Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: sledgemeister on January 08, 2011, 02:31:30 PM
Title: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: sledgemeister on January 08, 2011, 02:31:30 PM
Hang on to your hats guys looks like its gonna be a bumpy ride.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/08/gabrielle-giffords-shot-c_n_806211.html Gabrielle Giffords Shot: Congresswoman Shot In Arizona
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Rep. Gabrielle Giffords of Arizona was shot in the head Saturday and an unknown number of others were wounded when an assailant opened fire in an area where the lawmaker was meeting with constituents, officials said.
There were varying accounts on Giffords' condition, but a hospital spokesman said the Democrat was in critical condition. An aide to the Democrat was killed. An unknown number of others was injured, officials officials said, including additional aides to the lawmaker.
Congressional officials said one of the victims died soon after the attack, and others were taken to a nearby hospital. The officials said the wounded included some of Gifford's aides who were with her at the time.
an interesting quote off the news paper page
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Her father Spencer Giffords, 75, wept when asked if his 40-year-old daughter had any enemies.
"Yeah," he told The Post. "The whole tea party."
h ttp://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/ariz_congresswoman_shot_in_head_YFTvsurRHy5OWGSRKnuK8J#ixzz1ATapcbLU
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Arizona Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords was clinging to life after a gunman shot her in the head, after spraying a fusillade of bullets in front of an Arizona grocery store where she was holding a public event, authorities said.
The three-term Democrat, who might have been shot at point blank range, was undergoing surgery at the University Medical Center in Tuscon, Reuters reported.
Nine others injured in the bloody shooting spree, including a child, were also being treated there, according to reports.
Her father Spencer Giffords, 75, was rushing to the hospital when asked if his 40-year-old daughter had any enemies.
(http://www.nypost.com/rw/nypost/2011/01/08/news/photos_stories/Congress134425--300x300.jpg) Rep. Gabrielle Giffords, D-Ariz., seen here with House Speaker John Boehner, was shot at a public event in Tucson, Ariz.
AP Emergency personnel gather at the scene of the shooting. "Yeah," he told The Post. "The whole tea party."
He added that politicians constantly faced danger.
"They always get threat[ened]," Giffords cried. "We don’t really have any information. The Police department was supposed to call us but they didn't."
The congresswoman was chatting up a couple during her first "Congress in Your Corner" event at the Tuscon Safeway when the maniacal gunman fired at the crowd, reports said.
Giffords excitedly promoted her event on Twitter.
"My 1st Congress on Your Corner starts now," she wrote. "Please stop by to let me know what is on your mind or tweet me later."
The gun-toting event crasher was tackled by a bystander and apprehended, reports said.
The 40-year-old representative, who held her seat since 2007, was married to U.S. astronaut Mark Kelly. She took strong positions on minimum wage, stem cell research and immigration – a Arizona flashpoint issue.
Edited heading to make correct:
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: twyacht on January 08, 2011, 02:45:02 PM
Federal District Judge John Roll dead also. I've also heard a talking head on Fox News say "machine guns are illegal" to get off this many shots...
Your right sledge... Based on her Father's comments, previous threats to her, it will be a bumpy ride indeed.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: WatchManUSA on January 08, 2011, 02:46:10 PM
Fox just reported that a Federal Judge John Roll was killed at the rally, too.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: tombogan03884 on January 08, 2011, 02:58:34 PM
By TERRY TANG and AMANDA LEE MYERS, Associated Press Terry Tang And Amanda Lee Myers, Associated Press – 24 mins ago
0 TUCSON, Ariz. – Rep. Gabrielle Giffords of Arizona was shot in the head Saturday, an aide was killed, and an unknown number of others were wounded when an assailant opened fire outside a grocery store as the Democratic lawmaker met with constituents, officials said.
C.J. Karamargin, a spokesman for Giffords, said the congresswoman was in surgery as of 1 p.m. local time and that an unspecified number of Giffords staff members were injured in the shooting. Karamargin said he had no other information on the conditions of the injured or on the circumstances of the shooting.
Congressional officials said an aide to the Democrat was killed, and unknown number of others were injured, including staffers to the lawmaker.
President Barack Obama called the shooting "an unspeakable tragedy" and that such "a senseless and terrible act of violence has no place in a free society.
U.S. Capitol police say the shooter is in custody as one official said he carried out the attack with an automatic weapon. The officials who described the events did so on condition of anonymity, saying they were not permitted to comment publicly.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: sledgemeister on January 08, 2011, 03:03:00 PM
Interesting Tom, on msnbc (watching it now) they are saying a pistol with an extended mag? I guess if its identified by a reporter it could be anything, no doubt it will be a evil black gun of some type, high powered of course.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 08, 2011, 03:15:42 PM
By TERRY TANG and AMANDA LEE MYERS, Associated Press Terry Tang And Amanda Lee Myers, Associated Press – 24 mins ago
0 TUCSON, Ariz. – Rep. Gabrielle Giffords of Arizona was shot in the head Saturday, an aide was killed, and an unknown number of others were wounded when an assailant opened fire outside a grocery store as the Democratic lawmaker met with constituents, officials said.
C.J. Karamargin, a spokesman for Giffords, said the congresswoman was in surgery as of 1 p.m. local time and that an unspecified number of Giffords staff members were injured in the shooting. Karamargin said he had no other information on the conditions of the injured or on the circumstances of the shooting.
Congressional officials said an aide to the Democrat was killed, and unknown number of others were injured, including staffers to the lawmaker.
President Barack Obama called the shooting "an unspeakable tragedy" and that such "a senseless and terrible act of violence has no place in a free society.
U.S. Capitol police say the shooter is in custody as one official said he carried out the attack with an automatic weapon. The officials who described the events did so on condition of anonymity, saying they were not permitted to comment publicly.
This is the part of the story and others like this that make my blood boil. In the first reports up here it went on to include that the FBI was investigating and forbade disclosure. Having been responsible for safety and accident investigation situation at a prior firm I understand the issues that arise when information is released, especially in the course of an interview, and how it can undermine a fair and complete investigation. However, we have become a society of "self important expert idiots" that everyone is trying to get the attention of the media hoping that some day we will cash in on it >:(
More than once I have written posts and letters stating that if a person did not have permission to speak or had been forbidden to speak the source should not be a part of the initial reports. Down the road in the possibility of a cover up or other illegal activity is another story where the media is acting as "muck rakers" as was intended in the First Amendment. But, in an initial report like this it is wrong!
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 08, 2011, 03:36:32 PM
I have heard about this on the radio a couple of times
and the first report said that she was killed
however they later said she in surgry however there are un official reports that she has passed away
no matter what I fear the fall out of this for you guys no matter the reasons and what happened
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US congresswoman shot in street Nine others injured by gunman News updates to come A US congresswoman was shot along with nine other people at a political event in Tucson, Arizona, media reports say. Arizona Representative Gabrielle Giffords, a Democrat, was shot outside a grocery store, ABC News reported. Nine others have reportedly been injured, including three of her staff members. Initial reports said Ms Giffords had been killed, but the latest word from spokeswoman Darci Slaten is: "Miss Giffords is alive. She is currently in surgery." Earlier, The Huffington Post reported a spokesman for the Pima County sheriff said she was "shot point blank in the head". Andrea Gooden, a witness who was in an office across the street, told Fox News she heard a burst of gunshots and "immediately after that there were people racing across the parking lot".
