The Down Range Forum

Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: TAB on May 28, 2020, 12:28:23 PM

Title: American made.
Post by: TAB on May 28, 2020, 12:28:23 PM
So recently i have been looking to buy some products, but can not find any that are made in the usa. Whats worse is i can get them from china ( illegally mind you, but from  the same factory  as the real thing) for 1/8th the cost the company sells them for. The material costs are litterely  a few dollars on something that sells for $80...

My sickness of not being able to leave things be has lead me down the road to actually get pricing for producing said products.  I have ball park pricing for a small trial  production run and a meeting with a lawyer tomorrow.
If so my big selling point is made in the usa, on us made machines at a livable  wage.   


Its a sickness i tell you, a sickness.


Ps and tom, thanks for the imput, funny thing it actually made me want to do it.   I a cnc shop, tube bender and a injection moulding shop on board now.  Just need to find/ buy a vibratory polisher and a hand reemer to de burr.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: alfsauve on May 28, 2020, 01:44:08 PM
Look forward to learning more about this project.

Two Anecdotes:

During my brief hospital visit I decided to replace my toaster with a US made one.   Don't ask why this just became an issue, but when you're confined to a hospital bed with no visitors and lousy cable TV the mind does strange things.    Long and short I think I got took, it's from an Australian company with a US presence, but I think ultimately it still came from China.   

Today I was visiting Academy Sports and for some odd reason, decided to look at fishing rods (I haven't been fishing in decades and don't anticipate doing so in the near future).   Much to my shock most of them were made in China.    Really?     If do go fishing, I just might try making my own rod.  I didn't dare even look closely at reels.  My guess it there's not a US made one.

Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on May 28, 2020, 05:25:14 PM
Its just some bent ss tubing that for some reason cost $80.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Timothy on May 28, 2020, 06:13:28 PM
Seamless or welded tube?
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on May 28, 2020, 06:29:03 PM
Seemless.   5/8 od .012 wall thickness.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on May 28, 2020, 06:35:53 PM
 ;D   
https://www.mscdirect.com/browse/tn/Abrasives/Deburring-Tools/Hand-Deburring-Tool-Sets?navid=12100123

 ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Timothy on May 28, 2020, 06:39:21 PM
Seemless.   5/8 od .012 wall thickness.

Stainless I presume?  Seamless is more expensive and small quantity can be costly. 

McMaster Carr or Grainger will be way overpriced so finding a large house for big quantities is a way to keep cost down

(30 years in manufacturing, purchasing and process development...)
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on May 28, 2020, 07:03:58 PM
Fresh caught Norwegian haddock filets.
Come in boxes covered with Chinese writing where they were sent for packing.   :-\

TAB will wind up running another business.   ;D
Everytime he sees something he could build FT* gets a new product line.   ;D
Cool, some one to tell about my bright ideas .   ;D


*  Fabrique TAB     ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on May 28, 2020, 07:44:51 PM
Stainless I presume?  Seamless is more expensive and small quantity can be costly. 

McMaster Carr or Grainger will be way overpriced so finding a large house for big quantities is a way to keep cost down

(30 years in manufacturing, purchasing and process development...)
  only about $.40/  ft for 316. If i buy in 20' sticks.   McC wanted almost $2/ ft.

If your intrested i can show you the product in a pm.  Its basicly, some bending, cnc lathe, cnc milling , tig tacts and vibratory  polishing.     I would be shocked if you made some very basic fixturing  for the mill you could easily pop out 10 a min with load times.   The lathe with bar feeder would not be far from that.    Only real hand time is de burr and tig tact.  Which i am sure could be done in under 2 mins .

The prob is a very niche product and at its current  price point it is worth it.  Drop that down a 25% it gets less so.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: alfsauve on May 29, 2020, 07:57:45 AM
  only about $.40/  ft for 316. If i buy in 20' sticks.   McC wanted almost $2/ ft.

There is a theater lighting company that sells 1/2" black iron pipe for $10/ft also.   I was in the wrong end of that business, for sure.
 
