The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: Rastus on March 29, 2021, 11:30:32 AM
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Museum Ships Weekend 2021 starts Friday evening 04-JUN-21. Go to the website for updated timer....of course.
https://www.nj2bb.org/museum/ (https://www.nj2bb.org/museum/)
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I do have a 20m vertical up (actually a ham stick on my little tower). I'll try to get in on this one.
Did you make contact with Last Man Standing?
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No.
Dadgummit.
I would like to build a 3 element 20M Moxon for MSWE.
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I do have a 20m vertical up (actually a ham stick on my little tower). I'll try to get in on this one.
<snip>
I need to put up the Hustler 5BTV vertical that's been lounging away in a box for the last 3 years. It's good for 10, 15, 20, 40 and 80 meter bands. I also need to find some wire antennas someone besides me misplaced at home or I'll need to rebuild them. I like to have several dipoles up because of the directionality it will give me a little gain in the direction of the lobes. Picking up a couple of S units really helps break through the pile ups. I do have up my 20M loop in Arkansas now with the strongest part of the field pointing to North Carolina though locations in Florida to New York are really strong contacts too.
By the way...only 8 weeks to prepare now. 20 Meter should be popping in the morning. I make good morning contacts with the east coast on 20 M so that's the area I'll work first.
So far 50 ships are on the list with 13 maybes. The Wuhan Lab Flu is the reason for the low count and I expect that excuse to wane a lot over the next 8 weeks so I think it's a cinch we'll have at least 75 ships. That and there are always a dozen or so that list the last few days.
P.S. - A contract to decommission the reactor on the NSS Savanah (The US's first nuclear transport ship) was just awarded so after this it may be years before you can contact it again during the decommissioning process or at all if it is scrapped after the reactor removal.
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57 ships listed as participants with 12 maybe will participate. I suspect that others will come in at the last minute as they always seem to do.
One of the participants is operating only on June 1 which is before the usual start date. Several others will only participated one of the two days on the air.
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From FB:
USS ALABAMA Battleship Memorial Park
Celebrating Historic Preservation Month:
The Deep South Amateur Radio Club has spent this spring restoring Main Communication aboard the USS ALABAMA. This group of dedicated ham radio operators have chipped and painted the compartment, restored antenna, and worked to get the ship's radios operational.
The club will broadcast live from Main Communication during the Museum Ships Broadcast beginning on Friday, June 6, at 5:00 p.m., and continuing until Sunday, June 6, 5:00 p.m. This is the historic naval fleet's annual continuous 48 hour radio broadcast.
Be sure to tune in!
Call letters for the USS ALABAMA are K4DSR and the USS DRUM are K5LDA.
Thanks Deep South Amateur Radio Club for your passionate restoration work.
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Wow. Nice one PegLeg. Are you going to listen in on shortwave this year?
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I need to put up the Hustler 5BTV vertical that's been lounging away in a box for the last 3 years. It's good for 10, 15, 20, 40 and 80 meter bands. I also need to find some wire antennas someone besides me misplaced at home or I'll need to rebuild them. I like to have several dipoles up because of the directionality it will give me a little gain in the direction of the lobes. Picking up a couple of S units really helps break through the pile ups. I do have up my 20M loop in Arkansas now with the strongest part of the field pointing to North Carolina though locations in Florida to New York are really strong contacts too.
P.S. - A contract to decommission the reactor on the NSS Savanah (The US's first nuclear transport ship) was just awarded so after this it may be years before you can contact it again during the decommissioning process or at all if it is scrapped after the reactor removal.
I have the Hustler 6BTV also waiting for me to put up. Thinking of adding a G5RV or another dipole in inverted V. My house, unfortunately, is 700Ft above sea level but still in a bit of a valley with hills 200 ft high on almost all sides. I am not sure how well things will work. My stepson has the same antenna but is in a much better location.
This is what I will be adding.
https://www.gigaparts.com/mfj-1778.html?msclkid=d2c086956cc9126f7e12e60fe8ac8c0d&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=*Shopping%20-%20JumpFly&utm_term=4582145989392158&utm_content=MFJ
Thinking about adding radials to the 6BTV but that is a LOT of work digging the trenches. I "HOPE" to have this up and running before winter this year. If so, I will talk to you guys there. de K4JWK
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I have a 5BTV that I bought 3-4 years ago still in the box. I bought it for MSWE but never had time to put it up. I'm planning on putting it up this time just like all the previous years.
