, they don't offer the same protection.
However, one caveat though, storing firearms in jobsite tool storage boxes may be specifically forbidden by the manufacturer and will void the warranty...but do you really need a warranty on a steel box? Use at your own risk.
They are sold at Home Depot, Lowes, Grainger's, and other construction supply houses.
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Another option that no one has mentioned is jobsite tool storage boxes.
We had a good thread on this topic
http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=7060.0
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We had a good thread on this topic
http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=7060.0
That reminds me.............. I HATE BILL ! ! ! :D
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We had a good thread on this topic
http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=7060.0
Thanks. I'll read that.
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This is a problem I have been wrestling with for a while now I and I guess I am not smart enough to figure it out yet :-\. I use gunvaults for my handguns, two firearms upstairs and two down. But I have not figured out something for long guns.
We have a hope chest in our bedroom that is just the right size for my Stoegar side by side that I use in CAS. However since we have youngins come to our house regularly I am little leary about having it there. The kids are from a home that has no guns and the parents think that guns are bad so educating them is not really an option even though it would solve the problem.
One friend did come up with an interesting solution however. He got some wall lockers from a school when they fixed it up and after a fresh coat of paint they went into his basement workout room/laundry room. A civilian legal M4 fits in there perfectly. He keeps the rifle in there with acouple of magazines ready to go. His living room in his basement as well so the family does spend a lot of time down there and now they have easy access to a long gun. Little kids are forbidden to go into a laundry room and what child wants to do laundry anyway? Yet the weapon is easy to get to in case something does go wrong.
The kids issue is huge. Much like DWI, the pendulum has swung too far. First it was ignoring or excusing drunk drivers, now its crucifying someone who has 4 beers. With guns and kids, it was absolving gunowners of any responsibility for accidents, to nailing you to the wall if a kid who is old enough and been taught better (about 10 IMHO) breaks the rules. I have no kids in the house and so don't secure anything. If I did, I would figure that my odds of an 8 year old doing something dumb are far greater than my odds of a home invasion. In Grad school, where I lived in group houses with drunken idiots (like me), I kept a trigger lock on the guns. They were master locks with one key. I kept one taped to the back of my night stand with a pistol in the drawer. I could get to it quickly, my roomies and their friends didn't know it was there. Just a thought.
FQ13
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i have 2 small children (6.5 & 2.5) in the house and a wife who had never touched a gun before she met me so this is a constant issue. I use a gunvault that is bolted onto my night stand that has a Glock 21 on the top shelf with an Itac WLL1 light/laser combo. The bottom shelf is extra 21 mags and loaded AR Mags. I have an unloaded AR under the bed in a little sling that I made. It's actually up under the fabric on the bottom of the box spring, highly unlikely you'd find it if you didn't know it was there but I can have it out in under 5 seconds when laying flat in the bed (I've practiced and timed it quite a bit). In my closet which isn't the walk-in but a regular reach in closet I cut out the drywall above the door opening and made a compartment that holds a 18" barrel shotgun. I made a door out of 1/4" thick plywood and put a piano hinge along the top. I painted it to match the closet walls and if you didn't know what you were looking for you'd never see it although you can reach up and bring out the shotgun pretty quickly. I keep it loaded but not chambered and do have the door set up to add a small lock if I ever feel the need.
I have another gunvault, the small biometric model that is mounted to the shelf in the living room where I keep my wallet, knives, flashlights and everything else that leaves the house in my pockets. It easily holds my primary carry gun and my back up when I come home. At the front door I installed one of the small in the wall safes that mounts between the studs it's a combination lock but I recently purchased a biometric lock to upgrade it but haven't installed it yet. I built a small shelving unit that holds keys and cell phones etc. with chargers built in. I mounted this over the safe with a hinge on one side. You'd never notice that it even opens if you looked right at it.
Everything else lives in my large Liberty Safe in my wife's walk-in closet. I feel like I've kept my kids safe while maintaining pretty easy access in every part of the house. My son has who's almost 7 has just started to really become interested in shooting. He's been shooting my M&P 22 pretty well and wants his first "real" AR for his 7th birthday. As a side note even when I'm home and have locked up my primary carry gun and my backup since I bought my LCP I almost always have it in my pocket until I go to bed. Even laying on the couch in a pair of shorts I hardly notice it's there. I was always taught the best gun was the one you could get to the fastest.
As far as a place for long guns my dad built a cabinet into the wall between the studs and made a solid wood door with heavy hinges. He installed a regular combination home entry door lock exactly like he has on his house doors. It's not as secure as a gunsafe but most burglars won't take the time to get into it and it keeps the grandkids out. It holds 2 long guns and has a shelf above for handguns, ammo, flashlights etc.
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iicame up with a little different aproach. I have one of the electic key pad safes nex to the bed for hand guns. But over the closet door Ihave a Rossi Circuit Judge. Loaded with pdx1 loads and 45 lc. This fiream comes with a built in lock that locks the trigger with a small key. When the grand kids are around or I am gone I lock it.
I also sleep with a tarus Judge same loads.
You can pick up small motion detectors for the room or closet from Home Depot for 40.00 with remote. Just arm the closet. No bad guy will spend any time around there once that noise maker goes off.