Another witness told CNN he heard 15-20 shots and saw people running from the scene and screaming before police and firetrucks arrived around two minutes later. National Public Radio reports a bystander tackled the alleged gunman, who is now in police custody. Gabrielle Giffords had been hosting her first Congress on Your Corner event, in which constituents are invited to stop by and talk to their representative. Ms Giffords, 40, was first elected to Congress in 2006 and is married to Mark Kelly, a NASA astronaut. http://www.news.com.au/world/us-congresswoman-gabrielle-giffords-and-six-others-shot-dead/story-e6frfkyi-1225984408228#ixzz1ATxHSVWY
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http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011/01/09/3109039.htm A US congresswoman is among at least nine people who have been shot by a lone gunman at a public event in Tucson, Arizona.
Democrat Gabrielle Giffords was holding a public meeting at a grocery store in her home state of Arizona when a man emerged from the crowd and shot her in the head at what has been described as point-blank range.
The congresswoman's condition is understood to be so serious that she was initially thought to be dead.
But the local hospital has since said she is in surgery.
"[Ms Giffords] is currently in surgery. She's alive. Her condition is critical at this time," University Medical Centre spokeswoman Darci Slaten said.
The hospital spokeswoman says that at least eight other people were also wounded.
Witnesses said multiple shots rang out and the shooter tried to flee before reportedly being tackled to the ground by bystanders.
It was not known what the motive for the shootings was.
US president Barack Obama has condemned the shooting as an "unspeakable tragedy" and "senseless" act of violence.
"This morning, in an unspeakable tragedy, a number of Americans were shot in Tucson, Arizona, at a constituent meeting with congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords," Mr Obama said.
"And while we are continuing to receive information, we know that some have passed away, and that Representative Giffords is gravely wounded.
"We do not yet have all the answers. What we do know is that such a senseless and terrible act of violence has no place in a free society.
"I ask all Americans to join me and Michelle in keeping Representative Giffords, the victims of this tragedy, and their families in our prayers."
Ms Giffords has held several similar events since she first took office in 2007.
At one event in 2009, a protester was removed by police when his pistol fell on the supermarket floor.
Ms Giffords was one of the politicians featured on Sarah Palin's 'crosshairs map' of Democrats who voted for Mr Obama's healthcare reforms.
Ms Palin has since released a statement on Facebook offering her condolences to the victims of the shooting.
"My sincere condolences are offered to the family of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and the other victims of today's tragic shooting in Arizona," she wrote.
"On behalf of Todd and my family, we all pray for the victims and their families, and for peace and justice."
Concealed weapons can be carried without a permit under Arizona law.
Last year, her office was vandalised just a few hours after the House voted to introduce the new health reform bill.
Re-elected in the November 2 election, Ms Giffords has focused on immigration reform, military issues, stem cell research and alternative energy while serving in Congress.
She is married to US astronaut Mark Kelly.
- ABC/Reuters
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: tombogan03884 on January 08, 2011, 03:41:29 PM
This is the part of the story and others like this that make my blood boil. In the first reports up here it went on to include that the FBI was investigating and forbade disclosure. Having been responsible for safety and accident investigation situation at a prior firm I understand the issues that arise when information is released, especially in the course of an interview, and how it can undermine a fair and complete investigation. However, we have become a society of "self important expert idiots" that everyone is trying to get the attention of the media hoping that some day we will cash in on it >:(
More than once I have written posts and letters stating that if a person did not have permission to speak or had been forbidden to speak the source should not be a part of the initial reports. Down the road in the possibility of a cover up or other illegal activity is another story where the media is acting as "muck rakers" as was intended in the First Amendment. But, in an initial report like this it is wrong!
M58, you missed the best part. The story is out of Tuscon Az. but the "automatic weapon comment came from "U.S. Capitol police" (recheck that last line you highlighted ) That's from Washington. Local cops are not even sure how many people were hit yet, but 2,000 miles away the Capital police know all about it ? Dumb asses. I'll laugh my ass off if it turns out the shooter was an illegal alien.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 08, 2011, 03:48:35 PM
look for the Media pointing the finger at Palin.
from the ABC Aust article
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Ms Giffords was one of the politicians featured on Sarah Palin's 'crosshairs map' of Democrats who voted for Mr Obama's healthcare reforms.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: sledgemeister on January 08, 2011, 03:52:20 PM
M58, you missed the best part. The story is out of Tuscon Az. but the "automatic weapon comment came from "U.S. Capitol police" (recheck that last line you highlighted ) That's from Washington. Local cops are not even sure how many people were hit yet, but 2,000 miles away the Capital police know all about it ? Dumb asses. I'll laugh my ass off if it turns out the shooter was an illegal alien.
Been reading through the comments on Sarah Palins facebook page and some are blaming her for it (as tom says - dumb asses). Some are saying they know who it was and it was a obama supporter? So much speculation wit out evidence, a media/democrat field day
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 08, 2011, 03:58:55 PM
Gunman was Jared Lee Loughner.
His YouTube channel http://www.youtube.com/user/Starhitshnaz
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: PegLeg45 on January 08, 2011, 03:59:14 PM
Sad indeed, prayers for the dead and injured along with their families.......now just wait for the spin cycle.......you know the left never lets a tragedy such as this go without using it to stoke the furnaces.
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UPDATE: A second man has been arrested in connection with the shooting, while a third man is also being sought. http://ministryvalues.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1380&Itemid=357
Political Hacks Waste No Time In Shamelessly Exploiting Giffords Shooting To Demonize Political Opposition
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 08, 2011, 04:01:10 PM
just wondering what was the senator like ??
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 08, 2011, 04:28:34 PM
before his youtube vid is removed ( looks like a nutter )
it was a vid of the US flag that goes for about 7 mins and at the end it gets burnt
however this is the text with the vid
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=| If there's no flag in the constitution then the flag in the film is unknown. There's no flag in the constitution. Therefore, the flag in the film is unknown. Burn every new and old flag that you see. Burn your flag! I bet you can imagine this in your mind with a faster speed. Watch this protest in reverse! Ask the local police; "What's your illegal activity on duty?". If you protest the government then there's a new government from protesting. There's not a new government from protesting. Thus, you aren't protesting the government. There's something important in this video: There's no communication to anyone in this location. You shouldn't be afraid of the stars. There's a new bird on my right shoulder. The beak is two feet and lime green. The rarest bird on earth, there's no feathers, but small grey scales all over the body. It's with one large red eye with a light blue iris. The bird feet are the same as a woodpecker. This new bird and there's only one, the gender is not female or male. The wings of this bird are beautiful; 3 feet wide with the shape of a bald eagle that you could die for. If you can see this bird then you will understand. You think this bird is able to chat about a government? I want you to imagine a comet or meteoroid coming through the atmosphere. On the other hand, welcome yourself to the desert: Maybe your ability to protest is from the brainwash of the current government structure
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: twyacht on January 08, 2011, 04:32:49 PM
She is a House Of Rep. Member, not a Senator. Married to a former astronaut. She is pro-2nd Amendment. and has been known to legally carry from time to time. She is sharp, on her game, has a quick wit, and not a Pelosi mindless zombie. Has a good bit of blue dog in her, and the medical conference reports the head wound was through and through.
