The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: Timothy on August 05, 2009, 07:12:40 AM
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Russian fast attack subs off the east coast...This was my life back in the day! GO NAVY!
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/05/world/05patrol.html
WASHINGTON — A pair of nuclear-powered Russian attack submarines has been patrolling off the eastern seaboard of the United States in recent days, a rare mission that has raised concerns inside the Pentagon and intelligence agencies about a more assertive stance by the Russian military.
The episode has echoes of the cold war era, when the United States and the Soviet Union regularly parked submarines off each other’s coasts to steal military secrets, track the movements of their underwater fleets — and be poised for war.
But the collapse of the Soviet Union all but eliminated the ability of the Russian Navy to operate far from home ports, making the current submarine patrols thousands of miles from Russia more surprising for military officials and defense policy experts.
“I don’t think they’ve put two first-line nuclear subs off the U.S. coast in about 15 years,” said Norman Polmar, a naval historian and submarine warfare expert.
The submarines are of the Akula class, a counterpart to the Los Angeles class attack subs of the United States Navy, and not one of the larger submarines that can launch intercontinental nuclear missiles.
According to Defense Department officials, one of the Russian submarines remained in international waters on Tuesday about 200 miles off the coast of the United States. The location of the second remained unclear. One senior official said the second submarine traveled south in recent days toward Cuba, while another senior official with access to reports on the surveillance mission said it had sailed away in a northerly direction.
The Pentagon and intelligence officials spoke anonymously to describe the effort to track the Russian submarines, which has not been publicly announced.
President Obama spoke by telephone with President Dmitri A. Medvedev of Russia on Tuesday, but it was not clear whether the subject of the submarines came up, although another source of friction between the two countries did. Mr. Medvedev called Mr. Obama to wish him a happy birthday and the White House said the president used the opportunity to urge Russia to work through diplomatic channels to resolve rising tensions with Georgia.
The submarine patrols come as Moscow tries to shake off the embarrassment of the latest failed test of the Bulava missile, a long-range weapon that was test fired from a submarine in the Arctic on July 15. The failed missile test was the sixth since 2005, and some experts see Russia’s assertiveness elsewhere as a gambit by the military to prove its continued relevance.
“It’s the military trying to demonstrate that they are still a player in Russian political and economic matters,” Mr. Polmar said.
One of the submarines is the newer Akula II, officials said, which is quieter than the older variant and the most advanced in the Russian fleet. The Akula is capable of carrying torpedoes for attacking other submarines and surface vessels as well as missiles for striking targets on land and at sea.
Defense Department officials declined to speculate on which weapons might be aboard the two submarines.
While the submarines have not taken any provocative action beyond their presence outside territorial waters of the United States, officials expressed wariness over the Kremlin’s motivation for ordering such an unusual mission.
“Anytime the Russian Navy does something so out of the ordinary it is cause for worry,” said a senior Defense Department official who has been monitoring reports on the submarines’ activities.
The official said the Navy was able to track the submarines as they made their way through international waters off the American coastline. This can be done from aircraft, ships, underwater sensors or other submarines.
“We’ve known where they were, and we’re not concerned about our ability to track the subs,” the official added. “We’re concerned just because they are there.”
Once among the world’s most powerful forces, the Russian Navy now has very few ships regularly deployed on the open seas. Moscow has contributed warships to the international armada searching for Somali pirates. In addition, a flotilla of Russian warships participated in exercises with Venezuela last year.
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The "Cold War" is back on
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According to the US Naval Submarine force, it never ended!
http://www.russiatoday.com/Sci_Tech/2009-03-16/For_the_U.S._submarine_fleet__it_s_still_a_Cold_War_.html?gclid=CKO0-vjfjJwCFQKJxgodZRFFYQ
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Its a test of BHO........ Good 'ol Joe was right
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Its a test of BHO........ Good 'ol Joe was right
BINGO!
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BINGO!
Remember the handshake snubs?
The Russians have no respect for the "weak" U.S. president (I know, but in this instance "president" does not deserve capitalization).
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Even OUR liberals view him as a "Token black" other wise they would not assume every one who opposes his socialist agenda was racist.That right there tells me THEY only voted for him because he's black. Why would the REST of the world view him as anything more than Affirmative action gone berserk.
