Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: gunman1911 on June 28, 2008, 01:34:09 PM
Title: the 13 folds
Post by: gunman1911 on June 28, 2008, 01:34:09 PM
When you fold a fflag there is a meaning to each fold, and I thiught I would share them with you.
1) The first fold is the sybol of life. 2) the second fold is the symbol of eteral ife . 3) the third fold is made in Honor and Remeberance of Veterans departing the ranks who havegave a portion of the lives for the defense of the Country to attain peacethoughout the world. 4) The forth fold represents the weaker nature, for as Americans citizens TURSTING IN GOD IT SI TO HIM we turn to hin in peace as well as in time of war for his guideance. 5 The fith foldis a tribute to the country for in the words of Stephen Decantur "Our country, in dealing with other countrys, may she always be right , but right or wrong she is still my country. 6)The sixth fold is for where peoples hearts lie. It is with their hearts that they pledge Allegiance to the flagof the United States of American and to the Republic for which it stands one Nation unde God Indivsible with Liberty and Justice for all. 7) The seventh fold is a tribute to its Armed Forces that they protect their Country and Flag against all her eneimes. 8) The eighth fold is a tribute to the ones WHO ENTERED IN THE VALLEY OF DEATH so that we might see the light of day. 9) thee nith fold is a tribute to the womanhood and Mothers, for it has been through thier Love, Loyalty and Devotion that the men and women made this country great. 10) the tenth foldis a tribute to the Father, for he too gave his Sons and Daughtersfor the defense of thier Counterysince they were first born. 11) the eleventh fold represents the lower portion of the Seal of King David and King Soloman and gloifies in the Hebrew eyes the God of Abbreham,Isaac and Jacob. 12) The twelvthe fold represents an emblem of eterity and Glorifiesthe Cristions eyes , God The Father ,the Son and The Holy Sprit. 13) The thirteenth fold is when the flag is completly folded the stars are uppermost reminding them of the motto " IN GOD WE TRUST" Who were folloed by their comeradsand shipmates in the Armed Forces of the United States of Americapesenting for them thier Right, Privleges and Freedoms they enjoy today. There are some traditions and way if doing things that have deep meaning. In the future you will see flags folded and now you'll knowwhy. This s on of the symbolsof Liberty and Freedom.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: ericire12 on June 28, 2008, 01:40:04 PM
ALL Veterans Can Now Salute the US Flag Without being in Uniform
U.S. Senator Jim Inhofe praised the passage by unanimous consent of his bill (S.1877) clarifying U.S. law to allow veterans and servicemen not in uniform to salute the flag.
Current law (US Code Title 4, Chapter 1) states that veterans and servicemen not in uniform should place their hand over their heart without clarifying whether they can or should salute the flag.
"The salute is a form of honor and respect, representing pride in one's military service," Senator Ihofe said,
"Veterans and service members continue representing the military services even when not in uniform. Unfortunately, current U.S. law leaves confusion as to whether veterans and service members out of uniform can or should salute the flag. The legislation will clarify this regulation, allowing veterans and servicemen alike to salute the flag, whether they are in uniform or not.
I look forward to seeing those who have served saluting proudly at baseball games, parades, and formal events. I believe this is an appropriate way to honor and recognize the 25 million veterans in the United States who have served in the military and remain as role models to others citizens. Those who are currently serving or have served in the military have earned this right, and their recognition will be an inspiration to others."
This Bill was passed July 25, 2007.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: Ruger-55 on June 28, 2008, 08:00:46 PM
I feel terible that as a marine & a marine vet now that I did not know about the 13 folds... I feel really bad
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: twyacht on June 28, 2008, 09:15:10 PM
Thank you gunman1911, its sad that our education system does not teach the heritage of why traditions are what they are. That's probably why more students didn't get involved in the post on trampling the flag.
Similar to the Changing of the Guard at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier,(previous post), the reasoning and history of why its done is why I love this place. The old saying that knowledge is power holds true, and it's here on this forum. For every "kid" or adult that could care less, there IS and WILL be those that do. I would guess around 98% on this forum.
Thanks again.