You can put the radials on top of the ground for now and then bury them later..which is what I'll do. 200' high sides may be a problem but I think only if the angle is greater than 25-30 degrees to the top...otherwise you should skate on that one. You may have a higher SWR stringing it up as an inverted V.
Neat presentation:
http://www.bvarc.org/pdf/g5rv_w5rh.pdf (http://www.bvarc.org/pdf/g5rv_w5rh.pdf)
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You may have a higher SWR stringing it up as an inverted V.
Neat presentation:
http://www.bvarc.org/pdf/g5rv_w5rh.pdf (http://www.bvarc.org/pdf/g5rv_w5rh.pdf)
Actually, the angle is more like 10 or so at most so..... The inverted V was an idea. Do you have any suggestions?
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You may have a higher SWR stringing it up as an inverted V.
Wow. I did not know it used 75 Ohm. I also don't know if I can get it to the 34ft height. Something to think about now.
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10 degrees won't hurt you at all. There is very little signal that low.
If you go flat top with the G5RV it should tune better.
Do you have an antenna tuner? I have a 74'-75' circular loop (20 meters) hanging in a tree 4' off the ground that works better than anything I've had before...with a caveat. It has to be fed on the side parallel to ground with ladder line (~450 ohm) and tuned. I use it on 80, 40, 20, 15, 12, and 10 meters. Sometimes I can tune in 17 meters. But I need a tuner and it has some weird lobes when off 20 meters...but most antennas do have lobes when not in the band designed for.
Anything you can buy made up is cheaper done just buying the components: https://thewireman.com/ (https://thewireman.com/)
There is a ton of data out there on building various dipoles, loops, etc. The Villages development has a ham club (do a search on The Villages Ham Radio) that has some excellent information out there. The best presentation I have seen on antenna efficiency and cost is this one: https://www.hamfesters.org/main/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Stealth-Antenna-Guide.pdf (https://www.hamfesters.org/main/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Stealth-Antenna-Guide.pdf)
Here's one on stealth:
https://www.k4vrc.com/uploads/1/0/1/5/10156032/present-tvarc_antenna_guide.pdf (https://www.k4vrc.com/uploads/1/0/1/5/10156032/present-tvarc_antenna_guide.pdf)
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Wow. I did not know it used 75 Ohm. I also don't know if I can get it to the 34ft height. Something to think about now.
Put a balun on it and don't worry about the 75 Ohm....
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Do you have an antenna tuner?
Yes. I have a Yeasu FTdx3000 with a built-in tuner and an FT847 with an external tuner (200-watt rating)
I do have trees on my lot but the feed from trees to my shack would exceed 70 feet and I am not sure how the power at the antenna would faire. I fear too much signal loss due to length of feed line.
I do have a 200 ft straight line fence that is close enough from where co-ax would enter my shack but, of course, it is not really high enough to be of value. I can probably put up poles against each end for support of the antenna but no way to get them to 35ft.
I guess it will be a project for this summer. ;^)
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70ft isn't a problem unless you have high SWR's. Get some of the 450 Ohm window or ladder line. If you aren't running power then the 16 or 18 gauge will be fine. https://thewireman.com/product-category/feed-lines/ladder-line/ (https://thewireman.com/product-category/feed-lines/ladder-line/) You can cover that 70 ft for under $35 or so and because it is balanced line run 150 ft and have less loss than than 50 ft of coax.
To crossover back to coax I have one of these: https://www.gigaparts.com/mfj-911h.html (https://www.gigaparts.com/mfj-911h.html) I used this before I had the AT4K tuner.
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I'll try it.
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I haven't looked at the KY distribution for ships' sites, so I don't know how NVIS would work for you. We used to live in Lexington on the downslope of a hill, and I used NVIS to reach out to FL.
Here on the coast of GA I intend to try both a 17' vertical and an NVIS random wire end-fed. Note I live in an HOA so they need to be temporary AND I am surrounded by woods immediately to the north and east. I do have clearance to the west, but the house will block to the south. I expect the NVIS configuration alone to bring in maybe a dozen ships - if I can remember how to operate my radio. It's been a while . . . .
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Pathfinder you have plenty of time to catch up!
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Less than a week to get ready guys! They are up to 75 ships now and I've never seen a year where there were not some added a few days before the event.