I noted in the article the Navy said they had been tracking them for a couple weeks. I thought the Akula class were the ones made super quiet with stolen US technology ? ;D
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I noted in the article the Navy said they had been tracking them for a couple weeks. I thought the Akula class were the ones made super quiet with stolen US technology ? ;D
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D :o :o :o ;D ;D ;D ;D
Have I ever mentioned how the Navy gets the COOLEST TOYS?
;)
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;D ;D ;D ;D ;D :o :o :o ;D ;D ;D ;D
Have I ever mentioned how the Navy gets the COOLEST TOYS?
;)
I know that most of the research information about "Whale songs" came from the Navy ;D
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I know that most of the research information about "Whale FARTS" came from the Navy ;D
Corrected for clarity!
:)
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I honestly think the initial report was right. This has little to do with us and a whole lot to do with Russian domestic politics. Their Navy has been showing its ass ever since they lost that sub a few years back and repeated failed missle tests just drove it home. Let them patrol. We're all about freedom of the seas and it gives the ASW boys something to do.
FQ13
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Without going into any detail, I can assure one and all that these two boats barely made it out of Polyarny before they were picked up.
As far as the ASW community having something to do? Well the Chinese have been building diesel boats for several years now, the Russians are not too much concern. When a diesel boat goes quiet it's like a hole in the ocean, you will NEVER find them until they light the torch again....Diesel boats are scary shit to an ASW spook....trust me!
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Without going into any detail, I can assure one and all that these two boats barely made it out of Polyarny before they were picked up.
As far as the ASW community having something to do? Well the Chinese have been building diesel boats for several years now, the Russians are not too much concern. When a diesel boat goes quiet it's like a hole in the ocean, you will NEVER find them until they light the torch again....Diesel boats are scary shit to an ASW spook....trust me!
The Kelsey Grammer movie "Down Periscope" contained a lot of truth on that subject.
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I know this is serious but I had to change my dark mood. This story reminded me of the movie, "The Russians Are Coming the Russians Are Coming!"
Rent it if you want a break from the mess Obama, Pelosi and Reed are making. You almost got me started again.
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As long as there are former KGB agents in charge of Russia's government, there will always be a Cold War. I do not and will not ever trust Russians nor the Chinese.
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As long as there are former KGB agents in charge of Russia's government, there will always be a Cold War. I do not and will not ever trust Russians nor the Chinese, nor the gubmint.
Altered for accuracy. ;D
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One thing about the Ruskies, they always go to sea with their best. RED OCTOBER
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Their best usually isn't that good though.
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Remember the Russian "silent" sub that was covered with rubber? It worked okay until the rubber came loose and started flapping around. Then it was noisy.
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Our Navy tracked one of those because one of the crew jogged around the engine room every day and the could hear his sneakers on the deck.
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Capt. Vasili Borodin: I will live in Montana. And I will marry a round American woman and raise rabbits, and she will cook them for me. And I will have a pickup truck... maybe even a "recreational vehicle." And drive from state to state. Do they let you do that?
Captain Ramius: I suppose.
Capt. Vasili Borodin: No papers?
Captain Ramius: No papers, state to state.
(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm182/twyacht/bloghuntoctober_4.jpg)
This cat and mouse stuff has been going on for how many years?
I think it's great,... we PING them, they disappear, we find them and PING them again... Plus a couple hundred miles offshore, is open ocean,..Our Navy guys play the "game" better than anyone...
Let em' play,...
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Great movie with really bad intelligence....
Technically, we don't need or want to ping them. That's active sonar and if you let out a ping you've given up your position to the entire fleet! The only time you use active sonar is when your hunting and intend to kill the target!
Russia still has a couple of Typhoons up in Polyarny, see a previous thread for pictures...basically a rusting bucket of poorly engineered junk like the rest of the Russian Navy....
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During the Yeltsin years some of them actually sank at the dock due to neglect.
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During the Yeltsin years some of them actually sank at the dock due to neglect.
Do a google earth look at Polyarny and Mermansk area and you can still see them sitting at the docks....
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Thanks for the tip ;D