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on May 29, 2020, 09:58:13 AM
I'll try to pass on other challenges .   ;D
I've gotten that way.   ;D
Little story.
I know a retired Airborne Major who's main non military interest is Newspaper, He's been working at it since he was a kid, Literary club at Dartmouth, and involved in unit papers on duty, becomes the local history columnist here when he retired.
I challenged him thusly.
F*ck, The word is considered vulgar and not used in "polite society" (the old Bluenoses who don't   ;D)
Find an unvulgar word that serves as many varied meanings.
F*ck you, F*ck this, f*cking A ,  etc.
He never has, that was a year ago, and every now and then he still mentions not being able to find any printable word that serves as well. 
It's one of those little things that won't go away   ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Rastus on May 30, 2020, 09:10:49 AM
Seemless.   5/8 od .012 wall thickness.

SS tubing....I've bent miles and miles of it working as an instrument tech offshore Louisiana.  Mostly 1/4" and 3/8"...some 1/2".  I used to repair and refurbish pneumatic/hydraulic control panels.  Loved that work....but I went back to school because I worked with so many highly paid dumb engineers and I figured I could make it as an engineer and make a few more $$$$'s.

Gee that's old memories.  Yep...Grainger and those other guys were expen$ive.  The best sources are around refining centers....both for price and availability.  I used to get it shipped down to Venice, LA, to be put on a boat with at least 1,000' at a time.  I also ordered rolls of 1/4" for well installations.  If you need compression fittings the Swagelok brand is the best...and you pay for it...but the Parker brand get's the job done and the ferrule is one piece.  Of course things may have changed on that.  The best valves used to be Whitey brand...all of this is stuff I quit doing mid-80's so things may have changed.

The deburring tool may be needed for that large of tubing....however on the smaller stuff like I worked on up to 1/2" the tubing cutters had a deburring tool built onto the back of them (just a hardened piece of metal with a deburring lip cut into it) that worked just fine. 

Depending on your pressures and the tightness of bends you may not need that seamless tubing.  I usually bought seamless tubing but never had seamed tubing fail at pressures at or below design pressure.  Even with a 180 degree curve to fit into panels.  The big leak factors were not installing the compression fittings correctly and once in place vibration wear.  That stainless is relatively soft compared to regular steel pans and mounts that equipment is placed on that we attached the SS tubing too.

Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Timothy on May 30, 2020, 10:21:27 AM
Swagelok fittings are the best!  I agree!  Tough to make a mistake with their go-no go gauge supplied!  Don’t remember if 5/8” is a common size though.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on May 30, 2020, 11:33:25 PM
 i am looking to start selling the end of August  at this point.   I am going to try and send a few to youtube people to see if they like them.  After that they will most likely be sold on amazon.  The cost of building a web site is too much for what ammounts to me " playing" to see where it goes. Still have to come up with a name, i want something thqt says us made, with out being tacky.  I doubt it will even go past tye 1st 500, but who knows.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on May 31, 2020, 08:20:01 AM
See what I mean ?   ;D

It's a gift, like painting, or a good memory.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Rastus on May 31, 2020, 08:39:41 AM
Seemless.   5/8 od .012 wall thickness.

.012?  That may be a specialty product....at least for the pneumatic/hydraulic control and sensor world.  In this catalog on page 5 there's a table of common fractional tubing sizes, wall thicknesses and pressure ratings:  https://www.swagelok.com/downloads/webcatalogs/EN/MS-01-107.PDF (https://www.swagelok.com/downloads/webcatalogs/EN/MS-01-107.PDF)

It appears, from this table, that 5/8" tubing in the thinnest wall, .049", has a pressure rating of 2,900 psi depending on application factors.  The thickest wall commonly available for 5/8" tubing listed is 0.095" good for 6,000 psi.  Whatever it is you are replacing would be seriously upgraded by either.....a selling point.

An issue may be the connection.  That thin wall stuff may not work well with a compression fitting like i'm accustomed to. 
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on May 31, 2020, 09:15:54 AM
The product in question holds zero pressure and is decortive in nature.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Rastus on June 02, 2020, 09:22:24 AM
The product in question holds zero pressure and is decortive in nature.

Whhaaaatttt?  Well heck...it only needs to be thick enough to bend.

Chrome plating?
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on June 02, 2020, 10:13:50 AM
Whhaaaatttt?  Well heck...it only needs to be thick enough to bend.

Chrome plating?

I will pm you a link it will make sense then.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: PegLeg45 on June 02, 2020, 11:23:46 AM
Swagelok fittings are the best!  I agree!  Tough to make a mistake with their go-no go gauge supplied!  Don’t remember if 5/8” is a common size though.

