The Down Range Forum
Flying Dragon Productions ( Michael Bane ) => The Best Defense on My Outdoor TV => Topic started by: ericire12 on January 07, 2009, 01:20:03 PM
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I don't know why I didn't think of this before... if you guys have any real world questions about how to go about securing a door, feel free to ask me. This is something I do for a living.
Start a thread for that.... I'd love to read your thoughts on the subject
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Start a thread for that.... I'd love to read your thoughts on the subject
In general, unless you beef up the structure, your wasting your time. I've done all the stuff like renforced strike plate and longer hardware. Do they help? yes, but very little. What happens is when they kick the door in they take part of the wall with the jamb and door. One thing that works very well is a "new york bar" You just have to have a good solid anchor point on the floor for it. If you really want to make a door that they will not be able to kick, bend over, its going to cost you thousands.( last one I did was $7800) As much as I would love to take your money, I will advise you that its just not worth it. There are plenty of windows they can get in. If you think the door was expensive, you don't even want to know how much it will cost to replace all your windows.( starting price for just the window is about a grand. fire codes are a bitch. )
With a decent lock set( they start at about 150 and I'm not talking about the fancy stuff that the hd/ lowes sell) and a new york bar, it will be very hard for even the professionals( LEO, firemen, guy with BFH/ ram) to "kick in the door"
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Thing is, with so many Mobile homes nowadays you reinforce your doors put grills over your windows, at each step spending the kind of money TAB is talking, no short cuts. You have zero security. The metal or vinyl siding can be cut with any decent knife The aluminum siding is .032 inches thick, then insulation and paneling, I have cut all of these with a swiss army knife.
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There is nothing you can do to a building that a circular saw and the right blade can't whip.
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All the stats say that the vast majority of entries are through the door
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There is nothing you can do to a building that a circular saw and the right blade can't whip.
Even Masonry can be gotten through.
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Even Masonry can be gotten through.
Its why god made 14" cut off saws with diamond blades ;D
I've used mine with a metal cutting blade to open safes, it takes longer to get every thing set up then it does to open them up.
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"There is no problem so large,
that it can't be fixed with the proper application of High Explosives."
;D
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Start a thread for that.... I'd love to read your thoughts on the subject
Hey, I stated a thread without even starting the thread ;)
...... BTW this is a nice read by Janich on reinforcing an entry way:
http://www.downrange.tv/bestdefense/article1-ep2.htm
Many home invasions begin with the criminal simply kicking in your front door. This can happen so quickly and so suddenly that you have very little time to react and nobody outside your home really notices. The best way to prevent this type of entry—and a great way of establishing your home as a hard target—is to harden your front door. First, choose a sturdy, solid wood door or a steel-sheathed door. It should be hung with heavy-duty hinges installed with extra-long screws (like three inch deck screws), not the short ones that typically come in the package. To further strengthen the hinge side of the door, at least one screw in each hinge should be replaced with a steel nail or pin that extends about 3/8-1/2-inch above the surface of jamb side of the hinge and “nests” into the matching hole in the door side of the hinge. This reinforces the hinge joint in the closed position and prevents the door from being removed—even if the hinge pins are taken out. If you don’t want to “roll your own,” purpose designed “hinge studs” of this type can sometimes be found at locksmith shops.
Don’t settle for an ordinary door knob lock for your front door. These are weak and can be easily defeated. The security of your front door should only be trusted to a high-quality, name-brand deadbolt lock. The interior side of the lock should be a knob style; it should not be double keyed. Removal of the internal key could prevent you from being able to leave your home in an emergency, so stick with a knob. If you do not have a steel-sheathed door, the area of the door around the lock should also be reinforced with a metal door reinforcement.
In order for a dead bolt lock to do its job, it must anchor solidly to the door frame. The typical strike plate included with most locks is not up to this task. Instead, you need to invest in an extended, high-security strike plate. These strike plates are typically about 8-10 inches long, include multiple holes for mounting the plate, and include extra-long screws that anchor the plate solidly into the structure behind the door frame, not just the wood of the frame itself.
With a solid door properly installed as your front door barrier, your next step should be to ensure that there are no weak spots around the door that would compromise its function. The most common example of this is a window located immediately adjacent to the door. Although this window does offer the positive function of allowing a view of anyone standing outside your door, by simply breaking the window, a burglar or home invader could easily reach through and unlock the door.
