The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Politics & RKBA => Topic started by: Hazcat on October 05, 2009, 02:46:37 PM
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TAMPA — Police have arrested a male suspect at the University of South Florida, and are sending a bomb disposal unit to check the man's belongings.
But nearly two hours after the first reports of an armed intruder on campus, police were still responding to reports of other potential threats, including one of a white male in the Cooper Hall area carrying a puppy and a large hunting knife.
Initial reports focused on the campus library, but police were then sent to the transportation center on the north side of the Tampa campus.
A hostage negotiator was dispatched to the scene, said Lt. Meg Ross, a spokeswoman for the USF Police Department.
"We're trying to take action until we confirm otherwise," she said.
Earlier, a report of an armed intruder on the Tampa campus prompted the University of South Florida to send out a warning in a mass text message at 1:51 p.m.
"Emergency: Armed intruder on campus. Stay inside. Lock doors. Emergency Personnel Responding.''
The initial alert followed a 1:36 p.m. call to the Hillsborough County Sheriff's Office of an armed person at the campus library. The call was routed to the USF Police Department.
She said there were no reports of shots being fired or people being hurt, and the department was still in the process of verifying the report of an armed intruder.
"We are still trying to secure the area," she said.
Bay News 9 reports that the person with a gun was outside the library building.
Junior Hannah Quill said she was just leaving her calculus class in building CW-Y, which houses the campus Reserved Officers Training Corps programs, when she heard a loud, audible alarm outside.
"I walked outside and heard one of those massive alarms,'' she said, and a message "that said, 'Armed intruder on campus,'" she said. "It sounded like one of those tornado alarms up north, really loud.
"Everyone is like in classrooms on lockdown," she said. "I saw quite a few police cars heading towards the front of campus."
A few moments later, she got a text message on her cell phone.
"Report of an armed campus intruder at the library," Quill said, reading from the message. "Avoid area and report anything suspicious."
No other details were immediately available. Please return to tampabay.com for updates.
http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/crime/article1041681.ece
Comments at link
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Lots of "reports", but it seems nothing actually happened.
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Yet another reason to allow CCW on college campuses. I am very much against allowing guns in dorms due to drugs, alchohol, teen angst, poor security etc. BUT if you were to put a minimum age of say 25 on it, and exclude undergrad housing, profs and older commuter students would be there. Locking me down in my classroom is one thing, locking me down with my Glock is something else. It is perhaps foolish to hope folks will learn from this,but .....
FQ13
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Yet another reason to allow CCW on college campuses. I am very much against allowing guns in dorms due to drugs, alchohol, teen angst, poor security etc. BUT if you were to put a minimum age of say 25 on it, and exclude undergrad housing, profs and older commuter students would be there. Locking me down in my classroom is one thing, locking me down with my Glock is something else. It is perhaps foolish to hope folks will learn from this,but .....
FQ13
The Main issue I have with your plan, even though it might be a step in the right direction, is that it will only encourage those bent on mayhem to move their target acquisition zones from classrooms, libraries, etc., to undergrad dorms. And the arbitrary 25 year old minimum age simply means that those under 25 don't have the same rights of self-defense as those 25 and over. While I share your concern about guns in dorms, we must remember that, even in college dormitories, an armed society is more likely to be a polite society.
So I agree with you about 50%.....which is more than we've agreed on some other things.
Does that mean there's hope for you, or hope for me? ;D
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The Main issue I have with your plan, even though it might be a step in the right direction, is that it will only encourage those bent on mayhem to move their target acquisition zones from classrooms, libraries, etc., to undergrad dorms. And the arbitrary 25 year old minimum age simply means that those under 25 don't have the same rights of self-defense as those 25 and over. While I share your concern about guns in dorms, we must remember that, even in college dormitories, an armed society is more likely to be a polite society.
So I agree with you about 50%.....which is more than we've agreed on some other things.
