The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: david86440 on April 20, 2010, 11:15:41 PM
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Good ole California! Can't even keep what little rights we do/did have. They are talking not being able to carry an "unloaded" gun here, never mind an actual loaded handgun. I'm glad I have my CCW.
SACRAMENTO — Siding with law enforcement authorities, California lawmakers on Tuesday advanced legislation that would make it illegal to openly carry a gun in public, even if it's unloaded.
The bill cleared its first committee after an emotional debate that pitted public safety concerns against Second Amendment rights cited by gun owners.
"I think it puts all of us at such great risk," said Assemblywoman Nancy Skinner, D-Berkeley, one of four Democrats who voted for the ban.
Two Republicans on the Assembly Public Safety Committee voted against the bill, which now goes to the appropriations panel.
Current California law allows gun owners to carry a rifle or handgun in a holster in public if it is unloaded.
The bill's author, Assemblywoman Lori Saldana, D-San Diego, said unloaded guns pose a threat, in part because gun owners are allowed to carry ammunition and could load their weapon within seconds.
To emphasize her point, she wore a bulletproof vest while testifying before the committee.
Law enforcement also can't tell whether a gun is unloaded when approaching a person, said Lt. Wayne Bilowit, legislative advocate for the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department.
"If you're carrying a gun and a magazine next to it, if you make a sudden movement, we don't know if the gun is loaded or unloaded," Bilowit said. "Sooner or later, someone is going to get hurt."
Florida, Illinois, Texas and the District of Columbia have a similar open-carry ban, according to the Legal Community Against Violence, a public interest law center based in San Francisco.
While California and 34 other states allow people to carry guns without a license, only California, North Dakota and Utah require that the weapon be unloaded.
Republicans on the Assembly committee complained the Democratic-controlled Legislature already has adopted too many laws restricting legitimate gun ownership in the state.
"Basically, the ones that are using these laws, the law-abiding citizens, are the ones being hurt here, not the criminals," said Assemblyman Curt Hagman, R-Chino Hills.
In California, loaded weapons can be carried in public only by those who have a concealed-weapons permit, which would not change under the Saldana bill.
Those permits are hard to obtain, requiring people to demonstrate they need to be armed. For that reason, gun owners say their only option is to carry an unloaded weapon as a way to deter trouble.
"If this bill were to be passed, I would be less safe," said Walter Stanley of the San Francisco suburb of Livermore. "What we're talking about is a right to bear arms, not a privilege."
Stanley, who began carrying his handgun about four months ago, is a member of the growing open-carry movement, which encourages gun owners to wear their weapons as they go about their daily lives.
Gun advocates gathered Monday at rallies in Washington, D.C., and outside the state Capitol in Sacramento to demonstrate for their right to bear arms.
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I hate to say I told you so, but...
I told you so.
I knew this was coming as soon as all the news crews started doing storys on the OCers. people don't know its unloaded, they just see the gun.
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I've got family and friends in Kalifornistan so it would pose an extreme expense to get them all moved to Arizona, but maybe it's time to give this embarrassment of a state back to Mexico.
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Law enforcement also can't tell whether a gun is unloaded when approaching a person, said Lt. Wayne Bilowit, legislative advocate for the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department.
And their super secret x-ray vision and esp allow them to know if someone has a loaded gun in their baggy jeans illegally ??? Oooooops, if they were using those tools they would know that the legal gun was unloaded as well. Another law that stops law abiding citizens from exercising their Rights! And, because the Second Amendment is not PC the courts will call this reasonable.
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And their super secret x-ray vision and esp allow them to know if someone has a loaded gun in their baggy jeans illegally ??? Oooooops, if they were using those tools they would know that the legal gun was unloaded as well. Another law that stops law abiding citizens from exercising their Rights! And, because the Second Amendment is not PC the courts will call this reasonable.
Nooo...next step is to pass a law stating all citizens must assume the hand on the wall, feet apart when they see LEO's approaching so they will be able to determine who is a criminal by searching them
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maybe it's time to give this embarrassment of a state back to Mexico.
No need to. They've already taken it, and stuck us with the bill in the process. Bill T.
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Some good pro gun Representative or Senator needs to attach an amendment to this that will reform the CCW laws to a Shall issue! I don't like the idea of banning Open carry, but I would rather lose the battle of UNLOADED Open Carry and win the war on CCW of LOADED weapons!
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Some good pro gun Representative or Senator needs to attach an amendment to this that will reform the CCW laws to a Shall issue! I don't like the idea of banning Open carry, but I would rather lose the battle of UNLOADED Open Carry and win the war on CCW of LOADED weapons!
Ageed, let them pass it. I admire the unloaded open carry folks but..... To my mind, this is just asking for trouble. Eg (Uloaded gun please steal/notice to high strung cops, I may be threat). Neither sounds like a great idea. But if getting uniform consensus to kill it means shall issue? Then its well worth it. If it won't help, then fight for it just to keep the antis busy on non-sense while we wait for the Court.
FQ13
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You don't have to have the gun unloaded in North Dakota.
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You don't have to have the gun unloaded in North Dakota.
You sure? that wasn't my understanding of the law when it comes to open carry (w/o the ccw and even then I thought it was frowned down on) other than when in the field hunting...don't get me wrong I'd be happy to be wrong about it
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I dont have a CCw but i do carry when i go to work just like my co-wokers do. We work in a rough part of town and it is stupid not too. I had a run in with members of MS13 one day after work, and ever since then i keep my G26 close. I dont care what law im breaking my life is more important.
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I dont have a CCw but i do carry when i go to work just like my co-wokers do. We work in a rough part of town and it is stupid not too. I had a run in with members of MS13 one day after work, and ever since then i keep my G26 close. I dont care what law im breaking my life is more important.
Someone who looks a lot like me may have been there some years back, but man its not a good place to be. Good,luck.
FQ13