The presence of a window adjacent to your door frame also means that you do not have a solid structure around the entire frame. This weakens the overall structure of the door and compromises its function as a barrier. Ideally, it should be eliminated by having a competent contractor “fill in” that area with a solid wood structure. If this is not possible, you should at least prevent someone from being able to access the lock if he breaks the window by covering the interior of the window frame with a sheet of strong Plexiglas® or Lexan® plastic, screwed firmly into the wood.
If filling in the window near your front door limits your ability to see someone standing outside the door, make sure you install a peephole in the door or a convex mirror that allows you to see that blind spot from another window.
Obviously, if you have any other ground-level or easily accessible exterior doors in your home, you need to take these same steps to strengthen them. Criminals will seek the path of least resistance, so don’t leave any weak spots in your defense.
Sliding patio doors should also be strengthened to keep them from being a weak link in your home defense. The traditional broomstick-in-the-track method of blocking these doors is a good start, but many criminals are wise to this and have figured out how to “rock” the sliding door to overcome this barrier or create an opportunity to pop it out of place with a piece of wire. A better solution is a purpose-designed security bar that can be wedged between the door and the frame above floor level. This creates a much stronger barrier and cannot be dislodged or overcome as easily as a dowel rod or broomstick. If you want to use the sliding door for fresh air, but don’t want to leave yourself vulnerable, these security bars are adjustable to you can open the door far enough to allow air—but not a person—to come in.
Ground-level windows or easily accessible second-story windows (like those with a balcony or adjacent roof area) should also be evaluated as potential weak points. Although strengthening glass is always going to be a challenge, it can be done. The best way is the addition of 3M Scotchshield®–a reinforcing film that transforms ordinary glass into a form of safety glass. The underlying glass will still shatter, but it the window remains as a barrier in the window frame. A cheaper alternative is to replace the ordinary glass with shatter resistant Plexiglas®.
Finally, you can consider adding a true barrier, like steel bars or an ornamental grate; however, you must make sure that you do not compromise your own safety in case of a fire. Make sure that any window you might need as a fire exit remains functional if you need it.
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I just made the 3'' deck screw upgrade to my doors and dead bolt plates. Its laughable how small those original screws were.
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Great discussion, guys. Thank you for participating.
I agree that making a door break-in-PROOF is a tall task. If someone wants in badly enough, they'll get in. However, you need to remember that reinforcing the door has two other important functions that pay big dividends:
1) It makes your house much less attractive as a target.
2) It buys you the time to get to the safe room or to exit through another door. If your upgrade means the difference between one kick and four or five, you still win.
One other thing I forgot to mention, when I was a kid, I lived half a block outside the Chicago city limits. Although we were technically in the suburbs, the neighborhood still sucked and we had a lot of spillover crime from the South Side. Since all the houses had detached garages well away from the main structure, some enterprising criminals decided to start burglarizing garages to steal tools and, in some cases, cars. Their method of entry was simple and quick--chop through the side door of the garage with an axe.
After a few of these crimes in our neighborhood, my Dad and I spent a morning re-working our garage door. We pulled the door (traditional solid wood frame, but with insert panels) and glued a piece of 1/4-inch Masonite (hardboard) over the entire face of it. This was further secured with carriage bolts (so no screw heads were exposed on the face). We re-hung it to accomodate the greater thickness, replacing the hinges with more and better quality ones. We reinforced the door frame structure (anchoring it to the brick construction of the garage), upgraded the lock and strike plate, and put angle iron bars over the windows (also shot into the brick). All that, plus pinning the track for the overhead door, paid off. Both our neighbors had their garages broken into within a few weeks of our efforts. The bad guys skipped us.
BTW, the beauty of the Masonite "skin" is that it is inexpensive and it has the wonderful quality of making things like axes bounce aggressively back at the wielder. I'm not sure where my Dad picked up that trick, but it's a good one.
Stay safe,
Mike
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Take a good look at your sliding glass doors. The purpose -made bars are good, as are the add on pins you attach to the door frame and push into holes you drill in the track tops and bottoms. But guess what? Most sliding glass doors are vulnerable to a relatively quiet entry through the non-sliding side. That side of the door can usually be removed from the outside by simply removing some screws. Most people just assume that side is secure unless smashed.
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using deck screws is not a good idea, they are very weak when it comes to shearing forces. Granted just about anything is better then the 1" or so screws provided with most lock sets.
