911.. In Plane Site

[tombogan03884]

Stuff like this is where "legends " come from,They are "Conspiracies" today but in the future just another of "Histories Mysteries", was it REALLY John Wilkes Booth who died in that barn ? Who killed JFK ? Who assasinated Napolean ? They are fun to debate, but the TRUTH will never be proven beyond doubt.

[tombogan03884]

Stuff like this is where "legends " come from,They are "Conspiracies" today but in the future just another of "Histories Mysteries", was it REALLY John Wilkes Booth who died in that barn ? Who killed JFK ? Who assasinated Napolean ? They are fun to debate, but the TRUTH will never be proven beyond doubt.

Yes, The Cubans, and No one. 

[Ron J]

But I don't  think I need meds cause I say that I believe amongst other things, that the Twin Towers was demolition set. I have  talked to several explosive experts BEFORE I watched the video.. and even though you might not believe the whole of the message of the video... who can really believe that the way both buildings came down was..ahhmmm ...from a plane that hit the top floors? 


The scientific answer to your question about the planes hitting the top floor is yes.  More on that in a minute. 

Ironically, it was a month or so ago that I had a rather detailed "discussion" with a Palestinian who claimed the same proof that 9/11 was an "inside job".   However, it was when I heard Jessie Venture claim that there was demolition involved in WT7 that caused me to start digging around for some information. 

Sticking point conspiracy theorists and this video was the collapse of forty-seven story tall Tower 7.  As to the collapse and what this video did not show (but other news videos did) was that Tower 7, had serious damage from the North Tower collapse.  There was a ten foot hole in the center of the building and ten to twenty stories long gash on the south side.  As well, this video did not mention that NIST reported that at least ten stories of the south side were “scooped out” from damage.  There were also fires in this building and very likely that the twenty-two large oil filled transformers (which can go boom) between ground level and the 5th floor blew.  Scientific evidence is very clear as to how and why Tower 7 collapsed.  It was due to damage from the North Tower.  Lastly, it was mentioned that if all this was all true, why did someone say “pull”?  To this, the call to “pull” was made to pull FDNY out of that building.  As the building had sustained serious damage and was starting to “moan”, orders were given to get people out of the building.  This was confirmed by multiple sources but not mentioned in the video. 

As to the Towers collapsing from the plane hits, keep in mind it was not the initial impact that caused the Towers to fall.  It was from the fires that weakened the steel that caused the collapse.  To note that there have been similar fires in other buildings around the world that had the same results as the Towers falling.  Studies from Purdue, MIT and Cambridge all came to the same conclusions that the buildings were weakened by the intense fires and that is why they collapsed.   

Yes, demolition “experts” have said the videos look like squibs going off as the buildings collapsed.  But this has been proven false.  One, there is an acre of space on each floor and that means an acre of air too.  Collapse one floor and the “poof” is the air escaping.  Firefighters even stated the “hurricane effect” this air had pushing people down stairwells.  As well, there was no traces of explosives and given the amount of explosives that would have been needed to collapse these buildings, had any been used someone would have found some. 

To date, no evidence supports demolition.  There is no scientific evidence and there is no “smoking gun” that indicates “inside job”.  These were attacks by Islamic radicals on our country that UbL praised in one of his tapes. 

[Neon Knight Anubis]

I'm impressed, I could not have put it so eloquently. I'm willing to bet you did more than 5 min worth of research on this matter.

[Ichiban]

If anyone is really interested, here's the link to the article Popular Mechanics did on the conspiracy theories.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1227842.html

Not that that will change anyone's minds. 

To quote Adam Savage (Myth Busters): "I reject your reality and substitute my own."

[Sponsor]

[Ron J]

Thanks Neon.  Yes, I did spend some time researching both sides because I wanted to understand why and how Jesse Ventura, Rosie O’Donnell and others would say what they were saying about the events of 9/11.  

What I found interesting if not amazing is how some really obvious facts regarding the events of 9/11 are usually left out of the conspiracy theories.  As well, how many of the conspiracy theorists have changed/modified their conspiracy theories when new evidence became available.  This really questions motive and credibility.  Lastly, while several of the leading resources that conspiracy theorists looked at and quoted had engineering degrees, none of their degrees were related to structural engineering.  In short, they didn’t really know dick to what they were trying to sell.

Not to insult anyone’s intelligence (which is something I am usually and regularly doing to myself!), but on the surface the conspiracy theories are very far fetched.  Can you imagine the details to pulling off a disaster of this scale?  How many people would need to be involved and would need to be eliminated due to the probability of someone talking?  The quantity of explosives that would have been needed and no one noticed an extra ton of thermite sitting in the office down the hall?  

Again, to date there has been no credible evidence that there were any explosives and/or that this was an inside job.  Only evidence that has been found is that the attacks of 9/11 were the work of terrorists attacking our country.  The link Ichiban posted as well as the MANY others out there from various sources debunk the conspiracy theories that are floating about. 

[Teresa Heilevang]

Thanks for everyones input. 

[Ocin]

Hello everybody,

if you would let me, i would like to put in my 5 eurocent worth of opinion in this (yes, i am from the Ueberliberal Kigdom of the Netherlands and since we have abolished the one and two eurocet coins this is the cheapest I can get).

First of all, i am from Amsterdam, Holland. About the planes into and the collapse of the Twin Towers, there is nothing I can add. But: some of you might recall 4th of october 1982 when an Israeli cargo plane crashed into an appartment building in Amsterdam. As a matter of fact, i did not see it happen but i was present on the scene even before the fire department was.

Now, about the Pentagon: a 757 is quite somewhat smaller as compared to a 747 and keep in mind that the Pentagon is built like a bunker. The hole in that apartment building was just 2 apartments wide which is 50 feet. Ok, i'll give you a hole of 75 feet. My point: the size of the hole being 65 feet in the Pentagon might very well be possible considering the damage a 747 can do on a commercially built apartment complex.

But: i do recall very vividly seeing the wreckage of the plane on the ground, seeing it's landing gear in the air ( hey, the thing is on it's back, and yes, they said it rolled over up side down before crashing) and 2 engines on one side of the aircraft (if it is a 747 where are the other 2 engines? And yes, they had fallen off before the crash and were located in a lake nearby).

My point? From what I have seen there should be a wreckage left from the aircraft, and even if it had desintegrated, well, they were able to rebuild the crashed 747 close to completion from the wreckage found on the scene. So, where is the crashed 757 that went into the Pentagon???

[someguy]

Ocin-  Not being defensive, just asking, as I am not at all familiar with the incident to which you refer...  Was the 747 full of fuel when it hit, and what was the estimated (or actual, if it's known) velocity of the aircraft upon impact?  Could make a big difference in the comparison if those variables aren't the same.

Especially if the 747 pilots knew they had a problem and did a fuel dump prior to impact.

[Ron J]

Ocin:

Every plane crash is different.  Angle, speed, weight, fuel, what they crash into, etc. makes crashes a dynamic study.  To any crash, the speed, angle and what a plane hits will determine how much of the plane can be put back together.  Given the speed of the 757 that hit a robustly built building like the Pentagon, the pieces will not be so big. 

They did find enough pieces (plane and human) including the black box to collaborate the eye witness testimonies that it was AA#77 that hit the Pentagon. 

When you look at the conspiracy theories, you have to look at them like you would a “magic act” on TV.  With the magic act, you’re not seeing everything you need to see.  Same with what the conspiracy theorist put out.  Look at the evidence.