The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: jaybet on December 04, 2012, 02:01:10 PM
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IDIOTS!
http://radio.foxnews...ed-robbery.html
AutoZone Fires Worker Who Stopped Robbery
An AutoZone worker who stopped an armed robbery by retrieving a weapon from his truck said he was fired by the company for violating their gun policy.
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Devin McLean and his store manager were about to close the AutoZone in York County, Va. when a gunman barged into the store.
“He pulled a gun from his waist band and demanded me and my manager go back into the office,” McLean told Fox News.
At some point, McLean was left in a restroom while the gunman made the manager open the store safe. That’s when McLean, a 23-year-old Air Force veteran, bolted through a side door and ran to his truck.
He returned through the front door holding a Glock 40 – pointed directly at the masked robber.
“I told him to freeze and to drop his weapon,” McLean told Fox News.
Instead, the robber took off – last seen running down the street from the store.
“I watched him run down the street,” he said. “I came back inside and made sure my manager was okay and he called the police.”
The York County Sheriff’s Dept. believes the bandit is responsible for as many as 30 robberies across the region.
“One of the officers asked why I didn’t shoot the robber,” McLean said.
Sheriff J.D. Diggs told Fox News he considers McLean to be a hero.
“He did a very brave thing,” the sheriff said. “He put himself in jeopardy in an attempt to make sure his friend was safe. He did a very brave thing.”
The part-time worker’s manager was especially thankful and credited McLean with saving his life.
But two days after the robbery – and just a week before Thanksgiving – McLean was fired.
Television station WTKR reported that McLean violated corporate policy by leaving the store and returning with a weapon.
The station spoke to a representative from the company’s corporate office who said they had a “zero tolerance policy for employees having weapons inside the store.”
An AutoZone spokesman told Fox News they will not discuss the matter.
“It was a surprise to me,” McLean said. “I did the right thing. I saved the company $2,000. I saved one of their manager’s lives – and you’re letting me go? It was a slap in the face.”
McLean said the firing came at a difficult time. He’s about to be a first-time father.
“We’re having a little boy,” he said. “I remember when the guy came in with that gun. My initial thought was I want to make it home to my family. I want to have the opportunity to meet my son and for my son to meet his dad. And for someone to come in and shove a gun in your face?”
So why not just keep running? Why go back inside the store – and risk your own life?
“I regard them as my family,” McLean said of his co-workers. “You’re not going to leave your brother or sister behind.”
It’s a lesson he learned in the Air Force.
“Never leave a man behind,” he said. “I’m not going to leave my brother in a room with a guy with a gun – that’s threatening his life.”
In spite of losing his job, McLean said his actions would be the same if it happened again.
“I wouldn’t change anything,” he said.
The sheriff said he was disappointed to hear that McLean lost his job on account of stopping the robbery.
“That’s certainly unfortunate,” he said. “They should be doing something to reward that young man instead of firing him.”
Sheriff Diggs said AutoZone has also sent an unintended message to the community.
“The company has now sent a message to every would-be robber out there – ‘Hey we’re open for business and unarmed. Come on in and take our money,’” he said.
Meanwhile, the backlash against AutoZone is spreading. Cam Edwards, of NRA News, called AutoZone’s decision an “injustice.”
“It may have been corporate policy to fire Devin McLean, but it’s also an injustice. He came to the aid of a fellow employee threatened by an armed robber and was canned. They should have named him employee of the year.”
He said the nation needs more people like McLean.
“He had the chance to run away but instead he chose to arm himself with his legally owned gun and save the life of his supervisor,” Edwards told Fox News. “Wouldn’t we all like to work with someone like Devin?”
Customers have launched a boycott against the company on Facebook and a petition has been started urging them to rehire McLean.
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Any employer would have done the same. thats reality, don't like it, well start your own company. this is a simple one. You break the rules, (maybe even the law) open up your employer to massive liabilty, you are going to be fired. we don't know exactly how thing went down, but that really does not matter, he is still fired. yeah I know this is going to be a unpopular view here, still reality.
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I guess maybe he should have clocked out before going out to his truck to get the gun. ::)
Zero tolerance and anti-gun strikes again.
