The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Defense and Tactics => Topic started by: cooptire on January 12, 2009, 02:15:02 PM
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Question for whoever. As I was working through the house getting sight pictures, as some have suggested, with my .40 and my light, I got to thinking about how to best secure my house, or more importantly, my kids. Since 2 of mine are on the main floor and 2 are in the basement with the stairs in the middle of the house. I was thinking about a so called hot burglary or home invasion scenario and basically came up with........nothing! How would someone reason out a plausible way of securing a non-shooting wife and 4 kids under 11 on 2 different floors? All I came up with was secure the girls with the wife upstairs and try to clear my way to the boys and leaving the girls alone. A real "Kobayashi Maru" scenario. The more I think about it, the more my head hurts.
Does anyone have any suggestions as to where to start planning? Or how?
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With out alot more detail, there is no way we can help... you know ages of kids, floor plan... etc etc.
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This is an incredibly tough situation.
Considering where your loved ones are in the house and where the bad guy might be, the best thing may just be to leave your family where they are and engage the threat.
If 2 kids are in the basement, they are essentially pretty safe for the time being.... If the wife and other kids are in a backroom far enough away, then they too may be fairly safe from an immediate threat (and may actually be able to escape the home). There are a lot of variables in play, but it may be that you have to take the fight to the bad guy if everyone in your family is to make it through alive.
*Any windows in the basement that the kids could slip out if there was trouble?
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With out alot more detail, there is no way we can help... you know ages of kids, floor plan... etc etc.
11, 8 (today ;D), 5 & 3 (in 12 days ;D ;D) are the ages. Standard rectangular footprint with all bedrooms on one end. Upstairs doors face each other at end of hallway. My bedroom is located upstairs. Stairs in living room (by the front door) going down towards opposite end of house. Then all the way back towards the boy's bedroom that are directly underneath upstairs bedroom.
I was generally looking for procedures or ideas to test rather than exact step by step instructions because I realize the incredibale amount of variables and lack of knowledge about the actual layout of the house to everyone. Just thinking that there might be one or two solid things to do or prepare for. I realize that you can't give more than general suggestions. I plan on hardening the house first of all to prevent, hopefully, any break in. My mind starts to hurt a lot when I think about trying to secure 2 floors by myself or moving everyone from one floor to another.
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So my first question is how many home invasions are there in Emporia Kansas? I am guessing that it isn't the crime mecca that some place like Camden NJ is. How often are those burglaries that do occur, occur with intent to do harm? I don't know, so before I start poking fun, I thought it good to ask.
Are there only 2 floors? A main floor and a basement? Three floors: Main, Upstairs and Basement? Does the basement have an external door (growing up we had a basement with a sliding glass door)? Do the kids know the neighbors well? Are you comfortable with them?
Typically the best thing to do is baracade yourself in one room. Contrary to popular belief, this doesn't mean (necessarily) sliding your wife's armoir in front of the door. What would be better is if you could get to a place that had a choke point (say the bottom of the basement stairs if they are close enough to the family). That is thing one, thing two is that while the wife doesn't shoot, she can still be eyes on your six with say a cell phone in hand placing a call to 911. You're going to want to do that anyway, and let whom ever is in the house understand that you have done so. This may not scare them (which means they are really bad men) but it will record the entire interaction if shots need to be fired. You may even want to say something like "whoever is in the house, I have called 911 and have armed myself (assuming that you have) and I will respond to any movement in my direction as a threat to my life and will respond accordingly, the police are on their way, I suggest you leave!" Generally it is best to be baracaded by this point, and not a good idea to go roaming through the house looking for a fight. If that is what you need to do to get to your kids however, I would recommend it. Get the entire family in one spot, if you can't get whoever isn't with you to a safe place, if you can't probably getting one parent with each set of kids is the next (read last) best solution. If that is the case, tell your wife that she should learn how to shoot at least once, teach her something simple like "extend, touch and press" and let her take care of the girls.
There really isn't a clear cut answer as all situations depend on lots of factors. Some factors that don't change are your preparation. You should always have the cell phone charging on your night stand, a flash light next to it and your gun someplace where you can get to it quickly but is also out of childrens reach. Next make sure you have a plan and rehearse it so the family knows it.