The suspect has a Unibomber, Timothy McVeigh, hate the gov't, ramblings, including mind control. Shame the asshats throw their vile crap at Palin, or Tea Party, Right Wing type BS.
I think being 22, his tin foil hat was too tight, and it's a shame. Even though she is a Democrat, no one wishes this kind of action.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 08, 2011, 04:52:41 PM
M58, you missed the best part. The story is out of Tuscon Az. but the "automatic weapon comment came from "U.S. Capitol police" (recheck that last line you highlighted ) That's from Washington. Local cops are not even sure how many people were hit yet, but 2,000 miles away the Capital police know all about it ? Dumb asses. I'll laugh my ass off if it turns out the shooter was an illegal alien.
Latest report from the AP is that it was a pistol >:( F'en; Aholes can't resist the chance to make a tragedy worse >:(
Top it off with another asshat releasing the name of the gunman against orders:
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Police say the shooter was in custody, and was identified by people familiar with the investigation as Jared Loughner, 22. Pima County Sheriff's officials said he used a pistol to carry out the shooting spree. U.S. officials who provided his name to the AP spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to release it publicly.
Red by me
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 08, 2011, 05:32:16 PM
latest update
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Up to 18 people were shot during the attack, including three of her staff members. Six people are dead.
and the anti gunners are out with the comments posted
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: sksmedic on January 08, 2011, 05:43:34 PM
Words can not describe how I feel about this. My thoughts and prayers are with everyone harmed by this event. Another situation to make all law abiding gun owners look bad. :-[
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: twyacht on January 08, 2011, 06:02:53 PM
If the anti's haven't posted it yet, I'll cover it.
Words can not describe how I feel about this. My thoughts and prayers are with everyone harmed by this event. Another situation to make all law abiding gun owners look bad. :-[
+1 sksmedic.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: tombogan03884 on January 08, 2011, 06:54:30 PM
Why do these azzhats go after people we never heard of ? That's what makes it a "tragedy". I doubt any one here would be to broke up if it had been Chuck Schemer, or Charlie Rangel, or Harry Reid, (tough shot hitting that scrawny SOB ).
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: jnevis on January 08, 2011, 07:07:48 PM
M58, you missed the best part. The story is out of Tuscon Az. but the "automatic weapon comment came from "U.S. Capitol police" (recheck that last line you highlighted ) That's from Washington. Local cops are not even sure how many people were hit yet, but 2,000 miles away the Capital police know all about it ? Dumb asses. I'll laugh my ass off if it turns out the shooter was an illegal alien.
Remember Tom SecretService is VP annd POTUS US Marshals protect fed judgesand Capitol Police are responsible for the physical security of Reps and Senators while in the US.
Fox is saying it was a Glock BTW
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: twyacht on January 08, 2011, 07:15:29 PM
Fox News reported either an armed citizen, or security officer/LEO got a shot off at the BG, before the crowd tackled and disarmed his ass.
As this goes fwd. it probably saved lives.....but you won't get this in the MSM....
Of course it was a Glock..... :-\
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: tombogan03884 on January 08, 2011, 07:39:46 PM
Remember Tom SecretService is VP annd POTUS US Marshals protect fed judgesand Capitol Police are responsible for the physical security of Reps and Senators while in the US.
Fox is saying it was a Glock BTW
I didn't know that, I thought they were just responsible for Govt facilities in DC.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: jnevis on January 08, 2011, 08:08:39 PM
There is something like 150+ police agencies within 75 miles of DC, mostly Federal. Each has a specific function and juristiction. The FBI has their own uniformed division that is only responsible for the HQ building and the street its on, for example.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 08, 2011, 08:15:14 PM
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Ulmus on January 08, 2011, 08:24:21 PM
That's just a curtosy delay.
What bother's me is that this happened in January. How bad is it going to get when sumer hits and bothsides have been at each others throats for six months?
My prayers to all those killed and injured.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 08, 2011, 08:39:24 PM
the ban everything bregarde BHORE supporters / anti Palin were out on one of the IT forums here
I posted this
Quote
Left, Right, dose not matter who said what
the bloke was mentally ill and no matter what laws are in place it will not stop people like that
they need help and that is something lacking, both here and in the USA
apparently acording to one of the replies
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Oversimplification and a trivialisation. There's something more serious going on here than a random mental case letting a gun loose.
I need a smart arse reply just struggling for the right words right now
IMO it is that simple , mentally ill - lost the plot least he is still living to face up to what he did
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Ulmus on January 08, 2011, 08:46:48 PM
Ask them if they've ever heard of Occam's Razor.
"The simplest answer is often correct."
Or you can use his own words from the CNN sound byte. "I define terrorist."
The guy was nuts.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 08, 2011, 08:50:29 PM
Or you can use his own words from the CNN sound byte. "I define terrorist."
The guy was nuts.
thanks mate :)
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Ulmus on January 08, 2011, 09:14:16 PM
No worries. :)
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: WatchManUSA on January 08, 2011, 09:35:35 PM
I just read on CNN (via Drudge) the shooter's gun was a Glock 19 with a 30 round (G18) magazine.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 08, 2011, 09:41:36 PM
::) ::) ::) ::)
<http://blog.bradycampaign.org/?p=3078>
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Giffords Shooting – Another American Gun Tragedy » by Paul Helmke on January 8th, 2011 Permalink Being the target of violence has always been a risk for those in public office in this country. The organization I head, the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, is named after a man, Jim Brady, who was shot and seriously injured nearly 30 years ago while serving as President Reagan’s Press Secretary. During my first month as mayor of Fort Wayne, IN, I started receiving death threats which my Police Department considered to be very credible. Too many public officials have been killed and injured in this country in my lifetime – nearly all of them by guns.
I first met Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords shortly after her election in 2006. All who met her felt that she had the potential to go far in politics and government. Our hearts and prayers go out to her for a successful recovery, and to the families of the Federal Judge, the young child, the District Director for the Congresswoman and the others killed and injured at the Tuscon grocery store today.
While we are all still learning details about this shooting, and particularly the 22-year old responsible for this horrendous act, we should find it unacceptable that when Americans and our elected leaders are assembling in public places, their lives are at risk from gun violence.
We also are deeply concerned about the heated political rhetoric that escalates debates and controversies, and sometimes makes it seem as if violence is an acceptable response to honest disagreements. Shortly after President Obama took office, the head of the NRA crowed that “the guys with the guns make the rules;” participants in Congressional forums and Presidential events started carrying guns in public; and then, just last year a candidate for U.S. Senate said the citizens unhappy with elections results should consider exercising their “Second Amendment remedies” and Sarah Palin used gun “target” metaphors encouraging voters to defeat Rep. Giffords and others.
We, as Americans, can and should do more to restore civility to our political discourse. And we can and should do more to address the easy access to high-powered guns that make it too easy for dangerous and irresponsible people to disrupt and destroy the lives of innocent Americans, and political leaders who are simply trying to serve their communities and our country.
