The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: texcaliber on July 09, 2007, 09:21:28 PM
-
I spent another afternoon retesting my Rem. 870max for pattern. Before I posted these results:
I just spent the day with my gunsmith checking the pattern on my Reminton 870max and I came back very supprised. Shocked I thought 00buck would be tighter than it was at 40yds. i couldnt hit a ISPC target with more than 2 pellets with most shots only producing 1 hit on target Angry. Quickly moving into home defence ranges the results were still not real pleasing, 30 feet getting almost a full spread(shoulder2shoulder) cutting down to 10-15feet much better but head shots printed low. needless to say it would be really REALLY!!!! messy man Wink. IF you have seen the updated version of "Dawn of the dead" when Ving Rhames takes off the top of the gunshop guy's(named Andy in flick) head. Well just picture that shot 6-8" lower. EWWWW man ew! Drughead cleanup in aisles 1-5 please. Roll Eyes Just absoult best 7yd group from before no joke saying thought the long distance preformance of shot would be ALOT better. Huh
tex
Now let me be real honest. The (4) different ammo i used were Remington 00Buck reduced recoil, Remington 00Buck 3" mag, Winchester 00buck 2 3/4" and last Charles Daily 00Buck. So there was some difference in ammo. From $2 a shell to freebee. But the results in spread were almost the same with Rem. reduced recoil and Winchester producing......better?..... krappy patterns. Lets not dwell in the past.......
So lets fast forward -------> today I tested some of the Hornady TAP FPD with a huge >:( ! I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that I was just wasting time and MONEY! taking advice that this TAP stuff may close up my groups. But at least i Could post my results. I couldnt be more W R O N G !
My goodness folks the hype is true. The gun shot one big hole at 7yds. and at 10yds. it open up the size to 3 inches outsid to outside! NO JOKE So I ripped some out at 25 yards and even my gunsmith was suprised and claimed "got a new BuckShot come hunting season." The shot group on target was about the size of a paper plate with all nine pellets in target. I couldnt believe it sooooo... I repeated test 4 more times. All the same results. Oh yeah I didnt change my sights from last time but my point of impact did. Before all shot low but Hornady was right on the white of the front post.
Now we were stumped........and just couldnt believe what we were seeing........ so we had to retest most of the WinchesterOO i had left over at 7yds.. Different day maybe something wierd had happened and the Rem.870 fixed itself. NOPE! At 21feet Win.00 made a 12" pattern(best) with 1 pattern and a hair under 18". Same target no without cool down Hornady put 5 shotshells into a 4" hole. Thats FRICKIN OUTSTANDING!!!! I am dumbfounded. Can believe my own eyes kind of thing man. But thats what I get for being so pessimistic
Tex
-
TAPS are spooky good...at GUNSITE, we were able to pull patterns with TAPS out of ancient cop 870s that rivalled patterns out of new top-of-the-line Vang Comp barrels with other LEO buckshot...and the Remington isn't chopped liver!
TAPS out of Vang Comp barrels are nothing short of amazing...I've paid full boat for every round of Hornady TAPS I've shot; that's what's in all my defensive guns right now and that is what I unconditionally recommend...
Michael B
-
TAPS are spooky good...at GUNSITE, we were able to pull patterns with TAPS out of ancient cop 870s that rivalled patterns out of new top-of-the-line Vang Comp barrels with other LEO buckshot...and the Remington isn't chopped liver!
TAPS out of Vang Comp barrels are nothing short of amazing...I've paid full boat for every round of Hornady TAPS I've shot; that's what's in all my defensive guns right now and that is what I unconditionally recommend...
Michael B
do you have any opinions on the LEO TAP vs. the reg. TAP FPD? LEO is about half the price(odvious one out of the way) but as far as the preformance goes or any other NEED-TO-KNOW-INFO :)
I still can not believe how huge the improvement was. ;D
Tex
-
Got to call B*** S*** on you Michael ;D I was there when Giles Stocks was handing out free boxes (5rds) of TAP at Gunsite ;D
Hornady's Tap Shotgun Ammo is the bomb in one of my Win. 1300 (10" at 30yds) with only the forcing cone extended 1.5" but it is very average in my 870 with the Vang voodoo, it really likes the Rem 8pellet low recoil stuff, once again showing that each weapon is a law onto it's self.
