The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: fightingquaker13 on August 12, 2011, 12:07:51 PM
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What does TMJ mean in regards to ammo? I am making a list for a run to Gander tomorrow to take advantage of their ammo sale. They have Speer lawman "TMJ" for $13 per 50. I've never used this and thought I'd give it a whirl at that price. But...FMJ I understand. What the heck is TMJ? Just curious.
FQ13
PS I can also get American Eagle at about the same price. If anyone with experience with either or both has an opinion I'd like to hear it. I usually use WWB or PMC/UMC or whatever the house brand is at my range which was house brand only, but at these prices I'll try anything. I mean, its a Glock, much like Mikey they'll eat anything. ;D
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I've seen the term used with pistol bullets meaning Total Metal Jacket.
the bullet is formed so there is no exposed lead at the base of the bullet.
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We could probably help better with PICTURES OF SAID GLOCK! ;D
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We could probably help better with PICTURES OF SAID GLOCK! ;D
Its black and green and kind of ugly. ;)
FQ13
PS Solus do you know WHY they would jacket the whole round? Is there a performance issue, or was it just cheaper to make?
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I've seen the term used with pistol bullets meaning Total Metal Jacket.
the bullet is formed so there is no exposed lead at the base of the bullet.
Correct, and I will add that it is like a plating process where there is no seam. The process has been around for quite awhile, I first heard of it from Federal, and it was most common in small companies catering to reloaders. Speer has a big push on them recently.
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Its black and green and kind of ugly. ;)
FQ13
PS Solus do you know WHY they would jacket the whole round? Is there a performance issue, or was it just cheaper to make?
Some indoor ranges require them because there is less lead exposure and, thus, less air contamination by lead.
There might be performance reasons since if the lead is exposed and cause air contamination, it must be being affected by the blast to some degree or other.
Don't know..
If anything, they would not give poorer performance, but might give better, but I am just guessing from the info I have presented.
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and kind of ugly. ;)
Isn't that in the standard description for all glocks??? ;D
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Isn't that in the standard description for all glocks??? ;D
Well, to a degree. They have a new Long Slide Glock that has an extra inch or so of ugly....way over the top.
It's a good thing Glocks success isn't based upon it's looks.
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Its black and green and kind of ugly Glocky. ;)
FQ13
PS Solus do you know WHY they would jacket the whole round? Is there a performance issue, or was it just cheaper to make?
FIFY ;D
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FQ said:
Quick ammo question
No such animal. ;) ;D ;D ;D ;D
Buy the stuff and shoot it, FQ.
Speer is a known quality bullet purveyor and AE also makes good ammo, that in the opinion of most of my range colleagues, is several notches above WWB and PMC in both performance and cleanliness.
YMMV, of course as most things are conditional to a degree.
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I've heard the expression 'Truncated Metal Jacket', although I don't know what it means....
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I've heard the expression 'Truncated Metal Jacket', although I don't know what it means....
I've heard that also and I've guessed it was a jacketed Keith type bullet configuration rather than round nose.
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Think .40 S&W target ammo....
I have shot it and recovered bullets from various backstops,....it flattens to about the diameter of a quarter shooting through water jugs.
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I've heard the expression 'Truncated Metal Jacket', although I don't know what it means....
Truncated is a geometric form. Think of a tapering cone with a flat top rather than coming to a point.
Full metal jacket ball ammo has a "blended radius". Now make that flat like .38 WWB ball ammo. That would be "truncated" as it's flat on top for use in lever action rifles.
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I've heard the expression 'Truncated Metal Jacket', although I don't know what it means....
Truncated is a geometric form. Think of a tapering cone with a flat top rather than coming to a point.
Full metal jacket ball ammo has a "blended radius". Now make that flat like .38 WWB ball ammo. That would be "truncated" as it's flat on top for use in lever action rifles.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What he said.
(http://www.corbins.com/images/dwg-tc.jpg)
http://www.corbins.com/specs.htm#tc
http://firearms.digital-criminals.co.uk/handgunmmo.html
http://www.pmcammo.com/bronze-handguns.html
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What he said.
(http://www.corbins.com/images/dwg-tc.jpg)
http://www.corbins.com/specs.htm#tc
http://firearms.digital-criminals.co.uk/handgunmmo.html
http://www.pmcammo.com/bronze-handguns.html
Commonly known as semi wadcutter?
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Or TMC - Truncated Metal Cone. SWC has a sharper edge that cuts targets much better.
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Looks like it comes in both RN (round nose) and FN (flat nose) configureations if you look at the product listings, also something called RHT ?
From Speer's websight:
Lawman Clean-Fire—The Indoor Training Solution
If air quality in indoor ranges concerns you, Speer® has the ammunition to set your mind at ease. Lawman® Clean-Fire® is loaded like regular Lawman except for the primer and bullet. The ignition power comes from our patented* Clean-Fire primer that contains no lead, barium, or antimony.
The bullets we load in Lawman Clean-Fire are Speer's TMJ®. The lead core is completely and seamlessly encased in jacket material so powder gases can't burn lead off the bullet base. This design is superior to other makers' "base cap" bullets where the caps can loosen, leaking lead and destroying accuracy.
Lawman Clean-Fire leaves the range air and your firearm cleaner. Fired cases don't show the usual soot coating you see in most regular ammunition. Velocities and bullet weights are the same as most Gold Dot® products for realistic practice.
When you need to clear the air, reach for Lawman Clean-Fire, your training solution.
http://www.speer-ammo.com/products/lawman_cf.aspx
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Looks like it comes in both RN (round nose) and FN (flat nose) configureations if you look at the product listings, also something called RHT ?
From Speer's websight:
Lawman Clean-Fire—The Indoor Training Solution
If air quality in indoor ranges concerns you, Speer® has the ammunition to set your mind at ease. Lawman® Clean-Fire® is loaded like regular Lawman except for the primer and bullet. The ignition power comes from our patented* Clean-Fire primer that contains no lead, barium, or antimony.
The bullets we load in Lawman Clean-Fire are Speer's TMJ®. The lead core is completely and seamlessly encased in jacket material so powder gases can't burn lead off the bullet base. This design is superior to other makers' "base cap" bullets where the caps can loosen, leaking lead and destroying accuracy.
Lawman Clean-Fire leaves the range air and your firearm cleaner. Fired cases don't show the usual soot coating you see in most regular ammunition. Velocities and bullet weights are the same as most Gold Dot® products for realistic practice.
When you need to clear the air, reach for Lawman Clean-Fire, your training solution.
http://www.speer-ammo.com/products/lawman_cf.aspx
When directed at individual shooters this is nothing but marketing BS.
The only way that components can effect air quality in a range is if only that ammo is used.
As an advertisement to range operators it may be true , but on an individual basis it will make absolutely no difference since the guy before, or on either side of you is probably not using it.
So all you are doing is causing yourself to either waste the brass or have to sort for 2 different primer sizes.
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Okay, the question is answered (sort of). I made it to Gander and bought a box of the stuff today, I mean, at $12 per 50 why not? According to the box it is training ammo for LEOS that mimics the weight of Speer Gold Dots, but it is pretty much lead free in the primer and the entire bullet is jacketed. So its NOT "truncated metal jacket" (which I was hoping for), but total metal jacket. Basically its a lawyer round designed to keep the environmentalists happy on outdoor ranges and OSHA happy on indoor ones. Still, its a box of Speers for $.24 a round. I'll take it. ;)
FQ13
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The TMJ is electroplated and built up "one molecule at a time" to the precise thickness they want. It's more than adequate accuracy for me.