The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Politics & RKBA => Topic started by: Rastus on July 05, 2011, 08:26:02 PM
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I wonder how many of the now hundreds of teachers and principals who conspired to rig ACT test scores are good card carrying NEA members? NEA...aren't they supporting BHO again today?
Problems in Washington DC, Atlanta, etc.....something like 80 school "professionals" have admitted cheating in Atlanta. Hey, that's the kind of people I want teaching my kid...how 'bout you?
If only they would replace all the people who participated in this....if only....
Oh well, we won't hear much more about this I suspect.
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Blame it all on Capt Kirk. He taught us that it was okay to cheat if you're in a no-win situation. Kobayashi Maru
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But, but, but . . . . this cannot possibly be true!! Didn't Joe "The Plagerizer" Biden just tell everyone at the NEA convention that teachers are not part of the problem with edumacation these days? So this cannot possibly be true!!!!
[/sarcasm]
>:(
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If there are cheaters teaching my kid, I want them to be successful cheaters.
You know, the kind that DON"T GET CAUGHT. ::)
But, as they say, Them that can't do.......
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http://news.yahoo.com/americas-biggest-teacher-principal-cheating-scandal-unfolds-atlanta-213734183.html (http://news.yahoo.com/americas-biggest-teacher-principal-cheating-scandal-unfolds-atlanta-213734183.html)
Noble profession just because they say it is without individual character evaluation....educators my ass...lying cheats. How did these idiots ever think something of this scale could be concealed? Yeah, I support the NEA...Obama is great, Obama is king, Obama for life....HA. The "emperor" has no clothes. And, it's more than just Atlanta, read on.....
..America's biggest teacher and principal cheating scandal unfolds in AtlantaAt least 178 teachers and principals in Atlanta Public Schools cheated to raise student scores on high-stakes standardized tests, according to a report from the Georgia Bureau of Investigation.
By By Patrik Jonsson | Christian Science Monitor – 13 hrs ago
.....Award-winning gains by Atlanta students were based on widespread cheating by 178 named teachers and principals, said Georgia Gov. Nathan Deal on Tuesday. His office released a report from the Georgia Bureau of Investigation that names 178 teachers and principals – 82 of whom confessed – in what's likely the biggest cheating scandal in US history.
This appears to be the largest of dozens of major cheating scandals, unearthed across the country. The allegations point an ongoing problem for US education, which has developed an ever-increasing dependence on standardized tests.
The report on the Atlanta Public Schools, released Tuesday, indicates a "widespread" conspiracy by teachers, principals and administrators to fix answers on the Criterion-Referenced Competency Test (CRCT), punish whistle-blowers, and hide improprieties.
It "confirms our worst fears," says Mayor Kasim Reed. "There is no doubt that systemic cheating occurred on a widespread basis in the school system." The news is “absolutely devastating," said Brenda Muhammad, chairwoman of the Atlanta school board. "It’s our children. You just don’t cheat children.”
RECOMMENDED: Education reform: eight school chiefs to watch in 2011
On its face, the investigation tarnishes the 12-year tenure of Superintendent Beverly Hall, who was named US Superintendent of the Year in 2009 largely because of the school system's reported gains – especially in inner-city schools. She has not been directly implicated, but investigators said she likely knew, or should have known, what was going on. In her farewell address to teachers in June, Hall for the first time acknowledged wrongdoing in the district, but blamed other administrators.
The Atlanta cheating scandal also offers the first most comprehensive view yet into a growing number of teacher-cheating allegations across the US, reports of which reached a rate of two to three a week in June, says Robert Schaeffer, a spokesman for the National Center for Fair & Open Testing, which advocates against high-stakes testing.
It's also a tacit indictment, critics say, of politicians putting all bets for improving education onto high-stakes tests that punish and reward students, teachers, and principals for test scores.
"When test scores are all that matter, some educators feel pressured to get the scores they need by hook or by crook," says Mr. Schaeffer. "The higher the stakes, the greater the incentive to manipulate, to cheat."
Cheating in Atlanta Public Schools
The 55,000-student Atlanta public school system rose in national prominence during the 2000s, as test scores steadily rose and the district received notice and funding from the Broad Foundation and the Gates Foundation. But behind that rise, the state found, were teachers and principals in 44 schools erasing and changing test answers.
One of the most troubling aspects of the Atlanta cheating scandal, says the report, is that the district repeatedly refused to properly investigate or take responsibility for the cheating. Moreover, the central office told some principals not to cooperate with investigators. In one case, an administrator instructed employees to tell investigators to "go to hell." When teachers tried to alert authorities, they were labeled "disgruntled." One principal opened an ethics investigation against a whistle-blower.
