The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Politics & RKBA => Topic started by: tombogan03884 on September 04, 2010, 02:58:38 PM
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More at link but I found the highlighted part especially amusing ;D
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100904/ap_on_re_us/us_sept11_muslim_fear
NEW YORK – American Muslims are boosting security at mosques, seeking help from leaders of other faiths and airing ads underscoring their loyalty to the United States — all ahead of a 9/11 anniversary they fear could bring more trouble for their communities.
Their goal is not only to protect Muslims, but also to prevent them from retaliating if provoked. One Sept. 11 protest in New York against the proposed mosque near ground zero is expected to feature Geert Wilders, the aggressively anti-Islam Dutch lawmaker. The same day in Gainesville, Fla., the Dove World Outreach Center plans to burn copies of the Quran.
"We can expect crazy people out there will do things, but we don't want to create a hysteria," among Muslims, said Victor Begg of the Council of Islamic Organizations of Michigan. "Americans, in general, they support pluralism. It's just that there's a lot of misinformation out there that has created confusion."
On Tuesday, the Islamic Society of North America will hold a summit of Christian, Muslim and Jewish leaders in Washington "to address the growing tide of fear and intolerance" in the furor over the planned New York mosque.
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The "DOVE" World Outreach Center will burn Korans!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ::)
Only in Florida........ ::)
I mean look, I'm a Christian, and hardly Islam's number one fan as my posts will attest. Yet and still, there is making a point and standing up for your faith on the one hand, and being an obnoxious jackass that wants to pick a fight when it could be easily and honorably avoided on the other.
How would Christians react if the Muslims had "Burn a Bible Day"? What do these idots think will happen? The key to SD is to avoid a fight and to end it on your terms if it won't avoid you. Going out of your way to pick one? Particularly if you drag me into it without asking my permission first? F*ck you very much! And you are dragging me into it, since I'm a Christian in Florida and will be stuck cleaning up your mess. Kiss My Christian Redneck Ass "DOVE" Outreach Center. With "Christians" like you who needs Muslims? Again I say KMA. Don't back down, but don't pick a fight either. Pastor, its time you grew up!
FQ13
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Ummm, actually FQ, in Saudi Arabia preaching Christianity is a capital offense.
That's a bit more extreme than burning a few books.
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Ummm, actually FQ, in Saudi Arabia preaching Christianity is a capital offense.
That's a bit more extreme than burning a few books.
Yep! Its why I think they are stone age age savages. However, that is their perogative as long as they don't bring their BS to my house. Me, I would prefer to be better than them. To quote my late lamented Great Grandfather, "There are plenty of reasons to kill a man. There are none to be rude to him".I'll cheerfully shoot them, I just like to know that I wasn't the one who started the fight. ;D
FQ13
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"There are plenty of reasons to kill a man. There are none to be rude to him".I'll cheerfully shoot them, I just like to know that I wasn't the one who started the fight. ;D
I LIKE THAT.
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Ummm, actually FQ, in Saudi Arabia preaching Christianity is a capital offense.
That's a bit more extreme than burning a few books.
I agree but let's not forget that Hitler burnt books as well!
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And they are at your house and in your streets.And cheering on 911, not mourning.
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I agree but let's not forget that Hitler burnt books as well!
Let's not forget that Hitler commissioned the building of the Volkswagen.
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Point is, if you go to Drudge Report, you'll find international protests over this from Saudi to Indonesia. Its all boiler plate "Death to America". the oppressed Muslim, Crusaders, Blah, Blah, Blah. ::) Still, why hand our enemies a weapon? A redneck (and not in the good sense of the term) media whore pastor wanted attention. He got it. What did he gain? A few less Korans, and a few more Jihadis. This is a win for us how? You want to fight Islam? Try funding a missionary to get folks to at least understand us, not inciting more folks to hate us. Is it just me, or does this not seem obvious?
