The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: tombogan03884 on July 20, 2012, 08:10:09 AM
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http://gma.yahoo.com/mass-shooting-colo-movie-theater-14-people-dead-085940786--abc-news-topstories.html
A lone gunman dressed in riot gear burst into a movie theater in Aurora, Colo., at a midnight showing of the Batman film "The Dark Knight Rises" and opened fire, killing at least 12 people and injuring at least 50.
The suspect, James Holmes, 24, of Aurora, was caught by police in the parking lot of the Century 16 Movie Theaters, nine miles outside Denver, after police began receiving dozens of 911 calls at 12:39 a.m. MT. Police said the man appeared to have acted alone.
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Police said 10 victims died inside the theater, while dozens of others were taken to local hospitals, including a child as young as 6 years old.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>MORE AT LINK<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Initial thoughts,
Bet it was a "Gun Free Zone".
That worked real well.
Part of the reason these things happen is because of the way the "news media" glamorizes them.
The only actual confirmed information available so far are the location, and the name of the suspect, even the number of casualties is not confirmed yet, the linked article says 14 dead in the title, 12 dead in the article, and 10 dead in the photo caption.
Yet with that meager amount of info the media have milked it for about 3 hours worth of speculation as of 9AM, if the shooter was looking for attention he has certainly gotten his wish thanks to the media.
Any parent who takes a 3 month old baby, or a 6 year old, to a midnight showing of a movie may not deserve to get shot, but a good beating would be totally appropriate considering the inflated price of even "normal" movie tickets.
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Hardly the time for this commentary I know BUT - I'd add to tombogan's post that any "adult" who goes to see a movie with "Batman" in the title deserves a good slap too.
Now back to our regularly scheduled prognosticating
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What about adults that watch Spiderman and the others?
http://thegunrunnerpodcast.com/tgrp-episode-191-pass-review/ (http://thegunrunnerpodcast.com/tgrp-episode-191-pass-review/)
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Thin Tom,
I agree on the ages of the children with one more comment:
What type of parent takes a six year old to a show with the content of the modern Batman? Granted it is not as bad as the parents that take their young children to R rated movies, but PG-13 and a six year old ??? This is the time of life for "Once upon a time ...", not "You ain't gonna believe this shit."
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Thin Tom,
I agree on the ages of the children with one more comment:
What type of parent takes a six year old to a show with the content of the modern Batman? Granted it is not as bad as the parents that take their young children to R rated movies, but PG-13 and a six year old ??? This is the time of life for "Once upon a time ...", not "You ain't gonna believe this shit."
I hear what you are saying, I've had the same thought about parents who let their young children watch things like "Nightmare on Elm St". I can't comment on "Batman" since the only one I saw had Michelle Pfiefer in tight leather, oh, I saw the one with Halle Berry as Catwoman too ;D
The new ones from what I can tell have no relation to the "real" Batman,
You know, this guy
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I just ran down and bought "Ice Age the meltdown" for my grandaughter who's staying for the night. We have a special set of DVDs just for her.
How to train your dragon
Caiuo (SP?)
Ice age
Ice age 2
Princess diaries
Enchanted
I'm looking forward to the day she is old enough for Balto and Herbie.
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Talk about Thread Drift!!!! :o
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Well, Bloomberg has jumped on the tragedy :o
Call for BHO and Romney to address gun control because this affects us all.
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Talk about Thread Drift!!!! :o
We've got two threads going simultaneously; we might as well drift one.
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Bottom line is that innocents got shot and /or killed and all gun owners are gonna pay in one way or the other.
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Yep on both of the last two posts.
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Well, Bloomberg has jumped on the tragedy :o
Call for BHO and Romney to address gun control because this affects us all.
WOW, 11 whole hours before the elitists start using a tragedy to advance their agenda.
Probably would not have been so slow had it occurred at a more civilized hour.
But is any one really surprised that right after an incident like this the libs want to punish every one who DIDN'T do it ?
Mean while the DOJ still has not prosecuted Malik Nidal after almost 3 years.
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Some douchebag congress critter was just on Fox News commenting on the shooting. One of the things he thinks needs to be investigated is how this guy "amassed such a large cache of weapons". The guy had two handguns, a shot gun and a rifle. Four, count em FOUR guns!! Hell, I have more than that in my truck on many days!!