If you want to know what your shotguns capable of, do as Tex did. Buy as many brands/types as you can, go out and put them on paper at various yardage 10-15-25-30 pick the one that works the best and go buy a boat load of it.
The only down side (IMHO) to the low recoil stuff is possible under penetration. I've never shot anything over the size of a large dog (45lbs) with LR Rem stuff so if'n I was hunting larger game with it I'd keep a few round of some thing with a little more kick.
Low Recoil is great for personal defense training purposes, go out and get some, training that is, forget all the tactical/ninja crap to hang off your gun and get some training if you plan on using it (shotgun) for such, it's not the hammer of Thor, but it can be very close.
Best regards,
tb, AZ
-
+1 on the Hornady TAP as well. I took a shotgun class where the instructor let everyone try a few rounds and I believe every shotgun did very well with it.
Does anyone know if they are still making both the red and blue rounds or just the red now?
-
I agree with the Hornady TAP. I've put several different brands through my 590A1 and have never had it pattern with anything as good as TAP. Here's a pick of my guard dog.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v414/danceswithbow/SHOTGUN.jpg)
-
I agree with the Hornady TAP. I've put several different brands through my 590A1 and have never had it pattern with anything as good as TAP. Here's a pick of my guard dog.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v414/danceswithbow/SHOTGUN.jpg)
Howdy danceswithglock, i have a chance to get one of the 590's and wonder if you ever shot an 870 and what your opinions were. IF one was better how and why would be appreciated. :)
Tex
-
Yes sir, I've owned both, I had a REm 870 HD, it was a nice gun, I don't think you can go wrong with either. I prefer the 590A1, I like the tang mounted safety, heavier barrel, metal trigger group and Mossbergs ghost rings sights. It a heavy pig, but it also cuts down on recoil.
-
Thanks dances, now I HAVE to buy it. ;)
Its main roll is going to be backup to my Rem. 870max and you never know, may even take the car gun position for those very rare times. Which seem less rare lately.
I cant find any info on the different colored TAP other than one may be for LEO and the other for citizens? But i would rather hear it from a more reliable source which told me. But its all i got for ya. :)
-
One color was for autos and had a little more power to it to cycle the action and the other was for pumps but I don't remember which color was for which. I thought I heard they went to one color because they didn't want LEO's getting them mixed up and turning their autos into a single shot.
-
danceswithglock i just picked up a 590 A1 which has a pistol grip on it. Is there any extras that you would suggest putting on. It came with the stock in the box also, but i was thinking of more car system roll. I know with out a doubt now that TAP FPD is going to be loaded. And prob. a couple of the Rem. reduced recoil slugs. But only firm on the Hornady.
Tex
-
danceswithglock i just picked up a 590 A1 which has a pistol grip on it. Is there any extras that you would suggest putting on. It came with the stock in the box also, but i was thinking of more car system roll. I know with out a doubt now that TAP FPD is going to be loaded. And prob. a couple of the Rem. reduced recoil slugs. But only firm on the Hornady.
Tex
Hmm, my 590A1 didn't come with the pistol grip, but then I did buy it six years ago- bought it after 9/11. I had shipped all my good stuff out of Illinois when Blagoyavich and Daley's thugs got elected in 2000, and found that after the terrorist attack I had nothing to defend myself with.
I use the Win slugs, have had good luck with them. I definitely need to get some TAP.
Next stop is the Knoxx collapsible stock for my short arms to better control the beast with and to absorb a bit of the recoil from the magnum double ought buck I foolishly bought. I was standing on my ranch porch steps when I fired the magnum for the first time and it doggone near blew me off the steps.
-
Hmm, my 590A1 didn't come with the pistol grip, but then I did buy it six years ago- bought it after 9/11.
Sorry I soulda told yall i am buying it used, the package i am getting is a 590A1 with both pistolgrip and factory stock. It also has the Ghostring sight setup with redramp front sight. Also the original box if that matters?
-
Speaking of Hornady TAP FPD and Tom Knapp...