Hope that helps
JB
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With 4 youngins I would be REAL careful in any scenario. The likely hood of a breakin thru the basement is going to be high. So you might have an attack right off the bat on the kids furthest away from you and before your awareness is up. Then the kids might start moving thru the house also. So it might be the kids making their way to your room. Slow and deliberate would be the key words....
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Sadly JC4, home invasions are becoming more and more commonplace, kinda like carjackings were the rage for ease of theft, but I'm getting the impression the home invaders are doing it more because they are emboldened sociopaths and are getting off on the power trip. Much more volatile and dangerous situation. Used to be nada like that where I live, now I'm hearing about forced entries posing as cops, one where the newspaper reported the 'woman was brought to a bedroom by two of the intruders while the male was held at gunpoint in the front room' (too polite or politically incorrect to say "gang raped"?), one in the wrong house (drugs), one for money by a former employee, one for the keys to a jewelry shop, about 3 seemingly random...
That was in the last year and a half, and just the ones I heard about. Our newspaper is a bit lax on reporting these, especially since they consider a home invasion just a burglary. Usually find these when I check the crime map section after something is reported in my immediate area.
Coop, I feel your pain. The house we rented while ours was being built was two floors, master bedroom upstairs, kids rooms downstairs. At that time, we were more concerned with a rash of child molesters who moved from other states to avoid tracking. I actually hinge pinned the downstairs windows so at least I'd hear glass breaking as opposed to someone just popping the lock and raising the sash. You can drill multiple holes in the upper sash so you can open the windows and still secure it.
In your case, I'd look into making your house as uninviting for a home invasion / burglary as you can. Motion lights outside, thorny bushes under windows, etc. Look into something like this The Reporter (http://www.smarthome.com/7317/Reporter-Wireless-Driveway-Alert-System/p.aspx) to give you some advanced warning of trespassers. Set four sensors up at strategic locations. Also, if you can, get in the habit of garaging your cars. No one ever knows if I'm home or not as the auto is always out of sight. One other step - put a timer on a few lights - use one that replaces one of your kitchen or den light switches, set it for 5 or 10 minutes at various times once or twice a night. Maybe one timer in one other room. Look like a random insomniac... :)
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Everything that JC said, and this extra possibility:
The idea of having your wife move with you makes sense.... the two of you get the kid's on your floor, put them behind her or between the two of you (depending on the likelihood of a threat being behind your group), as you move to secure the other kids. In this case, your Safe Room should be one of the rooms with a child on the lower floor. This minimizes your movement and gets your family all together.
(tangent)
One REALLY important thing for you is the idea of Intermittent and Indirect light use. It will be covered in an upcoming episode of TBD, but here's an Article:http://www.imakenews.com/valhalla/e_article000413118.cfm?x=b11,0,w (http://www.imakenews.com/valhalla/e_article000413118.cfm?x=b11,0,w), to get you primed..... You don't want to be moving through your house like a 2nd rate TV cop pointing your gun/light at your kids. This is pretty strong tangent, please start a new thread if anyone wants to discuss.....
(/tangent)
-RJP
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My $.02 . . .
Set up a safe room downstairs, and some form of alarm. Teach the kids when that alarm goes off to hit the safe room and bar the door. Keep a walkie-talkie in there and with you so you can communicate. Teach a safe word as well, so that they know it's you to let them out. And maybe another "safe" word that says it's you but do not open the door, as in a hostage situation. Food and water and warm fuzzies for warmth and comfort completes the picture.
In a way, that allows you to worry about the threat and not them.
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I think pathfinders on the right track, communication, and some pre determined safe words or battle words, something that says ok we are all safe, or TSHTF, and we all now go to a predetermined position. That position should be very safe!! Do you have ground level windows that could be invaded? If so, reinforce them, have a discussion with the young boys, and let them know what the plan is and why!! I like the radio or intercom idea ;D I don't know your house, but, could an access be put in the floor of the upper level, like a folding attic stairway that could lead upstairs from the basement?? The youngun's in the basement seem to be the the utmost concern, so concentrate there, impede access, and allow the most egress to get out.
