The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: billt on February 21, 2017, 06:43:32 AM
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For years now I've been fighting with my garage door opener. My house faces south, and this time of year, and again in the Fall, the Sun would hit the electric eyes at an angle that would prevent the door from closing. I fabricated shields out of cardboard and sheet metal. Used shelving to block the Sun, and just about every other trick in the book to get it to work. It worked for a while, but just kept getting worse.
I finally mounted the eyes close to each other out of the light, and that fixed it for a about a year. Then even that didn't work. The thing was loud as hell and jerking until it reversed itself. (I unhooked it from the opener and the door went up and down easily). I got sick and tired of waiting in the driveway until the door went all the way down, (it was getting slow as hell), so I finally got fed up and called the garage door guy.
He told me the problem wasn't the electric eyes, but the opener itself. The gears were so worn out it was jerking the door to the point it would reverse. He also showed me 3 rollers that were just about ready to shear off. So he replaced the opener, along with all of the rollers. And readjusted the spring.
What a difference! The new one works in almost total silence. Smooth as silk. The new rollers are Nylon instead of steel. You can even program it into your phone, and it will send a message if you're gone and your door opens. You can also set it to close automatically after so many seconds after you leave. The Sun has zero effect on it's operation. I got 20 years out of the old one, (Genie Intellicode). Hopefully this one will be the last one I ever have to buy. (Lift Master).
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Everything has a service life.
Is there any provision for lubrication of the gears on the new unit to prolong it even longer than the last one?
You should be good for years and years, but over the next few years, keep an eye on the track.
Depending on what type "nylon" the rollers are made of, they can actually wear out the track next. We had a pulling system to extricate hot metal from a machine and it had heat treated tool steel rollers that rode in a UHMW (heavy duty plastic) track. The rollers would wear out four times faster than the track. The stainless steel cable that pulled it ran through a plastic guide and the the cable would wear out faster than the guide.
Also keep it clean. The plastic rollers will gather more dust and debris from the atmosphere and that will work like sandpaper on the contact points.
Saying that, I imagine the rollers on a garage door are much softer material and will wear before the track.
Abrasion characteristics are a funny thing. I've seen rubber hoses wear holes in steel hydraulic tubing due to vibration of a machine.
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I fought leaves and trash blocking the safety "eyes" as well as sun issues for several years. I moved the sensors up to the brace holding the motor mount so they're almost touching. Haven't had any problems in the last 15 years. Sometimes the problem is all the newfangled safety stuff.
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Who needs safety stuff anyway?
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Who needs safety stuff anyway?
Right up there on the list with "hod my beer and watch this....".
Have you tried to use anything tinted to shield it like a using the lense out of a pair of broken sun glasses??
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Who needs safety stuff anyway?
The only thing I will not touch on a house is the coil springs for a garage door. They are deadly. I have fixed homes were the rachet broke and it sent the tentioning rod through the front of the building and put a 2" deep dent in the 4x12 beam.
The old school extension springs, not big deal, the coils no f....k way.
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The only thing I will not touch on a house is the coil springs for a garage door. They are deadly.
I'm on my second set of coil springs on this house. The builder supplied coil, (single on one side only), lasted about 10 years. One night while we were watching TV, it sounded like a 12 gauge shotgun went off. I'm deaf in one ear and it was LOUD!
Turned out the coil let go. No damage was done except to my wallet. I had the guy come out the next day and replace it with a dual spring system, which should have been installed in the first place. It's crucial to keep them well lubricated. Otherwise the coils can't slide against each other while they are tensioning, (when the door is going down), and one part of the spring will load up faster and harder than the other. That will cause a premature failure over time.
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Is there any provision for lubrication of the gears on the new unit to prolong it even longer than the last one?
The new one is belt driven. (The belt is slotted like the final drive on a Harley, or the supercharger belt on a dragster, only smaller). The motor turns it directly, and it is lubricated for life. The Nylon rollers really help to make the whole system much quieter. It's all but silent while it's operating. What's nice is it starts out slow going up or down, then speeds up. It again slows down when it gets almost fully closed or open. It really helps in keeping the unit running smoothly, without banging like the old one did when it came to the end of it's travel.