I guess he could have stayed outside and called 911....but it is difficult to think-out all the possible scenarios in your head when your main concern is helping someone quickly. He just reacted.
I applaud the guy, and hope he finds another job soon. We need more like him.
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Hell, my current employer has big signs on the door indicating the guns are not allowed on the premises!
Some dumb rule because of the business we're in but it just screams something I don't care for!!!
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Hell, my current employer has big signs on the door indicating the guns are not allowed on the premises!
Some dumb rule because of the business we're in but it just screams something I don't care for!!!
When you get held up, just point ot the signs to the robber and politely ask him to leave. I'm sure that will work. ::)
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Yeah, it's a sad thing when the possibility of litigation makes a hero just a guy on the public dole. He probably won't even be able to collect unemployment.
I understand company policies. Personally, though, I'll think of this every time I need an oil filter or a bulb, and I'll buy them somewhere else.
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I guess maybe he should have clocked out before going out to his truck to get the gun. ::)
Zero tolerance and anti-gun strikes again.
I guess he could have stayed outside and called 911....but it is difficult to think-out all the possible scenarios in your head when your main concern is helping someone quickly. He just reacted.
I applaud the guy, and hope he finds another job soon. We need more like him.
+1.
"Zero tolerance" is another term for no thought allowed.
I don't think this guy will be out of a job very long if the media lets it be known he got fired for doing the right thing.
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So zero tolerance for theft is wrong? what about failing a drug test? sorry, violating company policy, and opening up a huge liability will always be grounds for a pink slip.
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In MY business', that would not happen. He (or she) would be rewarded. I have a zero tolerance policy, FOR CRIME!
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I'll be going to other auto parts stores for my oil, etc. I may make 1 last stop into Autozone and drop off a card I get from Rocky Mtn. Gun Owners (RMGO) it states I will not patronize any business that doesn't allow guns (by employees or patrons). Sort of tells the store their policy stinks and they'll be loosing $$$, may not be alot but.
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So zero tolerance for theft is wrong? what about failing a drug test? sorry, violating company policy, and opening up a huge liability will always be grounds for a pink slip.
Zero tolerance policies are nothing but a method of avoiding responsibility for decision.
I have twice worked at companies that decided to start doing drug testing.
In both cases the ones who failed were the best workers, managers, supervisors, lead men, the owners son.
In both cases the testing went away.
As for accuracy, Advil and Poppy seed rolls are among the many things that can cause a false positive result.
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Tom tests have come along way. Most people use piss only for a "right now" test or as a prescreen. Hair(generally body) is by far a better choice to check for long term abuse.
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So you are ok with giving a guy another chance after he stole a c note from the register? other wise thats zero tolerance.
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So you are ok with giving a guy another chance after he stole a c note from the register? other wise thats zero tolerance.
Depends on the circumstances.
Did it get taken with the thought that it would be replaced by the next count or did he take it thinking it would never be missed?
Did it get taken because his wife was in the middle of the freeway with a flat and he needed cash 'right now' and had to leave work to pay a tow truck, get the tire fixed so she could go to work and was going to tell the boss when he got back?
Is he a junky jonesing for a fix?
Zero tolerance means never asking any of those questions even of your most trusted, faithful employee or business partner.
Find out the 'why'.
There may be a reason but 'ZT' doesn't care about that, which IMHO is stupid.
Let me be clear, I'm NOT saying you TAB are stupid. I'm saying that zero tolerance policies are stupid and people with thinking brain matter should avoid them like the plague.
It is using the same retarded mindset that expels kids from school for making a finger gun and saying "bang" while playing or drawing one on scrap paper. That kid may be a Charles Manson in the making or an Elmer Keith. With ZT we'll never know because they are treated the same.
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It wasn't always my best employees who failed. Once it was a really good employee and it really pissed me off for him to let me down. He tested positive for coke after being clean and working for us 12 years....got a bad woman and oops.
He worked remote location with crude oil and natural gas....pressure in excess of 9,000 psig in some cases. A little weed, much less a little coke to dull your brain in a complex industrial situation where awareness keeps your alive and being in a place that is not cookie cutter kills. The signs were there...reports got sloppy and late and the equipment was not being maintained as it should and that cost us real $$$'s.
