The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: PegLeg45 on June 04, 2009, 04:46:00 PM
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Here's a good sites for some D-Day history and information.
http://www.worldwar2history.info/D-Day/
http://www.army.mil/d-day/
http://www.dday.org/
http://www.ddaymuseum.co.uk/
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Thank you PegLeg. A totally different time, when an entire world said enough to a Nazi Regime. The Germans knew it was coming, and even training for D-Day, Exercise Tiger, killed several hundred soldiers.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exercise_Tiger
Exercise Tiger was the code name for two military exercises held in the United Kingdom during the Second World War:
* The first, conducted in 1942, was an Army-level exercise by Commonwealth forces and the largest ever held in the UK up to then.
* The second, in 1944, was a full-scale rehearsal for the D-Day invasion of Normandy and led to the deaths of more than 700 American troops as a result of both blunders by the Allied forces and enemy attack by German motor torpedo boats (E-boats).
Point being, is WE had to make this work, WE had to get a foothold to get to Berlin. Despite the casualties in training alone, Brave U.S Soldiers, Allied Forces, and common fisherman that piloted supplies in their own boats across the Channel, stayed the course, that led to another day:
V-E Day. May 1945. V-J Day came 3 months later.
It had to be done, and "The Greatest Generation" carried it out.
Too bad it's not taught in schools anymore, except in a brief passing in a watered down American History course.
Current generations could learn so much.
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Maybe current generations will, with you 2 guys, posting stuff like this, I surely hope so, you young people, here is the history of your country and great grand fathers and grand mothers, it is rich, and if your a slacker, it is because your grand parents suffered and strived " so their Son could be a farmer, and his son a lawyer, and his son a poet " now it could go to " musician, slacker, burger king employee " I don't lump all young people in this wrap, but far too many are still living at home, at 25+. Waiting for their inheritance to make a few more miles, until, LIFE, slaps them in the head and they realize, unless they contribute, they are DONE.
Great post!!!!!!!!!!! It just brings things more into perspective, a perspective, I don't really like.
Our parents ( if your 50 or older ) and grand parents, uncles and aunts, were the " Greatest Generation " our culture has been lacking ever since.
My favorite uncle, in the Navy at 14 years old, ( great grand momma lied he was 16 ) and at Pearl Harbor, he was in the shit, lost sight in 1 eye, but survived, and was back on duty rather quickly, did his tour, did not have a bad word to say, it was life. He never talked about it to me about it until I was 38, 39 years old, He died shortly after that, but I remember it all and felt proud that he would share.
In civilian life He had an awning company, and as a child I went with him to work, and saw all these big machine brakes for cutting metal, and machines for corrugating metal, as they did it all in house, He bought me Cokes from the 6 cent 6oz Coke machine, and those Cokes were the real deal, choke one of those cold bad boys back and it brought tears to your eyes. It was nothing for him to drive from from Houston to Dallas to visit us, on a whim, 300 miles and a day trip, Mom would call us kids and say uncle Bill is here. And after lunch, drive back to Houston. I've only done it when I was drunk ( not proud ), but he one eyed it, every day of his life, less 14 for his whole life. I can't imagine driving 300 miles with 1 eye, but he did.
Late in life, He moved back to Alvord Texas, where my mother was born, and lived out his days, farming, never a harsh word, was on the town council for a while, and let me on to some city politics, A stand up guy in every respect, He grew -a 16lb cantaloupe. He is buried in the Alvord cemetery, where a lot of my family is buried, going back a hundred years, that is where my burial plot is next to my mother, and my oldest sister and wife have plots as well, it is on a wind driven hill, but what will I care, when the time comes.
William Sorrels, USN.
I'm proud, but choking on this. Thanks Guys, for giving me the opportunity to share this.
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My humble appreciation and thanks goes to The Greatest Generation the World has ever known!
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Thank you for sharing that story, M25.
As a side note, I read somewhere that our nation is losing its WWII veterans at a rate of over a thousand a day..........stunning.
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Thank you for sharing that story, M25.
As a side note, I read somewhere that our nation is losing its WWII veterans at a rate of over a thousand a day..........stunning.
If you enlisted at 18 in 1945, like the late Bob Keeshan (Captain Kangaroo) You are now about 82 years of age. Whats the average life expectancy for a man nowaday ? 75 ? 85 ? If you know a WWII (or Korean or Vietnam war) Veteran, it is imperative that you encourage them to write, video, or tape their recollections before these historic moments are lost forever to revisionist history.
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I buried my father about 20 years ago, June 6, 1989. While in town, we went through his stuff and I came across a scrapbook of his Naval career which dated from 1938 to 1948. The cover title was “USS Wasp CV-7”. I didn’t think too much of the title then. My brothers and I went through it one morning and recalled how we used to play with his medals when we were kids but couldn’t recall any stories from his time in service.
The scrapbook was handmade, leather bound and was most definitely something that he’d spend a lot of time on over the years. It had pictures, news clips, dates and names of hundreds of sailors, ports of call and all of the commands and ships that he was assigned to. Of the ten years my father was in the service, he’d spent 8 solid years at sea!
