The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: texcaliber on June 11, 2007, 08:45:37 PM
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I wanted to get some opinions of home defence guns and let me know if there is an ammo must. For example: shotgun with buckshot/AR with frangible ect. ect.
Thanks for your time in advanced yall. ;D
tex
P.S. if this is popular then maybe i will start an Ammo poll next yall ???
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mine by the way is a G35 with a Insite technology M3 tactical light. Loaded with hi-cap 15rds. mags with Corbon 40S&W DPX HP. And by the way i stoke the gun with 15rds.(14+1) not (15+1)
tex
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mine by the way is a G35 with a Insite technology M3 tactical light. Loaded with hi-cap 15rds. mags with Corbon 40S&W DPX HP. And by the way i stoke the gun with 15rds.(14+1) not (15+1)
tex
Right now Im keeping a Glock 17 with the plain jane glocklight on it. I'm sort of wanting to trade up to the G34.
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Lawrence Keeney
Right now Im keeping a Glock 17 with the plain jane glocklight on it. I'm sort of wanting to trade up to the G34.
Good choice Lawrence Keeney, my buddy has a G34 with the G18 mag setup filled to the brim with Glazer Safty Slugs. But his threat level is higher then mine.
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I keep a winchester 1300 handy, along with my side arms
I load my 1300 with #4 shot...FYI I read an article that said the best home defense weapon is a 20 ga. loaded with #8. Several reasons were stated, the main reason was the round would not overpenetrate and was good for apartment dwellers and would not go through walls to a great extent and hit family members. Not sure I agree, you can buy frangible rounds for rifles like the .223 and 762x39. I would choose a frangible in a pistol or rifle if I DIDNT HAVE A SHOTGUN.
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Hey Tex, I wish we could check more than one. The weapon system in the bedroom ( mind you, We do not have children)
#1) 870 Remington with 18" rifle sight barrel, tritium sights, car 15 stock, sure fire forend, 8 round mag, with 6 shot side saddle. Stoked with 7 1/2 shot for the first 4, then #4 buck. Side saddle is also #4 buck.
2) Model 22 glock, with hydra shocks. Soon to change to g17, I'm getting out of the .40 business, except for My Kahr, it just shoots and points too well. Thats my tool box gun at work.
3) Model 649 S&W bodyguard, with pmc hollow points. xtra speed loader on the night stand.
4) Lastly in my front pants pocket, a S&W model 940 with CT grips, 147grn Black Talons, with 2 extra full moon clips in my left pocket.
Go ahead call me paranoid.
Also in the closet is a 50 round bandolier of 12 guage, mixed, 00 buck and slugs. I have 3 streamlight stingers in chargers fixed to the side of the headboard. Surefire g2 with the 115 lumen bulb installed in my pants next to the bed. Also have the same upgrade I have not added to the surefire forend.
I know, my friends say, man " we've got to talk".
But the first rule in our house when things go bump in the night, where is the spousal unit?, nothing get's drawn until we establish that. Well of course the flashlights. After that, we have enough to arm both of us. Cordless and cell phones as well. We still sleep on water beds which does offer protection and something to hide behind.
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115 lumen bulb installed in my pants next to the bed. Also have the same upgrade I have not added to the surefire forend.
very VERY cool setup that i didnt know about m25operator, thanks for the post.
And by-the-byI know, my friends say, man " we've got to talk".
yup they need to talk to ya about how "Bad Arse" you setup is!!! :o
tex
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Springfield XD and a Ruger P90 in a gun vault on the nightstand. Stoeger coachgun (12ga) in the corner next to the bed. SKS under the bed. Winchester pump (12ga) and a Rossi .357 lever in the closet. His and hers Mag-lites on the headboard.
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I would want to check multiple also. I have a Remington 870 Express Magnum 12ga. with 7 shot tube, 18" barrel, and Truglo sight under the bed loaded with Winchester reduced recoil 00buck. Next to the bed, I have a lockbox with an XD 45 compact and XD 9 (for my wife). I also have 2 Streamlight TL-2 flashlights on the table. Of course the most important is the cell phone on my dresser for calling the guys that get paid for handling these situations. ;).
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Right now I use a Kahr MK4043 DAO (stainless) in .40cal S&W using Federal Premium 135gr Personal Defense. When my new Colt Defender SAO .45ACP comes back from having a trigger pull modification done by Colt, I'll use that. My buget won't allow it now but when it does I'll get a short barreled shotgun. A legal 16" will do fine. Thinking about what I've read on the web and my early small game hunting experience I'll load, first in order, #5 shot (won't go thru bad guy and wall too) then a 00 Buck and if he/she/s so drugged up they aren't down yet, a rifled slug.
SouthCentral
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I'll get a short barreled shotgun. A legal 16" will do fine.
