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Member Section => Tactical Rifle & Carbine => Topic started by: Tyler Durden on December 28, 2011, 04:40:11 PM

Title: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Tyler Durden on December 28, 2011, 04:40:11 PM
Just like the thread says....

http://www.paraord.com/new/product_rifle.php

I thought I read somewhere that the license went back to Mr. Zitta who was the guy who originally came up with the idea.

Why?

Were the sales languishing that much?

Was it price pointed too high?

Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Pathfinder on December 28, 2011, 05:40:01 PM
Part of the issue was that piston rifles just ain't selling, in fact EBRs ain't really selling, the go-to gun now is the handgun.

My guess is Para decided to focus on their strengths - the 1911 and other really niced handguns.

IMHO . . . .
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Timothy on December 28, 2011, 05:58:48 PM
You're both correct!

Para is going back to it's "core competency" and Zitta gets the rights to his design, manufacturing and marketing of his systems.

There's a blurb in the January issue of American Rifleman..
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: twyacht on December 28, 2011, 06:31:02 PM
Para moved to NC from FL, to save money and focus on making top-shelf stuff,(which they do),....

However, like many gunmakers,,,,,,the Marketing and Sales Division, looking at the gun sales numbers, keep their price point on the high end..

They seem to not get that if they dropped the price a couple hundred bucks, they would sell more....

Instead, lets keep the price on the uber high end....

For example, the LWRC REPR AR, a fine rifle, is over $2500....I can build a clone of one, damn near part for part, with some bravocompany, brownells, and palmettostatearmory and still have money left over for mags and ammo.

Kinda like the tax the rich folks more in your state, who than leave, and leave you short of what you were positive was a "sure thing"...



Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: BAC on December 28, 2011, 06:43:27 PM
When did they move to FL?  I thought they just moved to NC from Canada.
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: tombogan03884 on December 28, 2011, 06:45:37 PM
When did they move to FL?  I thought they just moved to NC from Canada.

I'm not sure but it seems like they were only in Fla a short time, a year or less before they moved to NC.
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: twyacht on December 28, 2011, 06:48:56 PM
Para moved to NC from FL

Just outside of Charlotte...



Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Timothy on December 28, 2011, 06:50:07 PM
My LTC was made in Ft. Lauderdale.  I bought that in 2008.
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: BAC on December 28, 2011, 06:59:33 PM
Para moved to NC from FL

Just outside of Charlotte...






Ohhhhhhh...Never mind.
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: twyacht on December 28, 2011, 07:18:44 PM
My LTC was made in Ft. Lauderdale.  I bought that in 2008.

The year I move back to Ft. Lauderdale, (2008), they leave and moved to my 20 year "adopted" State of NC,.... :-\

I'd love a Para Hawg,....but not if I have to chase them..... 8)

Still a great American Gun company,.....Todd Jarret running 1000 rds. from a NIB 1911,....is classic,  a testament, and here in the DRTV vid section.
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Timothy on December 28, 2011, 07:22:32 PM
They were getting some bad press for MIM parts.  I did a bit of research after Peglegs review a bit ago.  I took mine apart before I put her up for consignment and couldn't find any in mine.  It's been Timex reliable on everything I've thrown through it.
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Tyler Durden on December 28, 2011, 07:27:51 PM
well...just for comparison sake...let's look at the SCAR....

folding stock, yep!

adjustable stock, yep!

in .223, yep!

takes AR mags, yep!

price point, right around $2,200 from what I gathered off of gunbroker.com

looking at the Para Ordnance TTR on gunbroker, if you can believe gunbroker's pricing is most likely between $1,500 to $2,000...

yeah, for $200 more I would rather buy the SCAR and look like one of the really cool kids on the block.

if Para could keep it under $1,500 I think they would have sold the bejeepers out of them.



Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Timothy on December 28, 2011, 07:32:23 PM
well...just for comparison sake...let's look at the SCAR....

if Para could keep it under $1,500 I think they would have sold the bejeepers out of them.

But they didn't!

And, were they actually making any of those parts?  Doubtful and the sum total of anything in parts is far more than it's assembled counterpart!

Buy a Boss 302 in parts and you'll be out 100K.  Buy one off the showroom floor and you'll save at least 40K...

Either way, they got into rifles at the height of the madness and it didn't work.
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Tyler Durden on December 28, 2011, 07:52:50 PM
did they really even advertise the TTR?

Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: les snyder on December 28, 2011, 09:55:14 PM
the one I handled, but did not shoot, was nose heavy and the folding butt stock had a very uncomfortable cheek weld
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Tyler Durden on December 29, 2011, 09:25:17 AM
Timothy wrote:
Quote
Buy a Boss 302 in parts and you'll be out 100K.  Buy one off the showroom floor and you'll save at least 40K...

not to derail my own thread, but....do you have a link just so I could see what you are talking about?

I like the look of the old Mustangs.  I like the look of the new mustangs too.  I saw a 2010 or 2011 Shelby Cobra Mustang with a sticker price of $52K.   :-X
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Timothy on December 29, 2011, 09:26:48 AM
Timothy wrote:
not to derail my own thread, but....do you have a link just so I could see what you are talking about?

I like the look of the old Mustangs.  I like the look of the new mustangs too.  I saw a 2010 or 2011 Shelby Cobra Mustang with a sticker price of $52K.   :-X


http://www.ford.com/cars/mustang/2012mustangboss/?searchid=61240949|2322893069|
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: bafsu92 on December 29, 2011, 06:02:43 PM
The para rifles were real hard to find, there was a perceived demand for them if they could've come to market a little faster. By the time they hit Sig & Ruger had really beat them to the punch with a piston rifle for $300 - $500 less. I saw, I believe in the CDNN catalog closeout Para rifles for around $1300.
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: BAC on December 29, 2011, 06:49:51 PM
Was the Para even a piston rifle?  I thought it was a delayed impingement system or something like that.  Or is that their fancy way of saying it's a piston system?
Title: Re: Just wondering about the Para-Ordnance Tactical Target Rifle???
Post by: Timothy on December 29, 2011, 07:07:19 PM
Was the Para even a piston rifle?  I thought it was a delayed impingement system or something like that.  Or is that their fancy way of saying it's a piston system?

"The biggest difference between the Para TTR and other AR-style carbines is in the operating system. Licensed by ZM Weaponry, the Para TTR uses a trademarked Delayed Impingement Gas System (DIGS) designed by Allan Zitta to get the shooter back on target faster than any other rifle in its class. The system utilizes a unique modified gas key sporting a nickeled operating rod that runs through the upper receiver and over the barrel to the gas block where it sleeves the chrome-plated gas tube."

Swiped from the interweb...