Fq13
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Point is, if you go to Drudge Report, you'll find international protests over this from Saudi to Indonesia. Its all boiler plate "Death to America". the oppressed Muslim, Crusaders, Blah, Blah, Blah. ::) Still, why hand our enemies a weapon? A redneck (and not in the good sense of the term) media whore pastor wanted attention. He got it. What did he gain? A few less Korans, and a few more Jihadis. This is a win for us how? You want to fight Islam? Try funding a missionary to get folks to at least understand us, not inciting more folks to hate us. Is it just me, or does this not seem obvious?
Fq13
Same as when Hitler did it, same as when they smashed OJ's Heisman Trophy, symbolism to get the masses of sheep involved and worked up. This is one of the ways you stir the type of "Crowd mentality" that can be used for starting things like riots or lynchings.
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Same as when Hitler did it, same as when they smashed OJ's Heisman Trophy, symbolism to get the masses of sheep involved and worked up. This is one of the ways you stir the type of "Crowd mentality" that can be used for starting things like riots or lynchings.
Its seems to be working, only with US troops as theguests of honor at the necktie party. Here is General Petreaus' take from the WSJ:
FQ13
Its worth a read.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703713504575475500753093116.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLTopStories
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Here's my beef with Islam. Where are all these so called "moderate Muslims" when pre-teen youths and women detonate their suicide vests in crowded markets? Where are all these "peace loving moderates" when women are stoned in public? Where is the outcry from the moderate Muslim community. Even Catholics (myself included) are outraged by the actions of pedophile priests and the non action of bishops who look the other way or transfer the offending priest to a different diocese. But, we rarely hear from local Muslim leaders or followers. Maybe we so-called infidels would cut the religion as a whole a little slack if we saw some outrage on their part! It always seems that the non believers must suck it up and bow our heads in forgiveness for speaking ill of Islam. How about an ounce of sensitivity on their part? Building your mosque somewhere else in NYC would be a great start!
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I may be wrong, but here is my take on "moderate Islamists" - they are an unwitting (?) tool of the radicals. The camel putting its nose under the tent, if you will. Once they have established the beachhead then the radicals can come in and seize control since the moderates can't/wont stand up to them. There is no "moderate" Muslim country that practices Shari law. Egypt? Don't think so. Turkey? It's circling the drain. I'm not talking about an immediate change (it could take generations), but that is where they seem headed.
Like I said, I could be all wet about this. I'd love for someone to give me examples (preferably more than one) of a Muslim country that is considered a "moderate" (it would be nice if they embraced/practiced some western freedoms as well) and isn't sliding down that slope.
Much of Western Europe is grappling with this much more intently (and in various manners) than we are, but we aren't far behind them in the need to sort out what it is we are going to do. And I have my politically incorrect opinions on that as well. ;)
Kipling was right - OH, East is East, and West is West, and never the twain shall meet.
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a religious zealot, is the most dangerous person in the world. It does not matter, what they practice, history has shown us time and time again that they are by far the most dangerous people on earth.
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Hey Ichiban! How about Dearborn, Michigan? (Largest Middle Eastern population in the U.S.)
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Hey Ichiban! How about Dearborn, Michigan? (Largest Middle Eastern population in the U.S.)
As a former Ford employee.....
(http://i755.photobucket.com/albums/xx191/saharrold/Nuke1.jpg)
No hard feeling?
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Your moderate muslim countrie? Indonesia, parts of the Phillipines, Morroco, Tunisia, Senegal, Egypt depending on your definition, Jordan,Turkey, some of the 'stans, the UAE, France, Michigan and a few others. ;) Some of these have more or less serious jihadi problems of their own, and some do practice some version of sharia. No where I would choose to live. Still, they are not so oppresive (by regional standards) that you would write them off as being hot beds of fundamentalism either.
However as to the moderates curtailing the radicals, we don't see it as much as we should, but these things come and go.