Does that mean there's hope for you, or hope for me? ;D
I hope the latter. ;D Remember though, I teach these folks everyday. College kids are by definition idiots. Two words, Beer Bong. The thing is, I remember my own lunacy back in the day and I see it every at work. If I had a dollar for every time I've seen one my students bare ass naked or shitfaced drunk (generally at the same time) I would have a gun collection like BillT's. The words "Hold my beer and watch this" were designed for a college dorm. Personally, I think I'd be safer with the theoretical whack job.
FQ13 who speaks from experience
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I hope the latter. ;D Remember though, I teach these folks everyday. College kids are by definition idiots. Two words, Beer Bong. The thing is, I remember my own lunacy back in the day and I see it every at work. If I had a dollar for every time I've seen one my students bare ass naked or shitfaced drunk (generally at the same time) I would have a gun collection like BillT's. The words "Hold my beer and watch this" were designed for a college dorm. Personally, I think I'd be safer with the theoretical whack job.
FQ13 who speaks from experience
Of course they are.......look who they have teaching them. ;D
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I hope the latter. ;D Remember though, I teach these folks everyday. College kids are by definition idiots. Two words, Beer Bong. The thing is, I remember my own lunacy back in the day and I see it every at work. If I had a dollar for every time I've seen one my students bare ass naked or shitfaced drunk (generally at the same time) I would have a gun collection like BillT's. The words "Hold my beer and watch this" were designed for a college dorm. Personally, I think I'd be safer with the theoretical whack job.
FQ13 who speaks from experience
Off topic....
I hate to remind you but this statement alone, proves WHY the college kids don't deserve the acolades they get in today's workforce. I work twenty feet away from one of these idiots who makes believe he actually knows what he's doing. I prove to him daily that he's not only under-educated but completely inept...and he went to a good school, Northeastern...
I'll hire someone WITHOUT a degree in a heartbeat if they can prove their worthy. Someone flashes a degree in my face, I'm going to take it with much reservation and probably take a pass.....
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Of course they are.......look who they have teaching them. ;D
http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=9198.msg118825#msg118825
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FQ 3 words," Equal protection clause"
On campus carry must be allowed for any one who qualifies for a permit, and cannot be prohibited in Residential areas.
In fact, regardless of school policy I do not believe students who legally own them can be prevented from having fire arms in their living quarters now if the school accepts Govt. funding.
That was the basis of the San Francisco gun case.
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FQ 3 words," Equal protection clause"
On campus carry must be allowed for any one who qualifies for a permit, and cannot be prohibited in Residential areas.
In fact, regardless of school policy I do not believe students who legally own them can be prevented from having fire arms in their living quarters now if the school accepts Govt. funding.
That was the basis of the San Francisco gun case.
Guns for me, but not for thee!
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Guns for me, but not for thee!
Tom and Eric
Here we get back to the old arguments about property rights vs gun rights. I agree the 25 yr old age bar is probably a loser in court (though I still think its not a bad idea). Lets take that off the table. The question is then, can a school bar guns from the dorms? Many schools bar booze even if you are 21 and some bar having a member of the opposite sex in your room/floor even though sex is legal in every state if you're over 18. The dorms are school property, they are liable if the rules permit unsafe behavior and someone gets hurt. Its why schools ban booze, even if they don't even attempt to enforce it. The reality is that 18-21 olds get angry, depressed homesick, despondent, know they've just lost the love of their life, drink way too much beer/smoke too much weed, play dumb pranks etc. I don't think adding guns to that mix is wise. Bring them to campus, fine. Undergrad student housing, not so much.
