A phrase that lots of gun owners use that just pisses me off..

[Teresa Heilevang]

hahahahahahahahaha 
I TOLD you I was old!

Well my broomstick goes BOOM sometimes..


They don't call me Bullet Witch for nothing you know..

[Teresa Heilevang]

I bet they will never get robbed either.

Nope.. I don't think that would be a good idea...
They'de be talking to the Big Guy in the Sky before they knew what hit 'em..

[ericire12]

Nope.. I don't think that would be a good idea...
They'de be talking to the Big Guy in the Sky before they knew what hit 'em..

 

[MOREGUNS]

Here is what my son and my ex have on their front windows of their Hardware Store here in Howard.

THANKS FOR TAKING THE PICTURE MOM!! THIS IS MY STORE. I HAVE HAD MORE PEOPLE THAN YOU ALL CAN IMAGINE COME IN AND THANK US FOR PUTTING THE SIGNS UP.  I HAVE NOT HAD A SINGLE PERSON COME IN WITH A PROBLEM  OR COMPLAINT ABOUT THEM. EVERYONE FEELS SAFE IN OUR SMALL TOWN HARDWARE STORE...

[Pathfinder]

In CA you can refuse service as well as access, to your place of biz...( other life saving medical treatment)   for pretty much any reason.

Now having a sign saying " no blacks"  is going to get you in a world of hurt, but asking them to leave is fine.  you are also allowed to restrict any object.(unless there is a law that says... you must wear this)   for example I could make a rule that to enter my shop you have to be naked... I would just have to restrict those that can not be in that envroment( minors)

I should also point out that you still have to meet the ADA stuff and have access, but thats a civil matter... and the only real protected class these days.

Actually, I'm glad you brought this up, Tab, I have been itching all day to get home and post on this side of the discussion. Sorry, NO corporation - from the mom & pop hardware to the mega international corporation can deny you your rights as an American citizen.

If I implement a policy that says my corporation, my division or any other part will not hire women, or blacks, or will pay them 20% less than whites, you will have a raft of state and Federal lawyers kicking your door down in no time flat. They will shut you down in a heartbeat. If I have a written policy that it is OK to embezzle from my clients' accounts, and do so, I will go to prison. IT IS ILLEGAL to do any of these. Period. No one cares that it is your own company, or that you had a policy that allowed it, it is against the law. Period. End of discussion.

So, why do you continue to believe that CCW - as in my case protected by state law (CCW) and the state Constitution (owning and bearing arms) - can be easily denied by that same corporate "policy"? Sorry, that dog don't hunt. My human rights transcend and trump a business' "rights" every damn time.

I suggest that the hysteria over guns and the lack of effective lawsuits has created an environment - on purpose IMHO (but then I am paranoid) - in which companies are allowed to get away with restricting our rights in selected areas, using a "reasonable" argument, in this case a shopkeep's corporate "rights". I would ignore a "No Guns" sign, and if discovered to be CCW, I would leave - if I in fact entered at all other to tell the owner that I would not frequesnt his store any longer.

As for big corporations - they have no rights, but they do have the law - right or wrong - on their side in most cases. Posters here are right that I can be fired for violating the "policy" if discovered. And given the climate in this country, it would be difficult to win a lawsuit against the corporation for violating my civil - or human - rights.

[Sponsor]

[DDMac]

While there will always be businesses owned or controlled by those under liberal misconception about firearms, there is no reason to abandon attempts to educate merchants as to the realities of the "gun free zone"

In about 1999 (when you get older, time gets very general), the new Lowe's Foods in my neighborhood posted a "No Firearms" sign in the window. Didn't bother me. I was still on the job and exempt. But my old friend and neighbor JJ., Marine Corps, retired US Secret Service, NRA Firearm Instructor, was not so indifferent. I happened to be shopping on the day he came in to meet with the then store manager, Terry, about the sign and it's significance. He strolled in, cowboy hat, vest, neatly attired with 1911 invisible to the eye, as always, with that Tombstone look in his eye.

