The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Handguns => Topic started by: tstand on April 08, 2012, 06:32:16 PM
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Looking for a handgun for home defense. It would be a supplement to the shotgun I already own. I have no plans for concealed carry. I would probably mount a light or laser to the handgun and store in a quick release safe.
If the LR22 was an acceptable home defense weapon, I would get a Browning Buckmark, but I keep reading the 22 is not going to be effective and the 9mm is considered the minimum defensive caliber.
The Smith & Wesson M&P fits my hand well and the recoil is manageable. I fired two other guns that did not feel as good: Glock 19 and CZ P-01, both of which are compacts. With both of these, the middle finger of my shooting hand rubs against the trigger guard after a few rounds and hurts. I also tried a couple of revolvers (models unknown) and they were also too small fitting for my hand.
Ideally, I would like something that fits my hand as well as the S&W M&P but has less recoil. Can anyone suggest other models I should try that are $600 or less?
Many thanks! :)
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If you're looking for less recoil, you should try a full-size, heavier gun. Since you won't be carrying it that shouldn't be a problem. Maybe try out a Glock 17 Gen 4, Beretta 92a1, CZ 75 SP-01, Springfield XDM. Lots of available choices for $600 or less. You'll just have to try them until one finds you. Awwww, too bad.
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You might give a try to the Springfield XD and XD(m)s. They have a compact model with both shot and long magazines. Now they're not cheap, but the Walther line might be one to look at too.
In revolvers, it really hinges around the grips. You can pick up a 4" S&W 686 (.357Mag) used for under $600 if you bide your time (I got mines for $466 including transfer fee, but I had to be patient on the auction sights). Then you can select different grips that are either large, like Pacymayer 2 piece or small, like the Hogue mono-grips.
In fact if you get a 686 I'll send you a pair of the Pachmayers, I don't need.
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If I was looking purely for a nightstand gun it would be a revolver. Unless you're committed to spending the money to find a reliable cartridge to feed an autoloader, you can't go wrong with kindergarten simple in a wheelgun!
A .357 in a 3 or 4" barrel would be sufficient for most purposes and there are several available for under 600 bucks.
my .02...
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If you're looking for less recoil, you should try a full-size, heavier gun. Since you won't be carrying it that shouldn't be a problem. Maybe try out a Glock 17 Gen 4, Beretta 92a1, CZ 75 SP-01, Springfield XDM. Lots of available choices for $600 or less. You'll just have to try them until one finds you. Awwww, too bad.
Great suggestions from all. Thanks. I just discovered the DPM Recoil System. Makes me wonder if I should just get the M&P and put the DPM on it. Then I've got a nice-fitting, light gun with low recoil.
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If you decide on a 9mm Glock... G19/G17/G34, I would suggest a Gen 3 and not Gen 4.... a G34 is only slightly longer than a 1911
If you have large hands, the beavertail of a M&P will fit you better, and the M&P comes with better sights....Glock non tritium sights are terrible
I shoot a G34 as a competition gun, and think it is overlooked by a lot of new shooters.... as others have said, I too usually recommend a 3 or 4" revolver as a first gun.. Ruger or S&W...the last FBI wheel gun.. M13 3" heavy barrel round butt (M65 in stainless)...
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If you decide on a 9mm Glock... G19/G17/G34, I would suggest a Gen 3 and not Gen 4.... a G34 is only slightly longer than a 1911
If you have large hands, the beavertail of a M&P will fit you better, and the M&P comes with better sights....Glock non tritium sights are terrible
I shoot a G34 as a competition gun, and think it is overlooked by a lot of new shooters.... as others have said, I too usually recommend a 3 or 4" revolver as a first gun.. Ruger or S&W...the last FBI wheel gun.. M13 3" heavy barrel round butt (M65 in stainless)...
I usually carry a 1911, but I have, and sometimes carry, a 4" S&W model 13 in .357.
If I had to reduce it to only one pistol, that is the one I would keep.
If you are looking for less recoil and lower price another option is a .380, home defense will be fairly close range, and with the modern hollow points .380 is more effective than it used to be.