Investigations by the Atlanta Journal-Constitution (AJC) and state investigators found a pattern consistent with other cheating scandals: a spike in test scores in one critical grade would be followed by an equally dramatic drop the next year. A USA Today investigation in March found that erasure data in six states and the District of Columbia showed these "abnormal patterns," according to testing expert Thomas Haladyna at Arizona State University.
The Atlanta testing allegations led to the first major law enforcement investigation of teacher cheating. Scandals in other states have typically been investigated by state officials. In response to recent teacher cheating allegations in Baltimore, Michael Sarbanes, the district's community engagement director, told District Management Journal, an industry publication for school administrators, that manipulating a test is "inherent in human nature, [although] we think people who do that are outliers."
The high stakes for teachers
Ten states now use test scores as the main criterion in teacher evaluations. Other states reward high-scoring teachers with up to $25,000 bonuses – while low scores could result in principals losing their jobs or entire schools closing. Even as the number of scandals grows, experts say it remains fairly easy for teachers and principals to get away with ethical lapses.
"I think the broadest issue in the [Atlanta scandal] raises is why many school districts and states continue to have high-stakes testing without rigorous auditing or security procedures," says Brian Jacob, director of the Center on Local, State and Urban Policy at the University of Michigan. "In some sense, this is one of the least worrisome problems in public education, because it's fairly easy to fix. The more difficult and troubling behavior would be teaching to the test, which we think of as a lesser form of test manipulation, but which is much harder to detect, and could warp the education process in ways that we wouldn't like."
In response to cheating scandals, some states and school districts have instituted tougher test-auditing standards, employing software that analyzes erasure rates and patterns. Meanwhile, the Obama administration is reforming NCLB to reduce pressure on teachers and principals. Education Secretary Arne Duncan said in June that NCLB “is creating a slow-motion train wreck for children, parents, and teachers.” On the other hand, an Obama administration proposal – to pay bonuses to teachers who improve test scores in their classes – may shift the stakes without lowering them.
"The [Atlanta] teachers, principals and administrators wanted to prove that the faith of the Broad and Gates Foundations and the Chamber of Commerce in the district was not misplaced and that APS could rewrite the script of urban education in America and provide a happy, or at least a happier, ending for its students," writes the AJC's education columnist, Maureen Downey.
"And that’s what ought to alarm us," adds Ms. Downey, "that these professionals ultimately felt their students could not even pass basic competency tests, despite targeted school improvement plans, proven reforms, and state-of-the-art teacher training."
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According to the article it has nothing to do with the ethics and morals of the teachers and administration. It is all about our reliance on standardized tests to evaluate their job.
The Principles should be gone regardless. They are the ones in charge, and they can perpetuate or end this.
Teachers that were instigators are gone. They are the "class leaders" that lead the rest astray.
Any teacher that participated through pressure from above. Not just peer pressure, but actual following of orders from their Principle or department head gets a one year suspension without pay during which they must take courses, at their own expense, at the local university on ethics and the course they teach. After one year they reapply for their old position.
People will say that you can't fire them all because of teacher shortages, but you can not leave these people in the classroom! You are better off with one true teacher overseeing the work of three aids that are leading one hundred teachers. The youth of America is watching this, and what happens to these teachers will teach them how they can act for the rest of their lives.
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And just released in today's paper, Beverly Hall, the Superintendent of Atlanta Public Schools, knew the cheating was going on and took retaliatory actions against whistle blowers.
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If this was cops they would want their heads cut off.
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As a teacher, I'd say the same. They shouldn't go to jail unless money changed hands, or a principal coerced a teacher into participating. Beyond that though, every single one of them should have their asses fired.More than that, there should be a school assembly explaining to the students why they were fired to demonstrate that cheating has consequences. It would be their last lesson as a teacher. If you can't be the messenger, you can be the message. 8)
FQ13
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As a teacher, I'd say the same. They shouldn't go to jail unless money changed hands, or a principal coerced a teacher into participating. Beyond that though, every single one of them should have their asses fired.More than that, there should be a school assembly explaining to the students why they were fired to demonstrate that cheating has consequences. It would be their last lesson as a teacher. If you can't be the messenger, you can be the message. 8)
FQ13
Hell has frozen over. I agree with FQ.
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And just released in today's paper, Beverly Hall, the Superintendent of Atlanta Public Schools, knew the cheating was going on and took retaliatory actions against whistle blowers.
How much jail time for her?
Like I said in mine, those that pushed it are done. She is one that is done, and when you go after a whistle blower there are laws that have been broken.
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Hell has frozen over. I agree with FQ.
You work cheap, TT. I do not agree with FQ - money did change hands, they should all go to jail for fraud and corruption. They got paid, remember? To be teachers and admins, not to game the system and involve thousands of students in a fraud on the taxpayers.
