The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Shotguns => Topic started by: SwoopSJ on August 11, 2008, 09:52:14 PM
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Years ago, I really got into shooting trap, but due to lack of time (education, then work) I gave it up. I have recently renewed my interest in breaking clays, but I don't have "appropriate" hardware. I am hesitant to drop $2,000+ on a new competition shotgun unless I decide to really get back into it. So... does anyone have any suggestions for a moderately priced o/u? I have been checking out the Remington SPR 310, Mossberg Silver Reserve, and the Ruger Red Label on the companies' sites, but that hasn't helped much, as far as making a decision. I am open to any suggestions, and while aesthetics are always a plus, they are not my main concern. As always, any assistance y'all can provide is much appreciated.
Swoop
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I have shot the browning cynergy and realy like it but I dont wont to drop the 1500 for one,so I still use my beretta 303 and I shoot trap about 150 times a year now throuth the 4-h shooting sports program.
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Years ago, I really got into shooting trap, but due to lack of time (education, then work) I gave it up. I have recently renewed my interest in breaking clays, but I don't have "appropriate" hardware. I am hesitant to drop $2,000+ on a new competition shotgun unless I decide to really get back into it. So... does anyone have any suggestions for a moderately priced o/u? I have been checking out the Remington SPR 310, Mossberg Silver Reserve, and the Ruger Red Label on the companies' sites, but that hasn't helped much, as far as making a decision. I am open to any suggestions, and while aesthetics are always a plus, they are not my main concern. As always, any assistance y'all can provide is much appreciated.
Swoop
Swoop, check out Legacy Sports. Escort shotguns.
www.LegacySports.com
Nice guns at a good price!!
shooter32
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I shoot trap and sporting clays with my Browning Gold Semi-Auto Shotgun.... A500G. I also use it to bird hunt.
I love it... I can shoot all day and never have a sore shoulder.
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Find a shotgun you can borrow until you decide how much you are going to be shooting and if you really want to get that $2,000 piece
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There were several old timers including two former PA state champs who shot old Model 12's Trap guns and kept us young Turks inline at the time. (1980-1995)
A friend was in a gun shop when an old woman came in with a single barrel Baker trap gun that was her late husbands. The store owner said it was only worth $50. My friend offered her $1000 on the spot. The jerk who owned the store ended up paying her a decent price for the gun but banned my buddy from his store.
I kept an A rating with an 870 Trap gun before switching to an 870 Comp. If you look around you can find a used BT99 for a decent price. Look for a good used shotgun and save yourself some bucks. It limits you to 16 yard and handicap but they will take thousands of round a year and still hold up. I do remember the SKB and Rugers would not hold up if you were shooting 500 birds or so a month.
I haven't shot registered birds in years but it did help my tactical shotgun shooting quite a bit. Head on the stock, keep the gun moving works every time.
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SwoopSJ,
What scatter gun(s) do you already own and use for hunting, etc? When I started trap I used my one and only shotgun ... a Winchester 1300 Ranger (cheap as they come pump). I later came across a Charles Daly Lux o/u that I love. The Daly is my main trap gun, but I also will shoot my Benelli's that I use for hunting.
Most people think the blinders shooters put on the sides of their glasses are designed to limit distractions and aid shooting ... WRONG! They are designed to keep you from worring about what the guy next to you is shooting!
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M58
I do shoot sporting clays and sometimes skeet with my bird gun, a Charles Daly O/U.
Your right with changeable chokes you can make ago at it with out spending too much money. If you want to shoot a little more seriously you need a gun for the game. If it's for fun, run what you got.
As it is I have:
870 Comp for trap
11-87 Skeet for skeet.
Beretta 391 for sporting clays
Mossburg 835 for turkeys
870 PD for tactical/ home defense
Charles Daly O/U Diamond Grade bird hunting
1100 for waterfowl
Parker S/S just because it was the first gun I ever owned. It's to beat up to be worth much but I still hunt with every so often
Model 97 because it was given to me by my uncle.