Douchebags. ::)
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Local officials just finished their press conference:
Gov., Mayor, Police Chief and Dist. Attorney all did a very good job of saying it is a tragedy, they are working to learn what happened, the community will band together to heal and move on, we can't let a person that does this change our lives and what we do, and they moved on to explain how to find help if you need it.
Amazingly, Pres. BHO was mentioned that he had called first thing this morning, but they didn't beg him for help.
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I'm surprised, Colorado cities are pretty liberal.
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They're now reporting (badly) that he had a large cache of weapons on him consisting of a shotgun, two handguns and an AR-15 rifle, "capable of holding upwards of 100 rounds of ammunition"!
My sister in law is eating this BS up...I said, where's the "large cache" of weapons? I have that much in my closet!
though I don't own an AR...
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They're now reporting (badly) that he had a large cache of weapons on him consisting of a shotgun, two handguns and an AR-15 rifle, "capable of holding upwards of 100 rounds of ammunition"!
My sister in law is eating this BS up...I said, where's the "large cache" of weapons? I have that much in my closet!
though I don't own an AR...
Yea, I feel your pain. I'm going to pay for this on the in-law front myself. Have a gun hating b-i-l that lives in Golden, so I'm going to hear all about this. Fortunately he is broke and won't be able to make a trip home.
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Yea, I feel your pain. I'm going to pay for this on the in-law front myself. Have a gun hating b-i-l that lives in Golden, so I'm going to hear all about this. Fortunately he is broke and won't be able to make a trip home.
Oh, she knows nothing of guns in general. She's just parroting what she's seeing on the evening news! This S-I-L is one of the kids that were missed in the educational system of the 70's. She 53, reads and writes at about the fourth or fifth grade level and her other social skills are null and void! Thank goodness my marriage license doesn't have a rider saying that I have to actually give a shit about my in-laws...I just tell her to STFU!
;)
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To the original OP by tom,....99.99999% of large cinema plex's are "gun free zones". Posted at each entrance.
Regardless of throat protection, groin plate, ballistic helmet and body armor, I still maintain well placed shots with a handgun, would penetrate a gas mask, knee cap, forearm, shin, and break his concentration as he's being "thumped" preferably with a high capacity semi-auto pistol like a Glock 21.....Hindsight being 20/20.....
Ask deepwater about when we went to see Aliens.......That Tok went anyway. and would have been effective.
He probably knew it was a gun free zone.
Some asshat Colo. detective this a.m. on Fox & Friends, "insisted" this must have been a fully automatic "assault rifle" and how could he have purchased it due to the mass casualties.
Later today, they were all legally purchased at area Bass Pro, and local gun shops.
Brian Ross of ABC news looked up a James Holmes in the phone book and identified him as a member of the Colorado Tea Party...
same name, different guy,....but that was after this "outstanding" journalist put it out on the air.
after being bombarded via Facebook/Twitter, and the ABC switchboard, he apologized....
Here we go again.
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TW,
One Glock and the shotgun at Bass Pro, and the other Glock and S&W M&P15 at Gander Mountain.
Bass Pro has issued a statement with the standard well wishes and sympathies, and that they have reviewed all paperwork, and the employees acted correctly concerning store policy, and local and federal laws.
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Three words: New Life Church.
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Look at the mass shooters
Tuscon Laughner was an alleged Tea party member, turns out he was a Dem volunteer and college drop out,
Virginia Tech, Cho was a nut college student
Ft Hood, Nidal was a Muslim psychologist, college grad
U of Alabama, Huntsville, Amy Bishop was a whack job with a Phd.
I believe that exposure to flawed liberal thinking that removes the concept of personal responsibility plays a large part in inciting the mentally unbalanced to commit these acts .
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Such a tragedy.
Has really stirred up the gun debate here again.
I woke up around 3 am this morning and was hearing them banging on about gun ownership and more restrictions an they should be like us bla bla
One thing the guy said was I have never seen anyone that has ccw stop a mass shooting.
So when I get a chance I will be sending him an email to educate him.
Also for those that know the area. Is it a "gun free zone " as I wanted to know for my email to him and also comment on a couple of forums here. That are also going on the they should just ban guns.