(Note to readers: This entry, along with past entries, has been co-posted on The Huffington Post)
Posted in Brady Background Checks, Closing The Gun Show Loophole, General, Gun, Gun Crime, Gun deaths, Second Amendment, nra
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: fightingquaker13 on January 08, 2011, 09:44:26 PM
I just read on CNN (via Drudge) the shooter's gun was a Glock 19 with a 30 round (G18) magazine.
At least he had good taste in weapons. ::) Why is it that these idiots can't just kill themselves rather than taking out innocents with them? All we can do is pray for the victims and hope that folks will have some comon sense here. God knows thats a slim chance, the Brady Bunch and Holder are probably already in a huddle. Its already Palin, probaly Lou Dobbs and Sherrif Joe as well, and of course EBGs. That jackass sherrif saying nut jobs are easily incited? No kidding. But as much as I dislike Sarah, she has never even come close to calling for violence. Give me a break. Maybe the general political rhetoric could and should be cooled down, I agree with that, but to blame any side for this is beyond shameful. FQ13
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: WatchManUSA on January 08, 2011, 10:32:39 PM
For sake of 24 by 7 news, looses like Jared Loughner, get huge amounts of notoriety. Perhaps this has more to do with violent acts like this than gun, magazine capacity and ammo used in a crime like murder.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 08, 2011, 11:20:03 PM
Mid afternoon the AP reports were having a hay day with Palin and her ad campaigns about targeting, and how these ads with a crosshairs prompted actions like this. Later in the afternoon the liberal talking heads were making fun of Palin for expressing concern for those affected by this shooting.
The video of the Sheriff is just the tip of what we are going to hear from the anti's on this. I'm sure that as soon as the initial shock, 0.35 seconds, wore off they were gathering in the war rooms rolling out the plans to capitalize on this tragedy.
Get ready boys and girls, because the shooter had nothing to do with it. This was all about that ugly and evil gun that not only can't be detected by x-ray or metal detectors, but that evil gun that ran out and killed and wounded all these people in the hands of the poor victim that happened to be holding it.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: jp1 on January 09, 2011, 01:17:31 AM
I’m sure the anti-gun groups will have plenty to say about this and I don’t know if the Dictator in chief will try to have his regulatory hounds try to regulate anything like magazines or not. But I don’t think that is what they will go for with this one; I think they will be looking to use the FCC to regulate the 1st amendment, and get rid of as much conservative speech as they can. Don’t think they will be successful but I think they will try.
The Sharif set the tone with his comments and my guess he comments has something to do with the note found on that crazy nut, and now the left is out in full attack mode trying to sway public opinion. And surprise most are not going after guns, here a just a few examples:
CNN Reporter: Palin Part of Rhetoric That ‘Allowed This Kind of Thing to Happen’ Politics
Washington Post’s Eugene Robinson: Violent Rhetoric Comes Exclusively from the Right
NY Times’ Krugman Blames Shooting on GOP, ‘Hate-Mongers’ Beck & Limbaugh
Keith Olbermann Compares Glenn to Shooter, Calls on Beck to Apologize for His Rhetoric
Never mind that right after the shooting the Feds had his MySpace page pulled off the net in amazing speed, luckily there are some fast fingers after the name was released that got a look at it.
“He lists reading under interests, as well as "conscience dreams," and among his favorite books are "Mein Kampf," the "Communist Manifesto," "Animal Farm" and "Brave New World.”
Sound like a person that would listen to a conservative show?
One other thing I find very ironic is that Gabrielle Gifford was the one to read the 1st amendment when Congress read the Constitution, and now there is a full fledge attack on it.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: fullautovalmet76 on January 09, 2011, 10:50:33 AM
A young man who is said to be mentally unstable carries out a heinous act. Does anyone see a pattern here from others in the past? The underwear bomber? The shoe bomber?
They think he had an accomplice. I'm going to watch this one carefully but don't be surprised if the FBI "knew about" this guy before he committed the crime.
How the narrative will be constructed afterward: "Hate" speech laws will be expanded to include political statements. Get ready for this: a limitation on the capacity of magazines. A "re-examination" of carry laws in AZ and other places that are relatively "loose".
I already have a few 30 round mags for my Glock. I think I'm going to buy a few more.
I'm not waiting around for this one, I'm contacting my state and federal elected representatives to let them know curtailing rights over this tragedy is not going to be acceptable. I suggest all of us get proactive on this and get out in front of the spin machine that is going to be going on Monday.....
Extra item: According to the NRA and GOA she has a grade of 'D' from both. I guess her support for our rights is tepid at best. If she comes out of this OK (that is my hope), she might become the next Jim Brady....And we know what that brought us.....
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: tombogan03884 on January 09, 2011, 12:48:52 PM
When you answer all opposition with insults and accusations of racism, with the intent to divide voters into easily bribed special interests, sometimes you have to reap what you have sown.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 09, 2011, 01:04:22 PM
A young man who is said to be mentally unstable carries out a heinous act. Does anyone see a pattern here from others in the past? The underwear bomber? The shoe bomber?
They think he had an accomplice. I'm going to watch this one carefully but don't be surprised if the FBI "knew about" this guy before he committed the crime.
How the narrative will be constructed afterward: "Hate" speech laws will be expanded to include political statements. Get ready for this: a limitation on the capacity of magazines. A "re-examination" of carry laws in AZ and other places that are relatively "loose".
I already have a few 30 round mags for my Glock. I think I'm going to buy a few more.
I'm not waiting around for this one, I'm contacting my state and federal elected representatives to let them know curtailing rights over this tragedy is not going to be acceptable. I suggest all of us get proactive on this and get out in front of the spin machine that is going to be going on Monday.....
Extra item: According to the NRA and GOA she has a grade of 'D' from both. I guess her support for our rights is tepid at best. If she comes out of this OK (that is my hope), she might become the next Jim Brady....And we know what that brought us.....
As much as I hate what happened and do not want her to suffer for this, you know that the Brady campaign already has the contracts ready for her to sign.
I can understand their train of thought concerning this, but it is flawed logic. By taking away all guns you are not going to stop someone like this. He could just as easily charged in with a knife, machete, baseball bat, pipe bomb, automobile, or any number of IED's that most school boys experimented with in their pre-teen and teen years.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: tombogan03884 on January 09, 2011, 01:17:46 PM
Only the right engages in "hate rhetoric"
Like Hitler said, "If you're going to lie, you might as well lie big"
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: crusader rabbit on January 09, 2011, 02:16:43 PM
I just read on CNN (via Drudge) the shooter's gun was a MACHINE Glock 19 with a 300 round (G18) magazine.
There. Fixed it for you. (per left-wing media dictates) I believe we will soon discover it had a laser guided GPS homing device. /sarc off
May God bless the congresscritter. No one deserves to be taken out by a nut case. Condolences to the families of those killed, and prayers for recovery for those wounded.
CR
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Timothy on January 09, 2011, 03:20:46 PM
May God bless the congresscritter. No one deserves to be taken out by a nut case. Condolences to the families of those killed, and prayers for recovery for those wounded.
CR
Seconded....