There maybe on or two more hiding in the safe I forgot about.
I need a good 20 s/s for birds.
FN SLS for 3 gun might be nice.
Sorry but no pictures in case my wife would see them. She lost count of my firearms years ago and I'm not going to make her any wiser.
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Years ago, I really got into shooting trap, but due to lack of time (education, then work) I gave it up. I have recently renewed my interest in breaking clays, but I don't have "appropriate" hardware. I am hesitant to drop $2,000+ on a new competition shotgun unless I decide to really get back into it. So... does anyone have any suggestions for a moderately priced o/u? I have been checking out the Remington SPR 310, Mossberg Silver Reserve, and the Ruger Red Label on the companies' sites, but that hasn't helped much, as far as making a decision. I am open to any suggestions, and while aesthetics are always a plus, they are not my main concern. As always, any assistance y'all can provide is much appreciated.
Swoop
Bass Pro Shops has a Stoeger O/U 12ga for $400.
My oldest son has a Fausti, imported by Traditions that came from (of all places) Wal-Mart. It cost $500 and it shoots dead on and is a beautiful gun to boot.
http://www.stoegerindustries.com/firearms/stoeger_condor.php
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I started shooting trap last month with my Beretta 686 Black Onxy set up for sporting clays. Using modified choke and as long as I do my part the gun will take care of business. Neat shotgun for dove also.
One of the guys is using an old Winchester Model 12 and is the only one busting 25. Lot of more costly and fancy guns being used but the 12 is kicking butt. Wish I could have found one before I bought the Beretta.
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I started shooting trap last month with my Beretta 686 Black Onxy set up for sporting clays. Using modified choke and as long as I do my part the gun will take care of business. Neat shotgun for dove also.
One of the guys is using an old Winchester Model 12 and is the only one busting 25. Lot of more costly and fancy guns being used but the 12 is kicking butt. Wish I could have found one before I bought the Beretta.
Remember...It's the Indian, not the arrow.
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Remember...It's the Indian, not the arrow.
never heard it that way before....but i like it... :D
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Remember...It's the Indian, not the arrow.
So true Hazcat, but better tools help in performing a job.
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So true Hazcat, but better tools help in performing a job.
True, but as you try different sports you will find that you can go up in steps with equipment as you progress. When I started bullseye I used my S&W 22a and winchester wildcat ammo. Next I went to better ammo, and now I have switched to my Mark III. I picked up my old 22a and wildcat and found that I am better than that combo, but I still have not improved enough to say my Ruger and midrange ammo is holding me back.
My philosophy (I'd ask for extra credit for use of a big word, but I'm not sure I spelled it right) is to reward my self for consistant success with new improved quality. This keeps me in equipment better than me, but with rewards to come as I reach goals.
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True, but as you try different sports you will find that you can go up in steps with equipment as you progress. When I started bullseye I used my S&W 22a and winchester wildcat ammo. Next I went to better ammo, and now I have switched to my Mark III. I picked up my old 22a and wildcat and found that I am better than that combo, but I still have not improved enough to say my Ruger and midrange ammo is holding me back.
My philosophy (I'd ask for extra credit for use of a big word, but I'm not sure I spelled it right) is to reward my self for consistant success with new improved quality. This keeps me in equipment better than me, but with rewards to come as I reach goals.
Man, you sound like a school teacher............ ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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True, but as you try different sports you will find that you can go up in steps with equipment as you progress. When I started bullseye I used my S&W 22a and winchester wildcat ammo. Next I went to better ammo, and now I have switched to my Mark III. I picked up my old 22a and wildcat and found that I am better than that combo, but I still have not improved enough to say my Ruger and midrange ammo is holding me back.
My philosophy (I'd ask for extra credit for use of a big word, but I'm not sure I spelled it right) is to reward my self for consistant success with new improved quality. This keeps me in equipment better than me, but with rewards to come as I reach goals.