The guy told me to ONLY use Silicone Spray to lubricate anything involving the door. Rollers, hinges, door opener track, springs, etc. It attracts less dirt and dust. Out here it can get dusty, and grease will attract it like a magnet. Then you basically have lapping compound.
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Have you tried to use anything tinted to shield it like a using the lense out of a pair of broken sun glasses??
With the old one I did. I even made up Sun shades out of old end mill tubes from work. Everything worked for a while. Then over time as the gears and everything else got worn, the thing was banging so bad it would reverse itself half way.
The new unit is fully warrantied, and the guy told me if it ever starts reversing to call him. He told me he's never had one start doing that yet. He mounted the electric eyes in the same place. They are much smaller than the old one's were. (About the size of a pack of gum).
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The new unit is fully warrantied, and the guy told me if it ever starts reversing to call him. He told me he's never had one start doing that yet. He mounted the electric eyes in the same place. They are much smaller than the old one's were.
Sounds good. So I guess if it ain't broke, don't fix it!
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I can't remember where I heard it but - If it ain't broke, you aren't trying. ;)
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I really wish I had the pics of when that tenetioning bar was thrown through the front of the home. it was scary.
some where I have pics( 35 mm so I still have them in a box some where lol) from when a large roll up doors spring broke and what it did too the door and ripped out the anchors in the tilt up wall.
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Yep. I stay away from the spring too. Had one break once...it stayed put but I never want to be around them when they go.
Also the belt drive is quieter than the chain. Not that it really matters.....I have one chain and one belt drive and it was an "on sale" thing that made the difference.
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The Torsion Bar type of springs tend to fly apart in chunks when they let go. The coil springs generally break in one place along the coil, (usually at the end), then they violently spin around on the bar until the tension is relieved. If I had to be in a garage when one or the other let go, I would choose the coil springs because the bar itself usually keeps a lot of the pieces captive.
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The Torsion Bar type of springs tend to fly apart in chunks when they let go. The coil springs generally break in one place along the coil, (usually at the end), then they violently spin around on the bar until the tension is relieved. If I had to be in a garage when one or the other let go, I would choose the coil springs because the bar itself usually keeps a lot of the pieces captive.
all extention springs have two captive loops and have since the 50s. Other then changing your shorts you will be just fine.
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Hadn't had time to get back to this but I thought I'd share my mounting pictures.
First since the joist in the ceiling never run right where you need them, I used Unistruts between the joist, then an angle iron position right where the opener is.
Next I put those screw in adapters so I could plug in external lights. Now rather than 2 60W lights hugging the unit, I can put most any wattage I want without fear of melting the plastic. So two 100W bulbs spaced away from the unit to give light.
Finally, the infernal safety devices are mounted on the angle iron about an inch apart.
(https://photos.smugmug.com/General/i-HcCRsCN/0/O/IMG_0264.jpg)
(https://photos.smugmug.com/General/i-8DRGshx/0/X2/IMG_20170316_080812780-X2.jpg)
(https://photos.smugmug.com/General/i-n3bP8q7/0/L/IMG_20170316_080747108-L.jpg)
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That's a good idea you used with the lights.
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Yes no kidding. I like the light idea.
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The light fixtures are kind of funny looking but way better than having them right on the opener.
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The light fixtures are kind of funny looking but way better than having them right on the opener.
Wonder if the outlets are rated high enough to run a 4 ft fluorescent fixture on each side. The older I get the brighter I like things???
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Wonder if the outlets are rated high enough to run a 4 ft fluorescent fixture on each side. The older I get the brighter I like things???
You can get 4' LED's now.
Bright, less current draw, less heat, and no ballast to go bad.
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Wonder if the outlets are rated high enough to run a 4 ft fluorescent fixture on each side. The older I get the brighter I like things???
I think 4' fluorescent tubes are rated at 40 watts each. Perhaps less now with everything and everyone so energy conscious. If you used 2 doubles you would be pulling 160 watts with 4 tubes. I think you would be OK. I'm sure there are a lot of these things in garages running 2, 100 watt bulbs.