Tough situation.
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I often say that "I am not impressed with T-shirts anymore" because I've seen poor examples from just about every Cool-T-Shirt group you can name. Usually, they are extreme exceptions, but the fact that they exist means that I wouldn't trust my daughter's life to just anyone who can say "I am a Starship Trooper!". We see people all the time who have been highly trained fail miserably to perform. Add the "woken up in the middle of the night factor and I would not expect much from a pre-teen. That said, your kids might be incredibly exceptional, but I wouldn't expect them to be able to fend for themselves nor give them that responsibility as Plan A, electronic comms or not. You could easily end up spending 30 seconds trying to make sure you are on the right channel and the battery is charged....
I really do think that M25 has a great idea in the "access hatch" concept though, if the floor plan supports it.
-RJP
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I often say that "I am not impressed with T-shirts anymore" because I've seen poor examples from just about every Cool-T-Shirt group you can name. Usually, they are extreme exceptions, but the fact that they exist means that I wouldn't trust my daughter's life to just anyone who can say "I am a Starship Trooper!". We see people all the time who have been highly trained fail miserably to perform. Add the "woken up in the middle of the night factor and I would not expect much from a pre-teen. That said, your kids might be incredibly exceptional, but I wouldn't expect them to be able to fend for themselves nor give them that responsibility as Plan A, electronic comms or not. You could easily end up spending 30 seconds trying to make sure you are on the right channel and the battery is charged....
I really do think that M25 has a great idea in the "access hatch" concept though, if the floor plan supports it.
-RJP
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Everyone has had good suggestions, in another thread some one mentioned that even if you can't have a dog, it doesn't mean you can't leave "beware of dog" signs, food and water dishes and a couple of chew toys (Maybe a REALY tore up car tire ;D )
Burglars HATE dogs ! Some of the things suggested take time to arrange, but RIGHT now consider if you can take a safe position on the ground floor, keeping all family members out of the line of fire, but controlling access to BOTH stair wells ? you may lose valuable stuff from the rest of the ground floor but ,so what ? STUFF can be replaced, lives can't.
On code words, Often in intelligence nets, the absence of the "safety" signal is in it's self the "danger" signal. Train your wife and kids to unlock/bar the door of the safe rooms ONLY if you use the SAFE word, otherwise they should ask "What", "What did you say ? If you repeat and still do not use the safe word they should ignore any noises they hear until you tell them to open up and DO use the SAFE word. Unpleasant thought but if you are under duress of some sort those noises are liable to be frightening. Under your conditions I think your wife has a duty to you and her children to learn at least the basics of firearms handling, your situation is nearly impossible for a LONE man to deal with outside of the movies.
Now I will probably find exactly the same things I've said on the second page I haven't read yet ;D
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Burglars HATE dogs !
As to dogs.....
Ever seen the show on Discovery called "It Takes a Theif"? Basicly a couple of ex-burglars break into people's homes and then teach them how to prevent future break ins and then they upgrade their home security for them....
....Anyway.... They basically proved time and again that dogs really dont mean much of anything to burglars, and that 99% of domesticated dogs are basically just giant pussy cats -- no offense Haz. Most of the home owners were certain that their dogs would turn into Rin Tin Tin and stop the guys from burglarizing their homes, but the exact opposite was always true. They instead greeted them with affectionate licking and followed them around like they were old family friends. Sometimes the burglar gave them meat out of the fridge to keep them occupied. Other times they were just shuffled off into a bathroom and closed the door behind them. And these were "big scary dogs"..... Ones you would consider to be intimidating and the ideal dog to have around as a deterrent.
The bottom line here is dont think of a dog as anything more then an over active and unreliable early warning system. Some bad guys might have an over exaggerated fear of dogs and may pass your house by because of your "big scary dog", but the professional and/or determined criminal will not view them as a deterrent. They know that 99% of domesticated dogs are meek and harmless.
*Now if you have a $15,000 trained guard dog, disregard everything I just said.
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As to code words....
