Jury's Perspective vs. Tactics

[twyacht]

The Hollywood Mystique of a one shot stop with the bad guy flying backwards is hardly the reality. The tunnel vision, the adrenaline, the reactive actions the body goes through, especially those with minimal training, makes head shots improbable.

Law enforcement is trained to continue shooting until the threat is absolutely neutralized. Keyword is threat. My leetle .380 Kel-Tec, is not considered a whopping man-stopper by any means, but that is not the point, nor why I carry it.

The point is to end the threat. If it takes 3,4,5,6 a reload, and 2 more so be it.  The end game is I'm alive, and the BG is not trying to end my life. If the BG expires,....so be it.

Notes from Col. Jeff Cooper come to mind.

"One bleeding-heart type asked me in a recent interview if I did not agree that 'violence begets violence.' I told him that it is my earnest endeavor to see that it does. I would like very much to ensure (and in some cases I have) that any man who offers violence to his fellow citizen begets a whole lot more in return than he can enjoy."
Jeff Cooper, "Cooper vs. Terrorism", Guns & Ammo Annual, 1975

"It’s our experience that in a fight you will continue to shoot the gun until the threat goes away or until the gun is empty."

"If you're not shootin', you should be loadin'. If you're not loadin', you should be movin', if you're not movin', someone's gonna cut your head off and put it on a stick."
From The Clint Smith, Jeff Cooper Memoirs.

Highly recommend finding them online and reading them...

http://myweb.cebridge.net/mkeithr/Jeff/

[r_w]

The time to modify tactics is before the gun is drawn.  Escape or de-escalate.  Once you draw the gun, you have elevated it to a deadly force encounter and need to finish it.

[Magoo541]

Dead bad guys don't sue for becoming a victim.  Their family might but, if the shooting was righteous than they should lose in criminal court.  In civil court, anything goes as you don't have to prove diddle "beyond a reasonable doubt!".  Remember, you can't go to prison for a civil case!  Shoot for center of mass and don't stop until the threat is neutralized.

I know that doesn't really answer your question.

I've told the story about an Army Ranger I live across the school yard from that shot (single 9mm to center mass at about 20 feet) and killed a kid that broke into his house with the cops in "hot pursuit".  He wasn't charged but he did have to retain legal counsel and fight a civil case for the death of the young man.  From what I gather you can't get blood from a turnip so he was "victorious." 

[Timothy]

I've told the story about an Army Ranger I live across the school yard from that shot (single 9mm to center mass at about 20 feet) and killed a kid that broke into his house with the cops in "hot pursuit".  He wasn't charged but he did have to retain legal counsel and fight a civil case for the death of the young man.  From what I gather you can't get blood from a turnip so he was "victorious." 

Though it's tragic the death of an innocent young man, I doubt this Ranger feels like he's won anything.  He has to live with the emotions of the accident for the rest of his life.  A civil court can award money that far exceeds ones actual wealth as was the case with OJ Simpson.  So I understand the need for counsel.  The boy did break into his house after all.

[Magoo541]

Though it's tragic the death of an innocent young man, I doubt this Ranger feels like he's won anything.  He has to live with the emotions of the accident for the rest of his life.  A civil court can award money that far exceeds ones actual wealth as was the case with OJ Simpson.  So I understand the need for counsel.  The boy did break into his house after all.

True on all accounts.  I think if he had more resources the other party may have been more tenacious in their law suit but he had nothing to speak of.  If their lawyer was payed only on settlement basis I'm sure they saw an empty well and not much reward for the effort. 

MAG40 is at the top of my list for training because of the legal implications, although I sense a shift towards the self-defenders' rights.

[Sponsor]

[Solus]

Ohio's Castle Doctrine law came with a  nice provision.

If the shooter is not convicted of a crime in the shooting, there can be no civil case.

[Timothy]

Ohio's Castle Doctrine law came with a  nice provision.

If the shooter is not convicted of a crime in the shooting, there can be no civil case.

As should be the case everywhere.  When someone dies during the committing of a felony, the felons are generally the ones to be charged with the death regardless of who did the actual killing.  Most recently the 15 year old in Tifton, GA last week that was mentioned in another thread.

[Hazcat]

Ohio's Castle Doctrine law came with a  nice provision.

If the shooter is not convicted of a crime in the shooting, there can be no civil case.

Florida has that too.  That is why I asked what state this was.  When I was told Florida I became very confused.