I saw Tom Knapp today doing his exhibition shooting at my local gun club. Better than on TV (except for the replays). Combined with the fact I bought a couple of boxes of Hornady, I hurried home to perform my own stunts. I shot the Hornady 00 buck w/8 pellets against Remington #1 buck w/16 pellets at 15 feet and 30 feet. [I'll have pics later, I can't find the camera, waiting on the wife to return home]
I shot both on the same target(s) with my Remington 870 12ga 20'' barrel. Quite a difference. I'm sold on Hornady for home defense.
As for my exhibition shooting, well practice, practice...I threw up 7 and hit 3 (one at a time of course!) Knapp did 7 at a time (I think his record is 8 or 9).
Shotguns are fun.
pic added at 9:30PM ET
-
I shot the Hornady 00 buck w/8 pellets against Remington #1 buck w/16 pellets at 15 feet and 30 feet.
I can not find any info on 8pellet TAP. And....
[I'll have pics later, I can't find the camera, waiting on the wife to return home]
Awsome man, cant wait. I need to being Ms.Tex to take pics and put them on this site on the improvement of TAP FPD over everything else.
-
I can not find any info on 8pellet TAP. And....
Hornady only puts 8 pellets in their 12ga loads.
-
Hornady only puts 8 pellets in their 12ga loads.
Where did you find that info? Not that i dont trust ya but @1.50 a shot i could cut one open just the same but no Ms.Tex to help with the pics. >:(
-
Where did you find that info? Not that i dont trust ya but @1.50 a shot i could cut one open just the same but no Ms.Tex to help with the pics. >:(
No problem Tex. 1) I only made 8 holes when I shot (no I didn't miss) 2) check this link http://www.gunsandammomag.com/ammunition/tap_010506/index1.html
-
gotcha page 1. had the info. Thanks Don I am going to have to start writing down the info and stop assuming info when i am testing this stuff out/
-
:) ;)well, I used several different type of brand. it also, counting what type grain and buckshot used by what company.
myself , I used a law enforcement winchester double bucks with number 9 pellets. i think you will be please with it.
billye1952
-
myself , I used a law enforcement winchester double bucks with number 9 pellets. i think you will be please with it.
billye1952
I bet you change your mind after you try Hornady TAP FPD 00Buck. I know I sure did.
-
Here is the second photo, at 15 ft...Hornady vs Remington...
-
DW,
I assume cylinder bore and an 18 - 20 inch barrel?
-
DW,
I assume cylinder bore and an 18 - 20 inch barrel?
Yes. 20in. See my earlier post for the 30ft pic.
-
I am trying to talk Ms. Tex into bringing the camera to the range to get some pics. But trying is the key word. :) I just picked up a couple boxes of the LE TAP to try also. So we can see if there is a difference. I dont know if i will be able to talk my gunsmith into Crono. the f/s but we will see how it goes.
-
Yes. 20in. See my earlier post for the 30ft pic.
Not anymore. I just now but in a new 18.5 in barrel with a bead site. Will shoot it tommorrow.
-
Not anymore. I just now but in a new 18.5 in barrel with a bead site. Will shoot it tommorrow.
Curious as to why. 1.5" doesn't make that much difference (at least in gun barrels ;D).
-
Hazcat my results have shown a Huge Difference with that 1.5" barrel. I am sure someone will know why but time after time and a lot of cash down range has proven that the longer the shotgun barrel the tighter the pattern. Except for this one ClassIII shotgun that was like a pistol lenght barrel and had some turkey chokes and a lot of custom work to make some real tight groups. Always at least one exception to the rule man. ;)
Tex
-
Curious as to why. 1.5" doesn't make that much difference (at least in gun barrels ;D).
Silly boy, I was after the bead sight!
-
Silly boy, I was after the bead sight!
Into beads are you? Still got your Puka beads? :D
Seriously I didn't realize the 18.5 didn't have one.
-
Seriously I didn't realize the 18.5 didn't have one.
The new barrel does have a front bead sight. That is why I bought it. I prefer a bead sight on a shotgun. Now I need to sell the 20in barrel with the rifle sights.
-
So the 20 was a slug barrel?