TB
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 09, 2011, 04:15:19 PM
that video of the Serif that I posted earlier is being quoted all over the place here
they are blaming US politics over this ::) not the fact that there was a nutter out there ( that apparently according to his friends had mental problems as well.He was known to Police and had a charge sheet as well and was rejected by the military for service)
Quote
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/world/us-congresswoman-gabrielle-giffords-and-18-others-shot-in-tucson-street/story-e6frea8l-1225984649820 US politics was left to hang its head in shame yesterday after months of ugly rhetoric culminated in a massacre at a political rally in Tucson, Arizona.
Six people were killed and a dozen wounded after gunman Jared Lee Loughner walked up to Democrat Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords and shot her in the head before turning the weapon on supporters who had come to meet her.
Local sheriff Clarence Dupnik was quick to link the attack to the "vitriolic rhetoric" that became rife during the mid-term elections and Americans are questioning whether divisive politics had pushed the suspect over the edge.
During the campaign, Republican Sarah Palin put a target map online with Ms Giffords' district under the crosshairs of a gun. Yesterday, the gunman walked up to Ms Giffords, pointed the 9mm glock semi-automatic pistol at her head and pulled the trigger. The bullet went through her brain, entering her temple and exiting through her forehead.
Within seconds, six other people were dead, including a nine-year-old girl and Arizona's chief federal judge, and another 12 were wounded. Witnesses said it was so quick, there was barely time for people to scream before they fell.
Nearby restaurant owner Tony Martinez described the shooting, as "like a string of fireworks". "It happened so fast. Then it was silent but it was still chaos as there were bodies everywhere," he said.
Loughner, was preparing to reload his pistol when two onlookers tackled him.
Doctor Peter Rhee said he was optimistic that Ms Giffords would survive and she was responding to commands from doctors last night.
"She is in critical condition and I can tell you at the current time period I am very optimistic about recovery," he said.
Loughner's motivation remains unknown, but local sheriff Clarence Dupnik described him as a mentally unstable young man who possibly acted with an accomplice.
The apparent assassination attempt has left the US in shock, sparking renewed debate about the safety of politicians and the country's contentious gun laws. Sheriff Dupnik blamed the "vitriol that has permeated the political scene and left elected officials facing constant threats".
"I think it's time as a county that we do a little soul searching because I think it's the vitriolic rhetoric that we hear day in and day out, from people in the radio business, and some people in the TV business, that this has not become the nice United States of America that most of us grew up in."
US President Barack Obama said the shooting was an "unspeakable act".
"This is more than a tragedy for those involved it is a tragedy for Arizona a tragedy for our entire country," he said.
"Such a senseless and terrible act of violence has no place in a free society," he said.
Others killed in the shooting spree included US District Judge John Roll, who had stopped by the event to say hello to Ms Giffords, and her director of community outreach Gabe Zimmerman.
Nine-year-old Christina Greene died at the hospital.
Ms Giffords, a one-time Republican, became a Democrat in 2000 and won election to the Arizona House, where she served one term.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 09, 2011, 04:24:19 PM
The more I read and listen to commentaries on this event, the more I realize we can no longer say "it's Bush's fault." As of yesterday it is "all Palin's fault." >:(
Just so all the snoops on here know, last night I moved all my black handguns and rifles into a vault and locked it so they won't wander away and hurt anyone. Damn, I never knew how dangerous these tools could be just hanging around.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: PegLeg45 on January 09, 2011, 06:18:32 PM
A friend sent this to me in an email. It may be a hoax, but if it is real, it certainly is strange:
Quote
Okay.... This is strange. Rep Giffords has a youtube account that she has posted several videos to in the past couple of years. She has over 200 subscribers to her page. The page lists the people she has subscribed to. That would be only two people. One is Rep. Ike Skelton and the other is to the lunatic that shot her and all the other people. I don't believe in coincidences.
These links are to the only two chanels that she subscribed to, according to her page:
http://www.youtube.com/user/Classitup10
http://www.youtube.com/user/RepIkeSkelton
Like I said, could be set up...could be real....maybe more investigation will bear things out.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: twyacht on January 09, 2011, 06:20:00 PM
Anyone who has ever watched an episode of Beck, cannot possibly ascertain a vitriolic violent undertone. (Oh,...except the grass eating, anti's),....
and so it goes, the disarmed "rest of the civilized world" can stand on a high horse, and call America a bunch of gun totin nuts, and the Krugman's, Brady folks can shout "See, See,....told ya so,...."
To blame Palin, Beck, whoever, is vile. Please email the editors of these liberal rags, and "respectfully" tell them they are filth in today's world for blaming anyone else than the tin-foil wacko that committed this shooting.
Remember what Auntie Hillary Said, with anger and venom?
The double standard hypocrisy has to stop....
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: tombogan03884 on January 09, 2011, 06:28:37 PM
The surprising thing is that more politicians are not being killed . We are in a civil war, we have been since the communist inspired and backed anti war movement of the 60's. and America is losing.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: jp1 on January 09, 2011, 10:10:41 PM
Boy it's really going to hit the fan on this one, our only hope is the new congress! Next week is the time to start making phone calls, I have them on speed dial on my cell and will be sure to talk with them.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: fightingquaker13 on January 09, 2011, 10:38:41 PM
The good news, such as it is, is that the outrage seems focused on political rhetoric, not guns. Granted, the antis will trot out new bills, but they will go nowhere. Let people engage in navel gazing about rhetoric. Hell, I think its useful (I have been quoted a time or two here urging folks to calm down a bit). I don't blame Limbaugh or Palin for this whack job any more than I bame environmentalists for the Unabomber or Earth First. Nut jobs are nut jobs. Still, when the NYT and other publications are calling for a "return to civility" rather than "ban all guns Aussie style", I consider it a good thing. The Tea Party and Sarah will get some undeserved knocks. They'll get over it. Its a hell of a lot better than a new AWB. FQ13
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 10, 2011, 04:07:11 AM
The good news, such as it is, is that the outrage seems focused on political rhetoric, not guns. Granted, the antis will trot out new bills, but they will go nowhere. Let people engage in navel gazing about rhetoric. Hell, I think its useful (I have been quoted a time or two here urging folks to calm down a bit). I don't blame Limbaugh or Palin for this whack job any more than I bame environmentalists for the Unabomber or Earth First. Nut jobs are nut jobs. Still, when the NYT and other publications are calling for a "return to civility" rather than "ban all guns Aussie style", I consider it a good thing. The Tea Party and Sarah will get some undeserved knocks. They'll get over it. Its a hell of a lot better than a new AWB. FQ13
are you sure about that :-\
that is not what we are hearing over here :'(
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: fightingquaker13 on January 10, 2011, 05:34:07 AM
Phil I am sure (as sure as one can be of anything politically). This will not lead to massive gun control being passed. The GOP has the House and pro-gun Blue Dog Dems dictate the balance of power in the Senate. There will be a lot of rhetoric, but I doubt it will gain traction. The media's focus isn't on the guns, or even on the gunman (after all, that would be absurd ::)). Instead its on political rhetoric. The Dems are a lot more interested in discrediting the Tea Party and Palin than they are in banning guns. Good! This works for us. Let them debate over who started the food fight. I do fear an infringement on 1A rights, but the Court has been pretty clear on this issue. The 2A? The Dems seem more interested in getting payback on those that ousted them in 2010 than a gun control bill that could backfire in 2012. Just my .02. FQ13
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 10, 2011, 05:52:42 AM
I hear what you are saying however over here on talk back
all I was hearing was Gun culture this and Gun culture
as well as the Political retric there Palin is also copping it, however they were also bringing up Gun culture all the time
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Solus on January 10, 2011, 08:23:46 AM
I hear what you are saying however over here on talk back
all I was hearing was Gun culture this and Gun culture
as well as the Political retric there Palin is also copping it, however they were also bringing up Gun culture all the time
As FQ says, the motives here are payback for the Dem losses and to sabotage any further effect the Tea Party and Palin might have.