Ahhh,, good ol' Swagelock....brings back memories. We kept thousands of $$ worth on hand at all times. We used valves, regulators, and fittings from 1/4" up to 2" at the time as well as other products made by them.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on June 27, 2020, 03:54:14 PM
So a lady i sent a preproduction model did some instagram and facebook live stuff with it yesterday.   I had about 200 emails this morning asking where and when i can get them.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on June 27, 2020, 05:01:48 PM
TAB is the only guy I know who can turn a can of beans into a natural gas contract  ;D
Good for you.
Did you do anything different that's patentable ?
I can't get Rollin White out of my mind .    ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on June 27, 2020, 07:59:51 PM
TAB is the only guy I know who can turn a can of beans into a natural gas contract  ;D
Good for you.
Did you do anything different that's patentable ?
I can't get Rollin White out of my mind .    ;D
  yes, but its not enforceable.    All i did was change the style of control vavle on thr intake to suck more from the skimmer.   The other one use a bypass sleave. Just twist to control the flow.   I went with a tapped hole in the skimmer and a ss cap head screw.  With a ss allen key.  So you dont have to get your hands wet.   I am sure as soon as it bits china, they will be made as soon as they do thier next production run.  Its a stupidly simple part, there is no reason for it to cost what it does.   I doubt i will make a 2nd batch, but we will see.   I could sell off the desgin with cam and cad stuff to a vender so they could be exclusive, but  i doubt some one will pony up 10k for it.  It will just go down as one of those projects i wanted, so i made lots more of them.   Lots of emails asking about it so far, up to around 600 now.   Only have 506 units.



Oh and trust me, beans give me plenty on natrual gas.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on June 28, 2020, 09:15:14 AM
.   I could sell off the desgin with cam and cad stuff to a vender so they could be exclusive, but  i doubt some one will pony up 10k for it.  It will just go down as one of those projects i wanted, so i made lots more of them.   Lots of emails asking about it so far, up to around 600 now.   Only have 506 units.



Oh and trust me, beans give me plenty on natrual gas.

So what ?
Put it out there any way, (The product, not the gas   ;D  )
At worst you don't sell the design, otherwise, every one can use an extra 10 K.
Not that I think you should start that low.   ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on June 28, 2020, 10:42:42 AM
  China is already pumping them out.  Not only  is production cheap, but thier market for this type of product is bigger than north america and europe combined.  This really was one of those things i looked at and went "wtf" why is this so much?  This was never about the money, it was about me getting pissed off that a company was charging 7-10x thier cost for a chinese  made product.   I totally get then need to make money deal, i also understand mark ups, but thats extreme.   I litterely  found us producers of everything in less than a week.  I know exactly what it cost to start production, in the usa.  It had to be way less in china.    Even at my buy for 1 sell for 2 model. I would earn about 75% more than my start up and production costs.   

Funny thing, i spent more on lawyers than i did on thr cad/cam/gcode

 ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: MikeBjerum on June 28, 2020, 11:58:34 AM
Fresh caught Norwegian haddock filets.
Come in boxes covered with Chinese writing where they were sent for packing.   :-\

Caught, cleaned, packaged, and frozen (or frozen and packaged) on a Chinese factory ship in Norwegian waters. 

That finished product may have never seen China!
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on June 28, 2020, 12:55:23 PM
Yes, I didn't think of factory ships.
But it's still damned annoying.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: MikeBjerum on June 28, 2020, 02:26:30 PM
Just like all the Green treaties and accords, we bind ourselves, we pledge billions to support it, we pay billions when we do something outside the lines, and we allow others, like China, India, Taiwan, etc., do as they please.  We even pay these other nations to make the so called green technology for us.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on July 08, 2020, 09:31:23 AM
As of this morning,  they are sold out with a shiping date in August.   I made sure every one knew about the delay.  They are bent, machined, welded and polished.   Just waiting on the plastic bits and the box.