I have done the same thing. When I started shooting PPC, I started with a stock S&W 28. Later I had a target front sight put on it. Then I went to a S&W 14 with bull barrel and target sights. Can't remember the name of the sights, wasn't a Bomar, but they had three adjustments which you could set for three ranges. Progressed to Master with that pistol. But we could not compete with the guys that had the support to get the super duper pistols and all the time and ammo that they wanted to practice. We had to work and practice when we could.
Good equipment does help. There is nothing wrong with your philosophy either. I doubt that I will get too serious about trap and my Beretta will serve me very well. Still would not mind having a Model 12.
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Man, you sound like a school teacher............ ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Damn ... In the many hats I have worn over the years I have taught part time at vo-techs (several areas of EMS, firefighter and specialized rescue). I hope I'm not this transparent in all areas, because there are some things I'm not too proud off ::)
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Damn ... In the many hats I have worn over the years I have taught part time at vo-techs (several areas of EMS, firefighter and specialized rescue). I hope I'm not this transparent in all areas, because there are some things I'm not too proud off ::)
Don't worry, we ALL have a skeleton or two (or at least some bones) in the closet we'd like to forget about.... ;D
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I'm relatively new to trap, & soon to be skeet, but I picked up a Stoeger Condor from Bass Pro. I talked to several people knowledgeable at my range, and they felt that for the money, it wasn't a bad gun for a starter. You can get a 12 gauge, or 20 gauge for $350.00, or get a 12/20 gauge combo for $500.00. I also like the fact that it is extracter, as opposed to ejector. I'm getting too old to chase down the empties. :o
Brian
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I have an 870 Trap and love it. It has the most beautiful wood I have ever seen on a Remington shotgun. Adjustable butt pad and fits like a glove.
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One of my friends that shoots trap with me has an 870, beautiful wood with a full choke. First time out with it, had problems figuring out how it shoots, adjusting slowly but progressing.
I am progressing with my Beretta 686 sporting clays, from a low of 13 to 23. Tried out some yellow shooting glasses, non-prescription, large green fiber optic front bead and shot the 13. Went back to regular prescription glasses and a smaller green fiber optic front bead and got a 23. Last Sunday was my third trap shoot. Having fun.
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Anyone looking for a new over/under should get to their local Friends of NRA banquet this year. The gun of the year is a Weatherby o/u. I have not had a chance to shoot the gun, but I did display it and box it up for the winner. The gun handled great and shouldered perfect for me. This lucky guy put up with the harassment of his wife while he bought a $10 ticket for a 1 in 300 chance for the Weatherby, a $50 ticket that came attached to a set of Caldwell electronic ear muffs for a 1 in 24 chance at a Kimber 1911, and a $20 ticket that came attached to a folding knife for a 1 in 50 chance at a S&W Chiefs Special.
As I took his money for the Kimber I consoled his wife that that would be the cheapest gun he ever bought. She just gave me the look that only a wife could give. When his name was drawn I took the chance to deliver the paperwork to their table and just said "nice $50 gun!" Once more the look. When the last drawing of the night, the Weatherby, came up as the same guy I took the chance to deliver the paperwork again and rub in that I didn't want any lip from her next year. She did however get a jab back as the 1099 was filled out later.
The best came when they were getting ready to leave. His arms were full of a 1911, hearing protection, a print he bought on the live auction, a couple items they won on the bucket contests, and he asked her to carry the shotgun box. She looked straight in my eyes and told him "you won it you carry it!" He found a way to scoop it up, and on the way out the door she yelled back "see you next year."
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Yesterday I went to our local club and paid my yearly membership dues. Just happended to have my little 870 20 gauge that is really a skeet gun but I could not resist shooting a couple rounds of trap whit it. It has a straight grip and a 21" barrel with a modified choke tube. First round was a 17 and second round was a 20. Breakiing clay is a great way to ring in the new year. I hope everyone here at DRTV forums has a safe and wonderful New Year.
Conagher
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Why would Skeet and Trap guns be any different ?
For that matter why would they be any different than your field gun ?
The only differences between the 3 have nothing to do with shooting moving targets.