I think I'm going to try and put up that 5BTV today. I may set up a 75 meter delta loop this week. That's really iffy for me I have a lot to accomplish this week. But I do have my 20 meter loop up and running and I think I'm going to also take down the 6 meter dipole and replace it with a 15 or 17 meter dipole.
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Still 75 ships listed but 9 are pending their final Wuhan Flu directives from the people who run the museums.
Mr. Kennedy....get that skyhook up?
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Still 75 ships listed but 9 are pending their final Wuhan Flu directives from the people who run the museums.
Mr. Kennedy....get that skyhook up?
Unfortunately not yet. If it stops raining maybe, with luck, this weekend.
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Yes, it's raining here too. But MSWE kicks off Friday evening so I'm at least going to get the 5BTV up....I think. I will also replace that 6 meter dipole with maybe a 40 meter...that will be easy since I have it on pulleys. All I need to do is replace a few feet of wire on either end of the balun.
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Nothing like a man with a plan.
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Yes, it's raining here too. But MSWE kicks off Friday evening so I'm at least going to get the 5BTV up....I think. I will also replace that 6 meter dipole with maybe a 40 meter...that will be easy since I have it on pulleys. All I need to do is replace a few feet of wire on either end of the balun.
What's wrong with throwing a Slinky into a tree top ? ;D
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What's wrong with throwing a Slinky into a tree top ? ;D
Actually, you can do that. It's a novelty but people use them in their attics.
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What's wrong with throwing a Slinky into a tree top ? ;D
Hell, all the ones I have seen lately are made of plastic, or at least plastic coated.
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We've been having - and are scheduled to get - thunderstorms through the weekend with lots of lightning. I ain't sticking a 17' vertical up in that! I have no lightning protection yet. The end-fed random in NVIS, maybe. I will definitely SWR tho.
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Actually, you can do that. It's a novelty but people use them in their attics.
It's what they used them for in Vn. ;D
Hell, all the ones I have seen lately are made of plastic, or at least plastic coated.
Well, yeah, there is that . :-[
We've been having - and are scheduled to get - thunderstorms through the weekend with lots of lightning. I ain't sticking a 17' vertical up in that! I have no lightning protection yet. The end-fed random in NVIS, maybe. I will definitely SWR tho.
Cleated shoes, (If they still use metal ) .
You'll be grounded, it'll be fine.
Ben Franklin did it, are you a wuss ? ;D
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Cleated shoes, (If they still use metal ) .
You'll be grounded, it'll be fine.
Ben Franklin did it, are you a wuss ? ;D
https://youtu.be/b07-yKnKRMQ?t=12
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;D
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I got a late start yesterday but I did get the 80M vertical loop up. 265' of wire in a rectangle.
So...I managed to contact the USS Nautilus, USS Alabama, USS Montrose Memorial and the USCG Ingham. Not good....
I heard the USS Missouri but some Canadians were polluting the band with spurious signals and I couldn't make the contact. Also heard the USS Midway but could not make that contact either.
Looks like the European Museum Ships primarily broadcast in the Extra approved spectrum of the band...motivation to study I suppose.
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Conditions are poor on 20M but improving. Logged a contact with the USS Massachusetts @ 12:32 UTC.
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USS Drum in the logbook.
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USS New Jersey and USS North Carolina both in the logbook.
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Saturday: Of course I didn't get on until mid-day. Of course I only have a 20m antenna. So not a lot of stations responding to me, MSWE or otherwise. This pm I've made one stateside contact and maybe one DX. Zero contest.
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Cleated shoes, (If they still use metal ) .
You'll be grounded, it'll be fine.
Ben Franklin did it, are you a wuss ? ;D
I am NOT a wuss! The sky looked ominous, but I put on my Dad's old golf shoes, with the steel cleats like you suggested, and started to set up the antenna when the lightning hit. But you knew that was going to happen, didn't you TOM?????
Anyhow, I managed to pick up the NSS Savannah in Baltimore fairly clearly, and 2-3 other ships barely, couldn't quite get the call letters except for one that wasn't on the list - K8A was all I heard. Did pick up a guy in Council Bluffs, IA, clear like he was standing outside my window; and another in central TX. No actual contacts, though, interference was pretty tough from mid-morning on, and I think I still need to test the transmission part of my station.
Not bad though for a 17' vertical on a 4' steel pipe (old satellite TV mount) in Savannah, GA surrounded by houses and trees. The NVIS random end-fed was near worthless, even with a counterpoise, which really surprised me. I figured I would at least get the ships in Charleston, SC with that one.