Drug tests don't test positive for poppy seeds or Advil and haven't for over a decade. I once a had a construction crew of about 45 guys on an offshore platform repairing Hurricane Ivan damage, had the operator stop ops and call everyone in the quarters for a meeting....about 5 minutes before the dogs arrived via helicopter. Not one guy had drugs and nothing was found stashed anywhere. I gave all them an extra pay in appreciation for them being clean.
Now, just to rub it in my current company does not have an anti-gun policy. The building has one but in OK if they know you have one then legally the worst that can happen is a $75 trespassing ticket if you don't leave when they ask you....but then they will never know. Heck, the building guys only show up when you need a light bulb changed in the office; the guard on the desk is "looking for your drunk uncle to stumble in" like most guards so no problem there. No policy against weapons in company vehicles....eat your hearts out guys. We have about 100 employees.
Not all workplaces are like Kalifornia yet TAB.
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8:12 am and FOX news is running it on their morning show now.
Lord I HATE that BITCH Gretchen Carlson HATE HATE HATEEEEEEEEEE her!
Over the years she's made second hand comments on air like - Guns are bad. People don't need guns with them. ...but why a gun.
I'm forced to endure the morning show while the wife is getting ready for work (I work from home) and I suppose it is better then most other morning alternatives... but still, she's no better than Bob Costa in my eyes.
Bitch.
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Stealing, is stealing. If they needed the money for something important. All they had to do is ask. I have always been a very fair employer.
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So you are ok with giving a guy another chance after he stole a c note from the register? other wise thats zero tolerance.
Stealing, is stealing. If they needed the money for something important. All they had to do is ask. I have always been a very fair employer.
Zero tolerance for a crime is not exactly the same thing as zero tolerance for a 'silly-to-begin-with' company policy..... Big difference.
I do tend to lean the same way as TAB on that part about stealing. Ask me and I'll give you the shirt off my back. Steal it and it's a whole different ball game.
I can't tolerate a thief......... but comparing stealing, which is an outright crime like rape, to a guy breaking a policy in a private setting is off the mark, IMHO..
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8:12 am and FOX news is running it on their morning show now.
Lord I HATE that BITCH Gretchen Carlson HATE HATE HATEEEEEEEEEE her!
Over the years she's made second hand comments on air like - Guns are bad. People don't need guns with them. ...but why a gun.
I'm forced to endure the morning show while the wife is getting ready for work (I work from home) and I suppose it is better then most other morning alternatives... but still, she's no better than Bob Costa in my eyes.
Bitch.
Tell us how you really feel, guy. ;D ;D
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You guys are knee jerking on this becuase of the gun. Think about this from strickly a employers point of view. if a robbery happens, you are insured for that. if something bad happens to a employee during said robbery, you are insured for that. Employee pulls a gun, shoots bad guy and hits kid standing behind them, you are not insured for that. employee has a nd and hits some one/thing, comp pays, then comes after you for it. reality is, if they are on the clock, you own anything they do. Lets just say one of your workers takes thier work car to lunch, they have a few beers, hit some one on the way back. now this should be on them, but its not, its on you. thats how the world works, sucks, but its life.
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You guys are knee jerking on this becuase of the gun. Think about this from strickly a employers point of view. if a robbery happens, you are insured for that. if something bad happens to a employee during said robbery, you are insured for that. Employee pulls a gun, shoots bad guy and hits kid standing behind them, you are not insured for that. employee has a nd and hits some one/thing, comp pays, then comes after you for it. reality is, if they are on the clock, you own anything they do. Lets just say one of your workers takes thier work car to lunch, they have a few beers, hit some one on the way back. now this should be on them, but its not, its on you. thats how the world works, sucks, but its life.
Yes.
That aspect of it is understood, and is a valid point.
But, with an absolute "zero tolerance" policy in place versus a "we'll weigh each circumstance as it happens because we are all adults with brains" type policy then the good guy loses and the company loses a guy that seems like a stand-up type person.