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Why would Skeet and Trap guns be any different ?
For that matter why would they be any different than your field gun ?
The only differences between the 3 have nothing to do with shooting moving targets.
I shoot both with a stock 870 Wingmaster with an IC barrel. Not a problem for me. I suppose if you want to complete, a dedicated gun would improve your hits but the weight of the gun and the correct comb, LOP has more bearing than anything I'd expect.
I once shot 78 with a 80 dollar set of golf clubs. By the time I could afford better clubs, I couldn't break 85-90 anymore so I quit!
The moral is it's the guy pulling the trigger that's the variable, not the tool!
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Oh...come on now Tom!
You know better than that!
We need you to buy at least two different preferably 3 different shotguns...one for trap...one for skeet...and one for the field.
I have been going pheasant, chukar, or quail hunting once a week since before Thanksgiving....maybe even before Halloween...I can't remember now.
These hunts have been on clubs where you pay to have the club workers or the owner of the club put out birds for you. Or on state public land, again where we have paid to have birds put out. At the state park, we can only harvest two pheasants...rooster...hen....doesn't matter. I go mainly to get my dog experience on live birds.
We have been out there walking for a good 4 hours trying to "limit out".
So my point is....for the field where you do more walking than shooting, you want a lighter gun. For trap or skeet, you want a heavier gun so that it absorbs the recoil of 25, 50, or 75 or more shots back to back and that the recoil doesn't beat you up.
Elsewhere on the forum, I posted a while back that I got a Weimaraner puppy. So that got me more into training him and more into shotguns. After my second round of skeet ever, I realized that I needed to see an optometrist ASAPly. The doc saw me, and he came to the conclusion that I am actually left eye dominant. The clay games are a little better for me now that I put a piece of scotch tape over the left lens.
Anywhooo....getting back to trap shotguns, the higher end ones with fancy combs, adjustable ribs, buttplates, etc. that is just to make it easier to get a "sight picture". I have heard some obscene numbers as far as the total shells some guys shoot in a year. So the guns have to be built to last.
And well...there is a bit of fashion show and snobbery with it. I am not too far from Sparta, IL where they hold the Grand every year. When the Grand is going on, it is like Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous. RV's there that rock bands would travel in. You can't swing a dead cat without hitting a $10,000 shotgun.
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I had not considered the difference in carrying vs shooting.
I see why the field gun would be different.
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I have a friend who shot Skeet before he got into CAS, He has a Perazzi that the wood on it was a $15,000 upgrade by itself
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I still have the pictures on my iPhone from when I stopped by the Perazzi booth at the Grand. I specifically took pics of the price tags next to their engraved receivers. One over under was $79,000. Then there was another over under that had a 3 barrel or 4 barrel set, 12 gauge, 20 gauge, 28 gauge, and I guess .410 barrels too. All for the grand total of $379,000.
The guys who won the shoot off at the Grand got checks for $100,000 .
It is a different lifestyle, that's for sure.
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I still have the pictures on my iPhone from when I stopped by the Perazzi booth at the Grand. I specifically took pics of the price tags next to their engraved receivers. One over under was $79,000. Then there was another over under that had a 3 barrel or 4 barrel set, 12 gauge, 20 gauge, 28 gauge, and I guess .410 barrels too. All for the grand total of $379,000.
The guys who won the shoot off at the Grand got checks for $100,000 .
It is a different lifestyle, that's for sure.
I saw the Grand on Wednesday night at the range last week (Shooting USA I think). The winner of the shoot off was 13 years old. Kid's got a future in shooting!
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I still have the pictures on my iPhone from when I stopped by the Perazzi booth at the Grand. I specifically took pics of the price tags next to their engraved receivers. One over under was $79,000. Then there was another over under that had a 3 barrel or 4 barrel set, 12 gauge, 20 gauge, 28 gauge, and I guess .410 barrels too. All for the grand total of $379,000.
The guys who won the shoot off at the Grand got checks for $100,000 .