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That's why radio died out, it was to finicky.
Operation Market /Garden would have been a success with modern communications.
The radio's didn't work between ground units and were the wrong frequency to talk to aircraft overhead.
2 Panzer divisions sitting on the LZ was a real problem, but communications would have allowed coordinated reactions.
As it was, the commanders spent most of their time running around trying to connect instead of commanding.
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Antennas are a most important part of the system. Also managing the band conditions and knowing when to switch bands due to atmospheric conditions. I picked up one of the contacts in Galveston Bay on 6 meters.
I managed 20 MSW ships this time. Conditions weren't great and there was a lot of interference from NPOTA operators. Also maybe 1/2 of the operators were on location but weren't able to use the gear in the ships because of people being scared of the Wuhan/Chinamen flu still has a lot of people pissing down both legs...so they had to set up temporary systems which were a lot less robust than the normal equipment.
I started late Friday night and ended it early due to thunderstorms in the area.
So the best I had for an antenna was the 80 meter vertical loop. If performed well on all the bands except 6 meters....but that's because I have an antenna tuner separate of the radio and I run ladder line not coax. No way I could have run that with coax because of the high SWR's which drove up the voltage...coax may have failed and for certain would have lost 20-40% of the energy intended for the antenna. I wish I had the 5BTV vertical up but I didn't have time to get it up...and my 20 meter loop has evidently lost some insulation making it less than adequately functional.
I also contacted the Netherlands, a few guys in Toronto and some dude named Julian in the Congo...but for the most part I ignored anyone but MSW operators.
And....oh yeah, zeroed out a turtle in the pond with the 22.
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And....oh yeah, zeroed out a turtle in the pond with the 22.
Did you log that contact ? ;D
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Yep. With a sharp report I logged that action into the dog's. They then did what dogs do..
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Sniffed it, pissed on it and went back to sleep ? ;D
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Naw...it had blood on it. It got crunched and clawed.
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Just FYI to you ham guys I scored a used Force 12 Tri-Band C-3E antenna for $270 including shipping. It's in great shape and will be up for next year's MSWE.
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Just FYI to you ham guys I scored a used Force 12 Tri-Band C-3E antenna for $270 including shipping. It's in great shape and will be up for next year's MSWE.
Hell of a price. I hope you have help in putting it up. You have a good rotor?
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Just FYI to you ham guys I scored a used Force 12 Tri-Band C-3E antenna for $270 including shipping. It's in great shape and will be up for next year's MSWE.
Uh Rastus, you left a zero on the end of that price. WOW. A steal.
RECOMMENDADTIONS?
I've been hobbling along for 4 months now with a 20m Ham Stick mounted on my tower. Thinking, okay, I can be happy with a multi-band vertical. Much cheaper and much less hassle than a rotatable beam. I want 40m-6m with a good match, no tuner required, don't care about WARC bands. And I'm putting this 24' up on my mini-tower so radial not desired.
Been looking at the options. One, I think the Comet, uses a mystical, magical matching device that, while providing 50Ohm matching, the antenna itself isn't really "resonant" at the right frequencies. Nope. I want some semblance of resonance for each band. Been looking at the usual suspects like MFJ and High-Gain and Diamond.
Any words of wisdom?
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Hmmm. 6 meters is so far from the other bands in frequency it sort of just gums things up to include it on a multi-band antenna. Just throw up a do-it-ourself dipole for 6 meters...it's only 4-1/2 feet of wire on either side of balun. I'd go to The Wireman https://thewireman.com/ (https://thewireman.com/) and buy the components.
The best antenna I've had is a vertical loop fed on the side with 450 ohm ladder (window) line. Get that from The Wireman too. It's about 73-75' of wire in a circle. I use insulated ~12-14 gauge wire and string it in trees. The loop doesn't have the noise and it does have gain...in this configuration it's fairly omnidirectional. And...here's the big deal....the bottom of it only needs to be a few feet from the ground...mine was about 4' off the ground. If you feed it from the side you get vertical polarity and a low radiation angle.
Here's the kicker on that loop....get an antenna tuner. I have an AT4K that I can bring in a string of ladder line. Doing that I have tuned that 20 meter loop for 75 meters, 40 meters, 20 of course, 17, 15 and 10 meters. You have to play with the tuner a bit but it worked for me. There's less of a null on the sides of the loop than a dipole.