These motives aren't involved over there except as observations of what is happening here.
Over there, they can make more hay by pushing the Gun Culture bit which does work for the Antis over there.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Ichiban on January 10, 2011, 08:46:30 AM
I'm shocked! Shocked, I tell you!
Journalists urged caution after Ft. Hood, now race to blame Palin after Arizona shootings http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/2011/01/journalists-urged-caution-after-ft-hood-now-race-blame-palin-afte (http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/2011/01/journalists-urged-caution-after-ft-hood-now-race-blame-palin-afte)
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: JC5123 on January 10, 2011, 08:46:37 AM
Fox News Radio is reporting that several Congress Critters have said that they will start carrying at public events. The were not named. I can't say I blame them. I am also hearing reports that the shooter was a left wing anarchist. Big surprise there. ::) Of course the media is labeling him as a Tea Party member.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: TAB on January 10, 2011, 08:49:38 AM
guess which senator form CA has had a ccw for decades? oh yeah she lives in a place where you can't get a ccw, but yet she legally has one.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 10, 2011, 09:00:20 AM
Fox News Radio is reporting that several Congress Critters have said that they will start carrying at public events. The were not named. I can't say I blame them. I am also hearing reports that the shooter was a left wing anarchist. Big surprise there. ::) Of course the media is labeling him as a Tea Party member.
And at the same time some of them will try to limit our ability to do the same on a regular basis. It has come up in the past, and my addition is the way it always goes.
With apologies for leaning into a possible drift area, at what point did it become and we allow the Tea Party Movement to become a bad thing? Go back and read articles and listen to their speeches - that is where the internet DOES come in handy. The movement is for a return to basic Rights and focus on what our once great nation was founded on (once meaning that our special interests have lost focus and now "wag the dog" rather than the way it was all intended in the 18th century). All Americans that understand our history should be neutral at worse to a strong supporter in at least principal of the Tea Party Movement.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: billt on January 10, 2011, 11:24:52 AM
What I'm finding totally laughable through this whole thing, are the liberals talking about, "stopping the hate and vitriol!" Who the hell are they kidding? Can you imagine what would be pouring from their pie holes if Sarah Palin was shot in the head? "She love guns so damn much, let's see how she loves 'em now!" You know they would be all over it and her like stink on dog $h!t. But if one of their goomba's gets capped we right away have to, "stop the hate!" These people are without a doubt the biggest hypocrites on the planet. Bill T.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: jaybet on January 10, 2011, 11:26:40 AM
With apologies for leaning into a possible drift area, at what point did it become and we allow the Tea Party Movement to become a bad thing? Go back and read articles and listen to their speeches - that is where the internet DOES come in handy. The movement is for a return to basic Rights and focus on what our once great nation was founded on (once meaning that our special interests have lost focus and now "wag the dog" rather than the way it was all intended in the 18th century). All Americans that understand our history should be neutral at worse to a strong supporter in at least principal of the Tea Party Movement.
I'm not sure we "allowed" that to happen M58. If we did, it was right after we "allowed" Obummer to get elected. The greatest threat to our society today is the main stream media.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 10, 2011, 11:28:38 AM
Billt, it is happening. I have read more than one report on the "irony" of this event. They go on to talk of the Senator's strong support for the Second Amendment, and her speeches on the culture and history of Arizona. It will spread, it will get worse, and it will be used as a tool.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: billt on January 10, 2011, 12:03:41 PM
They go on to talk of the Senator's strong support for the Second Amendment, and her speeches on the culture and history of Arizona.
It's all nothing more than total B.S. No one deserves to get shot for basically doing the job they were hired to do. With that said the woman was nothing more than a flip flopping, political hack. I put her into much the same class as Arlen Spector. When she was a "Republican" they couldn't trust her for her vote, much like Spector. When she became a "democrat", they felt much the same about her. She was, (is), all over the map politically, and likes to make noise. As a representative, she was, (is), about as dangerous as they come because of her unpredictability. "Pro gun", pro amnesty, pro border security, pro obamacare. Her political posturing on these issues is akin to fish in a blender. I'm sorry she got shot, but I'm glad as hell she's out of there! If you're going to be a Republican BE ONE! If you prefer the liberal point of view, then stand your ground. You can't be "a little bit pregnant." Bill T.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: fightingquaker13 on January 10, 2011, 01:35:29 PM
It's all nothing more than total B.S. No one deserves to get shot for basically doing the job they were hired to do. With that said the woman was nothing more than a flip flopping, political hack. I put her into much the same class as Arlen Spector. When she was a "Republican" they couldn't trust her for her vote, much like Spector. When she became a "democrat", they felt much the same about her. She was, (is), all over the map politically, and likes to make noise. As a representative, she was, (is), about as dangerous as they come because of her unpredictability. "Pro gun", pro amnesty, pro border security, pro obamacare. Her political posturing on these issues is akin to fish in a blender. I'm sorry she got shot, but I'm glad as hell she's out of there! If you're going to be a Republican BE ONE! If you prefer the liberal point of view, then stand your ground. You can't be "a little bit pregnant." Bill T.
Got to disagree here Bill. A lot of people can't have their beliefs covered by a tidy little label like liberal or conservative. Further they won't stay in a neatly wrapped box defined by political parties. These are people I respect, as opposed to those that seem to let others do their thinking for them and just vote the party line. FQ13
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 10, 2011, 01:46:24 PM
FQ,
You miss the point Billt is making. His short four item list shows two contradictions in stance: Pro-secure border vs. Pro-amnesty and Pro-gun vs. Pro-Obamacare. You can't vote for something one day and vote against it by supporting an opposite view the next.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Ichiban on January 10, 2011, 06:50:13 PM
At any rate, she is lucky (or not, depending on your point of view) he was using WWB FMJs.
And, not to be too ghoulish, here is a interesting bit from CNN on the wound. http://pagingdrgupta.blogs.cnn.com/2011/01/10/gupta-how-giffords-survived-bullet-to-the-brain/?hpt=T2 (http://pagingdrgupta.blogs.cnn.com/2011/01/10/gupta-how-giffords-survived-bullet-to-the-brain/?hpt=T2)
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: fightingquaker13 on January 10, 2011, 08:31:33 PM
You miss the point Billt is making. His short four item list shows two contradictions in stance: Pro-secure border vs. Pro-amnesty and Pro-gun vs. Pro-Obamacare. You can't vote for something one day and vote against it by supporting an opposite view the next.