Remember that most of the time these things are only on for a couple of minutes, while the door raises and lowers. Then they turn off automatically. That short of a cycle time knocks the hell out of fluorescent lights and ballasts over time. Especially in cold weather.
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The thing with fluorescent lights is if they still use a ballast, they diminish in longevity if turned on/off frequently and are susceptible to temperature changes (hard to start in colder climates).
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If you put in the 4' LED tubes in them that is fine. They are bright as all get out, and instant on. I put them in my kitchen light fixture as a test (I live off-grid, everything helps). They are 2x brighter than the fluorescent tubes!! I liked them so much I replaced the two fixtures in the garage as well, now no more problems at 20 below!! Those bulbs are moving with me too!!
I really like that idea with relocation of the bulbs.
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If you put in the 4' LED tubes in them that is fine. They are bright as all get out, and instant on. I put them in my kitchen light fixture as a test (I live off-grid, everything helps). They are 2x brighter than the fluorescent tubes!! I liked them so much I replaced the two fixtures in the garage as well, now no more problems at 20 below!! Those bulbs are moving with me too!!
I really like that idea with relocation of the bulbs.
the led conversion tubes are a bad deal. 1 there are 2 kinds. 1 require the ballest too work, thr other requires line voltqge. Either way sucks for this application. Better just to buy the led fixure. Cheaper too as they can be had for about $40
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My sockets with a short cord on them were the cheapest solution. Plus I can put in either incandescent, fluorescent or LED bulbs.
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the led conversion tubes are a bad deal. 1 there are 2 kinds. 1 require the ballest too work, thr other requires line voltqge. Either way sucks for this application. Better just to buy the led fixure. Cheaper too as they can be had for about $40
Thanks. I'll have to look in to that. Looks like brighter days ahead! :)
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I have a double 40 watt fluorescent in my kitchen. I would change it out to LED but there are too many wires. And electricity and I don't get along too well. A 110 volt outdoor light fixture I can handle.
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In my new opener I put in 2, 100 watt equivalent CFL bulbs. I think they actually draw only 18 watts each. They are quite bright. I also have a double 4 foot 40 watt fluorescent mounted on the ceiling. It was the fixture the builder put in the kitchen. I bought a nicer one for the kitchen, and put the crappy builder grade one in the garage. It replaced the crappy porcelain naked incandescent 60 watt bulb fixture that came with the house.
The thing is I did all of that 20 years ago. I forgot how I did it. There are a ton of wires in a fluorescent fixture with the ballast and all. But IIRC, there are only 2, (white and black), going out the back of it. Anyway, my garage is pretty bright with all 3 lights on. The new opener has a motion sensor that turns the lights on as you walk in. It also has a button on the wall mounted opener for just turning on the lights without opening the door. They'll stay on until you switch them off.
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Bill, it ain't too bad if you remember to turn off the breaker first. ;D
I've worked on everything between 4v DC to 480v AC and as long as you respect the 'lectricity, it's pretty easy to diy most things.
In residential wiring, black is hot and feeds from the breaker, white is neutral, and green/bare is ground.
All the extra wires in a flourescent light fixture stay in the fixture and need not be fooled with. Just disconnect the black, white and ground (either green or bare copper).
The new light uses the same color wires (or should).
One thing I have noticed about LED lights in general is that it is a "cleaner" light. It has the same or brighter light emission but without the fuzzy glare. The city near me has been swapping out street lights for LEDs and I noticed there isn't that haze around them at night, they are just clearer. I noticed the same thing with the outdoor lights my son just installed on one end of his house.
Last night I swapped the CFL bulb on my porch to a 60w LED (4 for $6 at wallymart) and it is much brighter.
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LED's are the way to go. CFL's have never lasted very long for me. Early LED's missed the mark but they are on target now. CFL's are pretty fragile and make a real mess if you have a boo boo....
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Does anyone know if they make high lumen, 4' LED fluorescent bulbs that you can just pop in, and they will run on the same ballast that I, and thousands of others currently have? Or do you have to replace the whole fixture?