Or 9mmX18 Makarov, the CZ 82/83 comes in either
http://www.jgsales.com/cz-82-czech-9x18-new-barrel-makarov-military-pistol,-vg-condition,-california-package-w-9rd-mag.-p-1604.html
http://www.jgsales.com/cz-83-czech-surplus-380acp-pistol,-overall-good-to-very-good-condition.-p-5703.html
The single stack version was the Soviet / Russian military issue side arm for the last 60 years or so.
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How about a word for one of our sponsors, Ruger?
Since they have fixed the trigger issues the SR9 is a nice light weight 9mm. Good ergonomics in a (relatively) slim package. The recoil is very soft for a polymer gun. They are going for about $400 (around here) so you'll have money left over for ammo to practice with.
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if you are really new to handguns, and recoil is your primary consideration I offer a comment.... a wheelgun offers a lot of versitility with cartridge selection that an autoloader doesn't... the autoloader cartridge has to have a certain minimum amount of energy to reliably work the slide....don't let the term " magnum" intimidate you... it describes the maximim power cartridge designed for the gun (stronger gun) ... a .38special and .357mag share the same barrel bore diameter (.357") and the case for the .357 is about 1/10" longer (so it won't fit in guns not designed for it)... since the cartridge doesn't have to operate the action in a revolver to prepare for the next shot, a much less recoiling cartridge may be chambered (.38special v. .357mag)...less recoil and muzzle blast shortens the learning curve with marksmanship and gun handling skill...
both my S&W 442 and Ruger Security Six are loaded with .38spl 125 grain Federal NyClads....
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if you are really new to handguns, and recoil is your primary consideration I offer a comment.... a wheelgun offers a lot of versitility with cartridge selection that an autoloader doesn't... since the cartridge doesn't have to operate the action in a revolver to prepare for the next shot, a much less recoiling cartridge may be chambered (.38special v. .357mag)...less recoil and muzzle blast shortens the learning curve with marksmanship and gun handling skill.
If I was looking purely for a nightstand gun it would be a revolver. Unless you're committed to spending the money to find a reliable cartridge to feed an autoloader, you can't go wrong with kindergarten simple in a wheelgun!
If it's your first handgun, seriously consider ^^these^^. Malfunction clearance drill for autos need to be practiced and owned.
With a revo, just pull the trigger again.
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Used Ruger Speed Six revolvers
Caliber - .357
Barrel - 2 3/4
Wood grips
Good condition
$289.95 (Hand pick add $10.00)
S.O.G.
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Saw a used Ruger Security Six for $400 at the LGS.
The Smith and Wesson M&P is a good starter pistol. Should last the rest of your life if you give it TLC. Same with the Glock 17. BAC did give some other recommendations.
As for the revolver, Ruger GP100. I am looking forward to Charter Arms .40 revolver coming out.
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I usually carry a 1911, but I have, and sometimes carry, a 4" S&W model 13 in .357.
If I had to reduce it to only one pistol, that is the one I would keep.
If you are looking for less recoil and lower price another option is a .380, home defense will be fairly close range, and with the modern hollow points .380 is more effective than it used to be.
Or 9mmX18 Makarov, the CZ 82/83 comes in either
http://www.jgsales.com/cz-82-czech-9x18-new-barrel-makarov-military-pistol,-vg-condition,-california-package-w-9rd-mag.-p-1604.html
http://www.jgsales.com/cz-83-czech-surplus-380acp-pistol,-overall-good-to-very-good-condition.-p-5703.html
The single stack version was the Soviet / Russian military issue side arm for the last 60 years or so.
I'll have to see what models are available in my area to rent. Today I learned a local dealer has a bunch of the CZ 82 or 83 available that are reconditioned and $300. The 9x19 ammo is priced about the same as 9mm too. For whatever reason the recoil on the markarov is comparatively less.
I will also pick up a couple of revolvers, whatever is available, for comparison.
Terry
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Smart move on the rent before you buy, that way you don't end up with a perfectly fine pistol that just isn't right for you.
Regardless of what you end up with, enjoy the testing ;D
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You mentioned that revolver grips were too small for your hand. There is the Sig Pro 2022 which has been selling in the low $400 range. It's a polymer frame pistol that is really reliable, comes in 9mm and 40 calibers, and the grip is larger than some, plus it comes with a second grip that is even larger.
It's a good gun at a cheap price.
If you are not going to shoot it much and others may use it, I'd go .357 revolver and buy a bigger grip.
