The Down Range Forum

Member Section => Tactical Rifle & Carbine => Topic started by: long762range on June 17, 2009, 11:39:21 PM

Title: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: long762range on June 17, 2009, 11:39:21 PM: http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/

New Ruger in Hand
June 11th, 2009 by Mas

As noted here earlier, the rifle is designated SR556, for Sturm, Ruger 5.56 millimeter. It takes standard AR15/M16 magazines, and comes with three of them, produced by Magpul, one of the best makers. It’s the most “vendor-outsourced” firearm this company has ever assembled – really, pretty much everything but the barrel and barrel extension come from outside the factory – but it’s an AR15 clone, after all, and that’s the logical way to make one given the nature of the industry. The trick is to use the best parts.
We toured the production cell at the Newport, New Hampshire plant. Ruger’s switchover to “lean manufacturing” has changed the look of the factory dramatically in the last few years. SR556s were literally flowing off the production line.
But, enough of that: how does it SHOOT?
The subtle feel of the mechanism as it cycles is different from your usual Stoner-type AR15, because the Ruger entry works of a piston design, specifically a proprietary two-piece piston. One of my fellow shooters said, “It feels like a whoosh, not a sproing.” That about describes it, even if it ain’t engineer terminology.
My buddy Russ Lary threw a 6.5-20X variable power Leupold Tactical scope onto his T&E SR556, and cranked it all the way up. Twenty power magnification ain’t much for sophisticated bench rest shooters, but for us meat n’ potatoes riflemen, think “Hubble telescope with crosshairs.” At about 100 yards, he found sub-one-inch groups easy, with Match grade 69 grain and 77 grain loads from Black Hills Ammunition shooting the tightest.
The piston system does indeed run cool. I could race a pair of 30-round magazines through it as fast as I could pull the trigger, and the carrier (bolt) was still room temperature to the touch. I’m told by folks I trust at Ruger that this thing has gone 20,000 rounds without a malfunction OR a cleaning in factory torture-testing. In the several hundred rounds of 5.56mm and .223 Remington that we’ve run through it, we didn’t have any malfs either.
It’s early yet, but I’m likin’ this rifle!
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Kid Shelleen on June 18, 2009, 12:05:47 AM: If Mas likes it that much, it's gotta be pretty good.

Now that I'm retired, I'd be happy to review guns and gear for DRTV. Michael, Marshal feel free to call all of the manufacturers and have them begin sending their latest ASAP. I'll start right away and spend all day every day testing and writing my reviews. No charge, of course.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: CurrieS103 on June 18, 2009, 07:59:23 AM: Kid,
I think they need to send it my way first so I can check it out. Don't want you to have any surprises during your testing. ;D
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Kid Shelleen on June 18, 2009, 11:34:28 AM: Quote from: CurrieS103 on June 18, 2009, 07:59:23 AM
Kid,
I think they need to send it my way first so I can check it out. Don't want you to have any surprises during your testing. ;D
A mighty generous offer, but you'll have to check out much more. I have offered to test all new weapons and gear from every manufacturer. If you're up to this large and very patriotic task, then I welcome your generous assistance. Of course we'll have to get approval from Michael & Marshal.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: CJS3 on June 18, 2009, 06:35:18 PM: Quote from: Kid Shelleen on June 18, 2009, 12:05:47 AM
If Mas likes it that much, it's gotta be pretty good.

I have no doubts that it would be good. The only thing keeping it out of my safe is the price. Ruger is awfully proud of their outsourced marvel.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: fullautovalmet76 on June 22, 2009, 05:41:22 PM: Here's a podcast from Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556:

http://proarms.podbean.com/
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: fightingquaker13 on June 22, 2009, 08:33:16 PM: Not just the price. I have zero doubt that this is a fine rifle. I have never owned a ruger I didn't like or found one hundred percent realiable and if had the cash I would come close to buying one. What would make me pause is the gas pston. It might make the rifle better but, this sort of gun is an SHTF weapon. One of the virtues of ARs is that they are common as dirt and if they're mil spec, parts are interchangeable. I'm not sure I wouldn't fgo with a less exalted (and cheaper) AR instead, just to maintain this advantage.
FQ13
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Big Frank on July 09, 2009, 12:51:23 PM: So SR doesn't mean SIG Retread? ;)
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: mudman on July 09, 2009, 12:55:40 PM: No retarded
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Pathfinder on July 09, 2009, 01:58:51 PM: Quote from: jumbofrank on July 09, 2009, 12:51:23 PM
So SR doesn't mean SIG Retread? ;)