No need to go through the logic with this group, and throw in the persuasive nature of a guy who knows his facts and will NEVER give up, the result was a vacancy where the sign was posted the next day. Terry is now a regional manager, and I've never encountered another such sign at any area Lowe's Foods.

It can be done. Just do it. Give it a shot!

Mac.

[TAB]

Sorry, NO corporation - from the mom & pop hardware to the mega international corporation can deny you your rights as an American citizen.

show me one court case that says carrying a firearm , is a right.   hell show me one court case that says we can own a firearm as a person, not part of a group.

I'll help, as of this post there are not any.

Also a employer can ask you to wave any right they want too...  all it takes is you to sign on the dotted line.( or even becoming an employee in some states) 

Same thing when you join the armed forces, you wave several of your rights. 

Get use to it, thats not something that is ever going to change.


 

[Rastus]

.........Also a employer can ask you to wave any right they want too...  all it takes is you to sign on the dotted line.( or even becoming an employee in some states) 

Same thing when you join the armed forces, you wave several of your rights. 

Get use to it, thats not something that is ever going to change.

Most likely...not knowing the finer point of law.  However, once on company property with rights excluded, the company is now suddenly responsible for security.  They are not responsible for a criminal act but they are responsible to keep me safe (Hey, we can sue for spilling our own hot coffee on ourselves, right?).  It's a farce to think if someone snaps there is time for the police whether a gun is involved or not (see mass knife killings in Japan this week).  There may be laws saying no to this security issue across this nation....but there are a lot of laws that don't stand to scrutiny when people push the issue in court. 

Buzz word in Oklahoma is, because of some corporations trying to deny people bringing weapons in the parking lot, that lawyers are lining up to sue when someone is hurt that has and wanted to carry.   Google is coming to town and they are front and center in the crosshairs due to their anti-gun stance (ya'll don't use them, you hear). 

It cuts two ways...I just finished a training module on violence in the workplace today....companies want to deny you the ability to defend youself with anything and run to HR or Legal if you think someone could be dangerous like that will keep you safe....OK...I've been told as a condition of employment I cannot defend myself...or I will be terminated.  Let me get a scratch and see what happens...big money means jingle in the NRA's pocket.  Oh yeah, and in the training module anyone who ever mentiones an "assault weapon" gun is suspect and subject to immediate investigation, and men are always the problem in the training exercises foisted upon us by the women in HR...never a woman being a problem....someday, right time, right place, this hostile anti-male environment they created will cost them a few $'s.

Besides legal, there is an overboard gynocentric point of view that running away to "big brother" and telling will keep you safe from violence.  HR departments are increasingly run by silly women who think you can run for help when something happens, this is lollipop land, and their will be no violence because you went to tell someone.  They don't want you to stand up because they can't do it (for whatever reason) because "violence only begats violence"....OK, let's violently end what you violently started with me staring down at you problem solved.

[TAB]

If the police don't have to protect you( this has come up many, many times in court cases)  a private company will not have to.

[DDMac]

Tab, I understand about the waivers, and military service, but the prime directive here does not come from the Judicial Branch. It pre-exists, and is memorialized in the Constitution. The cases you ask for are still pending and the first case you inquire about will be Heller v DC. That's why it's a clean slate case. The arguments (albeit in a friendly atmosphere) put forth here today are all included in the context of Heller. Let's just see. Won't be long now.
BTW, on the news tonight I see that a Federal judge has decided the Gitmo detainees have the right of Habeas Corpus. Civil hearings on detention? Can the UCMJ be next on the scrap heap of American jurisprudence?

The police don't have to protect you? There is always a minimum standard they must maintain. A general performance of duties to the general public must be provided.  Malfeasance or nonfeasance still apply. It is not total immunity for the agency, and government exempts itself whenever it can, as I'm sure you know. Private companies, in the field of customer safety, can't and have not received the same liability shelter to my knowledge.
Mac.