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You work cheap, TT. I do not agree with FQ - money did change hands, they should all go to jail for fraud and corruption. They got paid, remember? To be teachers and admins, not to game the system and involve thousands of students in a fraud on the taxpayers.
+1
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You work cheap, TT. I do not agree with FQ - money did change hands, they should all go to jail for fraud and corruption. They got paid, remember? To be teachers and admins, not to game the system and involve thousands of students in a fraud on the taxpayers.
You make a strong argument.
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Look, the teachers were under pressure. Unless they took money or profited they should be fired and walk. Those that did profit or took money should face prosecution. This kind of scandal starts from the top. Its administrators wanting better scores and threatening everyone below them to make it happen. The GOP in Florida has just done the same thing. Charlie Crist (that RINO bastard ::)) vetoed a law that tied teachers' pay to how well their students did on the FCAT (a standardized test). That veto d was reversed by Governor Skeletor. Now, guess how many teachers have a financial; incentive to help their students cheat? I am not excusing individual behavior here. I am saying that the the environment, and the rules do effect that behavior. Those who design a system that rewards dishonest behavior deserve their share of the blame. I offer Prohibition as Exhibit A ::).
FQ13
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Look, the teachers were under pressure. Unless they took money or profited they should be fired and walk. Those that did profit or took money should face prosecution. This kind of scandal starts from the top. Its administrators wanting better scores and threatening everyone below them to make it happen. The GOP in Florida has just done the same thing. Charlie Crist (that RINO bastard ::)) vetoed a law that tied teachers' pay to how well their students did on the FCAT (a standardized test). That veto d was reversed by Governor Skeletor. Now, guess how many teachers have a financial; incentive to help their students cheat? I am not excusing individual behavior here. I am saying that the the environment, and the rules do effect that behavior. Those who design a system that rewards dishonest behavior deserve their share of the blame. I offer Prohibition as Exhibit A ::).
FQ13
BULL
SHIT!
They committed fraud, they got paid to teach our children and they reneged on that contract. They go to jail.
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BULL
SHIT!
They committed fraud, they got paid to teach our children and they reneged on that contract. They go to jail.
I'll buy that for a dollar.
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If their students couldn't pass the tests the worthless teachers should all be fired any way.
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Look, the teachers were under pressure. Unless they took money or profited they should be fired and walk. Those that did profit or took money should face prosecution. This kind of scandal starts from the top. Its administrators wanting better scores and threatening everyone below them to make it happen. The GOP in Florida has just done the same thing. Charlie Crist (that RINO bastard ::)) vetoed a law that tied teachers' pay to how well their students did on the FCAT (a standardized test). That veto d was reversed by Governor Skeletor. Now, guess how many teachers have a financial; incentive to help their students cheat? I am not excusing individual behavior here. I am saying that the the environment, and the rules do effect that behavior. Those who design a system that rewards dishonest behavior deserve their share of the blame. I offer Prohibition as Exhibit A ::).
FQ13
Every working stiff out there is under pressure to do it faster, cheaper, and with fewer resources. Remember the quality of US cars in the early 80s? Somewhere along the line (after getting their ass handed to them by the Asians) they figured out quality had to be part of the equation. Same story here. Deal with it - that's life.
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FQ,
The only ones that should get a pass, and not a free pass, are the ones under pressure from their superiors to commit and cover the fraud. This is similar to fraud in the business place: It is wrong, it harms the system and it harms society. Even worse, it harms our youth and the future of our nation and families.
There should be no slack on this one. Put each character in their proper roll, and dole out the punishment at the highest level for each roll.
We complain about fraud and misconduct on Wall Street, in business, and in the board room - This situation with cheating in the schools just showed an entire age group that is is not only ok but that it is the proper way to get ahead. You wonder why we are in the mess we are - It is because of this type of BS, and it is because we do not get harsh enough with the consequences.
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You work cheap, TT. I do not agree with FQ - money did change hands, they should all go to jail for fraud and corruption. They got paid, remember? To be teachers and admins, not to game the system and involve thousands of students in a fraud on the taxpayers.
Then I must ask, what about teachers who "teach" to the test? They know what the test will cover and teach it specifically, sacrificing other things that should be taught in the place of the extra emphasis on the test contents.
They too are just as guilty of violating their contract by not teaching what their course should cover in order to give the kids a better chance to pass the test.
When so much of a kids future is based on the results of a single test and not what a good teacher will know about how well their students are doing, you are creating a situation where the kids will suffer if the test material is not emphasized in the classroom. The emphasis is not being place by the teacher, but by some "bureaucratic wisdom" from a political agency.