My company name  is RIP inc.   
Retirement
Is
Pointless
 ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on July 08, 2020, 03:26:21 PM
 Your kind can never do better than not being employed .
You're never out of work.
On the other hand you have good reason to get out of bed every morning.
They say "purpose" increases life span.   ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on July 08, 2020, 10:32:27 PM
Your kind can never do better than not being employed .
You're never out of work.
On the other hand you have good reason to get out of bed every morning.
They say "purpose" increases life span.   ;D
  i thought that was taking a shower with the misses
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on July 29, 2020, 01:07:48 PM
So product is not even out yet,

Given samples out too 6 youtube/ instagram/ industry leaders.  Of which 3 have put it out on soical media.  The run sold out in a week of the 1st post...some one found an almost exact copy on alibaba this morning for 1/2 the price.   Mine wont even ship for at least another 2 weeks.  Still waiting on one component...

I was sure it was going to happen, i just thought it would take a few weeks after i released them.  Nope they stole the design( which  is pretty simple)  from a dozen or so pics and a less than 25 mins of video. 

Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Rastus on July 29, 2020, 04:44:18 PM
So let's come up with something American made and leak it that will tie them up in knots and leave them with something they can't sell....
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on July 29, 2020, 06:19:44 PM
So let's come up with something American made and leak it that will tie them up in knots and leave them with something they can't sell....


I would love to do that, sadly the industries  where i k ow enough about the market to develop  products for dont like high priced items.  Even if they are high qaulity and far superior  to what else is on the market.   Many years ago i tried in this same hobby that these products are for.  I even had endorsments by basicly every single high profile person in said hobby( and trust me getting then all to agree on a product is harder then getting truck guys to agrer on ford chevy or dodgr)   yet i could not sell them for mu cost to build plus ship.  At that time is was $25.  Which was nothing considering  that at that time a co2 injection system was $400-600.    I cut every thing cut on a cnc router.  They twist lock coulpers i desinged and gave away cad files too are used industry wide now with almost zero changes.     In the end i made 25 of them as that was thr minimum  order size i needed to get tue cast acrylic tube in the size and thickness i wanted.

I sold about 10, a dozen or so away. Still have 3.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on July 29, 2020, 09:50:33 PM
Wow, I never knew any one counterfeited by the Chinese .  ;D
Sort of a compliment, I think .   ;D

If it makes you feel any better, my Dad machine gunned a shitload of them in Korea.
Is that paying it forward ?   ;D

The old Fart got his own chapter.

https://www.amazon.com/Gunners-Glory-Untold-Stories-Machine/dp/0345463897/ref=sr_1_fkmr3_1?dchild=1&keywords=Johnny+Clark+Gunners+glory&qid=1596077613&sr=8-1-fkmr3
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: MikeBjerum on July 30, 2020, 05:25:52 PM
Wow, I never knew any one counterfeited by the Chinese .  ;D
Sort of a compliment, I think .   ;D

I know a guy back in SW MN who has many interests and skills.  He has an old style shoe shop, and does repair.  He is a person that is always thinking about how to make things better.  He is a SCUBA diver and was always irritated by the way the buckles on the gear would snag weeds.  He went to work and developed a buckle system that was easier to operate, and it didn't snag weeds.  He was showing it to me and explaining everything, and then he told me that within one year of release the Chinese had stolen the design, and he was out.  However, he made several thousand off it before they took over.

Every couple years he releases something new, and he makes a fair amount on everyone of them.  After his first experience he learned to not waste the time and money on patents, because they mean nothing to the foreign manufacturers.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on July 30, 2020, 07:02:42 PM
Pretty much nailed it.

Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on July 30, 2020, 08:59:02 PM
because they mean nothing to the foreign manufacturers.

The name Eibar ring any bells ?   ;D

At least twice a normal year, Memorial Day when the beaches are opening, and mid June, during Bike week, there are always 1 or 2 Asian's arrested for selling counterfeit stuff.  A lot of Harley, and NASCAR stuff.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on August 03, 2020, 12:35:51 PM
I got tracking info on the plastic bits this morning.  Should be here friday... ofc its the day i am flying out of town for my grandmothers  90th bday.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Timothy on August 03, 2020, 05:11:10 PM
The name Eibar ring any bells ?   ;D

At least twice a normal year, Memorial Day when the beaches are opening, and mid June, during Bike week, there are always 1 or 2 Asian's arrested for selling counterfeit stuff.  A lot of Harley, and NASCAR stuff.