Those stances aren't contradictory. You can be in favor of a tight border, but amnesty those already here, hell Reagan did it. I dont agree, but there is no real contradiction. Likewise supporting nationalized health care and being pro-gun do not contradict one another. If they use health care to regulate guns? Well that is an issue one can oppose while still promoting the idea of government care. Again, I disagree with her position, but its a legitimate one. FQ13
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: billt on January 10, 2011, 08:45:55 PM
You can be in favor of a tight border, but amnesty those already here. FQ13
She is no more in favor of a tight border, than she is for the Second Amendment. In order to support Obamacare you have to support Socialism. There is no right to bear arms in a socialist government. If that isn't contradictory I don't know what is. This woman postures her every position, and tries to play both sides of the fence in the process. She only won by 4,000 votes in a district that is quite large. She did it by trying to appease everyone. Most with common sense didn't buy into her rhetoric. But enough did, just barely. She tells the people what she thinks they want to hear. I wouldn't trust her any further than I could throw a piano. Bill T.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 10, 2011, 08:56:21 PM
I lived several years in both Phoenix and Southern California. I know first hand that border security means nothing if you do not deal with those illegally here first. Amnesty does not fix the problem, it only changes the name.
Our glorious leader's health payment plan includes Second Amendment (or at least the first releases of bits did) infringements. Maybe I am incorrect on this, but I recently had surgery and during a follow up office visit and referrals I was hit with some questions I had never seen before. I asked about them and was told that it was tied to "new health regulations and the medical center's adaptation to the rules." Guns in the home was just one of the questions on the form!
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 10, 2011, 10:35:48 PM
Quote
Loughner appears in court, doesn't enter plea Gunman's family refuse FBI entry to home Obama lauds courage of brave bystanders Optimism for Giffords as condition stabilises THE alleged gunman behind a shooting which killed six in Tucson, Arizona appeared in court today, shackled and with a shaved head, but said little and did not enter a plea
ared Loughner, who was overpowered by heroic bystanders after allegedly trying to assassinate US congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords on Saturday, said little beyond answering "yes" to questions from the judge in the state capital Phoenix. The federal judge agreed to the assignment of Judy Clarke, who represented the Unabomber and 9/11 conspirator Zacarias Moussaou, as the 22-year-old's lawyer. The judge scheduled a preliminary court appearance for January 24. It was earlier reported that family members of Loughner had barricaded themselves into their home today, blocking the FBI's attempts to gain entry. The family of 22-year-old Jared Lee Loughner reportedly built the blockade with 4x4 double-thick plywood, The Arizona Republic said. At approximately 12.25pm local time, FBI agents banged on the blockade and demanded the family let them inside. Other agents moved to the back of the house and could be heard talking to someone inside. Read more about the barricade at www.azcentral.com. Meanwhile, US President Barack Obama has spoken of a sense of shock and grieving after the shooting rampage and lauded the heroism of bystanders who prevented the gunman wreaking further carnage. "Obviously all of us are still grieving and in shock on the tragedy that took place," Obama said today in his most expansive remarks yet on the attack which wounded Arizona congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords and killed six people.
"Families are still absorbing the enormity of their losses; we have a criminal investigation that is ongoing and charges that in no doubt will be brought," Obama said after talks with French President Nicolas Sarkozy.
"I think it's important for us to also focus, though, on the extraordinary courage that was shown during the course of these events," Obama said, praising a 20-year-old aide who ran into the line of fire to help Giffords.
He also lauded a "wounded woman who helped secure the ammunition that might have caused even more damage ... and citizens who wrestled down the gunman".
"In the coming days we're going to have a lot of time to reflect," Obama said in remarks that did not apportion blame or stray onto sensitive ground after the tragedy sparked debate about the tone of US politics.
"Right now, the main thing we're doing is to offer our thoughts and prayers to those who've been impacted, making sure that we're joining together and pulling together as a country," Obama said.
"And as president of the United States, but also as a father, obviously I'm spending a lot of time just thinking about the families and reaching out to them."
Earlier, the White House said Obama had spent part of the weekend calling relatives of the victims of the shooting, and political leaders of both parties.
Among his calls were the family of Christina-Taylor Green, the nine-year-old girl who was at the Giffords political event and was killed during the rampage by alleged lone gunman Jared Loughner.
Hope for Giffords
Doctors are breathing a sigh of relief as Arizona Representative Gabrielle Giffords reaches a third day without increased swelling in her brain. Neurosurgeon Dr Michael LeMole of Tucson's University Medical Center says Giffords is still responding to doctors and her condition is stable. Her brain remains swollen, but the pressure hasn't increased. He says they're much more optimistic. Of those injured in the deadly shooting Saturday in Tucson, eight are still hospitalized. One is in critical condition. Five are in serious condition, and two in good condition. A federal judge, a congressional aide and a 9-year-old girl, Christina Taylor Green, were among the six people killed, while Giffords and 13 others were injured. http://www.news.com.au/world/obama-talks-of-shock-grief-after-arizona-shooting/story-e6frfkyi-1225985352319#ixzz1AhMbD11W
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: tombogan03884 on January 10, 2011, 10:36:42 PM
M58, I think they were BSing you. I had surgeries twice since July and wasn't asked anything like that, in fact I had weapons in my possession the whole time.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Overload on January 11, 2011, 12:36:33 PM
Was I the only one not surprised that there's a special law about trying to kill a member of Congress?
Quote
Federal Criminal Code, 18 USC 531 (c) § 351. Congressional, Cabinet, and Supreme Court assassination, kidnapping, and assault; penalties
(a) Whoever kills any individual who is a Member of Congress or a Member-of-Congress-elect, a member of the executive branch of the Government who is the head, or a person nominated to be head during the pendency of such nomination, of a department listed in section 101 of title 5 or the second ranking official in such department, the Director (or a person nominated to be Director during the pendency of such nomination) or Deputy Director of Central Intelligence, a major Presidential or Vice Presidential candidate (as defined in section 3056 of this title), or a Justice of the United States, as defined in section 451 of title 28, or a person nominated to be a Justice of the United States, during the pendency of such nomination, shall be punished as provided by sections 1111 and 1112 of this title.
(b) Whoever kidnaps any individual designated in subsection (a) of this section shall be punished
(1) by imprisonment for any term of years or for life, or
(2) by death or imprisonment for any term of years or for life, if death results to such individual.
(c) Whoever attempts to kill or kidnap any individual designated in subsection (a) of this section shall be punished by imprisonment for any term of years or for life.
All men are created equal, just some more equal than others.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Solus on January 11, 2011, 12:42:54 PM
Was I the only one not surprised that there's a special law about trying to kill a member of Congress?
All men are created equal, just some more equal than others.
Well, that law doesn't make it any more illegal to kill a member of Congress or one of the other 6 that were killed that day.
Not sure why the law is needed, unless, for some reason, it imposes stiffer sentences.
Ahh...it could be that as a Federal Law, it would immediately involve Federal agencies in the case, where the killing of another citizen would be covered by state law and would not be a federal offense?
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: JC5123 on January 11, 2011, 12:53:30 PM
Was I the only one not surprised that there's a special law about trying to kill a member of Congress?
All men are created equal, just some more equal than others.