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The 100W equivalent CFLs are probably 23W which is still a great savings in electricity over incandescents. The light fixture in my living room takes 3 bulbs and I had 3 60W incandescents in it until one socket failed. Now I have 2 100W equivalent CFLs in it. It's about the same brightness, maybe a little better, at 46(?) watts instead of 180. I'm using about 1/4 of the amount of electricity I was earlier in that one fixture.
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The 100W equivalent CFLs are probably 23W which is still a great savings in electricity over incandescents. The light fixture in my living room takes 3 bulbs and I had 3 60W incandescents in it until one socket failed. Now I have 2 100W equivalent CFLs in it. It's about the same brightness, maybe a little better, at 46(?) watts instead of 180. I'm using about 1/4 of the amount of electricity I was earlier in that one fixture.
I just bought a 4-Pack of 100W equivalent CFL bulbs at Lowe's this morning. They draw an actual 23 watts, and put out 1,600 Lumens. They are "Bright Daylight". Those give off the most light. They have a bright, blue white hue.
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Does anyone know if they make high lumen, 4' LED fluorescent bulbs that you can just pop in, and they will run on the same ballast that I, and thousands of others currently have? Or do you have to replace the whole fixture?
yes they do, but they are about $30 each. so no real reason to do it when you can just replace the fixture for less. now you can get the ones where you bypass the ballest and hook them too 110.
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yes they do, but they are about $30 each. so no real reason to do it when you can just replace the fixture for less. now you can get the ones where you bypass the ballest and hook them too 110.
The problem is the fixture in my kitchen is a real nice one that she really likes. It's made from Oak, and it's got leaded stained glass in it. So if I could just swap out the 4' fluorescent tubes with LED's, $60 for 2 isn't that bad. Especially if they are brighter, use less juice, and last longer.
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call your local electrical/ lighting supply and ask for the line voltage kit. you will be a lot happier and the rewiring is a breeze.
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If you want I can get a part number from the lighting guy monday. I just need too know one thing off the fixture.
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If you want I can get a part number from the lighting guy monday. I just need too know one thing off the fixture.
That's OK TAB. The light is running fine now. So what I'm going to do is just wait. These things get real cheap real fast, once the technology is paid for. Look at how much LED screw in bulbs have come down in the last couple of years. I'll just wait until these crap out, and hopefully by that time the LED's will have gotten a lot cheaper.
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Billt needs to buy a loto ticket... just got back from a home that has exactly what he needs done... 4't 12. To line voltage leds installed....so now you will not only get a part number, but pics on how too wire them up.
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Please send that to me too Tab. I need to change out my Mom's 4' kitchen LED's and another in the shop.
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Thanks TAB.
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My sockets with a short cord on them were the cheapest solution. Plus I can put in either incandescent, fluorescent or LED bulbs.
The nice thing, even though it is probably just a happy accident, is that with the fixtures hanging there will be less hard vibration to shorten the life of bulbs and electronics.
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so i am doing something a little different than planed, I was planning on doing a full rewire of the fixture, but platt(nation wide electrical supplier) found a troffer light kit for $107 that is 6 screws and connect 2 wires. it goes from a 4 bulb too 3, but more light out put and led. I will have the part numbers tomorrow when I pick it up.
while it may not fit your exact app, having to do zero wiring other power connect saves a bunch of time. and when you consider that too replace all 4 lights with led tubes and new tomb stones is ~ $90 anyways... the 20ish mins it will save me is worth the $27 bucks.( at least too me, should be about a 5 min install)
stay tuned
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The nice thing, even though it is probably just a happy accident, is that with the fixtures hanging there will be less hard vibration to shorten the life of bulbs and electronics.
Mike, you are so right. I forgot to mention that benefit of my arrangement.
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What TAB is saying is the way to go. As such, I did not know that was an option at the time. I got my LED tubes from Costco, a pair for $24.
In the future, I will check with TAB before I do anything ;D
-Bidah
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take them back.