Big waste of time. Might work well if all parties are highly trained and strong minded men from a special forces unit, but your wife and kids do not have to mental fortitude to keep that door shut if someone is holding a gun to daddy's head and threatening his life. I couldnt do it. There is no way I could keep my wife locked out if she had a gun to her head. Too many emotions involved, and there is no way I could actively choose to sacrifice her life to keep that door shut.
Spend your time and ideas on finding other ways to be more secure.
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Depends on the dog.
Australian cattle dog/ blue heeler are naturals. Family oriented, intelligent and easily trained dog that tends to herd/ protect children. Had a girl friend with one. Strangers and bad attitudes met with growling at first until directed otherwise.
If girlfriend were attacked, attacker would likely loose their throat in less than a second. Not trained that way, but see there family job as active. Need space and activities - not an apartment dog.
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So my first question is how many home invasions are there in Emporia Kansas? I am guessing that it isn't the crime mecca that some place like Camden NJ is. How often are those burglaries that do occur, occur with intent to do harm? I don't know, so before I start poking fun, I thought it good to ask.
Same thing the wife says. Then I point out that until 2008, more people have been assaulted & murdered here than have been hurt or killed by fire. Yet we all have fire extinguishers and an escape plan. Not trying to be paranoid, just prepared. Meth has made a lot of people into someone vastly different than they thought they were, desperate beyond reason. Couple that with it being the intersection of sveral highways, known crime corridors and I on only a driver - five iron from 2 of them. Also, being a small business owner, a lot of people have the much mistaken impression that I somehow have a couple of million stashed in my mattress. ::)
I haven't really had time to review all of the rest of the post in detail yet but, WOW, that is why I like hanging out here. Good ideas and and ideas I wouldn't have thought of. I do appreciate everyone's input. And I will have more questions. ;D
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Build a trap door is not going to be easy, it will actually take alot of work. You will most likly have to cut out a small section of your basement floor to pore new footings for the new posts and beams that you will be needing to install. Depends on your house.
Cuting floor joists is never an easy task. When it comes time to sell your house it would also be a headache. Even if you went thru all the permit and engineering process of your local building department. Personally, if your going to go thru all the hassle of installing beams and cutting joists, you might as well just puting in another stair case. The cost increase would be very small.
I hate to be the bringer of bad news( seems like all I do is give home owners bad news)
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So my first question is how many home invasions are there in Emporia Kansas?
I'd say that usually this question shouldn't matter. It's always possible to be the only home invaded in your area, or even the first ever.
Our city has rated as the nation's "safest" city by the FBI for a few years, but we know of crimes that are happening still. Last year, a teenage girl was raped by a known gang member from LA (we are 35 miles south of downtown LA). When the police spotted his vehicle, he sped into a residential area, and broke into an occupied home. Thankfully, the homeowner not only had a gun ready, but also had just completed a training course. He scared the goblin back out to the police.
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Build a trap door is not going to be easy, it will actually take alot of work. You will most likly have to cut out a small section of your basement floor to pore new footings for the new posts and beams that you will be needing to install. Depends on your house.
Cuting floor joists is never an easy task. When it comes time to sell your house it would also be a headache. Even if you went thru all the permit and engineering process of your local building department. Personally, if your going to go thru all the hassle of installing beams and cutting joists, you might as well just puting in another stair case. The cost increase would be very small.
I hate to be the bringer of bad news( seems like all I do is give home owners bad news)
Sometimes your bad news is welcome, as in this case. It's another case of a really good idea getting mugged by the realities of cost.
TAB, In my younger days I helped with several jobs rough remodeling and building, from the little I learned it's obvious that you REALLY know this stuff, and have probably run into about every sort of odd ball set up around, odd dimension Canadian lumber, nob and tube wiring, all sorts of things that the average home handy man book never thought of and the average person will not have run into. You should consider sitting down and posting a LONG thread of security improvements, and things to watch out for, methods of doing things. Stuff your profession has showed you that the rest of us don't know, but should.
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Sometimes your bad news is welcome, as in this case. It's another case of a really good idea getting mugged by the realities of cost.