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Replacement grips are fairly inexpensive depending on what you like and can also really dress up and personalize a mass production revolver or pistol.
They are also as simple to replace as a light bulb.
Here's a little of what's available for both types of handgun.
http://www.pachmayr.com/home/
http://www.getgrip.com/main/overview/overview.html
http://www.eaglegrips.com/
http://www.exoticpistolgrips.com/
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I know some of the regulars here may poo poo on this suggestion for several reasons, but a .327 Federal magnum in a Ruger SP101 might make a good carry / home defense revolver. The specs on this round bring to about.357 magnum.
Two drawbacks that I see are, New Round and New Gun = Higher cost in ammo and firearm purchase at this current time.
But recoil will be some what less than the .357.
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I know some of the regulars here may poo poo on this suggestion for several reasons, but a .327 Federal magnum in a Ruger SP101 might make a good carry / home defense revolver. The specs on this round bring to about.357 magnum.
Two drawbacks that I see are, New Round and New Gun = Higher cost in ammo and firearm purchase at this current time.
But recoil will be some what less than the .357.
No argument here! I think you get an extra chamber as well?
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To the OP and original title?
The answer is no...whether in full size or compact.
(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm182/twyacht/MPc006.jpg)
(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm182/twyacht/MP.jpg)
It simply is the S&W got right....
OBTW, yes there are others....but test drive what you can. My two M&P's are tested, had a 500 rd abuse test, others have abused more, but there is no point.....They work.
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I know some of the regulars here may poo poo on this suggestion for several reasons, but a .327 Federal magnum in a Ruger SP101 might make a good carry / home defense revolver. The specs on this round bring to about.357 magnum.
Two drawbacks that I see are, New Round and New Gun = Higher cost in ammo and firearm purchase at this current time.
But recoil will be some what less than the .357.
You won't catch any crap from me.
I've heard good things about the round , I've been trying to convince my Dad to switch to it from the .22 mag he currently carries.
He is 81 with arthritis so he had to put up his .357 and started carrying a Ruger. single six.
Of course on the other hand, the .22 Mag will deal with people and snakes, but he will not be tempted to to use it on Grizzlies, mountain lions or the 200 pound wolves.
Just get back in the truck and leave. ;D
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Today I rented six different 9mm pistols at Vandalia Shooting Grounds in SW Ohio. All the guns were very nice and I think I would be happy with any of them. This is my rank order of preference based on felt recoil, grip comfort, and to a lesser extent, accuracy (I'm not consistent so hard to rate a gun on my spread)
1. Ruger SR9 (lowest felt recoil, fairly accurate for me, most comfortable grip - is it the rubber backstrap?)
2. Springfield XD
3. Beretta 90-two
4. Springfield XDM (the grated grip kind of bugged me)
SIG P??? (Poor aim with it)
M&P (good grip, but felt recoil is higher)
If I could get the SR9 with the DPM recoil reducer, I think it would be perfect for me. But they don't make it for Berettas.
Tomorrow I'm firing some revolvers at another location.
I wanted to try the Beretta PX4 but they did not have it in 9mm. Can anyone compare the PX4 to the guns above?
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My full size M&P .45 home defense weapon is an amazingly soft shooting pistol even without any recoil management add ons. Same goes for the M&P .40 I had. Don't trust all the things you read. Plus, anything you add to a gun that changes the slide dynamics can reduce reliability. One thing you can do that I did that gives you great flexibility and won't affect reliability at all is to buy an M&P .40 and then buy a 9mm drop-in conversion barrel from Storm Lake for $125 or so and a 9mm mag. All you have to do to change caliber is to field strip the pistol, swap barrels, reassemble, and put the appropriate mag in. That gives you the option of shooting 9mm or .40 S&W, two pistols in one. You have to get the .40 model and swap to 9mm, though. You can't buy the 9mm and go the other way.
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And not that I'm pushing Glock but you can do the same thing with Glocks. Among others Lone Wolf has a 9mm barrel for G: 27, 33, 23, 32, 22, and 31. And I think others (BarSto?) have conversions for XD.
I have one for my 23 and when I travel, I take 3 mags of .40 and 3 mags of 9mm with the conversion barrel. Anything serious happens I should be able to find ammo for one or the other.