It is a different lifestyle, that's for sure.
Any guesses on the side bets ;D
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Why would Skeet and Trap guns be any different ?
For that matter why would they be any different than your field gun ?
The only differences between the 3 have nothing to do with shooting moving targets.
Most Trap guns have a 28" or a 30" barrel for targets that are flying away from the firing line where Skeet guns have shorter barrels like 26" for tagets that cross in front of the firing line. Also shorter barrels swing faster for hitting doubles, That is just the theory. I remember years ago when the Model 12's and 870'"s were the kings on the trap and skeet fields before the over and unders were popular, still they are use alot in trap for shooting doubles.
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The whole sport of trap and skeet was brought about for pratice for hunting, I would assume with what ever would be carried in the field but some of that has change due to shooting 100's of rounds a day for competiton. (softer shooting to take it easy on the shoulders when you hammer a couple of hundered rounds a day of the weekend.)
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Most Trap guns have a 28" or a 30" barrel for targets that are flying away from the firing line where Skeet guns have shorter barrels like 26" for tagets that cross in front of the firing line. Also shorter barrels swing faster for hitting doubles, That is just the theory. I remember years ago when the Model 12's and 870'"s were the kings on the trap and skeet fields before the over and unders were popular, still they are use alot in trap for shooting doubles.
OH, OK.
My shotgun has an 18.5 inch barrel, I've never engaged in the shot gun sports.
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OH, OK.
My shotgun has an 18.5 inch barrel, I've never engaged in the shot gun sports.
If you can find a Sporting Clays club, they're a gas to shoot. You get at leas two birds per station and 15-18 or more stations. Each station differs from the next and mimics different game species like different ducks, goose, pheasant, quail, woodcock etc... some even have (don't tell the Crusader) rabbit along the ground.
You can use pretty much shoot with whatever you show up with and it's a load of fun. It's gonna cost a bit but you're shooting 2 to 4 boxes of shells at 50-100 birds.
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You can use pretty much shoot with whatever you show up with and it's a load of fun. It's gonna cost a bit but you're shooting 2 to 4 boxes of shells at 50-100 birds.
That's cheaper than shooting a Steel Challenge or a USPCA match, for me at least ;D. I wonder what it was like back when the pigeons were live?
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That's cheaper than shooting a Steel Challenge or a USPCA match, for me at least ;D. I wonder what it was like back when the pigeons were live?
The range near me knocks you for 45 cents a bird so 100 clays is $45.00 plus the shell cost. It's cheaper than a round of golf around here and a hell of a lot more fun!
Buy the 100 buck membership and the cost drops to 10 cents per bird...
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The range near me knocks you for 45 cents a bird so 100 clays is $45.00 plus the shell cost. It's cheaper than a round of golf around here and a hell of a lot more fun!
Buy the 100 buck membership and the cost drops to 10 cents per bird...
Two of my co-workers shoot both the Steel Challenge and USPCA matches monthly as well as some other less local matches and they suggest 180-200 rounds per match and in 45ACP that ain't cheap. The cost is usually just $10, which is waved if you come early and help set-up, and the range is only 15 minutes from my house. Just need to convince my 3 teenage daughters to quit spending all my money (not directly but with sports, field trips, dances, etc) so I can play but I have 8 months of school left so I don't need the distraction.
I am lucky too, I have a trap club 10 minutes from me too. I can drive for an hour and a half and hit almost half a dozen gun clubs. 97322 go look for yourself ;D Too bad I have the aforementioned kids' expenses...
