The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Politics & RKBA => Topic started by: Teresa Heilevang on February 12, 2008, 10:39:18 PM
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HOW LONG DOES THE USA HAVE?
About the time our original thirteen states adopted their new constitution in 1787, Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at the University of Edinburgh , had this to say about the fall of the Athenian Republic some 2,000 years earlier:
'A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government.' ''A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury.'' From that moment on, the majority always vote for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship.'' 'The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about 200 years'' ''During those
200 years, those nations always progressed through the following sequence:
1. From bondage to spiritual faith;
2. From spiritual faith to great courage;
3. From courage to liberty;
4. From liberty to abundance;
5. From abundance to complacency;
6. From complacency to apathy,
7. From apathy to dependence;
8. From dependence back into bondage'
I believe the United State is now somewhere between the 'complacency and apathy' phase of Professor Tyler's definition of democracy, with some forty percent of the nation's population already having reached the 'governmental dependency' phase. If Congress grants amnesty and citizenship to twenty million criminal invaders called illegal and they vote, then we can say goodbye to the USA as we knew it, in fewer than five years.
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M'ette Thats scary. Jefferson must have been refering to this work when he said "when the masses find they can vote themselves bread and circuses they will". Since all current Pres. candidates are soft on Illegal aliens, what do we do next?
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Beats the hell out of me.. and I don't think I'm alone with that answer. :-\
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If you accept that democracies do not last, and we may be hitting somewhere around 6 or7 on the progression chart, where would you rank the people of Mexico? Mac.
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People get so hung up on illegals they get blinded and can't think. If you are worried about cultural changes and impacts then you had better start worrying about LEGAL immigration as well. Legal immigration can change the good ole USA too.
Frankly, I think it's time to end all immigration to this country. We should close the doors and shoot for zero population growth or in another 100 years the country will be so overpopulated the standard of living will have gone to hell.
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I think your post is right on Ms M , unfortunately.
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People get so hung up on illegals they get blinded and can't think. If you are worried about cultural changes and impacts then you had better start worrying about LEGAL immigration as well. Legal immigration can change the good ole USA too.
Frankly, I think it's time to end all immigration to this country. We should close the doors and shoot for zero population growth or in another 100 years the country will be so overpopulated the standard of living will have gone to hell.
Clay,
I think that in general the people that come here legally tend to blend in better because they worked to get here.
It's the Mariel boat lift and political asylum as well as the illegals that want to live here under their old rules and culture.
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Somewhat related, so I'll post it here.
http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBViewItem.asp?ID=526
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Somewhat related, so I'll post it here.
http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBViewItem.asp?ID=526
OUTSTANDING! Thank you Hazcat
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someguy...That is a great article. ..as are so many of the comments and articles posted in here. I sent it on to several of my guy friends. They in turn will send it on to their friends and once again.. the internet does it's job! Thanks..
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OUTSTANDING! Thank you Hazcat
Your welcome Tom, but it was someguy who posted that excellent article.
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OOps Sorry ???
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Short answer. I just ordered 480 rounds of 30-06.
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someguy...That is a great article. ..as are so many of the comments and articles posted in here. I sent it on to several of my guy friends. They in turn will send it on to their friends and once again.. the internet does it's job! Thanks..
I'm here to help. :)
I was pretty impressed with it, too, so I figure the more people we share it with, the better.
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Somewhat related, so I'll post it here.
http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBViewItem.asp?ID=526
Did CA, MA, MD or any other Peoples Republic I might have missed rise up when their 2A rights were violated? NO. Will they? NO. If the Supremes rule against the 2A then we will lose because over time non gun owners will accept the court's ruling. And as our rights are gradually restricted gun owners will grumble but will cave just as gun owners in Britain and Australia did. And that will be that.
BTW, the gun friendly cop at the range or who goofs off at the gun shop while on duty will beat your door down in the middle of the nite to take your guns if told to do so. I still remember a column by Skeeter Skelton on gun control where he said as a law enforcement officer he would obey and enforce a ban on handguns if it came to that.