There is a good bit of Harley Davidson that is manufactured in East and SE Asia.  They ain’t 100%.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Majer on August 04, 2020, 09:26:51 AM
A bunch of years ago Harley sent their lawyers to Daytona with a court order to seize anything that didn't have the HD licensed logo on it, Most were shirts that had Harley F'n Davidson and the like on it. They were trying to project a more family orientated look.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on August 04, 2020, 01:53:28 PM
The whole fuel and electric system are made in China.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on August 16, 2020, 06:32:23 PM
Well got them all boxed up, labeled, ready to ship.  I have to go to fed up( both fedex and ups as there were some wild price differences) in the morning.  Every  one was billed as thier label was printed, they all got confirmation  emails.   

I made about what i thought i would, this was never about the money.  I was pissed off at the market place, so I stepped in.   I can not see me making a second run of them. 
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on April 27, 2021, 12:35:44 AM
Checking alibabba  tonight looking compoents to bottle and sell a product... what did I find, my product, using my pics for sale there.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: J. Kennedy-ar154me on April 27, 2021, 07:28:37 AM
That seems to be the new normal. Screw unto others before they screw unto you. I real-life game of the card game Uno.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on April 27, 2021, 08:54:14 AM
Checking alibabba  tonight looking compoents to bottle and sell a product... what did I find, my product, using my pics for sale there.

Should have got a patent.   ;D

Actually, the guy who tried to overcharge you should have got a patent.   ;D ;D   ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on April 27, 2021, 02:13:54 PM
Should have got a patent.   ;D

Actually, the guy who tried to overcharge you should have got a patent.   ;D ;D   ;D
toilet paper is worth more in china
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: billt on April 28, 2021, 07:06:38 AM
This is a big part of the problem.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/URREA-Forged-Steel-Pipe-Cutter-1-8-8221-To-2-8221/5001927929

VS.

https://www.harborfreight.com/no-2-pipe-cutter-62243.html?_br_psugg_q=pipe+cutter

It gets worse.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/URREA-Safety-Wire-Twist-Pliers-With-Spring-11-7-8/5001930153

VS.

https://www.harborfreight.com/9-inch-safety-wire-twisting-pliers-45341.html?_br_psugg_q=safety+wire+pliers
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on April 28, 2021, 08:04:25 AM
toilet paper is worth more in china

Just proves there are a LOT of assholes over there.   ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on April 28, 2021, 08:31:31 AM
This is a big part of the problem.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/URREA-Forged-Steel-Pipe-Cutter-1-8-8221-To-2-8221/5001927929

VS.

https://www.harborfreight.com/no-2-pipe-cutter-62243.html?_br_psugg_q=pipe+cutter

It gets worse.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/URREA-Safety-Wire-Twist-Pliers-With-Spring-11-7-8/5001930153

VS.

https://www.harborfreight.com/9-inch-safety-wire-twisting-pliers-45341.html?_br_psugg_q=safety+wire+pliers

Go put your hands on the tools, you will know which one to buy.  Horrible freight is at best a one time use tool.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: billt on April 28, 2021, 09:00:13 AM
Go put your hands on the tools, you will know which one to buy.  Horrible freight is at best a one time use tool.

I agree on some of the things they sell. But they are selling...... Like hotcakes in fact. Eric Smidt's net worth is right around the $4.7 BILLION mark, last time I checked. All of it came from the success of Harbor Freight.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on April 28, 2021, 09:10:48 AM
Go put your hands on the tools, you will know which one to buy.  Horrible freight is at best a one time use tool.

Be a cold day in hell before I pay that much for either tool.
Harbor frieght may not be top quality, but so what ?
They aren't trying to f..k you,
Single use ?
How do you plan on "abusing" a wire twister ?
A home handy man will probably never need it twice,
and a contractor can charge it to the job.
That's why people buy from China .
Thank the Unions.

Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on April 28, 2021, 09:55:14 AM
Be a cold day in hell before I pay that much for either tool.
Harbor frieght may not be top quality, but so what ?
They aren't trying to f..k you,
Single use ?
How do you plan on "abusing" a wire twister ?
A home handy man will probably never need it twice,
and a contractor can charge it to the job.
That's why people buy from China .
Thank the Unions.

I bought a 10# sledgehammer  from them, it broke on the 3rd swing, not the handle, but the bead shattered.  I was breaking up concrete.

Thats why I say at best 1 time use.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Timothy on April 28, 2021, 10:26:35 AM
I have tools from commercial plumbing supply that I paid wholesale prices for 35 years ago that work like new after years of abuse! 