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Magoo541...Syren's voice calling from the Dark Side " shoot USPSA...plastic gun, 9mm....plastic gun, 9mm" :)
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Magoo541...Syren's voice calling from the Dark Side " shoot USPSA...plastic gun, 9mm....plastic gun, 9mm" :)
Who've you been talking too!?! My buddy's both shoot 9mm, although one has a 45 and just picked up a XDM 5.25 in 40 so he can make major in the Steel Matches. I only have one handgun at the moment (XDM 45) and the next gun I buy needs to be an AR-15 but I have been thinking of.... I can do this.... <sigh>.... a Glock 19. :P
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Who've you been talking too!?! My buddy's both shoot 9mm, although one has a 45 and just picked up a XDM 5.25 in 40 so he can make major in the Steel Matches. I only have one handgun at the moment (XDM 45) and the next gun I buy needs to be an AR-15 but I have been thinking of.... I can do this.... <sigh>.... a Glock 19. :P
Its the best SD hand gun in the world for the money. Its less finicky than a 1911, has ironclad reliability, its concealable, accurate, extra mags are available for less than $20, and half the PDs on the planet issue them. Plus they're cheap. You can pick a used one up for less than $400. Its a no brainer for a do it all SD pistol in 9mm.
FQ13
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Magoo541... if you are going to play gun games, get a Gen 3 G34
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Magoo541... if you are going to play gun games, get a Gen 3 G34
That's a whole different animal, but also a cool pistol. Figure out what you want to do with it. But for a do it all, SD, concealed/nightstand gun, it hard to beat the G-19. For gun games, or if you just like .45 the G-34 is very solid.
FQ13
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I don't know which steel plate matches your buddy is shooting, but if it is a Steel Challenge type match where the steel is static, it just hangs off a post, then major power factor doesn't mater.
he could just shoot a 9mm.
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I dont know what I was thinking, it must be USPSA that he wants to make major power factor. Either way I'm a big guy so I like big bullets, they're like me-big, slow and hit hard ;D so the only thing I'll use a 9 for is playing gun games.
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Why would Skeet and Trap guns be any different ?
For that matter why would they be any different than your field gun ?
The only differences between the 3 have nothing to do with shooting moving targets.
There are major differences between the two. Trap shotguns are designed to pattern high. The reason for this is because in Trap the targets are shot on the rise. By having the gun set up to pattern high, it gives a "built in" vertical lead necessary to hit the ascending target. If a Trap shooter waited until the target was at the apogee of it's flight, it would be too far out of range, (40 to 45 yards), to allow for consistent hits. A Trap gun allows you to stack the beads one on top of the other, and hold just under the target, firing as it ascends.
If you shoot Trap with a field gun that patterns at point of aim, you have to cover the target to acquire the necessary vertical lead. Once you do that, you have no idea where the target is. This will cause a lot of dropped targets. This effect becomes even greater when you start shooting at handicap yardages, (17 to 27 yard line). Also, Trap guns are often equipped with very high vented rib barrels to further enhance this feature depending on the shooter, and what his handicap yardage is, along with his shooting style. It is not uncommon for AA Tournament ATA Trap Shooters to run 100 straight from the 27 yard line to win top tournaments. This would be all but impossible to achieve with a field gun.
Skeet guns are almost the exact opposite. They shoot point of aim, and have shorter barrels that are choked very loosely compared to the full chokes used by Trap shooters. The general consensus is Trap is easier to learn, but much tougher to master. The reason for this is in Trap you have no idea where the bird is going to go when you call for it. In Skeet you know exactly where the bird is coming from, and where it is going to go. Once you have figured out the established leads your pretty much good to go.
Skeet is always shot from the same distance, and from the same positions. The degree of difficulty is increased by shooting a smaller gauge shotgun. In Trap it is increased by increasing the distance handicap targets are shot from. A guy running 25 straight in Skeet with a .410 is the talent equivalent of a Trap Shooter running 25 straight from the 27 yard line. Either is no easy task, and takes years to achieve, and thousands of rounds.
Trying to shoot Skeet with a Trap gun, or visa verse is like trying to deep sea fish with a Fly Rod. Fishing rods are the same as much as shotguns in that regard.
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Thanks for that explanation Bill.
When I started shooting trap and skeet about 40 years ago in junior high, we run what we brung...I guess over the years, technology has advanced as it generally does! I haven't shot trap much over the years, probably two or three times. Mostly skeet and my 870 works well!