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Clay,
I think that in general the people that come here legally tend to blend in better because they worked to get here.
It's the Mariel boat lift and political asylum as well as the illegals that want to live here under their old rules and culture.
Are you absolutley, positively sure about that?
In any event the US population is growning due to immigration both legal and illegal. Resources are stretched thin now. Atlanta came within 90 days of running out of water due to drought. The southwest has suffered drought for years. Lakes Powell and Meade are way down. The Colorado River dries up miles before it gets to its mouth. Our quest for ethanol will have farmers plowing under marginal lands for corn. Fl is in danger of having its water table turn to salt water due to overuse.
Time for this nation to stabilize its population before we wind up a cesspool like India or China.
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Somewhat related, so I'll post it here.
http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBViewItem.asp?ID=526
Excellent article thanks.
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Are you absolutley, positively sure about that?
In any event the US population is growning due to immigration both legal and illegal. Resources are stretched thin now. Atlanta came within 90 days of running out of water due to drought. The southwest has suffered drought for years. Lakes Powell and Meade are way down. The Colorado River dries up miles before it gets to its mouth. Our quest for ethanol will have farmers plowing under marginal lands for corn. Fl is in danger of having its water table turn to salt water due to overuse.
Time for this nation to stabilize its population before we wind up a cesspool like India or China.
No I am not 100% positive but then, neither are you Clay.
The ethanol thing is a boondoggle and not very energy efficient at all but, like global warming it is more religeon than science.
As to other resources most of the problem is mis-management. Heck here in Tampa/St Pete they can't even figure out how to run a desal plant!
If we close the boarders and enforce the law MANY of our problems will fix themselves.
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Actually, the water supply has been talked about in many forums around the world, it will be the next big resource we run short on. lakes all over the southeast are dry or drying up, thats a fact.
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Actually, the water supply has been talked about in many forums around the world, it will be the next big resource we run short on. lakes all over the southeast are dry or drying up, thats a fact.
Good thing I like whiskey!
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Good thing I like whiskey!
I'm a Rum man myself but I do enjoy the occaisional bourbon with a good cigar. ;)
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Marshal'ette,
My feelings are the same about what's happening. :'(
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BUY AMMO LOT,S OF AMMO.
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I'm a Rum man myself but I do enjoy the occaisional bourbon with a good cigar. ;)
I knew I like you Haz- I used to own a cigar shop and now that I have to actually pay for them I've slowed down considerably. It's a tough decision...bullets or cigars? The ultimate is both, of course.
But I used to pound down a pile of good cigars and had a foreign connection for good Cubans for years. Now it's down to special occasions or really nice days when I can sit down and enjoy.
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I knew I like you Haz- I used to own a cigar shop and now that I have to actually pay for them I've slowed down considerably. It's a tough decision...bullets or cigars? The ultimate is both, of course.
But I used to pound down a pile of good cigars and had a foreign connection for good Cubans for years. Now it's down to special occasions or really nice days when I can sit down and enjoy.
I like the Atruo Fuente Grand Reserve in a natural wrapper and 3 fingers of Wild turkey. :)
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How long do we have? We don't! As far as I can tell, it's over for us. We could take it back, but try getting a few million people on the same page in this counrty. It can't be done anytime soon. It's over.
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If you start they will rise, :) Seriuosly, they (whoever starts the revolution) don't need to agree with us, we just hijack a revolution someone else makes. Thats how the Bolshevics and Sandanista's did it, we just make sure OUR people run internal security, justice, and the military. Finance would be good but if you've got the others you've got them by the short and curlies. Oh, you don't want to fund Eddy eagle, Gee, look at this file about your ( fill in executable offense here ). Then the ones you can't intimidate get "disappeared", or publicly killed as a lesson to others. Intimidating political foes is pretty easy to learn, just afew history books, ulag Archpeligo is a good one to start with.
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I like the Atruo Fuente Grand Reserve in a natural wrapper and 3 fingers of Wild turkey. :)
Whew! Perfect!