If you’re planning on using the tools even on a limited basis, it’s worth the extra money!  Again, Lowe’s and Home Depot sell crap for the most part.  Craftsman at Lowe’s is NOT craftsman of old...

Title: Re: American made.
Post by: billt on April 28, 2021, 10:44:03 AM
Be a cold day in hell before I pay that much for either tool.
Harbor frieght may not be top quality, but so what ?
They aren't trying to f..k you,
Single use ?
How do you plan on "abusing" a wire twister ?
A home handy man will probably never need it twice,
and a contractor can charge it to the job.
That's why people buy from China .
Thank the Unions.

That's just it. If I was a professional plumber or aircraft mechanic, I might go for the more expensive tool.... AFTER I tried the Harbor Freight special first. A lot of Harbor Freight tools are now coming with lifetime warranties. Just like Craftsman.... Which are also made in China.

Remember, in the case of the 2 tools I linked, we're talking 900%+ MORE for the premium tool. For as old as I am, and the limited use they'll see before I kick the bucket, I can't justify the cost.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: alfsauve on April 28, 2021, 11:18:28 AM
At my age, Lifetime Warranty doesn't hold the same value as it use to.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Timothy on April 28, 2021, 12:54:16 PM
Bill, how big of a pipe cutter and what materials are you cutting!

I have tools I’m no longer using.  My daughter gets right of first refusal but you’re welcome to them if she declined!  Her meathead is a licensed sprinkler guy so who knows.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: billt on April 28, 2021, 02:07:25 PM
Bill, how big of a pipe cutter and what materials are you cutting! I have tools I’m no longer using.  My daughter gets right of first refusal but you’re welcome to them if she declined!  Her meathead is a licensed sprinkler guy so who knows.

I don't have any projects in the hopper. I just thought I would grab one because they were cheap, and now I'll have something if a have to make a cut on a larger pipe with something other than a saw. But thanks for the offer!
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on April 28, 2021, 02:47:07 PM
Bill, how big of a pipe cutter and what materials are you cutting!

I have tools I’m no longer using.  My daughter gets right of first refusal but you’re welcome to them if she declined!  Her meathead is a licensed sprinkler guy so who knows.
  you don't by chance have a ridged 300 laying around doo you?   I am looking for a used one so I can run 1" black iron in my shop for air lines
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: J. Kennedy-ar154me on April 28, 2021, 02:49:42 PM
At my age, Lifetime Warranty doesn't hold the same value as it use to.

But on the other side a lifetime sentence doesn't seem that bad!!!!  ;^)
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on April 28, 2021, 02:55:15 PM
But on the other side a lifetime sentence doesn't seem that bad!!!!  ;^)
you have a funny way of pronouncing  the word marriage


Title: Re: American made.
Post by: J. Kennedy-ar154me on April 28, 2021, 02:57:05 PM
you have a funny way of pronouncing  the word marriage


 ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Timothy on April 28, 2021, 03:01:15 PM
  you don't by chance have a ridged 300 laying around doo you?   I am looking for a used one so I can run 1" black iron in my shop for air lines

No, I used the one in the shop.

New they are about $4k
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on April 28, 2021, 03:21:54 PM
No, I used the one in the shop.

New they are about $4k
thats why I want a used one
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Rastus on April 28, 2021, 10:00:17 PM
I bought a little 2" water pump from Harbor Freight to pump down a couple of leaking ponds.  About 55% of the cost for one also made in China from Lowes or Home Depot. 

If the ones at Lowes or Home Depot were made in America I would have bought them.   Heck, if they had been double cost I may have bought one. 

So instead of getting hard screwed (Chinese made plus HIGH PRICES) by Lowes or Home Depot I opted for Harbor Freight. 

It works as advertised. 
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: billt on April 29, 2021, 01:40:11 AM
I bought a little 2" water pump from Harbor Freight to pump down a couple of leaking ponds.  About 55% of the cost for one also made in China from Lowes or Home Depot. 

If the ones at Lowes or Home Depot were made in America I would have bought them.   Heck, if they had been double cost I may have bought one. 

So instead of getting hard screwed (Chinese made plus HIGH PRICES) by Lowes or Home Depot I opted for Harbor Freight. 

It works as advertised.