This is the part about our justice system that I have never understood. Why is it that we do not punish bases solely on the crime committed? Why does it matter who the victim is, or what the motives are? You committed X crime against Y victim(s) you get Z sentence. Period, no judicial "disgression". No harsher penalty because it came out during the trial that the victim was gay/black/green/catholic/illegal.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: billt on January 11, 2011, 02:04:00 PM
M58, I think they were BSing you. I had surgeries twice since July and wasn't asked anything like that, in fact I had weapons in my possession the whole time.
I don't know what the reasoning is, but it is on the forms at Mayo (formerly Rochester, now world wide) and Sanford (South Dakota). Both places gave me the same line with minimal differences.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 11, 2011, 02:08:25 PM
This is the part about our justice system that I have never understood. Why is it that we do not punish bases solely on the crime committed? Why does it matter who the victim is, or what the motives are? You committed X crime against Y victim(s) you get Z sentence. Period, no judicial "disgression". No harsher penalty because it came out during the trial that the victim was gay/black/green/catholic/illegal.
+1 and as many zeros as you want to add!
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Timothy on January 11, 2011, 03:28:31 PM
Well, that law doesn't make it any more illegal to kill a member of Congress or one of the other 6 that were killed that day.
Ahh...it could be that as a Federal Law, it would immediately involve Federal agencies in the case, where the killing of another citizen would be covered by state law and would not be a federal offense?
Because this loon killed a Federal Judge in addition to five others and the numerous wounded, the Feds get first crack at the guy for the indictment. It also brings in the death penalty regardless of the state that the crime was committed. Once the Feds get done with the guy, the State of Arizona can go after him in criminal court. Arizona is a death penalty state I presume?
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: TAB on January 11, 2011, 04:17:16 PM
Because this loon killed a Federal Judge in addition to five others and the numerous wounded, the Feds get first crack at the guy for the indictment. It also brings in the death penalty regardless of the state that the crime was committed. Once the Feds get done with the guy, the State of Arizona can go after him in criminal court. Arizona is a death penalty state I presume?
I really don't think this will end up being a capitol case. If even 10% of the stuff the media has reported to be true he has a very good chance he will be commited to a mental hospital for the rest of his life.
So rather its the feds or AZ that gets crack at him, once one court says he is nuts, he is nuts in the eyes of the other court.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: tombogan03884 on January 11, 2011, 04:32:36 PM
I really don't think this will end up being a capitol case. If even 10% of the stuff the media has reported to be true he has a very good chance he will be commited to a mental hospital for the rest of his life.
So rather its the feds or AZ that gets crack at him, once one court says he is nuts, he is nuts in the eyes of the other court.
All the more reason to put a needle in his arm. They still shoot mad dogs don't they ?
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: TAB on January 11, 2011, 05:04:36 PM
You know it does not work that way tom.
This guy may very well be treatable. That does not mean he should be held accountable for his crimes. He is in the age group where Schizophrenia can manfest itself fully in some one.
I'm not saying thats the case here. Just its a "maybe"
I'm sure over the next 6-12 months we will keep hearing about this, so I'm sure we will get more details.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: MikeBjerum on January 11, 2011, 05:10:59 PM
This guy may very well be treatable. That does not mean he should be held accountable for his crimes. He is in the age group where Schizophrenia can manfest itself fully in some one.
I'm not saying thats the case here. Just its a "maybe"
I'm sure over the next 6-12 months we will keep hearing about this, so I'm sure we will get more details.
In light of your phrase in blue, I'm hoping you left a word out of the phrase in red.
I don't care what the cause, mental illness, drugs or alcohol, people ARE responsible for their actions! Maybe we adjust the penalty slightly, but not drastically.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Timothy on January 11, 2011, 05:14:22 PM
Insanity cases are few and far between. Lets hope this one gets the needle or the noose or the gas or the juice.....he killed a 9 year old girl. I don't give a big, fat, hairy, rats ass if he's crazy.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: TAB on January 11, 2011, 05:17:56 PM
yeah I did,
it should have read...
That does not mean he should NOT be held accountable for his crimes.
he is accountable for his crimes.
The only time some one should ever be left off the hook for murder is after they killed some rapist. That should not be a crime, infact it should be law that you are required to do it.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: billt on January 11, 2011, 05:26:41 PM
News travels fast. This guys problems are just beginning. Bill T.
And this brings up the question that has been bouncing around my empty skull for three days now - Where was the good sheriff and his department during all of this?
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: philw on January 11, 2011, 08:49:55 PM
And this brings up the question that has been bouncing around my empty skull for three days now - Where was the good sheriff and his department during all of this?
someone has to keep the media entertained
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: TAB on January 11, 2011, 08:53:18 PM
And this brings up the question that has been bouncing around my empty skull for three days now - Where was the good sheriff and his department during all of this?
who knows, but I'd not be shocked if some one on her staff asked them to keep a very low profile.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: billt on January 12, 2011, 04:00:59 AM
This moron Dupnik talks about vitriol. Why hasn't he addressed the death threats leveled against Sheriff Joe Arpaio? His bordering County partner in law enforcement gets threatened every day. The liberals are falling apart in this country, along with their agenda. Their whole political platform went over like a turd in a punch bowl with the American people. This is how most of them have reacted. "It's Palin's fault!" I've seen Kindergarten classes act with more maturity. It's pretty hard to nail your own coffin closed. They're managing to do it. Bill T.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: twyacht on January 12, 2011, 05:24:50 AM
Even Arpaio suggests Dupnik STFU.
http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/Giffords-Dupnik-Arpaio-Arizona/2011/01/11/id/382540 Arpaio: Dupnik Should 'Shut Mouth' on Political Agenda in Tragedy Tuesday, 11 Jan 2011 04:15 PM
By Jim Meyers and Kathleen Walter
Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio tells Newsmax that, if his fellow Arizona Sheriff Clarence Dupnik were an appointed chief of police instead of an elected official, he would be “fired tomorrow” for comments he’s made about the shooting of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and others on Saturday.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Glockslinger on January 12, 2011, 06:27:29 AM
My blog on the topic, mostly aimed at non-gunnies:
http://djstucrew.livejournal.com/
So much disinformation out there!
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: billt on January 12, 2011, 06:35:43 AM
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: billt on January 12, 2011, 11:13:20 AM
This is really weird! What do you guys make of it? Bill T.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: Overload on January 12, 2011, 04:12:31 PM
billt, the easy explanation is that the youtube page of Gabrielle Gifford's listed in the video isn't hers, but made to look like hers, assuming she has a youtube page.
....OK, I just did some research. From her home page, there are youtube videos, and that account IS giffords2. Her page there shows 1 subscription, RepIkeSkelton. Interestingly, it shows her Last Visit Date as 1 Day ago, after your video was posted, and after she was shot. I assume many of her aids have access to this account. Also comparing, her current youtube page stats from what video's page shows 11K vs 296K channel views now. And your posted video only has 1400 views. Subscribers to her page have also doubled.
So, interesting, but easily faked or hacked.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: billt on January 12, 2011, 04:54:47 PM
The guy was off the rails to even suggest the shooting was faked. It just thought it was strange she would only have 2 subscriptions. Bill T.
Title: Re: US senator Gabrielle Giffords shot in arizona shooting - six others killed.
Post by: tombogan03884 on January 12, 2011, 05:47:31 PM