Tom W.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: gunman1911 on June 29, 2008, 08:37:03 AM
I can't take all the credit, when I seen Marshal'etts topic and the email a freind sent me I knew thay had to go together. It was somthing that just seemed right. My thans go to both of them. And Keith don't feel bad I did thee honores of folding the flag for two fellow officers and did not know the meaning either until yesterday and now I feel even more proud.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: Ruger-55 on June 30, 2008, 08:21:16 AM
Thanks, I did the fold thing too, at my uncle's furneal.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: CurrieS103 on June 30, 2008, 08:23:14 AM
I did the fold at several retreat ceremonies. It was an honor to be selected then...it means even more now.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: gunman1911 on June 30, 2008, 09:36:34 AM
The email I mentioned can be seen on the post "Trample my flag" it is mentioned by Tom Boggan on page 4.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: 2HOW on June 30, 2008, 06:04:40 PM
Great , thank you.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: Big Frank on July 21, 2008, 12:36:07 PM
It's a nice story, but it's just made up like a fairy tale. http://www.snopes.com/military/flagfold.asp
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: ellis4538 on July 21, 2008, 03:30:58 PM
jumbofrank, thanks for the info but bursting our bubble about the 13 folds was not necessary IMHO.
Richard
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: DDMac on July 21, 2008, 04:11:44 PM
To some people, a '57 Chevy is another old car, and that's fine. To others, it is their memories of youth, adventure, and passage into adult life. It means a lot.
So to with the flag. She has always been more that cloth and dye. We are free to add or detract as each sees fit. Some burn her, some cherish her. She will persevere. I see my dad, on the USS Omaha, during WWII, standing next to the Captain under that flag. Love that picture. "The Folds" may be an add on, but it's okay to add whatever you want, or ignore her altogether. It's about Freedom.
Mac.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: m25operator on July 21, 2008, 10:03:27 PM
If it is not true, then let's make it so, Forward this to your congressman, and Senators, and ask that it be made so. There are many ceremonies concerning the American flag, this should be utmost. It's too bad we can't make desecration a penalty. At the least, whe can make it an honor to do it right. I think this is very right.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: gunman1911 on July 22, 2008, 09:37:13 AM
To me 13 folds is not just another fairy tale. It speaks of pride of our country's symbol for freedom won from the brave willing to defend it with tier lives, to those who have sacrificed so much and to those who are willing to stand up and go forth into the deepest of harms way, to live and remember the horrors for rest of their lives. I have the utmost respect for those not to play into a "fairy tale" and to show my pride in being a American and honoring them the best way possible from my heart and sole.
Those who have sacrificed so much are the reason you may have you opinion even tho I do not agree with it and will with hold my opinion of your opinion. As i feel this is not the place.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: tombogan03884 on July 22, 2008, 11:12:52 AM
I't a shame that non Christians have to skip a few folds in the tribute.
Of course folks of several religions cannot pledge allegiance to their flag without paying tribute to a deity in which they do not belive.
Freedom OF religion also entails freedom FROM religion.
It still comes down regardless of political view, upbringing, religion, or any other factor, there WILL BE a fundamental level of Respect to those that the 13 folds "matter". Regardless of whether its etched in stone somewhere or not. People take a personal offense to those that lack a common trait of respect.. Be polite, Be Prepared, Give hoot don't pollute, open a door for a lady you never met, c'mon,...
Sorry jumbofrank, choice of words was callous and uncalled for; IMHO. I hope you can understand,...
Thanks TWYACHT, These colors don't run and neither do I!
Take note TAB, that's how Americans think .
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: DDMac on July 24, 2008, 12:16:31 PM
Tom, a national referendum on the accuracy of your observation is coming in November. I hope you are right. Mac.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: Teresa Heilevang on July 24, 2008, 05:25:43 PM
First year cadets at the Air Force Academy are allowed to leave the Academy without penalty up through the end of first-year Christmas break. Those who came back were assigned to write a paper on why they chose to return. Here is one young cadet's masterpiece, which has begun to be widely publicized... ____________________________________________________
Why return to the Air Force Academy after Winter Break?
So after our sunburns have faded and the memories of our winter break have been reduced to pictures we've pinned on our desk boards, and once again we've exchanged T-shirts and swim suits for flight suits and camouflage, there still remains the question that every cadet at U.S. Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs has asked themselves at some point: Why did we come back? Why, after spending two weeks with our family would we return to one of the most demanding lifestyles in the country? After listening to our 'friends' who are home from State or Ivy League schools chock full of wisdom about how our war in Iraq is unjust and unworldly, why would we return? And after watching the news and reading the papers which only seem to condemn the military's every mistake and shadow every victory, why would we continue to think it is worth the sacrifice of a normal college life?