Welcome Back Jumbo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Buckwheat McCoy on July 19, 2009, 05:49:23 PM: I picked up my SR556 Friday the 17th. Took it to the local gun club here in Roseburg, OR the next day. I also own a Bushie M4. I just love my SR556. Being middle aged, half deaf, and half blind, shooting 1" groups at 100 yds was a real thrill for me. The recoil felt more like a gental push, not at all like my Bushie. More like shooting a Ruger 10/22 than an AR. The trigger is what I would call a standard military trigger, heavy, but breaks crisp and clean. Zero travel with just steady pressure until it breaks and goes boom. At 25 yds rapid fire I was able to hold 2" groups. After 20 rounds of rapid fire the bolt assembly was only warm and clean. The only negative I have to say about this weapon is the Troy rail covers. They're a semi-hard plastic. I used some extra UTG rubberized rail covers instead. The three MagPul P Mags (not Mag Level) are very nice. The SR556 retails at Flying Cloud Trading Company, Roseburg, OR for $1450. The Owner is an Uzi collector and I had an Action Arms 9mm in the orginal plastic box along with a 45ACP converstion kit; also in the original case. The Uzi and accessories is worth about $2500; I paid $600 for it about six years ago. We did a straight trade. He's happy and I'm very happy.

I'm not and expert, but I truely believe that Ruger has hit on something here. As far as I'm concerned the SR556 is the new bench mark for all second gen gas piston ARs. Even at $1450 retail I thinks that it's one hell of a good buy. I'm taking my back to the club next Saturday. Mounting a Red Dot and co-witnessing it with the Troy Battle sights is next.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Pathfinder on July 19, 2009, 08:51:23 PM: Buckwheat - great report. Any pictures of the rifle (gun porn) or target (target porn)?

And what rounds were you shooting? And how many?

Enquiring minds want to know.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Kid Shelleen on July 19, 2009, 09:34:26 PM: Quote from: Pathfinder on July 19, 2009, 08:51:23 PM
Buckwheat - great report. Any pictures of the rifle (gun porn) or target (target porn)?

And what rounds were you shooting? And how many?

Enquiring minds want to know.
I second the motion. Like Path, I would really appreciate some gun porn.
Thanks for the range report. It's the first owner report that I have read.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Ping on July 21, 2009, 05:22:55 PM: Thanks Buckwheat McCoy. I am really liking what I have read about the piston AR's. Noticed a guy in Kentucky is selling a set of 3 DPMS AP4's starting at $2,400. If my wife would not boot me out of the house I would have bought them. ;D
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: rhinorex on July 21, 2009, 05:52:29 PM: Buckwheat - nice report. I've ordered my SR556 but have not received it yet. I'm seeing some evidence of carrier tilt issues with the SR556 on ar15.com with photos, but nobody has indicated any failures/stoppages that can be associated with this issue. Can you tell if you have any excessive wear in buffer tube at the bottom? If so, how many rounds and what ammo type did you get through your gun over the weekend? Also what gas setting did you use?

I know I know - lots of questions but inquiring minds want to know.

Thanks
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Buckwheat McCoy on July 21, 2009, 10:28:18 PM: I ran 6 mags (180 rnds) of Wolf 55Grn FMJ through the SR556. I decided on Wolf simply because of all the reports of fouling and malfunction issues with non-piston ARs. I have quite a bit of the Wolf for my Mini 14. I wasn’t taking any chances with my Bushie M4. I plan on running another 6 mags worth of ammo through it this coming weekend. When it’s all said and done, I plan on putting about 1,000 rnds of the Wolf through the gun before I try some "good stuff" (personally I like the Wolf ammo). UMC, Federal, Remington, etc. Once I put another 3-400 rounds of reloadable through the weapon I’ll see what Hornady Taps do. I’ve got some match grade ammo squirreled away that I'll try after that.

I’m using six MagPul P Mags, three standard and three MagLevel. The three standards come with the SR556 and I have a few of the MagLevel that I recently picked up.

