The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: bbbean on September 17, 2008, 03:20:32 PM
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I'm a big fan of shooting on TV. I watch every show that airs, listen to the podcasts, and read all the blogs I have time for. But Michael Bane is th eonly guy who rags on the other shows, and Jim Scouten in particular.
Now, I don't know about the rest of you, but I can watch TWO 30 minute programs in the same week and enjoy both of them.
SO what's Michael's problem with Jim Scouten? Did Jim Scouten steal his girlfriend or something?
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Troll Alert!
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I wouldn't go so far as to say MB is ragging on JS as I would say its more of range humor, healthy competition. Having both these guys producing shooting programs only benifits all of us. It would be hard for me to believe that these two guys don't have the highest respect for each other.
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It just Struck me as being Healthy competition and ribbing towards a colleague. Ya know, kinda how the Army, Navy, Marines, and Air Force all do each other. (Kinda like when they say "Marines is the Mens Dept of the Navy." Or like my dad says "The best Marine is a Submarine.")
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Troll Alert!
Not trolling, just curious after listening to the third podcast in a row with some sort of dig at JS. Maybe the other guys are right and its all in good humor.
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I picked up on the same thing. And I'm not sure it's said in humor though. He called his competitor(s)/colleague(s) "dweebs" this week. I think last week he referred to their video production as the work of amateurs. If he's joking around, he might want to throw that in every now and again. It's starting to sound like he's feeling a bit insecure, which I think he has no reason to feel that way.
Michael produces a first-rate show and I really enjoy the way he presents things. He is one of the influences (maybe the main one) that attracted me to competition shooting in IDPA. I hope he's not saying all that stuff in seriousness, as that besmirches his own character. And I am confident he's a bigger man than that too.
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To me, the problem is that there are two public versions of Michael Bane and it isn't clear which one is speaking because the podcasts have content from both.
If the comments come from Michael Bane the businessman then it is reasonable to expect him to promote his products (although I find the comments to be petty, and I think the lab coat guys are funny). If from Michael Bane the firearms industry/gun culture spokesman then they are inappropriate. If it is good natured ribbing then Michael throwing in a few stories where the others have topped him would make that clear.
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HMMMM, all guys with low post counts.
Maybe it's y'all that don't understand MB and not the other way 'round?
Just food for thought.
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HMMMM, all guys with low post counts.
Maybe it's y'all that don't understand MB and not the other way 'round?
Just food for thought.
Maybe. I've only been watching the show for a few years and listening to the podcast for a year or so.
On the other hand if "casual" listeners and viewers are getting the wrong impression from your broadcasts....
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HMMMM, all guys with low post counts.
Maybe it's y'all that don't understand MB and not the other way 'round?
Just food for thought.
Member: bbbean
Posts: 3
Posts on this thread: 3
Troll Alert!
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Michael's just having fun, bit of friendly competition is all I'm sure if Jim had a show he'd do the same once in a while. If Michael is being serious you'll know it right off, aka whenever he talks about sell outs (*hint* this brought to you by the letter W) and socia- I mean democrats.
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Wow I cant really believe this got any replies. If MB didnt have pride in what he has created here and be cocky about it, even at the expense of his competitors that he has caught stealing his ideas, there just might be something wrong.
I dont remember ever hearing him mention one specific name but maybe he did, I just thought it was a generalization.
I am glad you dicided to post on here and become a member but maybe we should stick to posting about guns and the life, instead of questioning the guy that has created this.
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Neon, your right on. MB and Jim are in the "gun show biz" and taking pot shots are welcome ;D
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Don't feed the Trolls!
I am done with this thread, and I hope that the rest of you are too.
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I'm sure if Jim had a show he'd do the same once in a while.
Obviously, Jim Scouten does have a couple of shows, but I've never heard him run down another show or host.
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I am glad you dicided to post on here and become a member but maybe we should stick to posting about guns and the life, instead of questioning the guy that has created this.
So, if I had a question about why MB does something on his show or podcast I shouldn't post it on the Down Range Cafe'?
Sheesh...
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Eric, I noticed you posted 3 times on a thread to complain that people were posting. Interesting strategy.
And once again, I'm not a troll. I'm a regular listener/viewer with a question. So sorry to have upset you.
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Obviously, Jim Scouten does have a couple of shows, but I've never heard him run down another show or host.
ie:I was referring to podcasts, sorry I wasn't being clear. Haven't eaten anything in a while and Japanese beer is 6%+ alcohol.
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ie:I was referring to podcasts, sorry I wasn't being clear. Haven't eaten anything in a while and Japanese beer is 6%+ alcohol.