Is it because the institution to which we belong is tuition-free? Anyone who claims this has forgotten that we will, by the time we graduate, repay the US taxpayer many times over in blood, sweat, and tears. Is it because the schooling we are receiving is one of the best undergraduate educations in the country? While the quality of the education is second to none, anyone who provides this as a main reason has lost sight of the awesome responsibility that awaits those who are tough enough to graduate and become commissioned officers in the U.S. Air Force.
I come back to the Academy because I want to have the training necessary so that one day I'll have the incredible responsibility of leading the sons and daughters of America in combat. These men and women will never ask about my Academy grade point average, their only concern will be that I have the ability to lead them expertly; I will be humbled to earn their respect. I come back to the Academy because I want to be the commander who saves lives by negotiating with Arab leaders... in their own language.
I come back to the Academy because, if called upon, I want to be the pilot who flies half way around the world with three mid-air refuelings to send a bomb from 30,000 feet into a basement housing the enemy... through a ventilation shaft two feet wide. Becoming an officer in today's modern Air Force is so much more than just command; it is being a diplomat, a strategist, a communicator, a moral compass, but always a warrior first.
I come back to the Air Force Academy because, right now, the United States is fighting a global war that is an 'away game' in Iraq - taking the fight to the terrorists.
Whether or not we think the terrorists were in Iraq before our invasion, they are unquestionably there now. And if there is any doubt as to whether this is a global war, just ask the people in Amman, in London, in Madrid, in Casablanca, in Riyadh, and in Bali.
This war must remain an away game because we have seen what happens when it becomes a home game... I come back to the Academy because I want to be a part of that fight.
I come back to the Academy because I don't want my vacationing family to board a bus in Paris that gets blown away by someone who thinks that it would be a good idea to convert the Western world to Islam.
I come back to the Academy because I don't want the woman I love to be the one who dials her last frantic cell phone call while huddled in the back of an airliner with a hundred other people seconds away from slamming into the Capitol building.
I come back to the Academy because during my freshman year of high school I sat in a geometry class and watched nineteen terrorists change the course of history live on television. For the first time, every class currently at a U.S. Service Academy made the decision to join after the 2001 terror attacks.
Some have said that the U.S. invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan only created more terrorists... I say that the attacks of September 11th, 2001 created an untold more number of American soldiers; I go to school with 4,000 of them. And that's worth more than missing a few frat parties.
Joseph R. Tomczak Cadet, Fourth Class United States Air Force Academy
(U.S. Senator Wayne Allard (R-Colorado) had Cadet Tomczak's essay read into the Congressional Record, and at a meeting of the Air Force Academy Board of Visitors he presented Cadet Tomczak with a framed copy of the essay.)
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: gunman1911 on July 24, 2008, 08:19:52 PM
Sounds like the Air Force Academy has some dam fine cadets that we all can be proud of.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: twyacht on July 24, 2008, 08:57:06 PM
Tom, a national referendum on the accuracy of your observation is coming in November. I hope you are right. Mac.
I'll tell you something similar to what I told TAB some where else. Just because there are a lot of them does not mean they are right, or are REAL Americans. Either Madison or Mason, (I forget which ) said "The majority ? The majority is an ass sir." But yes, I hope so too.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: gunman1911 on July 25, 2008, 11:29:11 PM
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: Teresa Heilevang on July 26, 2008, 11:42:10 AM
The National Anthem is played before every movie shown at a military theater.
From a Chaplain in Iraq :
I recently attended a showing of 'Superman 3,' here at LSA Anaconda. We have a large auditorium we use for movies, as well as memorial services and other large gatherings. As is the custom back in the States, we stood and snapped to attention when the National Anthem began before the main feature. All was going as planned until about three-quarters of the way through The National Anthem the music stopped.
Now, what would happen if this occurred with 1,000 18-22 year-olds back in the States? I imagine there would be hoots, catcalls, laughter, a few rude comments; and everyone would sit down and call for a movie. Of course, that is, if they had stood for the National Anthem in the first place. Here, the 1,000 Soldiers continued to stand at attention, eyes fixed forward. The music started again. The Soldiers continued to quietly stand at attention. And again, at the same point, the music stopped. What would you expect to happen? Even here I would imagine laughter, as everyone finally sat down and expected the movie to start.
But here, you could have heard a pin drop. Every Soldier continued to stand at attention. Suddenly there was a lone voice, then a dozen, and quickly the room was filled with the voices of a thousand soldiers, finishing where the recording left off: 'And the rockets red glare, The bombs bursting in air, Gave proof through the night That our flag was still there. Oh, say does that star-spangled banner yet wave, O'er the land of the free And the home of the brave.'