All I'm saying is that the zero tolerance policy ties the hands, making firing absolute, instead of allowing the manager to weigh the pros/cons of what occurred and saying, "Well, that could have ended badly for both you and the company liability-wise......Even though everything worked out this time, DON'T DO IT AGAIN. This time, you'll be wrote up (but not fired) for the infraction. Next time, if there is a next time, dial 911."
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TAB, let me be sure I understand what you are saying.
You think that the No-Guns Policy is valid but that the guy did the right thing by getting his gun and going back in the store knowingly violating the no gun policy? He just has to take the consequences of losing his job?
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So, was the man "on duty" when he re-entered the store with his gun? Or, was he a private citizen because he had left the premises and should no longer be considered as "on duty"? So, a lawyer could argue that he "fled" the store and therefore technically no longer was an employee on duty at that point. His return was not as an employee, but as a private armed citizen who broke up an armed robbery attempt and saved the life (perhaps) of a fellow citizen. If Autozone has a lick of sense, they would re-evaluate this case and declare that since he fled the store, he no longer was considered an employee on duty and their ZT policy no longer applied as he was not re-entering the store to perform the company's work. Autozone has an opportunity to do the right thing here. Then again, they could be like TAB and say TS.
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We don't have enough details to know what happen. I will say this, if he was in a autozone shirt and in the store... It does not matter if he was on the clock or not. Just like a guy driving home in a company car and hitting some one. Yeah, he is off the clock, but you are still going to pay.
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So TAB, the next time he should take his shirt off? Hope your company doesn't provide underwear because in the same situation you die.
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No my point is, if your a employee and and you do something wrong at work/ on your way to/ from your employer is going to eat it. thats reality, if you don't beleave me ask some one in your HR department.
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So, was the man "on duty" when he re-entered the store with his gun? Or, was he a private citizen because he had left the premises and should no longer be considered as "on duty"? So, a lawyer could argue that he "fled" the store and therefore technically no longer was an employee on duty at that point. His return was not as an employee, but as a private armed citizen who broke up an armed robbery attempt and saved the life (perhaps) of a fellow citizen. If Autozone has a lick of sense, they would re-evaluate this case and declare that since he fled the store, he no longer was considered an employee on duty and their ZT policy no longer applied as he was not re-entering the store to perform the company's work. Autozone has an opportunity to do the right thing here. Then again, they could be like TAB and say TS.
To quote Marshall, from "How I Met Your Mother" LAWYERED! ;D Plus 10 on that one. And the good part about is that everyonne wins. ;D
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You guys are knee jerking on this becuase of the gun. Think about this from strickly a employers point of view. if a robbery happens, you are insured for that. if something bad happens to a employee during said robbery, you are insured for that. Employee pulls a gun, shoots bad guy and hits kid standing behind them, you are not insured for that. employee has a nd and hits some one/thing, comp pays, then comes after you for it. reality is, if they are on the clock, you own anything they do. Lets just say one of your workers takes thier work car to lunch, they have a few beers, hit some one on the way back. now this should be on them, but its not, its on you. thats how the world works, sucks, but its life.
You know this is a GUN FORUM right?
Are you saying that if one or both employees had their knees or brains blown out, thats better because 'they're insured for that'? ::)
It seems most times things like this happen, you can't wrap your mind around people actually using guns properly in defense of themselves or others.
Not everyone lives in the liberal utopia of the Land of Fruits & Nuts that is poisoning your mind. (Thank you God!)
No my point is, if your a employee and and you do something wrong at work/ on your way to/ from your employer is going to eat it. thats reality, if you don't beleave me ask some one in your HR department.
Bullshit.
That may be CA law but luckily for eveyone else is the US, those laws don't cross CA boundries.
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Happens every where. Ask your hr guys if you don't beleave me.
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You know this is a GUN FORUM right?
Are you saying that if one or both employees had their knees or brains blown out, thats better because 'they're insured for that'? ::)
It seems most times things like this happen, you can't wrap your mind around people actually using guns properly in defense of themselves or others.
Not everyone lives in the liberal utopia of the Land of Fruits & Nuts that is poisoning your mind. (Thank you God!)