TAB, In my younger days I helped with several jobs rough remodeling and building, from the little I learned it's obvious that you REALLY know this stuff, and have probably run into about every sort of odd ball set up around, odd dimension Canadian lumber, nob and tube wiring, all sorts of things that the average home handy man book never thought of and the average person will not have run into. You should consider sitting down and posting a LONG thread of security improvements, and things to watch out for, methods of doing things. Stuff your profession has showed you that the rest of us don't know, but should.
Don't forget that someone may be starting a new home or a new major remodel and can incorporate these ideas into his project. Heck, I'm taking notes and making plans for the future home and that is one of those ideas that is going to be used. You could even use a spiral staircase to minimize wasted space for a second access to the other floor.
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Spiral stair cases are joke... they look really cool, but thats about it.
Not to mention they cost $$$$. The sqft need to a normal stair case is not that much more of a spiral one.
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I know they are a lot harder to use than a normal stair. I was thinking that it would be something that could be stuck in the back of a closet or the like, more for emergency use than anything. Of course it probably be smarter to just have another real stairway. For the small little floor plan I am looking at, I just wonder if that is something that could be stuck in a closet in a corner somewhere. Probably not practical, just something that popped into my head.
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"House Clearing?"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCSC8BBOO_o&feature=channel_page
Sorry guys, but I couldn't resist. With the way things are going, a little laughter can benefit us all. Bill T.
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My room and our kids room are all upstairs so I am good there. If I hear a noise I am always wondering if it is my kids, a invader or my imagination. On the off chance I am wrong and I go down stairs and get caught up in something, we have a code word. All I have to do is say the word "Kimber" and my wife knows to come with the gun, and Shoot. I figure if I scream it, she will come and even if I call it out because someone is holding me hostage, they would think that I was just calling my wife who happens to be named Kimber.
I know, she could shoot me, but my concern is to get out the firing line anyway I can. I figure even if the intruder doesn't get hit by the first shot, and they get down to take cover, I am probably going to be free enough to grab and use Judo holds to keep them down. Their element of surprise is gone and I have a slight advantage of not having to worry about the person with the gun. And I saw Blade Runner when I was a kid...the eyes are the softest spot. ;)
I get really worried about my kids, but they are all under 6 so they are not tall, I would always aim high just in case. I get most worried about encountering them and being on edge thinking they are the intruder.
One thing that I want to do after I buy a home is to set up IR cameras in my house and have it set so I can view it on my smart phone. Wake up, pick up phone, scroll through cameras, find the bad guy, hunt him down. It would also be really nice to have video evidence that they were in your house. (although if that evidence was not totally in your favor...) It would also be nice to know where your kids are. I know it sounds creepy to think of cameras in your home, but if you could have an eye in the other room in a tactical situation, it would be worth it. I think only my wife and I would know about it though.
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Scary to think I might have to do this someday.....personally I consider myself lucky, the house we purchased has all bedrooms upstairs, and quite frankly, I have no desire to clear my house. I simply will plant myself at top of steps, out of sight with good view down, and let em' know they can take thier chances coming up stairs in a loud voice while calling PD for assistance. I have insurance for anything they may take or damage.
Meanwhile, wife is gathering all kids in our back room just in case.
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Our home has an audible, and silent alarm, as well as an 85lb female boxer with a crappy disposition. So, I will have warning.
Our home is not large...about 2200 sq ft, and has 4 bedrooms. The master, and my daughter's bedroom (along with the other two) are at the end of a LONG hallway. The doorway to my daughter's room is at a 90-degree angle to my doorway.