FQ13
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Tom and Eric
Here we get back to the old arguments about property rights vs gun rights. I agree the 25 yr old age bar is probably a loser in court (though I still think its not a bad idea). Lets take that off the table. The question is then, can a school bar guns from the dorms? Many schools bar booze even if you are 21 and some bar having a member of the opposite sex in your room/floor even though sex is legal in every state if you're over 18. The dorms are school property, they are liable if the rules permit unsafe behavior and someone gets hurt. Its why schools ban booze, even if they don't even attempt to enforce it. The reality is that 18-21 olds get angry, depressed homesick, despondent, know they've just lost the love of their life, drink way too much beer/smoke too much weed, play dumb pranks etc. I don't think adding guns to that mix is wise. Bring them to campus, fine. Undergrad student housing, not so much.
FQ13
They are not legally banning those things that you mention.... it is just part of their policy that you must comply with in order to attend..... just like not allowing freshmen to have cars.
"Lets take that off the table.", and then two sentences later you bring it back up ???
By your logic and the reasons that you cited, NO ONE under age 25 should be able to own a gun.
You, Sir, are an idiot....... and a sorry example of a Libertarian.
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When I was an undergrad my institution of higher learning had a ban on guns on campus. While attending school and living on campus I also worked for the local county Sheriff's Office as a Deputy. The Sheriff and the college President had a little meeting of the minds and the Prez was informed that I was REQUIRED to be armed 24/7 as a condition of my employment. He further told the Prez that if he wanted to make an issue of it, the local LEO's would make an issue of college students doing the stupid things that college students do. ZERO tolerance. The Prez elected to allow ONE firearm on campus.
Of course, this was 30-some years ago, but I digress.
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They are not legally banning those things that you mention.... it is just part of their policy that you must comply with in order to attend..... just like not allowing freshmen to have cars.
"Lets take that off the table.", and then two sentences later you bring it back up ???
By your logic and the reasons that you cited, NO ONE under age 25 should be able to own a gun.
You, Sir, are an idiot....... and a sorry example of a Libertarian.
Beg to differ friend, I am neither of the above. I merely pointed out that age restriction beyond the legal one would not hold up in court. The second age mention was merely to point out the fact that kids do dumb things and tend to get overwrought in an environment like the dorms. Its why the military generally puts restrictions on having a firearm in the barracks. Again, bring them to school, keep them out of the dorms. TT is an execption, a cop "on duty" 24/7 is a lot less likely (though not immune to) hold my beer and watch this behavior.
FQ13
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Beg to differ friend, I am neither of the above.
FQ13
You're right... I never should have called you "Sir", and I certainly never should have used the word "Logic". (http://www.smileyx.com/smilies/mad0228.gif)
(http://www.smileyx.com/smilies/fighting0067.gif) http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=6440.msg83245#msg83245
(http://www.smileyx.com/smilies/fighting0067.gif) http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=8287.msg105815#msg105815
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OK, You understand that the age bar won't hold up in court because of the equal protection clause.
Now check this out, The SF case was the city prohibited the possession of fire arms in city owned housing. A Gay guy sued because he felt the need to protect himself. As I understand his case an entity that receives taxpayer funding can not make the surrender of a Constitutional right a condition of participation. The city lost and declined to appeal.
It has nothing to do with "Property Rights" since through public funding it is the property of us all.
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Someone please explain to the Professor that nothing in the Military remotely resembles a college dormatory. Most of the children in college dorms would not make a good mole on a GI's ass!
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He knows all about it Tim. He was in ROTC.
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Someone please explain to the Professor that nothing in the Military remotely resembles a college dormatory. Most of the children in college dorms would not make a good mole on a GI's ass!
Someone needs to explain to the professor that nothing on a college campus remotely resembles the real world.
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He knows all about it Tim. He was in ROTC.
So, he's not a REAL vet? FQ....did you serve at least 180 consecutive days on active duty?
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So, he's not a REAL vet? FQ....did you serve at least 180 consecutive days on active duty?