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Don't forget the "Occupy" threesome that was caught trying to plan to blow up bridges in Ohio a few months ago......One or two were from my area. It's posted here, I just haven't looked for it...
Once they were ID'd as Occupy groupies, the story went away,....
Gee, once the Gifford shooter wasn't a "Right Wing Extremist" the story,.....went away,.....
Talking Heads had a song in the 80's,.....Same As It Ever Was,....
I'm not shocked on this one in Co... Except for Ft. Hood,....we knew everything about these shooters in short order,.....and Nidal is still being supressed.
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I remember that, the third was from my area, he was a Free State "libertarian".
I was talking to a lady today who's sister lives there, she has been to that theater while visiting and it was posted as gun free at that time.
That worked real well. For Holmes .
As for Nidal of the Ft Hood "work place violence" after nearly 3 years he still has not come to trial.
Barry does not want him tried "it would make his people look bad".
Seriously, BO is sitting on an atomic bomb shell with that one.
Michelle Bachmann is being attacked by RINO's and liberals because she asked Why are people with known terrorist ties allowed to work in sensitive Govt. jobs.
She asked in reference to one of Hillary's aides who has family ties to Hezbollah I think it was.
This guy is a perfect example, every one who had dealings with him knew he was a radical Islamist A hole, but no one did squat except to shuffle him off to be some one else's problem.
It's McCarthy all over again, he asked "Why are known security risks being employed by the govt ?" and the left reacted then, and ever since, as if he sacrificed babies at black mass. He asked in reference to a proven Soviet spy, Alger Hiss.
The left will leap to the defense of Islamist traitor Nidal, the same way they worship confirmed communist traitors , Hiss, the Rosenbergs, Harry Dexter White, and Loughlin Curry.
I have been checking the comments on many of the news stories about the shooting.
There is a lot of hate and anger being expressed there.
Much of it is aimed at the anti's and BO. ;D
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A question for you Grunts, Jarheads, Flyboys and Squids...
Why is Major Nidal Hasan allowed to grow a beard? He's still an commissioned officer in the United States Army isn't he?
The last I recall, the United States Navy is the only armed force that allowed for a beard of any kind!
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The US Army recently, (last couple years) formed a Brigade of Sikh's, part of their religion, (a mix of Christianity, and Hinduism ) requires them to wear a turban a sword, (a small symbolic one in the folds of their turban) and a beard.
(Many other countries have Sikh Regiments, they are noted for their fighting skill, Ghurkas fear them, and their loyalty to their country of residence, they are the good guys )
It is possible that Nidal used that as pretext for a religious exemption to standard Army grooming regulations.
Or, it could be the DOJ is hoping that seeing him with a beard will cause people to forget he is an Army Officer and therefore has committed treason during war time.
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I'm well aware of the Sikh's and have been for twenty five years. It was still my understanding that beards are not allowed in the US Army. Active duty Army personnel are restricted from beards unless for medical reasons from anything I've been able to googlefoo...
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Wow yet again a madman causes misery and the LAFO cops the brunt of it.
That said condolences go out to all those poor souls and to their families and friends.
I hope no one on the DRTV family has been directly affected. :'(
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I'm well aware of the Sikh's and have been for twenty five years. It was still my understanding that beards are not allowed in the US Army. Active duty Army personnel are restricted from beards unless for medical reasons from anything I've been able to googlefoo...
I know the Sikh's were exempted from the "No Beards" rule, for sure in that Brigade, if not Army wide.
Overload is out that way, I'll PM him and check on him.
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I know the Sikh's were exempted from the "No Beards" rule, for sure in that Brigade, if not Army wide.
You know that old adage.."Uniformity will prevail" in the military! I can only surmise that Major Hasan has a medical exception that has been approved by the mamby, pamby hierarchy of the current military command structure.
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Hopefully they know he's riding a needle about the 1st of February and don't give a damn what he looks like when he dies .
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Hopefully they know he's riding a needle about the 1st of February and don't give a damn what he looks like when he dies .
He could be wearing a hair sweater for all I care! He decided to shoot people in the wrong state but then, he's in the Feds system of justice now!
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He could be wearing a hair sweater for all I care! He decided to shoot people in the wrong state but then, he's in the Feds system of justice just-us now!
