The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: rojawe on March 08, 2009, 06:37:12 PM
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How To: ID yourself to police during/after a shooting..."
March 4th, 2009
I read something recently that I think EVERYBODY who carries concealed should consider.
I can't remember where I picked it up... it may even have been on our own USCCA forum while browsing around- I'm not sure.
I received a LOT of positive feedback on the tip I offered yesterday about "hip shooting"- let's see if I can go '2 for 2' with today's "identify yourself" advice...
You've probably wondered before- what happens if I have to use my weapon in self defense, and the cops show up during, or right after?
How do I identify myself to them in a way to make them realize- "I'm the good guy- don't shoot me!"
This is a VERY important question, and I believe it's something that everyone who carries concealed has thought about at one time or another.
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Well, here is what I read. I have no idea how effective it would be, or how true it is... but here it is, anyway:
"...When an undercover police officer has to identify himself to uniformed officers, he holds his badge high above his head, in plain sight."
"...So, if you are ever in a situation where you have to identify yourself to police, it might be a good idea to try to hold your CCW license or entire, open wallet above your head for when the police first see you."
So there it is. First, I want to discuss a big problem I see with this advice, but second, I want to talk about why I thought it was worth sharing.
THE BAD: In order to get your wallet out of your pocket in the first place, you are going to have to reach behind your back and into your pocket. If police already see you, this act alone could get you shot- and understandably so. Therefore, I think this advice is intended more for "declaring your presence".
For example, if the police haven't seen you yet or don't know you are there- such as if you had to run out of a bank while it was being robbed.
The point is, NEVER do anything in front of an officer that could appear as if you are going for a gun. You'd be better off letting them cuff you and THEN try to explain to them that you are a good guy.
THE GOOD: To me, the idea of holding something above your head while declaring your presence to an officer actually makes sense.
The officer will certainly have no idea what you're holding above your head, but he or she will get that you are trying to communicate with them, and your hands will be perfectly visible.
You can certainly just keep your hands in the air, but the whole "hands up / running out of a crime scene" is usually associated with "I'm guilty and I am giving myself up- please tackle me at your earliest convenience".
One situation where this may especially be useful, is after a violent encounter on the street. When the police arrive, what do you think would say "I'm the one who called 9-1-1. You don't need to fear me- I'm the victim."
a) Frantically waving your arms at the police car.
b) A cell phone in one hand, and the other hand holding a permit high above your head, while making eye contact with the officer.
Again, if police ASK you to put your hands up or DROP whatever you are holding- just do it.
Always remember that police officers are people too, and if they come up on an actively violent situation, they are going to be trying to get as many details straight as possible, in as little time as possible. Above all, they want to get home to their families- just like you.
Well, I hope this helps, and if anybody has anything to add to this advice (or thinks it's just plain old bad advice), please feel free to contact me using this form:
=> ASK TIM!
Tim Schmidt
USCCA - Owner / Founder
P.S. - Get prepared while you still can.
FROM: Patrick Kilchermann, USCCA
co author, Beat the Ban.
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I recieved this email from concealed carry mag or something. But the next days email tossed all these ideas aside. Pretty much to a person, every leo that wrote to him said the best was to have nothing in your hands, don't reach for anything and just do as they say. Follow instructions, accept getting handcuffed and straighten it out together.
Brian
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During a deadly encounter you want to try and contact 911. If not possible, then immediately following the shoot. If no cell phone, try and get to a phone. If you are alone, hurt, and unable to get to a phone, then you need to tend to your injuries first, and save your life if possible.
But for example's sake, you are ok, and you have made contact with 911. At this point you need to:
1-Give your name
2-Give your location
3-Advise 911 that there has been a shooting and to send help
4-Don't incriminate yourself. They're sending help, not your lawyer!
5-Describe to her what you are wearing....shirt, coat, blue jeans, hat, ect....
6-Tell her you have holstered your weapon. Do not unload it. Your danger of others may still exist.
7-Tell her you wish to stay on the line with her until the Police have arrived, so they no you are the victim.
8-Once the police arrive, keep your hands up over your head and remain that way until they instruct you to do otherwise.
9-Keep your mouth shut until your lawyer can speak to law enforcement for you.
"Anything you say, can, and will be used against you in court" Believe it! You'll probably be detained, maybe even arrested. Don't freak out! Cops are trying to get you to. Remember, your the victim. You did everything right; the way you learned them. Your a legal right-to-carry citizen, who just protected himself with the use of deadly force.
Don't talk to the police. Or anyone else, including family over the phone. Don't fall for their bullshit threats, and lies to coerce you into talking to them. You have rights. One of them is to remain silent. Use it! Wait for your lawyer to get there.
I'm not an attorney, but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night. I know, corney! I had to!