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If you accept that democracies do not last, and we may be hitting somewhere around 6 or7 on the progression chart, where would you rank the people of Mexico? Mac.
I don't think they've ever had a real democracy. Heck, it hasn't been long since the stopped (?) sacrificing one another to some carved out piece of rock.
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I don't think they've ever had a real democracy. Heck, it hasn't been long since the stopped (?) sacrificing one another to some carved out piece of rock.
Geez, Don't let MB hear you put it that way, bad Karma ! :) But you are right, Mexico never had a democracy, If we have a Constitutional Republic then they must have a constitutional dictatorship, at least since they got away from the Emporor thing, with Maximilian. (up against the wall french motherf#@ker, Wasn't that a song a few years ago?)
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Geez, Don't let MB hear you put it that way, bad Karma ! :) But you are right, Mexico never had a democracy, If we have a Constitutional Republic then they must have a constitutional dictatorship, at least since they got away from the Emporor thing, with Maximilian. (up against the wall french motherf#@ker, Wasn't that a song a few years ago?)
Yeah...a song...I think it was from Jefferson Submarine or something....or maybe it was something I heard said at the submarine races once...I dunno, I think I remember hearing something like that a few years ago. :o
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The point of my question was that while we are in apparent decline as a Democracy, as historical observation concludes, Mexico, or at least the Hispanic guy on the street, is pulling their country UP the scale toward it. Seems like they are somewhere between 1 and 2 on the scale. They want it (at least the ones I talk to daily do). They are beginning to have money, individually, albeit proceeds of illegal labor in the U.S. One day they may have their own 2ND Amendment. And go back home to Mexico, where they really want to be. In the mean time, the people here in the U.S. are in an orgy haze, enjoying all the free stuff the public office holders can take from the dwindling pool of taxpayers to throw out to the mobs (who get to vote!). Mac.
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No argument with that Mac.
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My opinion?
It will survive as long as there are people willing to take a stand for what they believe.
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Shooting at Party Leaves 2 Dead (here in NC, WRAL-TV))
Posted: Today at 5:14 a.m.
Updated: 31 minutes ago
Clinton, N.C. — An argument at a party escalated into a shooting that left two men dead and four others wounded in Sampson County, the sheriff's office said.
All those involved in the shooting were attending a party at a house at 1135 Old U.S. Highway 701, between Garland and Clinton, Sheriff Jimmy Thornton said. At some point, five men and a teenage boy began fighting.
"They were all gathered behind this trailer, and (there) had been some drinking going on," Thornton said. "And apparently, an argument took place, and (they) started shooting each other."
A call about the shooting came in at 1:05 a.m., and deputies found the men and 15-year-old with gunshot wounds in the back yard of the house, Capt. Eric Pope said.
Sergio Cruz Rojas, 31, and Humberto Sanchez, 36, both of Clinton, were later pronounced dead at the Sampson Regional Medical Center in Clinton.
Deputies identified the three wounded men as Jose Delacruz Santibanez, 49, Jose Santivanez, 24, and Estaban Majia, 35, all of Clinton. The name of the 15-year-old boy was withheld.
Thornton said investigators were confident that no one else at the party, except the injured and deceased, was involved in the shooting. Deputies were not sure which of the six males were the shooters.
A shotgun, 9mm handgun and rifle were used to fire at least 50 bullets, Thornton said.
The four survivors of the shooting were in stable condition around 5 a.m., Pope said.
One survivor was hospitalized at Sampson Regional Medical Center, and three others were taken to Bladen County Memorial Hospital in Elizabethtown. From Bladen, one injured person was transferred to Duke University Hospital, and two to New Hanover Regional Medical Center. END. END.
NOW-If they would just take our guns, that they can't legally have here, back home and straighten out the oppression of their own country, like we did a few hundred years ago, human life would begin to mean more to them. They have the fighting instinct, just confused objectives. Even though it may be at our expense, perhaps they will rise, and go home. Mac.
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......perhaps they will rise, and go home. Mac.
Doubtful...one can always hope, though.