FIFY, Blacks and Muslims get special treatment from this regime.
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Two guys that were sitting in the front row described how this guy walked in through the emergency exit, across the front, fired into the ceiling, then went up the aisle "sparing" the first few rows before he started shooting others.
Do I need to post a photo of what someone in the first couple of rows could have used to stop this quickly?
P.S.
They are now replaying the news conference from this evening. Chief Dan Oates described the firearms, the ammunition, and the volume of magazines and ammunition purchased in recent days by the shooter. Question: It is an AR 15 assault rifle. It is a S&W M&P15 "assault rifle" and the man in blue does not know if it is automatic... The Colorado officials have impressed me to this point, but you guys are holding a rifle purchased at Gander Mountain that only comes in semi-automatic.
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Does anyone know if the shotgun used by this nut was a semi or a pump ? I am just curious.
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My reply on the issue of the shootings from another interweb location (where some pro-gun guys were falling for the hype, apparently, that more gun control could have prevented this or that guns caused it) went in part as follows:
If the guy had driven wildly down a crowded sidewalk in a Cadillac and killed/maimed the exact same number of folks, it would be a non-issue, as far as the media is concerned.
You just can't predict 'crazy'........
So much for "gun free zones".... and the false sense of safety they provide.
Being a killer is a mindset...irregardless of the weapon used. If someone wants to kill or maim bad enough, they will find a way to do it.
As to box cutters, were they not the weapon of choice for a few folks that hijacked four US planes on Sept. 11, 2001?
We can sit here and postulate and theorize the what-ifs until the cows come home and we'll be in the same place we started.
Guns are here..... guns are not BAD, but there are bad PEOPLE with guns.... always will be. There are too many good people out there with guns for any sane individual to blame the guns for the bad stuff that happens in this world. That would be like me saying that forks made me fat.
Violence happens every day.....prepare the best you can to deal with it.
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My reply on the issue of the shootings from another interweb location (where some pro-gun guys were falling for the hype, apparently, that more gun control could have prevented this or that guns caused it) went in part as follows:
If the guy had driven wildly down a crowded sidewalk in a Cadillac and killed/maimed the exact same number of folks, it would be a non-issue, as far as the media is concerned.
You just can't predict 'crazy'........
So much for "gun free zones".... and the false sense of safety they provide.
Being a killer is a mindset...irregardless of the weapon used. If someone wants to kill or maim bad enough, they will find a way to do it.
As to box cutters, were they not the weapon of choice for a few folks that hijacked four US planes on Sept. 11, 2001?
We can sit here and postulate and theorize the what-ifs until the cows come home and we'll be in the same place we started.
Guns are here..... guns are not BAD, but there are bad PEOPLE with guns.... always will be. There are too many good people out there with guns for any sane individual to blame the guns for the bad stuff that happens in this world. That would be like me saying that forks made me fat.
Violence happens every day.....prepare the best you can to deal with it.
Spot on Peg, everyone knows and remembers the Port Arthur Massacre in Australia, (just down the road from me, and yes I knew people that was killed) yet know one remembers the nutcase that massacred 15 people in Qld by setting fire to a backpackers hospital because the weapon was petrol. No one called for the banning of petrol, or requiring a licence to buy it, I mean heaven help us if the idiot had used 98 octane instead of regular unleaded.
Nutters are here, nothing will stop nutters from being nutters, someone who is hell bent on causing carnage will find a way, with or with out a firearm. Of course there is more of a chance he will be stopped if others are allowed to have access to a firearm.
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Col. Cooper sums it up best, IMHO:
"Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud, and the rifle is the queen of personal weapons. The rifle is a weapon. Let there be no mistake about that. It is a tool of power, and thus dependent completely upon the moral stature of its user. It is equally useful in securing meat for the table, destroying group enemies on the battlefield, and resisting tyranny. In fact, it is the only means of resisting tyranny, since a citizenry armed with rifles simply cannot be tyrannized.
The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."—Jeff Cooper, The Art of the Rifle
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Va Tech, U of Alabama Huntsville,the Gifford's shooting in Tuscon, Ft Hood,now this guy.