There's essentially no loss with ladder line. You have to keep it away from metal and the ground but it works. And the key of it is that at high SWR's there can be a ton of loss in your transmission through coax (when you tune a non-resonant antenna) but not so with ladder line. Resonant is great...but being non-resonant does not mean that nearly as much energy isn't transmitted into signal just because it is non-resonant. High SWR's and non-resonance is OK...better than coax and coils that suck the power away.
I have some links/files back home I can send you when I get back there next week and some great links. The Villages retirement community has some great information....maybe I sent Pathfinder the links. But they have a great rollup page on antenna pro's and con's. There is also a powerpoint on trimming an antenna and ladder line to specific lengths that give multipband capabilities...I made a couple they worked great...I gotta find it thoug.
For now peruse this one on loops: http://www.ve2azx.net/technical/AntenneLoop21MHz-3EN.pdf (http://www.ve2azx.net/technical/AntenneLoop21MHz-3EN.pdf)
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I'm not big on any antenna that requires an external, in shack tuner. Never had success with them. Plus you're tuning the feed line to be part of the antenna. And you got to fiddle with them when changing bands.
I did have a multi-band wire dipole for years but the trees had to come down.
Now my ideal would be the SteppIR yagi but >$4k is way out of my budget. Even their 40m-6m vertical is $2k.
I'm debating between the MFJ 1797 or 1796 verticals right now. Simple. No radials. Tuned elements. And best of all <$500.
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Well then I'd go with the Hustler 5BTV (even though mine is still unassembled). They are around $225. It's ranked a little higher than the MFJ's and will save you $100 or so. For either the Hustler or the MFJ you will need to put out at least 16 radials in the yard to get the performance up to snuff (the reason why the 5BTV isn't up over here). Purist run 32 or so radials per band...which I think is overkill. Just an adder...you don't need the radials on a loop. The good thing would definitely be that you can switch bands on either vertical and not have to fool with tuning...which is a plus.
Again, I don't mix 6 with HF....but I am sure it will work if you get the 1796. My preference would be for a dedicated j-pole or vertical for 2 meters and spending $25 on wire and a balun (or a dedicated vertical for ~$75) for 6 meters. That's because I have the 2 meter/70 centimeter input/output on my transceiver and 6 meters is through the HF input/output. If you have some restrictions or you don't mind switching over (or your transceiver ports 6 meter to the same input/output as 2 meter/70 centimeter which is assuming your unit is an HF/VHF/UHF model) then you can save a few bucks with the 5BTV and get a dedicated dual (or triband to include 70 centimeters) antenna for 6 and 2 meters. Of course if you have an antenna like the 1796 you'll likely need to split or switch the coax to use the 2 meter function because you'll need to separate it for your input/output ports.
I think breaking up HF from VHF/UHF will give you better performance than an antenna that tries HF along with UHF. There is some extra cost with extra coax to split up the bands but that is what I do. The 5BTV is higher rated and cheaper....I didn't look at the 1796 performance on 2 meters but I bet a dedicated 2 meter or dual or tri band VHF/UHF will perform better and you may get it all at nearly the same cost. And here's a plus...the 5BTV does 80 meters.
Hustler 5 BTV review: https://www.eham.net/reviews/view-product?id=1902 (https://www.eham.net/reviews/view-product?id=1902)
Single review for the 1797: https://www.eham.net/reviews/view-product?id=13105 (https://www.eham.net/reviews/view-product?id=13105)
1796 review: https://www.eham.net/reviews/view-product?id=1374 (https://www.eham.net/reviews/view-product?id=1374)
Some of the reviews make mention of the MFJ brand being less robust than the Hustler but that's all I had to go by...the reviews. And again...I didn't check the gain figures between Hustler and MFJ but they both have enough reviews to point me solidly towards the Hustler.
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I've always thought the MFJ stuff was a little less than robust.
Radials are probably not going to happen. I'm mounting this 25' up on top of my tower. Nobody has good indication as to what's going to happen if I don't use radials in that situation. The 5-BTV says you definitely need radials above ground height mounting. I could, I guess just hang some down the side of the tower as an experiment.
I've got a 6m antenna but I hate changing coax. Might have to bite the bullet and get a switch.
This will probably be an August project. See what I read and figure out between now and then.
BTB, with my 20m ham stick at 25', I've gotten 36 states confirmed in LoTW since May. Believe it or not I still need NY. Of course WA, OR, AK, HI & ME are on my watch list.
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That's great on the contacts.