Now I’ve only ran 180 rnds, but so far everything has ran just great. I have no evidence of “carrier tilt”. I just checked the buffer and everything appears to be perfectly aligned. But I’ll report back after 500 rnds and then 1000 rnds.

Just to let everyone know, ammo availability here in Southwest Oregon is easing up quite a bit. Prices are still high, but are starting to come down a little with the increased availability. Wolf and UMC 200 rnd bricks are showing up more and more nowadays.

Please remember guys, I’m just a half deaf, half blind middle-aged small-town rural manufactured home living bitter-clinger. I’m no expert by any stretch of the imagination, but I do really like this weapon. If I can rustle up some extra non-committed cash, I’m seriously thinking about buying a second SR556 and selling my Mini14 and Bushie. Fortunately I’m not married, no children, and self-employed. I don’t have to ask permission, just make sure that the mortgage and utilities get paid.

As I run this weapon more I’ll keep you all posted. I'll be surprised if I find any negative issues the the SR556.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Kid Shelleen on July 21, 2009, 10:32:05 PM: Thanks again Buckwheat,

I'm looking forward to the updates. ;)
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: rhinorex on July 23, 2009, 08:51:24 PM: Thanks for the update Buckwheat. I too look foward to hearing more range reports on the SR 556 and that goes for anybody else that wants to share their reports.

Maybe this belongs somewhere else in the forum, but since Buckwheat mentioned Wolf I thought I would chime in. For years I used Wolf 7.62 in Russian and Chinese SKS's and never had any problems. Of course these guns hardly have any issues anyway. In my opinion, the early Wolf ammo (1990's) always ran a little dirty similar but not as bad as the cheap Chinese no-name ammo I bought before the weapons ban.

Now I believe Wolf is much cleaner than it used to be.

Thanks
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Buckwheat McCoy on July 25, 2009, 05:11:47 PM: The "setup" will be on one post and the targets on the second; I hope.

Here is today's Range Report. 11:30 AM, Roseburg Rod and Gun Club, 82 Deg, light breeze from my six o'clock.

Zeroing my TruGlo 2x 30mm Red Dot. It's too low to co-witness without a 1/4" riser. But the battle sights can still bee used without problem. Using Wolf 55grn FMJ and Mag Pul MagLevel magazines. 120 rounds today.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Buckwheat McCoy on July 25, 2009, 05:32:13 PM: Now for the "results???". All using the 2x 300 TruGlo Red Dot. I'm going to try and attach the pictures in between the paragrahps, hope it works.

The first target is the beginning of zeroing the TruGlo. I starte "off target" at the 2 o'clock. Adjusted and then over-adjusted and then finally got the last five into the X ring. This is at 100 yards bench rest.

The second target is also at 100 yards bench rest and "rapid fire"; about 2-3 seconds apart.

The third target (feeling cocky), I tried for a head shot and missed (about 10 o'clock). The second shot got him in the chin and the third between the eyes. 100 yards. Bench rest.

The same third target was "rapid fire" (2-3 seconds) at 100 yards aiming at center mass. Bench rest.

The fourth target was at 25 yards "rapid fire" (1-2 seconds) standing off-hand. I aimed at center mass. As you can see at 25 yards the Red Dot shots low when zeroed at 100 yards.

I'm 54 years old and wear glasses but for my skill level (not very) I'm very happy with the results. This weapon will outshoot me. I have no doubt that in the hands of a younger and more practiced individual, the SR556 is a real winner. I've now ran a total of 300 rounds through the weapon and I don't plan on cleaning it until I hit around 1500 rounds. The bolt and carrier are only slightly dirty and I'm going to wait until round 500 before I run a clean patch down the barrel. Oh, did I mention "zero" malfunctions?

If anyone is thinking about buying an AR, I strongly recommend the Ruger SR556. You can get them in Roseburg, OR at Flying Cloud Trading Company for $1450.

I'm a very very happy boy.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: tombogan03884 on July 25, 2009, 05:48:50 PM: OK, I didn't think I'd be saying this about "just another AR" But 180 rounds of Wolf and good accuracy ? I'm impressed.
Thanks for the report Buckwheat, I've been skipping this thread but just read YOUR posts. Mos may be a great guy but he gets PAID to say nice things about guns. YOU made me a believer. ;D
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Buckwheat McCoy on July 25, 2009, 06:05:28 PM: If anyone wants larger pictures of the targets, let me know and I'll e-mail them to you. The forum only allows for 200KB and the orginals are between 3.5 and 4 Meg.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Kid Shelleen on July 25, 2009, 09:20:54 PM: Thanks for the pics and the excellent report Buckwheat.