I can only imagine the images that he’d seen, the experiences and the tragedy of the years between 1941 and 1945. He never said a word about it, even after his oldest son decided to enlist in 1971, his second son in 1973 and me in 1975. We did it because he had; I did because they all did, it was a simple decision.
I came across that scrapbook again recently and decided to set up a memorial for him on the Together We Served website. While doing the research of the dates and ships, I came across some startling information.
The USS Wasp, CV-7, was sunk on September 15, 1942. My father was reassigned in August 1942 and rotated off the ship. He was a Boiler Tech, Third Class. His chances of survival would have been slim to none.
I wonder who would be typing this if history had been a little bit different?
In fond memory of BTC EJ Bevins 1938-1948
Purple Hearts (2)
Philippine Liberation Medal
Sea Service Deployment (5)
WWII Victory Medal
Thanks Dad!
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I buried my father about 20 years ago, June 7, 1989. While in town, we went through his stuff and I came across a scrapbook of his Naval career which dated from 1938 to 1948. The cover title was “USS Wasp CV-7”. I didn’t think too much of the title then. My brothers and I went through it one morning and recalled how we used to play with his medals when we were kids but couldn’t recall any stories from his time in service.
The scrapbook was handmade, leather bound and was most definitely something that he’d spend a lot of time on over the years. It had pictures, news clips, dates and names of hundreds of sailors, ports of call and all of the commands and ships that he was assigned to. Of the ten years my father was in the service, he’d spent 8 solid years at sea!
I can only imagine the images that he’d seen, the experiences and the tragedy of the years between 1941 and 1945. He never said a word about it, even after his oldest son decided to enlist in 1971, his second son in 1973 and me in 1975. We did it because he had; I did because they all did, it was a simple decision.
I came across that scrapbook again recently and decided to set up a memorial for him on the Together We Served website. While doing the research of the dates and ships, I came across some startling information.
The USS Wasp, CV-7, was sunk on September 15, 1942. My father was reassigned in August 1942 and rotated off the ship. He was a Boiler Tech, Third Class. His chances of survival would have been slim to none.
I wonder who would be typing this if history had been a little bit different?
In fond memory of BTC EJ Bevins 1938-1948
Purple Hearts (2)
Philippine Liberation Medal
Sea Service Deployment (5)
WWII Victory Medal
Thanks Dad!
AWESOME!!!
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Any bets on how BHO will f**k this one up?!?!?
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" I came across that scrapbook again recently and decided to set up a memorial for him on the Together We Served website. While doing the research of the dates and ships, I came across some startling information."
Great post Tim, Thank you for sharing it with us. The sinking of the Wasp must have been VERY traumatic for your Father, leaving him struggling for years with the "survivors guilt" question of "Why me ?".
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My heartfelt "Thanks" to all of you whom have served in our armed forces! We're VERY proud of you!
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Thanks, Tim, for sharing a piece of your family's wealth.
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Also on June 6th
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Memphis
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Belleau_Wood
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Midway
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_Lebanon_War
Birthdays
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathan_Hale
Deaths
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Henry
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Quantrill
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_F._Kennedy
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We are seeing the last of some of the greatest men to ever walk the earth passing right before our eyes. I am glad to have spent time with some of them over the years and all the advice they had to share. All of them are gone now that I used to talk to in my neighborhood when I was a kid.
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My Dad was a pilot, 8th AF, 398th BG, 600th Sq. B-17s out of Nuthampstead, England. Here's a photo of him and his crew:
http://www.398th.org/Images/Images_Crews/Text/Flight/Lowe_600_early1944.html (http://www.398th.org/Images/Images_Crews/Text/Flight/Lowe_600_early1944.html)
My dad, Lt. Donald B. Lowe Jr., is second from left in the back row.
They had a Normandy mission on this day in 1944 - bombing Arromanches or Courseulles - about 2 miles apart.
Dad never talked much about his experiences, it was something they had to do, and the lucky ones came home to pick up their lives. Some years later, the movie The War Lover came out with Steve McQueen. As a promotional stunt, they took the 1 surviving B-17 from the movie (they intentionally crashed 2 others!!!!!), painted "War Lover" across that barn door slab of a wing, and flew it across the country. It landed in Chicago, Midway Airport I recall in the Spring - it was cool, so we went in to see it as a family. I was 13 or so.
It was on this trip I found out a few things:
1. There is no bathroom on the B-17. On the 10-12-hour bomb runs, the call would come up to open the bomb bay doors so guys could relieve themselves.
2. The pilot is the boss of the airplane, no matter what. My Dad had been given the clearance to move out and join the line of planes taking off. As he advanced the throttles and started to move, there was a slight crash and a jolt as the right horizontal stabilizer impacted the supply truck still parked at the back door. He was fined $25 for that little mishap. When I protested that wasn't fair since he was told to move out, Dad said the aircraft was his responsibility as the pilot, so it was on him even though the ground crew screwed up.