There is one common thread that no one is addressing seriously, ( the Dracula looking guy on Fox did mention it yesterday )
In every case the killer was recognized as a dangerous nut job by people who dealt with them and no one did anything about it. Every one of them had a clean police record, the only one who did not go through at least one NICS check was Amy Bishop in Ala who used a borrowed pistol, and even though she had previously killed her own brother with a shotgun she would have passed because that was classed as an accident when she was a juvenile. (The case was reopened after the Huntsville shooting and found to have been badly flawed )
If we were less politically correct, and more proactive about mental health issues we would not need gun laws.
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Just some food for thought. Has anyone noticed that they still haven't given a reason for the shootings yet. I find that odd, like they are trying to keep a lid on something. Within 48 hours of other shootings, most of the details have been reported by now. This entire incident stinks in every area: for the victoms, the families, and for Second amendment supporters. I find it odd that this just happens to happen right before the UN Small Arms Treaty Signing. The man is obviously deranged( despite ABC trying to make it the Tea Party's fault). Wouldn't it be ironic and despicable, if he were crazy enough to commit such a heinous crime to help out the anti gun cause and that is what they are hesitant about releasing. I know this kind of incident never make sense to begin with, it just seems like this man had an agenda, other than about himself or his victoms.
just venting,
GATC
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GATC,
You use the 48 hour timeline, and I will point out that at the time of your posting we were only 40 hours and 23 minutes into the incident. Also, they are just now holding the press conference, so we do not know if they are not being up front at this time.
Edit addition:
They just now, 14:40 mountain time, announced that they are working with the FBI to determine a motive. They are not speculating now, but the way the apartment was set up it was designed to kill anyone who enters, and they know that he assumed it would be law enforcement entering - meaning that he intended to kill officers.
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I think this picture speaks a thousand words of "motivation"
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/422325_267689263330697_931960943_n.jpg)
http://www.examiner.com/article/colorado-shooting-suspect-reported-to-be-former-occupy-member
The “Doo Doo Economics Blog” is reporting that shooting suspect James Holmes, of Aurora Colorado, is a former member of the Occupy San Diego group. Holmes was born and San Diego and has family there, and a Florida private investigator cited by the blog links Holes to the Occupy San Diego group. That investigator, Bill Warner, reports Holmes today on his web blow with this title, “Occupy Black Bloc Member James Holmes Shoots Up Aurora Co Movie Theater Killing 12 And Wounding 50.”
Earlier today on ABC News coverage of the tragedy, Brian Ross has speculated than another man named James Holmes listed on a local Tea Party site was possibly the suspected shooter. Conservatives roundly criticized ABC News and Ross for showing media bias by so quickly drawing that conclusion in speculation, and some have called for Ross to be fired by ABC News.
The author of the Doo Doo Economics Blog cites Holmes as a member of the “black block” faction of the Occupy movement who left the group allegedly because it was not radical enough for him. The blog also shows screen shots from a site allegedly connected to Holmes who warned that he would kill everyone at the opening of the Batman movie in Colorado.
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"Black Bloc" (no "K") is a violence oriented Anarchist faction that infiltrates relatively peaceful liberal protests in order to incite riot and resultant use of force by Cops that can then be used as anti establishment propaganda.
Anarchists have been around since before the turn of the century (1900) and they have always engaged in violence such as murder, Pres. Garfield, Archduke Franz Ferdinand) train derailments in the American West and in Europe, as well as bombings such as the one in Haymarket square.
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That doesn't make any sense to me.
You would think a guy would have to have his shit wired pretty tight to gain admission to a PhD program in neuroscience. I would think there would be a lot of money to be made salarywise once he got the doctorate. In short, he would be one of the "haves" that the occupy movement protests against.
I am looking at those two pics... My gut says that those are two different guys.
And just because it is on the internet, especially a blog, it is not journalism.
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That doesn't make any sense to me.
You would think a guy would have to have his shit wired pretty tight to gain admission to a PhD program in neuroscience. I would think there would be a lot of money to be made salarywise once he got the doctorate. In short, he would be one of the "haves" that the occupy movement protests against.
I am looking at those two pics... My gut says that those are two different guys.
And just because it is on the internet, especially a blog, it is not journalism.
DO NOT LET MICHELLE MALKIN HEAR YOU SAY THAT ! !