Thanks for your post SouthCentral, just one thing man 16" for rifle 18" for shotguns. I just spent the day with my gunsmith checking the pattern on my Reminton 870max and I came back very supprised. :o I thought 00buck would be tighter than it was at 40yds. i couldnt hit a ISPC target with more than 2 pellets with most shots only producing 1 hit on target >:(. Quickly moving into home defence ranges the results were still not real pleasing, 30 feet getting almost a full spread(shoulder2shoulder) cutting down to 10-15feet much better but head shots printed low. needless to say it would be really REALLY!!!! messy man ;). IF you have seen the updated version of "Dawn of the dead" when Ving Rhames takes off the top of the gunshop guy's(named Andy in flick) head. Well just picture that shot 6-8" lower. EWWWW man ew! Drughead cleanup in aisles 1-5 please. ::) Just saying thought the long distance preformance of shot would be ALOT better. ???
tex
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Thanks for your post SouthCentral, just one thing man 16" for rifle 18" for shotguns. I just spent the day with my gunsmith checking the pattern on my Reminton 870max and I came back very supprised. :o I thought 00buck would be tighter than it was at 40yds. i couldnt hit a ISPC target with more than 2 pellets with most shots only producing 1 hit on target >:(. Quickly moving into home defence ranges the results were still not real pleasing, 30 feet getting almost a full spread(shoulder2shoulder) cutting down to 10-15feet much better but head shots printed low. needless to say it would be really REALLY!!!! messy man ;). IF you have seen the updated version of "Dawn of the dead" when Ving Rhames takes off the top of the gunshop guy's(named Andy in flick) head. Well just picture that shot 6-8" lower. EWWWW man ew! Drughead cleanup in aisles 1-5 please. ::) Just saying thought the long distance preformance of shot would be ALOT better. ???
tex
Go with a shorter barrel. Taurus makes a .410/45lc revolver with a choice of two different barrel lengths. That'll get you the spread you need indoors.
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Here's one of my post-hurricane home defense systems...
(http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s118/auxair0483/UMP.jpg)
Suppressor used as well to aid in hearing conservation... ;D
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This is for Texcaliber, My shotgun instructor, demonstrated several buckshot loads for us, using our shotguns not his. His demonstration was an eye opener. His personal favorite was winchester 00 buck 9 pellet shells, in 2 3/4", and he demonstrated that it was very reliable and repeatable up to 18 yards, in an 18" cylinder bore barrel. Beyond that distance, flyers were to be expected. He explained that if your department issued other brands and that is all you have to work with, no problem unless no shoots were involved, so he taught us to hold off, away from the no shoot, and engage the shoot target ( bad guy ) and expect less pellets to do the job. A Vang barrel might help, but buckshot is not intended to perform well past 20 yards, precision wise. A good patterning shotgun for hunting with birdshot, would put all pellets in a 30" circle at 37 yards with no holes a bird could fly through. I am however very disappointed in your closer test results, I would expect much better, what combination are you using, choke, barrel length, and cartridge combination? I will tell you from experience, #4 buck sucks past 12 yards, not a problem in normal home distances, but not good past that unless you do some homework and try several kinds and different chokes in your gun. What is good, for defence? An 8" pattern at the maximum distance it will deliver it. Let your pattern be your guide.
GOOD LUCK
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I have used most everything over the years, but mostly use either my P89 9mm or P90 .45. When my wife is home at night by herself I load up the 12 ga Mossburg 500 pump, in addition to leaving her one of the pistolas!
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Re shot size for home defense shot gun.
OO Buck is good no doubt. But, a few, well quite a few years ago, when I returned from a tour in RVN I did some research for an Army Advanced Course Staff Study on shotguns in combat. Interesting thing I stumbled on was that the Brits found that #2 Buck was quite effective as well. Seems #2 would penetrate the leaves and the backpacks of the day and still do damage to the enemy. As I recall we -- the US Army and RVN -- were using Remington plastic case short magnums with 9 or 12 double ought buck. Either way a shot gun slings alot of lead into a small area at house gun ranges. You could probably use target 8s and get the job done. As for me I still have a supply of lead #2s that I can't use for geese any more. If I were to use a shotgun for defense I would use the lead #2s.
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#1 Buck. 16 pellets. Patterns just fine out to 30 feet (the longest shot inside my house) from my Remington 870 Express 20in.
8)
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This is for Texcaliber, My shotgun instructor, demonstrated several buckshot loads for us, using our shotguns not his. His demonstration was an eye opener. His personal favorite was winchester 00 buck 9 pellet shells, in 2 3/4", and he demonstrated that it was very reliable and repeatable up to 18 yards, in an 18" cylinder bore barrel. Beyond that distance, flyers were to be expected. He explained that if your department issued other brands and that is all you have to work with, no problem unless no shoots were involved, so he taught us to hold off, away from the no shoot, and engage the shoot target ( bad guy ) and expect less pellets to do the job. A Vang barrel might help, but buckshot is not intended to perform well past 20 yards, precision wise. A good patterning shotgun for hunting with birdshot, would put all pellets in a 30" circle at 37 yards with no holes a bird could fly through. I am however very disappointed in your closer test results, I would expect much better, what combination are you using, choke, barrel length, and cartridge combination? I will tell you from experience, #4 buck sucks past 12 yards, not a problem in normal home distances, but not good past that unless you do some homework and try several kinds and different chokes in your gun. What is good, for defence? An 8" pattern at the maximum distance it will deliver it. Let your pattern be your guide.
GOOD LUCK
thanks m25operator, the combo I used was Rem.870MAX with IC fixed or nonchoke threaded barrel, and we were shooting Rem., old box of Charles Daily and Win.(all were 00Buck 9pellet). Remington was reduced recoil and patterned the best but low(frontal lobe aim took out lower jaw) I dont know if it was too much to expect a good pattern with out a full choke but i had wanted a little better. Oh well.
tex