When I'm able I'l be picking up a Ruger 556.

Thanks again!!!
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: 1911 Junkie on July 25, 2009, 09:25:12 PM: Price being a consideration and all, I like the folding/collapsable stock that comes on the Para. I'm not in the market for another AR right now, but could the same thing be done with the Ruger? I haven't looked into it to see what the differences are.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Ping on July 25, 2009, 09:29:05 PM: Thanks for the range report and photos Buckwheat McCoy. Rather enticing photos and creates a sudden urge into purchasing one. But, the wife just found out about my order for a new Glock 35 and is a little pissed right now. Ooops. :-\ Guess I will not be making any firearm purchases in the near future.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Timothy on July 25, 2009, 09:35:37 PM: Quote from: Ping on July 25, 2009, 09:29:05 PM
Thanks for the range report and photos Buckwheat McCoy. Rather enticing photos and creates a sudden urge into purchasing one. But, the wife just found out about my order for a new Glock 35 and is a little pissed right now. Ooops. :-\ Guess I will not be making any firearm purchases in the near future.

Reciprocity Ping! Reciprocity!

Just understand you can have anything you want at twice the price. Fourteen hundred for the 556 and another 1400 for her new shoe collection or whatever. With mine it's pocketbooks! ;D ;D
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Kid Shelleen on July 25, 2009, 09:38:34 PM: Quote from: Timothy on July 25, 2009, 09:35:37 PM
Reciprocity Ping! Reciprocity!

Just understand you can have anything you want at twice the price. Fourteen hundred for the 556 and another 1400 for her new shoe collection or whatever. With mine it's pocketbooks! ;D ;D
Mine would want her own 556. ;D
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Ping on July 25, 2009, 09:40:51 PM: LOL. Thanks Timothy. I have been shelling out money on her left and right and thought I was covered. ??? Then she noticed the $17 I spent for the overnight shipment and payment to OMB Guns in Kansas and I could not lie!!! :P
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Ping on July 25, 2009, 09:43:40 PM: Well I am fortunate to have a shooter for a wife. Was trying to bribe her with some Crimson Trace grips. Didn't work but she was gracious.
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Timothy on July 25, 2009, 09:44:12 PM: Lies are too difficult to remember. The truth will set you free and is impossible to forget.

;)
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: tombogan03884 on July 25, 2009, 09:48:07 PM: It's also easier to get forgiveness than permission. ;D
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Ping on July 25, 2009, 10:07:47 PM: But did you notice that I did not lie!!!! ;) I just withheld information to myself. No lies!!!!
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: Pathfinder on July 25, 2009, 10:47:29 PM: Quote from: tombogan03884 on July 25, 2009, 09:48:07 PM
It's also easier to get forgiveness than permission. ;D

Actually, Tom, it's easier to ask forgiveness than permission. It doesn't always work. ;D
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: tombogan03884 on July 25, 2009, 10:52:49 PM: Quote from: Pathfinder on July 25, 2009, 10:47:29 PM
Actually, Tom, it's easier to ask forgiveness than permission. It doesn't always work. ;D

Well yes there is that ;D
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: fightingquaker13 on July 26, 2009, 05:16:13 AM: Quote from: tombogan03884 on July 25, 2009, 10:52:49 PM
Well yes there is that ;D
Of course, even if you don't get forgiven, you've still got the gun. Whereas if you don't get permission, you're SOL. Just sayin'. ;D
FQ13
Title: Re: Massad Ayoob on the Ruger SR 556
Post by: tombogan03884 on July 26, 2009, 11:54:55 AM: Quote from: fightingquaker13 on July 26, 2009, 05:16:13 AM
Of course, even if you don't get forgiven, you've still got the gun. Whereas if you don't get permission, you're SOL. Just sayin'. ;D
FQ13

Nice to see you are coming around to MY way of thinking.
We'll have you quoting "The Guy From Boston" yet ;D