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using deck screws is not a good idea, they are very weak when it comes to shearing forces. Granted just about anything is better then the 1" or so screws provided with most lock sets.
What do you suggest?
Take a good look at your sliding glass doors. The purpose -made bars are good, as are the add on pins you attach to the door frame and push into holes you drill in the track tops and bottoms. But guess what? Most sliding glass doors are vulnerable to a relatively quiet entry through the non-sliding side. That side of the door can usually be removed from the outside by simply removing some screws. Most people just assume that side is secure unless smashed.
I just noticed that on my sliding door. Any suggestions?
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one other thing to keep in mind:
As the quality of construction drops to keep prices low, sometimes it's easier to go through a wall than a door.
Some new homes in low-cost developments use a vinyl siding, gypsum sheathing, insulation, and drywall for exterior wall assembly. A good knife or a hammer would get you through the wall, possibly without setting off an alarm (if the home even has one). It's not exactly stealth entry, but someone could get in that way.
Skipping plywood sheathing and/or brick facades can make a big difference in the overall security of a home.
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What do you suggest?
Screws that are designed to take a shearing force rather then just hold. They will have the same head size and shape, but the shaft will be alot thicker. The bad part about screws is they have very hard, so much so that they break very easily.
I just noticed that on my sliding door. Any suggestions?
go buy 2 steel hinge pins. Drill holes thru your door and half way thru the fixed door. install the pins. The doors have to be lifted to be moved
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Does anybody have some tips for french doors?
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French doors, I think you see your own problem, pretty, but weak, it won't stop 200 lbs of anyone halfway determined. I am assuming your doors have like 9 windows each in them, if they don't have glass, then Michael Janich idea about a sheath on the inside or better on the outside could help, plus putting some substantial reinforcement on one door that you don't expect to open very often, making it for all intents, not usable without some effort.
Now I'm going to describe what was taught to me in a security class, which first taught us how to break in to structures, It is called a Government door, and I do not know if it is true, but parts of it make a lot of sense, and no, I have not built one.
1) solid wood core door or steel door.
2) longest dead bolt available.
3) metal plate around the dead bolt on the outside and inside to prevent pliers and hammers from busting or twisting it out.
4) drill through the door jam an 1 1/4" hole, to the next stud adjacent to the door lock receptacle, install an iron pipe, with a 1" ID. This is what the dead bolt will engage. If your handy, reinforce the door jam, with an additional 2x4 for added support on the lock side and the hinge side.
5) You'll need a long spade bit to do this, drill long holes, at least a foot, perpendicular to the door about 2" above and below the dead bolt, 1/2" holes, and the install 3/8 rebar cut to length in those holes. This will be a loose fit and will clang a bit when shutting the door. The advantage here, is if someone uses a saw, it will hit the rebar, and the rebar will spin, and not give the saw any purchase.
6) remove the center screws from all 3 of the hinges, both sides, drill out the holes in the hinges to 1/4" and then install 1/4" lag bolts on the door side, extending 2" out from the door, and then cut the head of the bolt off, and when you shut the door, you don't have skinny little screws holding the hinges, you have 1/4" steel studs in 3 places.
According to my teacher, this door will defeat the 6 minute rule, the maximum amount of time, someone will give to breaking into a structure in plain sight.
Don't forget garage doors, once inside the attached garage, the bad guy is hidden and can take all the time He wants. Maybe even use your tools to do it.
I also learned lock manipulation at this class, that is usually my 1st choice, tools fit in a small pouch, and usually successful in under a minute, my day job makes this a good skill, I highly recommend learning it.
That's it and would like your feedback. Especially TAB, as he is in the business.
A good DEA friend of mine, said when he worked New York that people would install 2 New York locks, 1 high and 1 low, at that point it was easier to go through the wall. The New York lock is badass, as long as your inside, does not help when your gone.
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If they are made in the last 15 years or so they will be tempered glass(federal law) Which is good as they are very strong against things like base balls, but also bad as a spring loaded center punch will make them explode. It has to do to the way the glass is prestressed.( the outer skin is holding presure in, a knick in that and all the stored engery is released.) Generally all double doors have a "live" door and a fixed door. for the most part what you want to do is add stronger hard ware at the top and bottum of the fixed door that gos into a solid structural member. Simlar to what you have now, only stronger.
1st link on youtube on tempered glass
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gDqiFRDPB4