I really dislike the ones that need the ballast. line voltage is so much better.
here is the kit we went with.
https://www.litetronics.com/products/50-watt-led-retrofit-120v-dimming-2x4-3-tube-troffer-5000k/
they have lots different retrofit kits for lots of different apps. I have used them( and similar) in the past. the time it saves on the install is insane. it took me longer too get the drop layed out( think no clean up= happy wife) ladder out and tools there then it did to replace the fixture. it was 8 screws to get the old fixture out, cut the power/stripped power cut off installed, and 6 screws too install. took maybe 20 mins from the door bell ring too here is your invoice. For the record it was a $400 job. ( most of that was the "show up fee")
I have some pics of how to install the power cut off socket, but that's it. honestly if you can't screw it into the ceiling in such a way it won't fall down.... well lets just say you should not be doing this and you need to turn in your man card.
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I watched both of the videos on that site and can't believe how simple it is to install the replacement kit.
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I watched both of the videos on that site and can't believe how simple it is to install the replacement kit.
I know. I did 93 in about 8 hours the 1st time I did them. It made a believer out of me.
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TAB,
What's a "Troffer"??
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TAB,
What's a "Troffer"??
It's the rectangular (some are square) light fixture that usually goes with a drop-ceiling.
(https://www.eledlights.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/thumbnail/8e86a600b326f05ecba54a74871cbc49/u/p/upgraded-troffer-afterw.jpg)
TAB, thanks for the heads-up on the retro lights. My church needs to replace a bunch of fluorescent lights in one of our large gathering rooms with high ceilings. Those you posted would work just right.
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the recessed lights in drop ceilings.
Watch this video... https://youtu.be/Bebh_HMOgXo
Edit. Peg you have pm.
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From Wikipedia - "A troffer is a rectangular light fixture that fits into a modular dropped ceiling grid (i.e. 2' by 2' or 2' by 4'). Troffer fixtures have typically been designed to accommodate standard fluorescent lamps (T12, T8, or T5), but are now often designed with integral LED sources. Troffers are typically recessed sitting above the ceiling grid, but are also available in surface mount 'boxes'." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troffer
Edit: I didn't realize there was another page here until I posted this but there is a little more information at the link.
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the recessed lights in drop ceilings.
Watch this video... https://youtu.be/Bebh_HMOgXo
Edit. Peg you have pm.
Got it...thanks, TAB!!!
These lights have evolved a long way.
I changed so many 8' fluorescent bulbs and 277v ballasts (tapped off a 480v circuit) that I could do it in my sleep.
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I spent too much time dealing with 208v. Lol
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https://www.platt.com/platt-electric-supply/Fluorescent-Fixture-Conversion-Kit-Retrofit-Kits/Litetronics/RF50UQT440/product.aspx?zpid=161162
link too the platt item page... this is a SO, as its not stocked.
PS we are really good at thread drift... from a garage door opener, to led conversions for a kitchen too troffer lights... ;D
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No telling where it might end up ;D
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Who handloads for the .32 ACP? ;D
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Who handloads for the .32 ACP? ;D
come on billt. You are not even trying...
You should have said.
The light above my reloading station needs to be replaced with something stronger. These old eyes can't see too reload 32 acp any more.
That way wr can branch off into at least 5 other paths.
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.32 a.c.p.??? who in the world would load an overpowered round like that? A .25a.c.p. is more than powerful enough to get the job done...Nobody needs a .32a.c.p. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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https://www.platt.com/platt-electric-supply/Fluorescent-Fixture-Conversion-Kit-Retrofit-Kits/Litetronics/RF50UQT440/product.aspx?zpid=161162
link too the platt item page... this is a SO, as its not stocked.
PS we are really good at thread drift... from a garage door opener, to led conversions for a kitchen too troffer lights... ;D
Hey, at least we stayed within the realm of "home improvement" ..... ;D ;D
Now, does Barnes make a monolithic, heavy-for-caliber bullet for the .32 ACP? 8)
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.32 a.c.p.??? who in the world would load an overpowered round like that? A .25a.c.p. is more than powerful enough to get the job done...Nobody needs a .32a.c.p. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
I believe reloading the .25 ACP would try a good man's patience and drive a lesser man insane.
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I believe reloading the .25 ACP would try a good man's patience and drive a lesser man insane.
Indeed so.
I own a .25 ACP Baby Browning that belonged to my late uncle (it was the first pistol I ever held). The ONLY reason I have any ammo for it is because of my standard belief that one should own some ammo for every weapon.