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Solus,
They also need to go! The students that are taught to the test are easily caught. If they do not know the theory or the principles of the subject they will be quickly caught through the system. My profession has a National Board test that we are required to pass. Students that purchased the compend to pass the test had a 50% pass rate. The students that studied the text book and teacher's notes had nearly 100% pass. The compend was every possible question you could be asked on the test (actual test questions), in multiple choice (like the test) with the answers in the end of each section. However, memorization of key words and answers failed the students when they were faced with situations that needed reasoning and/or formulas to find the best answer.
I like essay questions and tests that require you to show your work. These tests both catch those that don't know the fundamentals, and they help those that know the information and theory but screw up on the exact numbers or words offered in multiple choice or t/f.
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If there are cheaters teaching my kid, I want them to be successful cheaters.
You know, the kind that DON"T GET CAUGHT. ::)
But, as they say, Them that can't do.......
Maybe they could get tax attorneys and other lawyer types to teach "pro bono"..... ::)
Of course I already saw a quick MSM snippet about "No Child Left Behind",...aka "It's Bush's Fault" even though Ted "I'm still sober cause I'm dead" Kennedy wrote it.
They should be FIRED....and for cheating on a standardized state and/or fed test.......
Let's see....
Conspiracy
Fraud
Conspiracy to commit fraud
Unlawful acts against a minor(s)
Misrepresentation during the committing of a crime.
Oh, being asshat liberal cheating bastards
Fine the NEA.
Disband the Dept. of Ed.
Damn shame.
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TW...you got me thinking. If they used the US Mail then that is mail fraud....ouch.
Sic'em postal inspectors.....ya'll need the revenue.
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While I agree with the things posted here the fact remains, If a kid has curiosity, and wants to learn, all he needs is to be taught to read, his own desire to learn will take it from there.
On the other hand, a gullible slacker with no curiosity, or interest will remain a dumb ass with the best of educations.
The problem, in this particular case is the transformation of education into simply another unionized "industry".
Modern teachers are generally factory workers who simply wish to get their production accepted by the QA dept.
As in any socialist organization whether it is correct, and functional is irrelevant, all that matters is will QA "buy it".
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One of the guys over at Confederate Yankee is a teacher and he has been posting a series of "Letters From The Teacher". Several of them have addressed the problems with "critical" mandatory testing.
If you care to read further, you can find them here http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/
Will have to scroll down to find them.
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Coincidentally, I was listening to a Glen Beck segment on Sirius today that kind of spoke to what Tom said.
Beck is self educated....like me with some college and self taught. Most would agree that he's a pretty bright fellow and while I don't want to toot my own horn too much, I'm no slouch myself. I've taken many an engineer to task and in most places I've worked and I might be the smarter guy in the room rather than the dumbest. My current employer couldn't find his ass with both hands and a flashlight!
Curiosity is the key to knowledge, high school and advanced schooling give you the basis for learning but the task still remains with the student. I have little doubt, had I applied myself more seriously in my education, I surely would have gone further but, it remains to be seen if a college education would have done anything more than stifle my curiosity. My conservative attitude and my ability to aggravate my instructors is nothing new! Most professors cringed when I entered the classroom because I made THEM think rather than the opposite. It didn't hurt that I was a grown man at the time and not some snotnose kid right out of HS...
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That would have made you worth your weight in gold to any real prof. 18 year olds who tow the line are boring. You WANT a student with some RL experience who will get in your face, hell, you take them out for beers after class.
FQ13
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That would have made you worth your weight in gold to any real prof. 18 year olds who tow the line are boring. You WANT a student with some RL experience who will get in your face, hell, you take them out for beers after class.
FQ13
If you believe that Jay, then get back into the game....kids are getting the short end of the stick in most schools. A teacher that doesn't take offense to someone disagreeing with them is pretty rare.
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If you believe that Jay, then get back into the game....kids are getting the short end of the stick in most schools. A teacher that doesn't take offense to someone disagreeing with them is pretty rare.
Timothy, look at my record and style on this board. Love me or hate me, I speak the truth as I understand it, take shit with a smile and rolling eyes, and offer snark in response to insults, in hopes of getting a serious debate going. I'm the same way in the class room. You can accuse me of a lot of things, but being someone who wants "yes men" is not one of them.
FQ13
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Timothy, look at my record and style on this board. Love me or hate me, I speak the truth as I understand it, take shit with a smile and rolling eyes, and offer snark in response to insults, in hopes of getting a serious debate going. I'm the same way in the class room. You can accuse me of a lot of things, but being someone who wants "yes men" is not one of them.
FQ13
Then get back into the game young man! My post was more to light a fire, not to insult you! If you're willing to listen to a student and not "preach" the gospel according to "Obama (Lenin) or whatever the University directs that you're something this country needs.