3. The flight deck crew entered the plane through a nose hatch by jumping up, grabbing the inside of the hatch bulkhead, chinning themselves on the outside of the plane, swinging their legs and then their bodies into the hatch. As an adult, I can touch the bottom of the hatch easily, but as a runt little 13-year old it seemed to be 20 feet off the ground. We toured the plane from the back door to the flight deck through the bomb bay. Dad made friends with the pilot who also was a B-17 WWII pilot. As we left the flight deck, we all went through the hatch, and down an unsecured aluminum stepladder (no OSHA in those days).
Dad was the last one down the ladder, and I heard him say "I wonder if I still can...". I turned to watch him move the ladder, as a voice from inside the plane yelled out angrily - "Hey, who moved the ladder?" The pilot stuck his head out of the hatch, and said, "Oh, it's you Don, go ahead" - he knew what was happening even if I did not. And by God he did it to, just as if it was still 1944.
Not having served myself (draft #261) I cannot imagine being 25 years old, having the lives of 9 other men in your hands - as well as an expensive, complicated airplane as your responsibility as well - as you fly through AA and enemy fighters to drop 10 tons of stored high explosive on the ground.
To everyone who served on this day 65 years ago, bless you all. You were a hell of an act to follow and sadly I think we have failed you.
Update: PS: I still have the cool leather jacket Dad's wearing in that photo. ;D
And no, it doesn't even begin to fit me anymore! >:( :'(
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WOW! Is all I can come up with, Path. I am always in AWE of those men.
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I'm gonna be really honest with you folks..........I'm not ashamed to admit that when I heard the story about this man on the news this morning during the D-Day ceremony, I got choked up something fierce.
Sixty-five years after surviving the invasion to liberate Europe, he returned for one last visit. An honored guest at the ceremony, Jim Norene, a member of the 502nd Parachute Infantry Regiment of the 101st Airborne – didn't make it to the ceremony. Mr. Norene was gravely ill when he left his home, and he knew that he might not return. But just as he did sixty-five years ago, he came to France anyway. Last night, after visiting the cemetery for one last time, he passed away in his sleep.
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Death comes to all, but great achievements build a monument which shall endure until the sun grows cold.
Ralph Waldo Emerson
THAT is what D-Day was, and what those soldiers accomplished.
Lest We Forget..
I'm gonna be really honest with you folks..........I'm not ashamed to admit that when I heard the story about this man on the news this morning during the D-Day ceremony, I got choked up something fierce.
Sixty-five years after surviving the invasion to liberate Europe, he returned for one last visit. An honored guest at the ceremony, Jim Norene, a member of the 502nd Parachute Infantry Regiment of the 101st Airborne – didn't make it to the ceremony. Mr. Norene was gravely ill when he left his home, and he knew that he might not return. But just as he did sixty-five years ago, he came to France anyway. Last night, after visiting the cemetery for one last time, he passed away in his sleep.
Rest In Peace Jim Norene, and Thank You.
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We ALL die, but these men knew what it truly meant to live.
Pathfinder, One reason Your Dad did not talk to much with you about it may have to do with the fact that taking into account the ENTIRE length of the war the Air Forces had a higher daily casualty rate than the Marines or Army.
The Marines only had casualties when they were engaged in securing an Island and these campaigns rarely if ever exceeded 6 months, The Army troops in Europe were rotated as often as possible , but the Air Forces went up day after day, from 42 on Every B 17 or B 24 lost was ten men,
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We ALL die, but these men knew what it truly meant to live.
Pathfinder, One reason Your Dad did not talk to much with you about it may have to do with the fact that taking into account the ENTIRE length of the war the Air Forces had a higher daily casualty rate than the Marines or Army.
The Marines only had casualties when they were engaged in securing an Island and these campaigns rarely if ever exceeded 6 months, The Army troops in Europe were rotated as often as possible , but the Air Forces went up day after day, from 42 on Every B 17 or B 24 lost was ten men,
Exactly, the rate of attrition in the Air Corps was overwhelming, to say the least.
In the attack by Allied air power, almost 2,700,000 tons of bombs were dropped, more than 1,440,000 bomber sorties and 2,680,000 fighter sorties were flown. The number of combat planes reached a peak of some 28,000 and at the maximum 1,300,000 men were in combat commands. The number of men lost in air action was 79,265 Americans and 79,281 British. [Note: All RAF statistics are preliminary or tentative.] More than 18,000 American and 22,000 British planes were lost or damaged beyond repair.
http://www.anesi.com/ussbs02.htm
http://www.daveswarbirds.com/b-17/contents.htm
Here's a good site for WWII info on air warfare:
http://www.historyofwaronline.com/WW2-2.html
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All that I can say is thanks to the Greatest Generation. My Dad served in the Army Air Corps in WWII. He never talked about it....ever.
Thanks to everyone that puts on a uniform to keep us safe, be they our Armed Forces or anyone in law enforcement.
Thanks to their families that sacrifice every day as well.
God Bless America