I suppose if I were competing, I'd look into something different but my cheap little Wingmaster does fine for what I need it too and, at 42 years old (the gun, not me!) it still looks new! I guess, for me, the whole point in the game is to practice shooting on the wing. I'd prefer to do that with the gun I'm most likely going to take into the field.
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There are major differences between the two. Trap shotguns are designed to pattern high. The reason for this is because in Trap the targets are shot on the rise. By having the gun set up to pattern high, it gives a "built in" vertical lead necessary to hit the ascending target. If a Trap shooter waited until the target was at the apogee of it's flight, it would be too far out of range, (40 to 45 yards), to allow for consistent hits. A Trap gun allows you to stack the beads one on top of the other, and hold just under the target, firing as it ascends.
If you shoot Trap with a field gun that patterns at point of aim, you have to cover the target to acquire the necessary vertical lead. Once you do that, you have no idea where the target is. This will cause a lot of dropped targets. This effect becomes even greater when you start shooting at handicap yardages, (17 to 27 yard line). Also, Trap guns are often equipped with very high vented rib barrels to further enhance this feature depending on the shooter, and what his handicap yardage is, along with his shooting style. It is not uncommon for AA Tournament ATA Trap Shooters to run 100 straight from the 27 yard line to win top tournaments. This would be all but impossible to achieve with a field gun.
Skeet guns are almost the exact opposite. They shoot point of aim, and have shorter barrels that are choked very loosely compared to the full chokes used by Trap shooters. The general consensus is Trap is easier to learn, but much tougher to master. The reason for this is in Trap you have no idea where the bird is going to go when you call for it. In Skeet you know exactly where the bird is coming from, and where it is going to go. Once you have figured out the established leads your pretty much good to go.
Skeet is always shot from the same distance, and from the same positions. The degree of difficulty is increased by shooting a smaller gauge shotgun. In Trap it is increased by increasing the distance handicap targets are shot from. A guy running 25 straight in Skeet with a .410 is the talent equivalent of a Trap Shooter running 25 straight from the 27 yard line. Either is no easy task, and takes years to achieve, and thousands of rounds.
Trying to shoot Skeet with a Trap gun, or visa verse is like trying to deep sea fish with a Fly Rod. Fishing rods are the same as much as shotguns in that regard.
Great explanation, Thanx.
The issue of a lighter gun for the field because it gets carried more than the competition guns was covered earlier.
Now I'm wondering where a Sporting clays gun would differ from the other 3.
Your explanation makes me suspect that it would.
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shoot skeet... trap shooters never smile
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Another thing I should mention is that it is not at all uncommon to see long yardage AA Trap shooters show up at a Tournament with a many as 3 different guns. One for 16 yard singles, one for handicap, and a third for shooting doubles, (usually an O/U).
Automatics and pumps have fallen out of favor in Trap over the years, being replaced by mostly single barrels, (Browning BT-99 type), and O/U's. One of the reasons is that most dedicated Trap shooters are avid reloaders. If you shoot doubles with an autoloader you'll not only lose your empties, but you will be ejecting them at the shooter to your right. O/U's and single barrels allow easy retrieval of your empties.
BT-99's can be set to just extract, and not completely eject the case. World Champion Kim Rhode can catch both empties in mid air with one hand as they eject from her gun. When you shoot as much as 700 to 1,000 rounds a day, you get good at that sort of thing.
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Two words - adjustable comb.
I shoot trap singles, doubles and hncp, sporting clays and skeet with the same gun, a Browning Citori 625 Sporting LH. I had a gunsmith put an adj comb on it to better fit me and my gun mount. World of difference.
I only have the gun shooting 60/40 high/low and it's fine for ALL the clay games.
I have shot other trap guns with ridiculous amounts of 'vertical lead' built into them. They're not for me - to much of a PITA on hard angle targets.
My backup gun is my old Rem 11-87 that is box stock except for a new recoil pad and an extension of the LOP. If the shooter does their part, the old 870s and 1100s and Mod 12s will do what they have been doing for decades - setting records.