10-4. Love that rice beer.
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;D ;D
Good morning, folks!
Michael's hair is gray, mine is gray, JS's hair is not and we joke about it. It is that simple...
Actually, other people joke about it a lot more than we do in this business. We have some good laughs about it too.
And the coffee is black and tastes good!
And... yes, it is a competition between the shows about ratings and I like it that way. It keeps the producers busy and gun owners happy.
I just wish there were more resources available so we could produce even more shows and cover all the good things that is going on out there with or without pompadour hairstyle or old gray headed men . ;D
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Grey hair, black hair.... As a guy with multi colored hair everywhere except where it SHOULD be, I think this thread has gotten dumber and dumbest. That's showbiz fellers!
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Competition in shooting sports only makes you better. I think we all can agree on that. So why not competition in shooting sports tv shows? Don't you think in the long run they can both benifit from competition? Without someone else pushing you, why try getting better? I think there's room for both of them. Just my 2 cents. :)
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Hi kids;
I don't believe I've ever mentioned anyone's name, FWIW. Having said that, let me say that we are all involved in the great rite of capitalism. We all compete for limited resources — viewers and advertising dollars — and we all compete in multiple arenas, including through the shows themselves, through the Internet in its various forms, in speaking engagements and behind the scenes to the industry itself.
As a rule, I tend to favor the public arena, because I came up through journalism and back-room wheeling and dealing are an anathema to me. I much prefer a "what you see is what you get" universe. I do not circulate "slam letters" in the industry outlining my competition's faults, nor will I allow such to be circulated in my or my shows names. I have never dis'sed my competition in the back rooms. My broadcast and Internet shows' policies are public — I do not charge a fee or expenses for us to come to film; you do not have to be a sponsor to be mentioned on my shows (although I love my sponsors!); I and other people on my shows will always disclose our relationships within the industry...you have a right to know who's paying me to talk.
As much as possible — and it is less so since the InterMedia shows moved to a different network — I let the other producers know what I plan to film, because that way the viewers get the broadest view of the culture...there are 400 some-odd hunting shows, and there are fewer than 10 gun shows, even though according to the recent NSSF omnibus study on the future of hunting and the shooting sports, the hunting and shooting sports market are essentially the same size, with the shooting sports side growing (43% of the market has hunted and shot in the last 2 years; 43% have shot in the last 2 years; 14% have only hunted in the last 2 years).
I occasionally take pot shots (usually on the podcast, which is the most free-wheeling of my media products) at other shows — most of those guys are friends of mine, and in the case of Mark Keefe, Tom Gresham, Craig Boddington and Garry James, good friends of mine — and they can give as good as they get. And let's face it...we are not curing cancer here. Fore the most part we are talking about recreational fun with firearms...
One of the reasons I have been a success in many of my endeavors is that I have a somewhat irreverent world view, and that is unlikely to change. It puzzles me that oftentimes we have become so sensitive about even mild sarcasm and humor. When we choose to step into the public arena — and it is a choice; nobody made us put ourselves before the public — we accept that we rightly become targets. Getting dinged — sometimes getting flayed alive — come with the territory. There is currently a forum where a regular poster insists that "Michael Bane" is a pseudonym for a Washington antigun lobbyist...and he can prove it! Cool! I have neighbors who worry a lot about aliens, too.
Am I occasionally over the top? Am I sometimes offensive? Do I sometimes have to step back and apologize for my excesses? Absolutely! But I would also like to point out that I am the most reachable person working in this niche...if you ask me a question here, or on the blog, or in person, I'll do my best to answer it. And I do pay attention to what you guys say...if you think I'm to harsh in my criticism of other shows, maybe I am and it's something I'll consider.
While I appreciate that some people like Mythbusters' lab coat knock-offs, I happen to find them funny and a little silly...for exactly the reasons I have stated...machines generally should be tested in the context they're designed for. I can design a torture test that every gun in the world will fail...it's called a cutting torch. I did do a torture test once for SG — Paul Erhardt smacked a Sig 226 with an aluminum baseball bat and the gun still fired. It looked cool on camera, but I decided never to do that kind of testing again because I wasn't sure what it really told me about the gun. There's an apocryphal story out there of my first encounter with a certain polymer-framed service pistol...the factory rep while speaking to a group of police armorers made a big point that one could "literally throw this gun against that concrete wall — literally! — and it's 100%!" When it came my turn to handle the gun...well, you can probably guess what happened, which was followed by much shouting and laughter. The point in truth is that throwing the gun full force against a concrete block was was an unfair test...depending on how the gun hits the wall and with what force, something is likely to break. What the rep should have said, literally, is that the gun had been drop-tested to 5X the required height with no problems whatsoever. I suspect that with a little work and the right sauce, I could totally ruin my Ruger LCP on my BBQ grill, which doesn't actually mean anything unless I'm spending a lot of time myself inside BBQ grills, or perhaps on the surface of Mercury.