Bullshit.
That may be CA law but luckily for eveyone else is the US, those laws don't cross CA boundries.
It's TAB . He never supports an individual over an organization.
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Wrong, I am supporting the person, the owners rights. don't like the policy, go work some where else. you are fooling yourselfs if you don't think it does not apply every where. if you have ever been a employer of dozens of people, you would under stand.
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Well, I look at it like this.
If my wife were inside, say a small jewelry store which was posted against carrying concealed, and I was waiting outside because I was packing and I saw two armed men enter the place and heard my wife start screaming, I'd kiss the owners rights good by and do what was needed to go to my wife's aid. To me, saving a life trumps a person's rights to restrict firearms.
How about you, TAB...what would you do?
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Wrong, I am supporting the person, the owners rights. don't like the policy, go work some where else. you are fooling yourselfs if you don't think it does not apply every where. if you have ever been a employer of dozens of people, you would under stand.
You are NOT supporting the person, which would be the employee who foiled the robbery .
You are supporting a faceless corporation that has instituted a policy that violates individual rights and needlessly endangers employees and customers by discouraging lawful concealed carry while doing nothing to assure their safety. .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AutoZone
AutoZone is a retailer and distributor of aftermarket automotive parts and accessories.[2] based in Memphis, Tennessee.
Not franchises,[8] AutoZone's 5,000+ retail outlets[2] throughout the United States, Puerto Rico, Mexico and Brazil stock a variety of aftermarket parts. AutoZone's 5000th store in Wasilla, Alaska, opened on August 17, 2012.
Controversies and criticism
Controversies have included patent-infringement lawsuits. The company has been criticized by its employees.
Founder J.R. "Pitt" Hyde, Jr. bought the building involved in Doctor Martin Luther King, Jr's assassination: "AutoZone founder and civil rights benefactor J. R. Pitt 'Hyde' [sic] Jr. intends to buy Chappell's building and donate it to the Lorraine Foundation, which operates the museum, said Beverly Robertson, museum executive director."[9]
Litigation
In March, 2006, the company was accused of infringing two patents owned by Orion IP, LLC, in a lawsuit filed in the Eastern District of Texas. In May 2007, the company settled the lawsuit for an undisclosed amount and the case was dismissed.[10]
In September, 2009, AutoZone was accused of infringing a patent owned by Lisle Corporation in a lawsuit filed in the Southern District of Iowa.[11]
In September, 2010, the company was sued by the US Equal Opportunity Employment Commission for firing an employee.[12]
Survey of employee satisfaction
A 2009 survey of employee satisfaction conducted by glassdoor.com resulted in AutoZone being ranked the 4th worst workplace in America.[13]
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Happens every where. Ask your hr guys if you don't beleave me.
How 'bout I just ask my old boss that got rear-ended by a company car owned by an orthopedic surgeon group.
The one that was told: "No, you can't go after the orthopod group because of 3rd party lawsuit issues in AZ."
Same reason that in AZ, you can't go after the insurance company that provides your industrial/workmans comp. Even if they screw the pooch so bad you have permanent damage!
The ONLY thing you can do is sue to have them cover your claim. THAT ONE YOU CAN ASK MY WIFE ABOUT.
The only way you get around it is if someone is self-insured. (Like the City of Phoenix)
By then though, they have deep enough pockets to absorb a lot of pain.
on edit: Having an employee NOT dead or wounded is a damn good outcome for AutoZone. The firing of said employee is retarded.
Which is why they will no longer get my business.
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Dittoes. Manny, Moe and Jack are two blocks away and the the price is about the same. Decision made. Its an easy answer. I wonder how many guys will make the same call, and if they get the message?
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Well TAB, I checked with my HR department and he thinks like I do. I checked with my CEO and he thinks like I do. I checked with Legal and he thinks like I do. The smart thing to do is to rehire the black veteran and win the hearts, minds and wallets of the customers. Now I must admit that I am the HR Department, I am the CEO and I am Legal because I am RET! So, it is easy for me to be flexible.
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if your willing to risk losing every thing, go right ahead. me not so much. been there done that, it sucks.