Nope, and I've never pretended to be one either. Four years of ROTC and thats it. I do love the army as I owe them my education and a whole lot of growing up. I was in the magic class of '91. The Cold War was over, we won Dessert Storm,Congress was busy spending (excuse me investing) the "peace dividend" and the army was down sizing whole divisions. They didn't need a whole bunch of new butter bars. It was cheaper to cut us loose than train us and pay us to staff units that no longer existed.They gave us a choice (except for the cadets who had gotten RA rather than reserve or NG commisions, them, they wanted). Either walk away with a full ride, or accept the commission you were promised (and earned BTW). I hesitated a patriotic 30 seconds before joining the majority of my classmates before saying "so long and thanks for the fish". In retrospect I regret it sometimes as it does make you wonder how you would have done at the job you trained for four years. It wasn't just cadets either. One of my compatriots (she was 25 but a freshman) was an E-6 who been given a $15k bonus NOT to reenlist. Of course she banked it and got an ROTC shcolarship instead, but no one said the army made sense. As it is, I signed on the dotted line, trained and was prepared to go, but I just got lucky, or unlucky, depending on you POV.
FQ13
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So, I guess I won't be suffering any more "Squid" jokes then!
You have not earned the right to joke about Squids, Jarheads, Grunts or Flyboys...you just played one for a few years and that won't gain you entry into the club....sorry!
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So, I guess I won't be suffering any more "Squid" jokes then!
You have not earned the right to joke about Squids, Jarheads, Grunts or Flyboys...you just played one for a few years and that won't gain you entry into the club....sorry!
Hell Timothy, anyone can joke about squids, even if you kick army's ass on a regular basis in football. Oddly, it was rugby between GT's army team and GW's navy team, but it was college and the '80's so allowances had to be made. Still, y'all won. :P
FQ13
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The Army has more ships than the Navy, more airplanes than the Air force (which we started) and trains the Marines!
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The Army has more ships than the Navy
The little known "Ghost Fleet"!
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The Army has more ships than the Navy, more airplanes than the Air force (which we started) and trains the Marines!
Damn straight! I may not have served active duty, but I did take the oath and sign the papers. It was the army's call, not mine, to give me a choice to take a job in ordinance (there's a scary thought ;D) vs an out. I chose the out. It doesn't change the fact that I didn't know that going in, and was prepared to go the distance. I seriously love the army. If it weren't for them, I wouldn't have gotten my education and I will be grateful for that till the day I die. I tell my students to this day, you CAN afford the education, you just have to be willing to pay for it. I was, and the army came through.
FQ13
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Damn straight! I may not have served active duty, but I did take the oath and sign the papers. It was the army's call, not mine, to give me a choice to take a job in ordinance (there's a scary thought ;D) vs an out. I chose the out. It doesn't change the fact that I didn't know that going in, and was prepared to go the distance. I seriously love the army. If it weren't for them, I wouldn't have gotten my education and I will be grateful for that till the day I die. I tell my students to this day, you CAN afford the education, you just have to be willing to pay for it. I was, and the army came through.
FQ13
ALWAYS CAPITALIZE when speaking of the US Army!
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ALWAYS CAPITALIZE when speaking of the US Army!
Do I have to capitalize clips? ;D
FQ13
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Do I have to capitalize clips? ;D
FQ13
Only after I affix them to your balls!
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Only after I affix them to your balls!
Yes Sargeant ! Heard and understood! (PS can we aim litterally a little more above the belt? Because clips and balls should not be mentioned in the same sentence unless you're M'lette, and even then, only after careful negotiation). ;D ;D ;D
FQ13 who will be in the corner
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The Army has more ships than the Navy, more airplanes than the Air force (which we started) and trains the Marines!
In what ?
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Yes Sargeant ! Heard and understood! (PS can we aim litterally a little more above the belt? Because clips and balls should not be mentioned in the same sentence unless you're M'lette, and even then, only after careful negotiation). ;D ;D ;D
FQ13 who will be in the corner
DAMMIT, 'crute! It is spelled Sergeant, and It is proceeded by YES and it damn well be the first and last words out of your mouth!
Now DROP AND START PUSHING! I'll tell you when I'm tired!
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In what ?