This is the thing a lot of people overlook. Many people jump on anything from Harbor Freight, because most everything they sell is made in China. But the fact of the matter is so is most any comparative tool you buy from Lowe's, Home Depot, Ace, or True Value. Harbor Freight has simply never hidden the fact.

Someone mentioned Craftsman, and that's an excellent example. The guarantee on their hand tools is no better than Harbor Freight. And they are made in China as well. They just cost more, and are living on a reputation that has long since departed for parts unknown.

Harbor Freight's quality has increased substantially on many of their products over the last few years. While many "American" companies have allowed their quality to slip badly..... Craftsman being one of them. But their prices still remain high. Most everything I have purchased from Harbor Freight tool wise, will for sure and for certain outlast me. And that's all I really care about. 
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: billt on April 29, 2021, 01:09:40 PM
you have a funny way of pronouncing  the word marriage

You know what they say. Marriage is a lot like drinking and driving. Sooner or later there's going to be a hell of a wreck.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: tombogan03884 on April 29, 2021, 02:47:33 PM
This is the thing a lot of people overlook. Many people jump on anything from Harbor Freight, because most everything they sell is made in China. But the fact of the matter is so is most any comparative tool you buy from Lowe's, Home Depot, Ace, or True Value. Harbor Freight has simply never hidden the fact.

Someone mentioned Craftsman, and that's an excellent example. The guarantee on their hand tools is no better than Harbor Freight. And they are made in China as well. They just cost more, and are living on a reputation that has long since departed for parts unknown.

Harbor Freight's quality has increased substantially on many of their products over the last few years. While many "American" companies have allowed their quality to slip badly..... Craftsman being one of them. But their prices still remain high. Most everything I have purchased from Harbor Freight tool wise, will for sure and for certain outlast me. And that's all I really care about.

It's that way with EVERYTHING.
Remember where all our medical shit came from ?
It made ALL the propaganda outlets about a year ago.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: billt on April 29, 2021, 03:21:20 PM
It's that way with EVERYTHING.
Remember where all our medical shit came from ?
It made ALL the propaganda outlets about a year ago.

Brand New Ventilators Tossed Into Landfills!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPw19AGleDI
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on April 29, 2021, 05:24:14 PM
even stuff made in the USA, I have seen distinct  differences  between  stuff made for the box stores  and those made form traditional  vendors.   I am sure the chinesium  is the same.

It didn't use to be that way, but the last 10 years or so I have seen a draatic differences in quality of the same item in the box stores.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Rastus on April 29, 2021, 07:44:04 PM
even stuff made in the USA, I have seen distinct  differences  between  stuff made for the box stores  and those made form traditional  vendors.   I am sure the chinesium  is the same.

It didn't use to be that way, but the last 10 years or so I have seen a draatic differences in quality of the same item in the box stores.

I agree.  And, I surmise, to get around "price matching" they sell the same things with different model numbers and a sell it on a different slant.  So a 23 HP zero turn, for instance, from one big box has a different model number than other big box units that are the "same".  Then one advertises horsepower and the other uses displacement.  Same stuff though.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Rastus on December 03, 2021, 06:53:17 AM
<snip>
Someone mentioned Craftsman, and that's an excellent example. The guarantee on their hand tools is no better than Harbor Freight. And they are made in China as well. They just cost more, and are living on a reputation that has long since departed for parts unknown.
<snip>

Yep.  Sears was quite possibly purposely run into the ground.  As the Sears stores began closing (I know some are still here) I picked up a lot of the older Craftsman tools.  Also some 75th Anniversary tools in a box with a gold coating on them.  I remember buying Sears stock around $140/share because the guy running it was heralded to have the ability to turn it around.  Instead Sears was monetized (sold it off) and the CEO paid himself big bonuses which devastated all the people who had jobs and stock in Sears.

Harbor Freight is having a pretty big sale for it's "Inside Track" members right now.  I think it's time for me to pick up that Omnipro 220 welder.  I don't know that I'll see a lower price with the inflation we are "enjoying" now and for the foreseeable future.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: TAB on December 04, 2021, 11:33:53 AM
cheap no name made in Mexico hitch vs b&w made in the USA hitch.  Same weight rating.

(https://i.ibb.co/19nJDcz/20211202-160232.jpg) (https://ibb.co/BgPKXkn)
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: crusader rabbit on December 04, 2021, 12:21:15 PM
Even stuff that has been proudly touted as Made in USA gets made in China.  An example that I discovered while shopping for a gift was the Buck Knives Folding Hunter.  The real deal Made in USA knife can run around $199 with the leather sheath.  The one Walmart sells is around $55. 