It was the most inspiring moment I have had here in Iraq . I wanted you to know what kind of Soldiers are serving you here. Remember them as they fight for you! Pass this along as a reminder to others to be ever in prayer for all our soldiers serving us here at home and abroad. For many have already paid the ultimate price.
Written by Chaplain Jim Higgins LSA Anaconda Balad Airport in Iraq , north of Baghdad
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: ericire12 on July 26, 2008, 11:51:17 AM
God Bless America!
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: Big Frank on July 31, 2008, 12:47:05 AM
Maybe I should have said something other than "fairytale" to describe what is apparently a story that was made up by an unknown author. I did some research online and can't find any reference to the 13 folds before the 21st century. Everything I can find says that it's not official and someone just made it up, but they dion't know who it was. Now thanks to the internet it's all over the world, and some people think it's something official that the government came up with. People have been folding the flag that way, maybe over 200 years before the 13 folds got their supposed meaning. And it's a meaning that varies according to who you talk too. There are different versions of the 13 folds.
Just because I don't think the number of folds has the signifigance ascribed to them doesn't mean that the flag doesn't mean anything to me. If the flag didn't mean anything to me I wouldn't have saluted it and pledged my allegience all those times I did. If it didn't mean anything to me I wouldn't have an 8 foot flag displayed continuosly for the last 17(?) years and have it lit up every night for passeresby to see. And if you don't know the flag code as well as I do, the Flag Code permits night time display "when a patriotic effect is desired." It should be illuminated if displayed at night.
When I was in the army and we put the post flag up for the entire division, and later took it down and folded it, no-one there knew anything about the 13 folds. I'm sure at least one other soldier would know the meaning of the folds, if there was one, when we had conversations about the flag. Yes, we sometimes talked about the flag and what it meant. We just had two men folding the flag while the third saluted the whole time. No reciting any possible meanings of the folds. Since a bunch of soldiers on active duty didn't know anything about the 13 folds while we were folding it, that makes me think it's nothing official, just something made up. That's what my research says too. So it's a nice story, but it's just made up. I'm a patriot and a veteran, and the flag means a lot more more to me than any made up story.
This is what I found several places when I looked for the official way to fold the flag:
1. Begin by holding it waist-high with another person so that its surface is parallel to the ground.
2. Fold the lower half of the stripe section lengthwise over the field of stars, holding the bottom and top edges securely.
3. Fold the flag again lengthwise with the blue field on the outside.
4. Make a rectangular fold then a triangular fold by bringing the striped corner of the folded edge to meet the open top edge of the flag. Starting the fold from the left side over to the right
5. Turn the outer end point inward, parallel to the open edge, to form a second triangle.
6. The triangular folding is continued until the entire length of the flag is folded in this manner (usually thirteen triangular folds). On the final fold, any remnant that does not neatly fold into a triangle (or in the case of exactly even folds, the last triangle) is tucked into the previous fold.
7. When the flag is completely folded, only a triangular blue field of stars should be visible.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: tombogan03884 on July 31, 2008, 12:52:28 AM
If it's folded properly you should be able to run it up the flag pole (need to pull out the grommets so you can hook them)and open it with a sharp snap of the halyards. And I don't give a crap what Snopes says, I HAVE DONE THIS, looks really cool when done right.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: PegLeg45 on August 03, 2008, 04:27:05 PM
Interesting website for your viewing pleasure:
http://www.usflag.org/flagetiquette.html
God Bless America.................and thanks a bunch to all who have and still serve this great nation and to those who have paid the ultimate sacrifice for our ability to meet here.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: gunman1911 on August 05, 2008, 10:39:45 PM
The meaning of the "13 folds" came from the heart, that is why you can not find anything about it on the Internet, It is meant to show respect for the Flag of our great nation, the Respect for those who served and have paid the ultimate price for our freedoms , Respect for those Mothers and Fathers who spent many hard years raising those who go into Harms Way. I, like you ,and many others strive to find ways to show them the respect that they deserve. Its not what I find on the Internet but in my heart to share with others that wish to show their respect. And no matter what some peoples opinion may be does not mean that I do not respect them also. As I have stated many times before and will continue to do so until they put me in a hole and shovel dirt in my face" I truly thank ALL those who have served and are about to.
Title: Re: the 13 folds
Post by: Big Frank on August 08, 2008, 02:51:31 AM