I trained them as MPs at Ft McClellan. Most technical skills are taught to the Marines by other branches. It is a cost savings for the Marines.
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Oh, I knew that all the electrics stuffed trained with the Army, and I had heard they shut our Motor T school and sent it to Ft. Leonard Wood.
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Damn straight! I may not have served active duty, but I did take the oath and sign the papers. It was the army's call, not mine, to give me a choice to take a job in ordinance (there's a scary thought ;D) vs an out. I chose the out. It doesn't change the fact that I didn't know that going in, and was prepared to go the distance. I seriously love the army. If it weren't for them, I wouldn't have gotten my education and I will be grateful for that till the day I die. I tell my students to this day, you CAN afford the education, you just have to be willing to pay for it. I was, and the army came through.
FQ13
Spoken like a true Berkley Professor!
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ARLINGTON, Va. — The Marine Corps is a military service branch within the Department of the Navy and since November 10, 1775, its warriors have fought at the tip of America’s military spear. Still, some believe that as a branch within the Navy department, the Marine Corps doesn’t get the recognition it deserves.
Rep. Walter B. Jones of North Carolina hopes to change that with Congressional Bill H.R. 24, which proposes to change the title of the Department of the Navy to the Department of the Navy and Marine Corps.
“It’s three words. It’s symbolic, but I think it’s important,” said Jones who has been trying to push this bill since Dec. 13, 2001.
In the short time since the current bill was reintroduced Jan. 6, it currently has 200 cosponsors, which is more than this bill has ever had in its previous attempts in Congress, said George Mulvaney, a former Marine and Korean War veteran.
The process a bill goes through to become a law starts at the House of Representatives. If the House votes “yes” to the bill becoming a law, then it is sent to the Senate where the same process occurs. If both the House and Senate agree, then the bill is sent to the president and he makes the final decision on whether or not it becomes law.
In order to speed up the lawmaking process, Jones enlisted the help of Senator, and former Marine, Pat Roberts of Kansas. Roberts introduced an identical bill, S. 504, into the Senate. This is known as a companion bill, and it speeds up the process by allowing the bill to travel through the House and Senate at the same time, Mulvaney said
In the eight years that H.R. 24 has been circulating, it has garnered a lot of support from both the military and civilians. Among the supporters are former Commandants of the Marine Corps Gen. Charles Krulak and Gen. Carl Mundy and former Secretaries of the Navy Paul Nitz and John Dalton.
Krulak cited the bill as a logical evolution in a series of legislation designed to clarify the role of the United States Marine Corps. He said he supports both its “spirit and intent.”
The National Security Act of 1947 defined the Marine Corps, Army, Navy and Air Force as four separate services with their own individual missions. Furthermore, the Goldwater-Nichols Act of 1986 stated that each service branch commander serves equally on the Joint Chiefs of Staff. However, even though there are four chiefs of staff, there are still only three Departments, Mulvaney said.
If passed, the day-to-day life of Marines won’t change. The only thing that will change is the Marines will finally get the recognition they deserve, Jones said.
All bills start as an idea, and most never make it past that stage, he added. With a strong following and a lot of supporters, H.R. 24 becoming a law is starting to look more like a reality.
If Jones has his way, his eight year crusade will succeed with this Congress, and the Department of the Navy will be known as the Department of the Navy and Marine Corps. If not, he said there’s always next Congress.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/news/2009/04/mil-090413-mcn01.htm#
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Thank's Tim, I had not heard of that
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Thank's Tim, I had not heard of that
Your Welcome...
Knowing the speed of Gubment, it will travel to "The halls of Montezuma and the shores of Tripoli" before it gets passed!
Regardless, Marines continue to fight our countries battles!
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Mc the General
said the Marines get enough credit.
Pissed them off to. Rightly so.
SQUIDS FLOAT
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Mac. said that at the beginning of WWII. After several years of experience he refused to accept Command in Korea unless he was Guaranteed at least one Division of Marines.