The plan, at the sound of the alarm, is for me to grab my 3rd gen G17 with a LaserMax installed, a Surefire light attached, and a 17 round mag with a +2 extension sticking out the bottom from the nightstand, and gather my daughter and back into the master bedroom. My wife, will be in the master bathroom, which is also at a 90-degree angle to the entry to our bedroom, and cannot be seen into from the bedroom doorway, with her duty pistol (Glock 17) and her Benelli. Her Benelli and my M4 both reside in the bathroom...yes, they really do. All other guns are in the safe except our HD guns. She will cover our entry to the bedroom while she is on speakerphone to 911. We have a landline and cell phone dedicated to master bedroom use only. When I reach the bathroom with my daughter, I will arm myself with the M4, and relegate the Glock to my waistband in a clip on IWB (Yes it works in drawstring PJ bottoms, sweats, or gym shorts)
Across from the master bathroom is a full-length mirror that is hard to see from the doorway to the bedroom, but is totally visible from the bathroom. This way, we can see whomever comes into our bedroom from the hallway from cover and concealment in the bathroom. Our master bathroom which is deep and long, opens into our walk-in closet. This is where my daughter will be, hunkered down between 2 gun safes, under a blanket to guard against gunfire or flying debris.
My job will be to engage any threat, while my wife protects my six and more importantly, our daughter.
I fully expect my dog to have made her presence, and teeth known to anyone who would enter our home uninvited. So, if they get past her...then I get my turn.
I am not going to clear the house after my daughter is safe with us. I will wait for LE to arrive. I am retired LE and my wife is current LE. I will let the young fellers do the job.
As an aside...when we had our home built, I had a master light switch placed in our master bathroom. I can, from that location, control all the lights inside and outside of my home. I will make it very hard for an invader to hide in the shadows.
;D
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Frisco,
You need to get a 33 rd mag for that Glock!
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Frisco,
You need to get a 33 rd mag for that Glock!
I have about 4 of them...but holstering it when I get back to the bathroom makes it awkward. 20 rounds on board is plenty of BOOM BOOM for the 5 seconds or so that I will be moving between my room and getting my daughter back into our bedroom.
I have run through the drill with my M4 in hand as well...but, all in all, it is more efficient to use the Glock in my weak hand while I gather the midget, and move from her room to our room. I figure I will be carrying her, as she doesn't come to full wakefullness, and readiness to motivate on her own very easily. Thus, I had to make the decision that fit best all the way around.
And, as I mentioned before, I expect my dog to delay anyone entering our hallway long enough to get her safely to our room where the big boomers are located.
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Gabe Suarez had an interesting bit on house fighting yesterday in his newsletter. I couldn't find it on his website, so bear with me, it is long-ish but quite good at specifying the different tactics you might have to use.
Fighting In Your House
Fighting in houses...or fighting in your house can take on many forms depending on your mission. Having clarity of mission is essential so you know how to comport yourself in each event. I want to be very clear that this is one of the most dangerous activities that a homeowner may encounter.
Sadly, most training out there is limited to the police application, which I call "hunt the burglar". This has very little in common with much of what you may need to do if you are not in that line of work.
Basing our focus on the armed civilian CCW operator we can identify several possible mission profiles and tactical skills needed for fighting in houses.
1). Holding Ground. This is the most common home defense type scenario. Think of the classic scenario where a homeowner is awaken by a strange sound indicating a break in. They barricade themselves in the bedroom with the old double barreled shotgun, issue the classic warning, "I have a gun" and then call the police. We hear stories like this all the time.
The homeowner has no pressing need to enter the fight or go in search of the threat so he simply takes up a position of advantage, using as much cover and concealment as a bedroom will allow. He points his muzzle at the bedroom door chanelizing the avenue of approach of the bad guy and waits in ambush. When the bad guy forces his way into the bedroom, a "warning" may or may not be given depending on the tactical situation and the region.
For this very elementary event there is little need for any skills at all other than pointing the weapon and having the will to fire it at the home invader. They do however, need to have a weapon in the first place.
While many CCW folks advise this as what you always need to do, it is a very limited application. Will you do this if the rest of your family is still out there at the mercy of the home invader? Of course not.
2). Taking Ground. This is a bit more involved and far more physically and mentally demanding. This basically involves attacking the attackers. An example may be, as we mentioned earlier, the rescue of family members about to be victimized. The police parallel is a hostage rescue.
Think of the previous scenario except the homeowner is awakened by the sound of glass breaking, their child's terrified screams in a bedroom across the house are suddenly muffled and they hear a stranger's voice telling them to shut up.
This is hardly the time to hide under the bed with a shotgun is it?
