The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Handguns => Topic started by: Rob10ring on July 18, 2008, 05:09:31 PM
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I have a Para P-13 that I got back in the 90's and never really got too excited about, due to the fact that it wasn't very reliable. Recently, I got bit by the 1911 bug and started shooting it again. It shoots great, but it will not feed reliably with ball ammo. I don't want to spend a lot on this one, so should I sell it and get a new one, shoot it more or is there another solution? Is there practice ammo that is conical in 45, like there is for 40? Any advice would be great.
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Does your barrel have the integral feed ramp?
How many rounds through it at this point?
What type of ball ammo do you have?
Where does the cartridge stop?
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ditto m25...give us the details and we'll get it fixed!
Michael B
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It does have the integrated feed ramp. Recently, I've used Magtech and Winchester white box. I've tried four different magazines and what happens is that the bullets rides the ramp into the barrel, but right before going into battery, comes up about an eighth of an inch short. It's like the nose of the bullet is slowing feeding, maybe the ramp is too steep. I swapped the recoil spring for a new Wolff spring, that was probably reaching. I have had a little more success with Hydrashocks. I'm going to shoot some more ball through it this coming week.
Thanks guys
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Is the extractor fulling catching the rim?
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You might want to get the ramp polished. I've seen my 1911 FTF with a little offset between barrel and ramp (non-integra) and a friends P-16 (40) get hung up, both fixed witha really good polish job on the ramp. Place to start anyway.
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I believe that the extractor is catching the rim, but I'll make sure when I take it back to the range. The offset was kind of where I was heading. Does that do anything that is irreversible?
I have other guns, but if this was my only hearth & home gun, I'd be buying a new one tomorrow. My Glocks have been even better than my HKs.
Thanks all
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The first thing I would do is unload it, take the slide off, remove the barrel, put the slide back on and slowly work the slide on a full magazine, watch the case head slide under the extractor, it should go to the midway point of the case head easily but with some tension, what you are describing could be the case head binding on the way up, and different manufacturers have slightly different case head thicknesses, a thinner head would slide under the extractor easier. Also take some empty cases and work them by hand under the extractor and just feel how easy it is.
2nd, drop some loaded ammo in the barrel on the bench and see how easy they fall in, and to what depth, maybe the barrel has a tight chamber or not enough lead cut in the beginning of the rifling.
What you are describing to me sounds like the case has entered 90%. Should be quite solvable.
Extractor fit is an experience game, done a lot by feel, Although I do use an extractor tension gauge from Weigand. If your not comfortable, don't do it. If it seems it's the barrel, send it back to Para.
Good luck and keep us informed.
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M25, I'll try all of that. That is one happy guy on your avatar. What is that from? I laugh every time I see it.
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OK, I did all of the things recommended and here are the observations that I have made so far:
The case head and extractor seemed work exactly as suggested. Ammo drops into the removed barrel easily. With the barrel removed, I tried guiding a round up the ramp and into the barrel in a similar path, as if the gun were assembled. The mouth, or front edge of the case, seems to hang up on the inside of the top of the barrel, just a little inside. I cycled a magazine through the gun and took photos of how they are stopping. I marked the approximate location of where I manually experienced the hang up (maybe a little more into the barrel).
This is a point and shoot camera, so the quality is a little limited.
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Does the follower of the Mag have any play in it. That causes similar hang ups with an after market mag I bought for my Buckmark.
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I have some Beretta mags that do that. Particularly one Eagle magazine. It was a 19 rd mag and it seems like a lot of those extra-round mags in the 90's were that way. I have 3 Para mags 2 13's and a 10. All of them are very solid and I tested them in a friends newer Para with no problems.
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IT'S BROKE! I'll give you $100 for your broken gun! ;D
Seriousely, I would say based on your pictures that your extractor tension is too tight.
The extractor is exerting too much tension on the case rim and not allowing the cartridge base to slide under the extractor hook as the cartridge is feeding into the barrel.
Slightly radius the extractor edge and reduce some of the extractor tension. That should clear up the problem.
USSA-1
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IT'S BROKE! I'll give you $100 for your broken gun! ;D
Seriousely, I would say based on your pictures that your extractor tension is too tight.
The extractor is exerting too much tension on the case rim and not allowing the cartridge base to slide under the extractor hook as the cartridge is feeding into the barrel.
Slightly radius the extractor edge and reduce some of the extractor tension. That should clear up the problem.
USSA-1
It sound like if I get the extractor fixed and get the barrel polished I'll probably never have another problem with it again.
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You may need to polish the breech face too. The P-13 is the only size Para I don't have. Mine feed well with nearly any ammo including flying ashtrays. I've had the breech face and feed ramp polished on one, and the extractor radiused and polished on another. I've had my original 13+1 frame/with Colt series 80 slide 20 years and it rattles like a maraca but still shoots fine. The original recoil spring was 1-1/2 or 2 pounds heavier than a Colt spring. I've since replaced it with a stiff Wolff variable rate spring. The extra 2 pounds of spring tension and the variable rate spring both help IMO. I also replaced the magazine springs with Wolff 10% extra power springs on the old gun. That will help with a lot of feeding problems by itself. If heavier recoil and mag springs don't cure it, get a good pistolsmith to properly set the extractor tension and polish everything that's already been mentioned.