As far as the appropriateness within the context of the gun culture of anything I say or write, please be aware that I am in regular, high-level communications with the other media professionals in the field. I am a gadfly, a role I am particularly well suited for, if I say so myself!
Finally, I would like to point out the slogan of the Michael Blog, offending people of all stripes since 2003: "Warning! I fling poo!"
I do, too.
Michael B
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I took some time to listen to the last few podcasts again last night. I heard what I think started this whole thing, but can't figure out what the problem is. A comment on someone's hair and hairspray with no one's name mentioned, and a comment on the shooting ability of one's crew and a challenge (that is how I see that type of comment, at least that is what happens at our ranges) to the others to prove their skills. If your skin is so thin that you can't handle your favorite host being possibly eluded to with good natured ribbing, you need to find a new group to hang out with.
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Finally, I would like to point out the slogan of the Michael Blog, offending people of all stripes since 2003: "Warning! I fling poo!"
Fair enough.
FWIW, I never said anything about being offended, but I have learned a few things about the folks who hang out here. Again, sorry I ruffled everyone's feathers.
See you at the range.
BB
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I occasionally take pot shots (usually on the podcast, which is the most free-wheeling of my media products) at other shows — most of those guys are friends of mine, and in the case of Mark Keefe, Tom Gresham, Craig Boddington and Garry James, good friends of mine — and they can give as good as they get. And let's face it...we are not curing cancer here. Fore the most part we are talking about recreational fun with firearms...
Am I occasionally over the top? Am I sometimes offensive? Do I sometimes have to step back and apologize for my excesses? Absolutely! But I would also like to point out that I am the most reachable person working in this niche...if you ask me a question here, or on the blog, or in person, I'll do my best to answer it. And I do pay attention to what you guys say...if you think I'm to harsh in my criticism of other shows, maybe I am and it's something I'll consider.
Michael B
Hi Michael,
Thanks for responding. As for me, it was I just did not get it. I didn't know who or what you were talking about, though I figured out who you were talking about when you talk about the guys in the lab coats. I appreciate the details and I have a greater understanding of where you are coming from now. Now I know for the most part you are just talking smack to your competitors/friends, though you do seem to reserve some pointed darts for a few people. To pawn a phrase: That's just how you roll on DRTV!
Now for something completely different:
I know you advocate training in hand-to-hand or unarmed conflict. In other words, the gun should not be first and only solution to a problem. Of the martial arts, which do you recommend to a 40 year old? I like the idea of Krav Maga (sic) for its disregard for all ceremonial stuff that others have and gets right to the point. I have no prior experience, so please steer me in the right direction.
Thanks!
George
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There's also the "Russian, fighting dirty" martial art and a Cajun streetfighting martial art too. I can't recall the name of either. When it comes to fighting for your life I think fighting dirty is best. Not having osteoporosis like a little old lady would be even better. :(
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Now for something completely different:
I know you advocate training in hand-to-hand or unarmed conflict. In other words, the gun should not be first and only solution to a problem. Of the martial arts, which do you recommend to a 40 year old? I like the idea of Krav Maga (sic) for its disregard for all ceremonial stuff that others have and gets right to the point. I have no prior experience, so please steer me in the right direction.
George -
Great question. To get more attention, why not head up to the top of the Forums, and start a new thread. More people are likely to see it than buried here.
To answer, krav maga, the Russian and French systems, et al. as seen on those Human Warrior type shows, are going to be hard to come by in this country. I've heard of a couple of KM academies and instructors, but these are very specialized and localized to the urban areas. Your best hope is to look around your area and see what is available. Good luck.
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Just for the record, I don't get either what grilling, deep frying, or shooting at my Glock would prove. (And yeah I've seen video of a guy on ar15.com doing just that with his G21.) Well, at least the gun getting hit by a bullet or 2 is at least semi-likely to happen in a firefight. I like the Para Torture test (or was that a Todd Jarrett torture test?) you put up on here.
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Just for the record, I don't get either what grilling, deep frying, or shooting at my Glock would prove. (And yeah I've seen video of a guy on ar15.com doing just that with his G21.) Well, at least the gun getting hit by a bullet or 2 is at least semi-likely to happen in a firefight. I like the Para Torture test (or was that a Todd Jarrett torture test?) you put up on here.
You got a link?
I'd like to see that.