This situation requires moving rapidly and stealthily directly to the threat. The mission is not to stay safe, it is to go to the fight. The mission is to close on the bad guys and shoot them to the ground with surgical close range gunfire. The urgency of the situation probably proscribes any negotiation, warnings, or attempt to deescalate the situation. The bad guys are located, closed upon, and shot down in order to save the innocents they are victimizing.
A similar situation is presented in an active shooter event where you have elected to stay and fight rather than run away. And before you discount this, there are plenty of reasons to do just that if family members or others for whom you are responsible are still in the danger area. You are not going to abandon your kids at Trolley Square or the Tacoma Mall and run for your life are you?
3). Traversing Through. Traversing involves traveling through a contested or conflict area where there may be active armed bad guys. The mission is not to engage them, but rather to escape them. But understand, getting shot in the back is no way to escape. The operator (s) and their protectees move rapidly through and out, free of the threat area, but ready to engage any threats that may appear or impede their exit.
Think of the active shooter event where there are multiple shooters but their immediate whereabouts are not certain. All you know is that the current place is not safe and that remaining there is not a good idea. You need to escape but running into one or more of them on the way out is a very real possibility.
There is no time to clear or search. You move quickly as before, giving cursory attention to danger areas with eyes and muzzles on the approach and egress, but no attempt would be made to "clear them" or search them. As soon as a danger area is passed, it is abandoned as new danger areas appear. The goal is to escape...but in a strong and controlled manner ready to convert escape into attack if necessary.
4). Search and Clear. This is an area of study that is often the basis of many "shoothouse" training events. It involves moving cautiously and deliberately through an area in direct search for an adversary that is presumably hidden or unaware of the good guy's presence. It is basically an indoor manhunt.
Most people have no idea how strenuous this is both physically and mentally, nor how dangerous it is when done alone. A typical 3000 square foot house for example might take the better part of an hour to search correctly by a team of three. And by search I mean doing it right, not simply turning the lights on and peeking into a room then declaring it clear.
All of these require a thorough understanding of the nature of architectural features commonly found in modern buildings such as corners, hallways, doors, stairs, etc., and how to negotiate them at various speeds. You would also need the ability to identify danger areas and potential threats, and the ability to mold your fighting platform to the environment at hand. As well, you need a clear understanding of what your mission is at any given moment as well as the fact that things can change quickly from one mission profile to another.
A lot of the choices you make will depend on how much information you have. This is not the time to be thinking about liability and stuff like that. If you do, you'll lose.
For these events, a shotgun would not be a first choice at all. Rather something short, light, handy and with lots and lots of ammunition would be preferred. Something like a Glock or Beretta with a 20+ capacity magazine, or even an SBR'd UZI semi auto.
Consider these situations
1. You wake up at 3:00 AM because you heard something. You are not certain enough to go back to sleep but not certain enough to call 911.
2.
3. The noise that wakes you up is much more pronounced than in #1. Still not confirmed "human" but definitely something is not right.
4.
5. You wake up to the sound of glass breaking and swearing. You live alone.
6.
7. You wake up at 3:00 AM because you heard your kid scream across the house. His or her scream was followed by a male voice telling them to shut up.
8.
9. You are at church and your kids are across the on the other side of the church at youth ministry. You hear gun shots coming from that direction, people screaming and running away from the sound.
10.
11. You and your protectees are inside a building where bad things are happening. Your current location is untenable and you must leave but expect to encounter resistance as part of the escape.
12.
While each event is similar, the dynamics of the fight are different and each one requires different tactics, and will probably have different assets available in terms of weapons . Think about this now and how you might handle each one of these problems. Think also about what skills you might need to make your time in the fight safer for you and more dangerous for the bad guys.
Gabe Suarez
Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
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Boy, I surely would like to sit a spell and have a nice cold one or some sweet tea and jaw with you guys face to face some time.
I like the way you think.
8)
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A good point is made. If I were to hear my daughter scream and someone telling her to "shut up" or telling her ANYTHING for that matter...I would go to PLAN B and enter her room with my M4, and my wife hot on my heels with her Benelli. Violence and mayhem would ensue.