In the fifties and sixties, moderate to liberal Christianity was on the rise in the Protestant and Catholic churches. Now fundamenalism or at least conservatism seems to have the upper hand. I would also say I haven't heard conservative Christian leaders like Pat Robertson condemn the Quran burners, despite General Patreaus asking these guys to stop.Its only a fifty member church, and them doing something stupid to get attention is going to get folks killed.
FQ13 who isn't comparing Christianity with Islam, as we aren't blowing folks up. Just saying that religious leaders rarely fire on their own fringe, which is too bad, as those are voices that need to be heard in order to delegitimate the radicals.
PS a correction. The national Council of churches and the Natioal Association of Evangelicas did condemn them. Kudos.
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Your moderate muslim countrie? Indonesia, parts of the Phillipines, Morroco, Tunisia, Senegal, Egypt depending on your definition, Jordan,Turkey, some of the 'stans, the UAE, France, Michigan and a few others. ;) Some of these have more or less serious jihadi problems of their own, and some do practice some version of sharia. No where I would choose to live. Still, they are not so oppresive (by regional standards) that you would write them off as being hot beds of fundamentalism either.
Can't say that I would consider any of the mentioned countries an effective argument as most are sliding downhill fast.
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I agree but let's not forget that Hitler burnt books as well!
Hitler= government burning books
Dove= private citizen burning books
Big difference.
BTW if any body's interested, I can run down during UM/Ohio State half time and take a few photos. Saturday is going to be interesting. UF/USF football game at 1:00 p.m. So there will be a bunch of extra folks in town. USF is famous for:
http://www.investigativeproject.org/426/indicted-usf-student-has-terror-past-in (http://www.investigativeproject.org/426/indicted-usf-student-has-terror-past-in)
http://www.militantislammonitor.org/article/id/477 (http://www.militantislammonitor.org/article/id/477)
http://edition.cnn.com/2003/US/South/02/20/professor.arrest/ (http://edition.cnn.com/2003/US/South/02/20/professor.arrest/)
There was talk of shutting down University Ave. on Saturday to tighten up security. The church where this is suppose to take place is 40 + blocks North of the University. Needless to say, this Saturday should prove to be interesting....
GO 'CANES
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Cool, good to see our Smart donkey found his way back to the "bad" part of the pasture ;D
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Here's my beef with Islam. Where are all these so called "moderate Muslims" when pre-teen youths and women detonate their suicide vests in crowded markets? Where are all these "peace loving moderates" when women are stoned in public? Where is the outcry from the moderate Muslim community. Even Catholics (myself included) are outraged by the actions of pedophile priests and the non action of bishops who look the other way or transfer the offending priest to a different diocese. But, we rarely hear from local Muslim leaders or followers. Maybe we so-called infidels would cut the religion as a whole a little slack if we saw some outrage on their part! It always seems that the non believers must suck it up and bow our heads in forgiveness for speaking ill of Islam. How about an ounce of sensitivity on their part? Building your mosque somewhere else in NYC would be a great start!
Well spoken Graywolf! I couldn't agree more.
Ocin
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Here's my beef with Islam. Where are all these so called "moderate Muslims" when pre-teen youths and women detonate their suicide vests in crowded markets? Where are all these "peace loving moderates" when women are stoned in public? Where is the outcry from the moderate Muslim community. Even Catholics (myself included) are outraged by the actions of pedophile priests and the non action of bishops who look the other way or transfer the offending priest to a different diocese. But, we rarely hear from local Muslim leaders or followers. Maybe we so-called infidels would cut the religion as a whole a little slack if we saw some outrage on their part! It always seems that the non believers must suck it up and bow our heads in forgiveness for speaking ill of Islam. How about an ounce of sensitivity on their part? Building your mosque somewhere else in NYC would be a great start!
Yep...just because they ain't fighting, doesn't mean they ain't haulin' ammo.
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Very succinct way of putting it.