How can that be, you might ask. 

It's because Walmart negotiated a nice contract with Buck to sell a bunch of their knives, but not at the regular price.  So, Buck decided since it cost them more to make the knife than Walmart wanted to pay, they would have to do some offshore manufacturing. 

And lo and behold, a Buck Folding Hunter sells at Walmart for $55 (sometimes less, on sale).

The two knives look identical with the brass bolsters and wooden slabs.  But the steel isn't the same and the Walmart version is really a piece of crap.

Apparently, it was better for Buck to risk their hard won reputation and sell a shoddy piece of crap while basking in that Walmart cash.

Crusader Rabbit
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: PegLeg45 on December 04, 2021, 04:45:59 PM
Even stuff that has been proudly touted as Made in USA gets made in China.  An example that I discovered while shopping for a gift was the Buck Knives Folding Hunter.  The real deal Made in USA knife can run around $199 with the leather sheath.  The one Walmart sells is around $55. 

How can that be, you might ask. 

It's because Walmart negotiated a nice contract with Buck to sell a bunch of their knives, but not at the regular price.  So, Buck decided since it cost them more to make the knife than Walmart wanted to pay, they would have to do some offshore manufacturing. 

And lo and behold, a Buck Folding Hunter sells at Walmart for $55 (sometimes less, on sale).

The two knives look identical with the brass bolsters and wooden slabs.  But the steel isn't the same and the Walmart version is really a piece of crap.

Apparently, it was better for Buck to risk their hard won reputation and sell a shoddy piece of crap while basking in that Walmart cash.

Crusader Rabbit

That goes on with a lot of goods. Even some goods that are made entirely overseas has multiple versions of the same tool that is marketed at various target groups via the point of sale locations (mowers and power tools are the top two that come to mind).....so it's not surprising at all that a company like Buck fell into that habit. Kershaw knives has US and Chinese made knives as well and you have to look close when shopping.
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: billt on December 05, 2021, 01:10:48 AM
Even stuff that has been proudly touted as Made in USA gets made in China.  An example that I discovered while shopping for a gift was the Buck Knives Folding Hunter.  The real deal Made in USA knife can run around $199 with the leather sheath.  The one Walmart sells is around $55. 

How can that be, you might ask. 

It's because Walmart negotiated a nice contract with Buck to sell a bunch of their knives, but not at the regular price.  So, Buck decided since it cost them more to make the knife than Walmart wanted to pay, they would have to do some offshore manufacturing. 

And lo and behold, a Buck Folding Hunter sells at Walmart for $55 (sometimes less, on sale).

The two knives look identical with the brass bolsters and wooden slabs.  But the steel isn't the same and the Walmart version is really a piece of crap.

Apparently, it was better for Buck to risk their hard won reputation and sell a shoddy piece of crap while basking in that Walmart cash.

Crusader Rabbit

Harbor Freight is now selling a Buck General clone for $25.00 under the "Gordon" name.

https://www.harborfreight.com/6-in-bowie-knife-58090.html?_br_psugg_q=knife
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Rastus on December 05, 2021, 06:41:04 AM
I picked up a couple of Harbor Freight machetes.   There were real junk. 
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: les snyder on December 05, 2021, 09:11:20 AM
Rastus... I has been a couple of years since purchase, but my Tramontina bolo machete and Collins SA (Guatemala) have held up well... I did re-grind the bolo though
Title: Re: American made.
Post by: Rastus on December 05, 2021, 06:21:20 PM
My dad's machete is a USN version from I think 1942.   It looks like a Collins.  The next time I am in Louisiana I am going to take a look and see if it is a Collins.

Every machete I have owned is a serious second fiddle to the one he has...I really believe it may well be a Collins.  I saw one ground up pretty good on eBay for $275 and a better looking one for $145.  I am headed to Louisiana in a week and if it is a Collins as I suspect then I'm going to pinch one from eBay.  There is quite literally nothing like the one my dad had.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/154733244049?hash=item2406d1ee91:g:iowAAOSwyzJhdCkf (https://www.ebay.com/itm/154733244049?hash=item2406d1ee91:g:iowAAOSwyzJhdCkf)