The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Politics & RKBA => Topic started by: fightingquaker13 on December 19, 2010, 05:44:57 PM
-
America is a strange place. We have the most noble ideals of any nation on earth. Sometimes, we just aren't so good at putting them into practice though. "We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, and that they are endowed by their creator (not the government or the voting majority) with certain inalienable rights.....". It took a Civil War, the Sufferage Movement and the Civil Rights Movement, but we have been moving steadily in the direction of honoring Jefferson's promise. The Left says we are a nation of bigots. History says otherwise. This week, we decided that anyone who is willing to put on a uniform, pick up a gun, and obey the UCMJ and serve their country in time of war is welcome. About damn time! Those who say this will be disruptive haven't read their history. Integrating Army units in 1948, when Jim Crow was the law of the land and inter-racial marriage was a felony in many states, was far more of a social shock. Guess what? We got over it. Women on ships? Women in the field? We got over it. Gays in the military? We'll get over it. The same as Israel and all of NATO. I honestly don't care much one way or another about the gay rights thing. I just hate a hypocrite. If I can serve openly as a heterosexual and have it be my business as long as I do my job, why shouldn't a gay guy get the same treatment? Today is a good day. America's promise is being kept and screw the PC left who says that we are a bunch of bigots. BS. We should judge a person on merit. Nothing less and nothing more. Do your job and pull your weight, and race, religion, gender and orientation shouldn't be an issue.
FQ13
-
They have been serving under DADT for 17 years and the world didn't end.
The ones who cause problems are the self righteous "My way is the only right way" crowd and no one gives a crap what they think as they are no better than the Muslims who we are fighting.
They are probably "Peeping Toms" who watch their neighbors have sex.
On the other hand, Sodomy is still a crime under the UCMJ so there may be 5th A issues to work out.
-
It ain't over yet boys. The Pres' or the Pentagon can still kill it.
Personally, I think its a no brain'er. An all volunteer military MUST accept all who volunteer!
-
Personally, I think its a no brain'er. An all volunteer military MUST accept all who volunteer!
And for the third time today, Tim, I say amen! (I must be drinking too much eggnog). ;D Seriously though, who would you rather have in your unit; a gay guy who volunteered, or a straight guy who got drafted and wants to be anywhere but there?
FQ13
-
The only downside I see is that everyone is gonna have to have a private show or shower time.
-
The reality is here, if I might interject, is that these folks that enlist into the armed forces are NOT the flamboyant, stereotypical homosexuals. They're just folks who possess a strong desire to serve.
I've served with homosexuals, lived with a lesbian and can attest to their work ethic. Beyond that, if they think my ass was attractive, so be it.....
The only time during my active duty that had communal shower arrangements was in boot camp. Granted, I never served aboard ship.
-
I don't see the big deal. Those who were gay everyone knew anyway, . So what , now they are gonna change? I don't think so. Only the flamers will have more latitude. This makes something out of nothing.
-
The local paper had a Cartoon the other day, It showed a Flag draped casket with the caption "How should Congress vote ?
( ) Gay ( ) Straight (X)American
-
Preface: I am not now, and I never have been in the service. However, I "play" with those that are and have been.
My complaint with this and with don't as don't tell is that it is the legislation messing with what should be handled over in the big five walled building. Turning military PC over to the polls and popular opinion that dictates our legislators is a mistake! I won't go into details except to say that to a man the career guys I know say that there is a time and a place for this, and there is a time and a place for the other. Who should be making the decisions that affect all times?
-
Preface: I am not now, and I never have been in the service. However, I "play" with those that are and have been.
My complaint with this and with don't as don't tell is that it is the legislation messing with what should be handled over in the big five walled building. Turning military PC over to the polls and popular opinion that dictates our legislators is a mistake! I won't go into details except to say that to a man the career guys I know say that there is a time and a place for this, and there is a time and a place for the other. Who should be making the decisions that affect all times?
I hear what you are saying, and I'm not ddismissing it. Still, if it had been left to the military in 1948, do you think they'd have integrated? Or would they have have come up with reasons to delay like "unit cohesion" or the fact that combat troops, particularly conservative Southerners opposed it? What about giving women a shot? Do you think women would be doing anything more than secretarial duties if it were left to the generals?
We are a democratic republic with civilian control of the military. The military executes policy, they don't make it. This isn't some hare brained scheme in social engineering. The Israeli's and the Brits accept gay service members, and I wouldn't want to go to war against either one. If it works for them, there is no reason it won't work for us. Buracracies are naturally resistant to change. They will stick to the status quo as the path of least resistance until forced to do otherwise. Once they are forced to change? The US military has proven to be highly adaptable to accepting minorities and women. Why should gays be any different?
FQ13
-
They used the same arguments about integrating Black troops in the 50's and 60's, (Forgetting that Blacks served just fine in every war America ever had ) and women in the 70's and 80's, it was bullsh!t then and it will be bullsh!t in 50 or 100 years when they are using the same argument about robots or clones or space aliens.
-
So...now that this point is moot....how long until millitary shower protocol is like that depicted in STARSHIP TROOPERS?....
-
So...now that this point is moot....how long until millitary shower protocol is like that depicted in STARSHIP TROOPERS?....
If that happens, I see enlistment going up several hundred precent.
-
If that happens, I see enlistment going up several hundred precent.
Whatever you say, PFC TAB..... ;D