You can slope the radials down. The only thing I vaguely remember about doing that is to insulate them from the ground and they also double as guy wires. You can find information on a search about that....I'm thinking 4 radials per band will really bump up the gain.
However, that is not what I plan to do because, for now, the 5BTV will be a secondary HF antenna to the other antennas. I'll run 3-6 radials with insulators for length control as guy wires.
Edit--I Found It
This link helps a lot: http://www.k4vrc.com/uploads/1/0/1/5/10156032/2015_tvarc_antenna_guide.pdf (http://www.k4vrc.com/uploads/1/0/1/5/10156032/2015_tvarc_antenna_guide.pdf)
Note how it grades various antenna types. Very helpful.
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The Villages seems to have a "stealth" agenda, there. I didn't see any grades for a 34' tall, guided, trap vertical in there. And I'm guessing nobody has a 7 element full size yagi inside "the compound" either.
BUT, you may have convinced me to to Hustler, 4-BTV as opposed to MFJ.
So sitting here thinking, why can't I build my own SteppIR? Use a 50' measuring tape at the base. Put a pulley at the top of the vertical tube, then the motor pulls the tape up the tube. That way the motor assembly isn't "hot". I can control a stepper motor with an Arduino app. Maybe not automatic tuning, but let's say I have 5 memory positions. I adjust manual, one step-motor position at a time until I find resonance for each band then save that to memory. If I want to work something else then manual adjustments would be used. Maybe not as neat as a Steppir but a whole lot cheaper.
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I would not hesitate to go with a Hustler over the MFJ. Manufacturer's claims being what they are. If you don't need 75/80 then the 4BTV is the way to go.
The Villages did show a 26' trapped vertical and the performance will be either slightly less or slightly more than a 34' depending on design, radials and placement. Overall though, the difference between the heights will still grade out middle of the road compared to some other antennas. I have a friend who swears by his vertical and plethora of radials and the reason for that is DX. There is a low angle of radiation compared with other antennas he used to have.
One thing you may one day want to make and I've threatened to do it forever is a Moxon. They have a natural ~50 ohm connections and can be made of wire and fishing poles. If you search around you can find 3 to 5 element versions. The Moxon Rectangle has a low angle of radiation that's good for DX and has good rejection as well. When time allows some year I'd like to build a 4 element pointed towards my brother-in-law in North Carolina. So long as you are 20 meters and higher in frequency the Moxons are pretty small.
With your Arduino experience I don't know why you couldn't do that SteppIR design....and with better quality parts.
The full size 80 meter vertical rectangular loop I put up is pointed towards a buddy in Wyoming. It's ~12' off the ground and has a tilt of 10-15 degrees from bottom to top and in this configuration has gain and nulls. The gain is pointed towards Cody, Wyoming and it works well. To know/do that sort of thing you need to have some antenna modeling software. This is a good one: https://antennasimulator.com/ (https://antennasimulator.com/) . With your interest in programming and Arduino I think you'll have a natural draw towards modeling antennas.
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Homebrew: https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/multiband-1-4-wave-vertical-antenna.771482/ (https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/multiband-1-4-wave-vertical-antenna.771482/)
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BTB, I skimmed through The Villages' Covenents, Restrictions and Rules. OMG. It would become a hobby, a passion, my life's opus magnum to find ways to defy their petty laws if I lived there.
If anybody lives nearby, though, I think a lucrative business could be had making "distinctive" flowerpots. Patriotic, military and first responder themed might be popular. Then tacky and vulgar designs would be next.
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Seems like the Hustler antennas are available from several sources. I've pretty much decided to order from DX Engineering. They have the most extensive installation manual and accessories.
I'm getting the balum, the mounting plate, their Jet-Lube and the heavy duty lower sleeve. Brings the total up to $450.
I've also decided, since I'm not going with a horizontal beam, to lower my tower 10'. Right now it's at 26'. All I have on it is two VHF/UHF verticals, on side bars and a TV antenna, which I don't need anymore. That way the 4BTV won't be sticking up excessively high. I'll have to evaluate my home made dual side arm. It's a little "bendy", but I'm not paying $210ea for Rohn mounts. I think if I replace the angle iron with pipes I can get a better mount for my VHF/UHF verticals. Just need to find 4 stainless steel Cheesbourghs to clamp the vertical supports pipes on.
[Added] We call them Cheeseboroughs in theatre, but DX Engineering calls the Genius Clamps. Allows you to clamp to pipes are right angles.