I have planned for this too. Our home is wired for all points of entry, including the silly little windows above the showers that a midget couldn't possibly get through. All the windows and doors have decorative wrought iron security gates, so as to not look fortress-like, but still be a good deterrent to any would-be miscreant. The alarm has a cellular backup with batteries. And of course the dog, who sleeps IN my daughter's room on the end of her bed would be eating SOMEONE. So, I don't believe that this will be an issue, that someone could get to her before I could in a break-in, but I have planned for it anyway...just in case.
My wife used to think I was paranoid until she became an LEO. Now, she thinks I am just cautious, and perfectly reasonable in the precautions I have taken. We live, not too terribly far from the border, and illegals are rounded up around here fairly routinely on their way to Phoenix. A large, loud, mean looking dog is one helluva good thing to have to keep folks out of the backyard, house, and as an alarm when all else has failed.
I keep thinking of adding another boxer to our home. I have fallen in love with the breed, and really like the protective nature of the female boxer. I highly reccomend one for anyone looking for a loyal, intelligent, and protective dog for the home...one that also carries no stigma of being a vicious breed.
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Boy, I surely would like to sit a spell and have a nice cold one or some sweet tea and jaw with you guys face to face some time.
I like the way you think.
8)
I believe I'd like that too. Add some good BBQ and a trip out yonder to the range for some paper perforation...it'd be more fun than a barrel of monkeys with machine guns.
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A good point is made. If I were to hear my daughter scream and someone telling her to "shut up" or telling her ANYTHING for that matter...I would go to PLAN B and enter her room with my M4, and my wife hot on my heels with her Benelli. Violence and mayhem would ensue.
I have planned for this too. Our home is wired for all points of entry, including the silly little windows above the showers that a midget couldn't possibly get through. All the windows and doors have decorative wrought iron security gates, so as to not look fortress-like, but still be a good deterrent to any would-be miscreant. The alarm has a cellular backup with batteries. And of course the dog, who sleeps IN my daughter's room on the end of her bed would be eating SOMEONE. So, I don't believe that this will be an issue, that someone could get to her before I could in a break-in, but I have planned for it anyway...just in case.
My wife used to think I was paranoid until she became an LEO. Now, she thinks I am just cautious, and perfectly reasonable in the precautions I have taken. We live, not too terribly far from the border, and illegals are rounded up around here fairly routinely on their way to Phoenix. A large, loud, mean looking dog is one helluva good thing to have to keep folks out of the backyard, house, and as an alarm when all else has failed.
I keep thinking of adding another boxer to our home. I have fallen in love with the breed, and really like the protective nature of the female boxer. I highly reccomend one for anyone looking for a loyal, intelligent, and protective dog for the home...one that also carries no stigma of being a vicious breed.
My wife thought the same thing, until home invasions and daytime household robberies became two of the top perpetrated crimes in our area. After several homes on our road were broken into she came around to my way of thinking.
I believe I'd like that too. Add some good BBQ and a trip out yonder to the range for some paper perforation...it'd be more fun than a barrel of monkeys with machine guns.
And, BBQ is my specialty.........ribs and smoked shoulder to be exact. ;)
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My wife IS paranoid!
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My wife IS paranoid!
My wife says I am. But I know that everyone is really out to get me.
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My wife says I am. But I know that everyone is really out to get me.
Yes, Thanos, yes we are! ;D
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My wife thought the same thing, until home invasions and daytime household robberies became two of the top perpetrated crimes in our area. After several homes on our road were broken into she came around to my way of thinking.
My wife is a typical New Englander, splendid in the thought thinking the LE will watch our six. She came around rather quickly when I reminded her, now that I have five pounds of metal in my ass, I can't outrun em anymore and HER safety is paramount.
My daughter carries her own 9mm so the wife figured that having a 240lb husband carrying a .45 or .357 wasn't a bad idea afterall! ;D
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Yes, Thanos, yes we are! ;D
+1
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Yes, Thanos, yes we are! ;D
I KNEW IT! Keeps me on my toes though.
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Great Thread, guys.... Use PM's to plan your luncheons.
:-)
-RJP