It's OK to say it might not be true, but if you say it isn't journalism you might lose somethings you REALLY don't want to lose. ;D
http://redalertpolitics.com/2012/06/14/juan-williams-to-michelle-malkin-bloggers-arent-journalists/
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/just-a-blogger-watch-michelle-malkin-assert-the-power-of-conservative-media-at-right-online/
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I would think there would be a lot of money to be made salarywise once he got the doctorate. In short, he would be one of the "haves" that the occupy movement protests against.
I am looking at those two pics... My gut says that those are two different guys.
I give it 50/50. Shortening up his hair and shaving, it's possible. It would also fit the profile: Mid/late 20s, highly intelligent with a lot of free time to get "bored" and want to try and cause trouble, enough money to actually do something about it, plus highly "indocrinated" by radical left academics (love San Diego but has some odd balls), but no firm direction. Fight the system from within, so to speak.
--edit-- They are saying that he was from San Diego but haven't made the Occupy connection officlally, not necessarilly withholding it.
We had a guy like that here a few years ago. Software programmer on base (with a clearance), mid-20s, dating a hogh school student, building explosive devices in his apartment. Left them out on the dinner table while the cops knocked on the door to ask about his car that had been stolen earlier in the day. Only reason he gave to the officers about the explosives was that he was bored and wanted to see what he could make.
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That doesn't make any sense to me.
You would think a guy would have to have his shit wired pretty tight to gain admission to a PhD program in neuroscience. I would think there would be a lot of money to be made salarywise once he got the doctorate. In short, he would be one of the "haves" that the occupy movement protests against.
I am looking at those two pics... My gut says that those are two different guys.
And just because it is on the internet, especially a blog, it is not journalism.
As someone who has recently graduated with a M.S. and lives with a Ph.D. student, grad school can make you come unwired. I don't think it's to blame for this by any means, but it can drive you crazy. He just dropped out too. College and graduate school in particular can be a big reality check. You can quickly go from "the smart guy" to "just another guy" or "the dumb guy."
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I'm following the AR15.com thread... All 94 pages of it.
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Hassan can do as he pleases since he is a Muslim commissioned officer. Obama coming to Colorado today. How long did it take to find the way to Ft. Hood after Hassan did his deed?
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Texas wasn't a swing state, Colorado is.
You don't really think he gives a crap about the little people, do you?
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just the votes...
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The only reason for Pres. BHO to show up in Colorado right now is a campaign stop. They don't need him there, and the security issues is an added burden they don't need as they try to wrap this crime scenes up so life can return to normal.
I have heard incident commanders say it for decades that the biggest stumbling block in any disaster or crime is when dignitaries show up to "help."
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He has to claim it's an "official visit" so that the tax payer gets stuck with the cost instead of the campaign having to pay for it.
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Unfortunately is is a requirement anymore. When W did a fly-over of the Katrina devastation rather than an on-ground tour he was beat to a blood pulp by the left for being aloof and uncaring. I think the White House did a terrible job explaining that he didn't want to tie up resource that were urgently needed in the relief effort.
When BHO visited Colorado Springs a couple of weeks ago for an opportunity to soak the tax payer for trips to his fund raisers to show concern over the losses in the Waldo Canyon fire, the CSPD told him they could not provide security so it fell to the Sheriff's department - not like they could really spare the manpower either.
IMHO if some federal agency like FEMA isn't present then there is no need of federal grandstanding presence on site and they should shed their crocodile tears in Washington.
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Unfortunately is is a requirement anymore. When W did a fly-over of the Katrina devastation rather than an on-ground tour he was beat to a blood pulp by the left for being aloof and uncaring. I think the White House did a terrible job explaining that he didn't want to tie up resource that were urgently needed in the relief effort.
When BHO visited Colorado Springs a couple of weeks ago for an opportunity to soak the tax payer for trips to his fund raisers to show concern over the losses in the Waldo Canyon fire, the CSPD told him they could not provide security so it fell to the Sheriff's department - not like they could really spare the manpower either.
IMHO if some federal agency like FEMA isn't present then there is no need of federal grandstanding presence on site and they should shed their crocodile tears in Washington.
Another concern was a place to land a 747.
If "W" had walked across the Potomac the media headlines would have screamed that he should be impeached since he could not swim.