The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Politics & RKBA => Topic started by: tombogan03884 on January 15, 2010, 12:26:43 PM
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http://www.pjtv.com/video/Afterburner_with_Bill_Whittle/They_Stole_Our_Future%2C_But_They_Cannot_Break_Our_Will/2907/
http://www.pjtv.com/video/Klavan_on_Culture/DON%27T_PANIC%3A_DHS_Is_In_Charge/2946/
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I still want to be appointed over the various intelligence departments.
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Can I nominate myself for a "Czar" in a new Civilian Marksmanship Initiative?
"The great body of our citizens shoot less as times goes on. We should encourage rifle practice among schoolboys, and indeed among all classes, as well as in the military services by every means in our power. Thus, and not otherwise, may we be able to assist in preserving peace in the world... The first step in the direction of preparation to avert war if possible, and to be fit for war if it should come is to teach men to shoot!"
Theodore Roosevelt
Just following another pro-gun POTUS... ;D
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A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a Free State, the duty of the people to responsibly keep and bear arms for defense of themselves and their community shall be enforced.
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A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a Free State, the duty of the people to responsibly keep and bear arms for defense of themselves and their community shall be enforced.
change it to the Right and Duty of The People...
and it will be perfect
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change it to the Right and Duty of The People...
and it will be perfect
Great point. How about we add to it:
"...citizens defending this right from government officials and politicians are bound to act in a manner like and in the attitude of self-defense for the protection of life and no charges of any manner shall be held upon them, no property of any kind confiscated from them, nor that they be levied to them as fines, fees or taxes of any amount so long as this right does exist for any actions taken to defend this right.
If this right ceases from whatever manner the citizen and the military is required to reinstate this right by any means possible and in defense of this right no charges of any manner shall be held upon them, no property of any kind confiscated from them, nor that they be levied to them as fines, fees or taxes any amount in the exercise of that duty and if such were made prior to the reinstatement of this right upon reinstatment of this right the citizen shall be restituted and made whole in all cases or life and property to the full value of each.
It shall not be held against any military personnel to refuse orders which are contrary to the spirit or letter of this right in accordance with the full guarantees of a citizen and is encumbent upon such personnel to refuse those orders. Failure to refuse such order shall result in imprisonment of not less than 20 years and if found complicit in enforcing actions against this right which result in the injury or death of citizen defending this right the penalty of ultimate penalty is encouraged but no less than lifetime imprisonment with no parole must be employed
It shall be the express duty of the military, but in no way limited to the military and extended to the citizen and local, state or federal government, to deny, repel and destroy any international efforts to to rescind this right wherever forces have been ammassed towards it and that foreign bodies of government and law residing in this nation which support the demise of this right by legal decree, action, statement or ammendment to domestic or international law shall be apprehended and deported within 5 days of such a decree, action, statement or ammendment to domestic or international law furthermore such person or persons who have been deported shall, if they return to this nation, be apprehended and imprisoned for no less than 50 years of hard labor."
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I have a BIG Problem with adding the phrase "Spirit of the Law".
That opens the law up to "interpretation".
While a "Reasonable person" might be able to look at it and draw a reasonable conclusion. It is pretty obvious the the biggest mistake made by the Founding Fathers was to overlook the fact that most people are NOT Reasonable. They are either self serving, Crooked, or stupid.
The Constitution needs to be rewritten to prevent the type of bread and circuses freak show he are currently stuck with.
I left the word "Right" out of my version of the 2A because it will not BE a "Right". A right is some thing you can do if you chose, or not. Bearing arms for the defense of yourself and community will not be optional, you either do it or you do not vote or qualify for any local, state , or Federal programs, jobs, or Offices.
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I left the word "Right" out of my version of the 2A because it will not BE a "Right". A right is some thing you can do if you chose, or not. Bearing arms for the defense of yourself and community will not be optional
Sort of like you can have weapons if you join the militia?
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I have a BIG Problem with adding the phrase "Spirit of the Law".
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Well...1st draft Tom. But it said spirit or letter and in light of your comment there should be some language added that actually specifies what is what. And then I left out the entire issues of Class III items, mg's, supressors, cannon, etc.
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Well...1st draft Tom. But it said spirit or letter and in light of your comment there should be some language added that actually specifies what is what. And then I left out the entire issues of Class III items, mg's, supressors, cannon, etc.
Thats about ALL, you left out. ;D Not a slam, just a reminder of why constitutions are short and pithy. You really should read Federalist 84 (or maybe 87). Its Hamilons argument against a Bill of Rights, because he felt that anything excluded could be forbidden. The way to fix this is with broad inclusionary language such as "Congress shall make no law", not nit pick it to death with details. Think how much better off we'd have been if the "militia clause" hadn't attached to the 2A. It would have simply read "Thhe right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed". We'd still be arguing over what is an infringement, but Heller would have been settled two hundred years ago. When writing a Contitution, less is more. Give an order, not a recipe.
FQ13
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Sort of like you can have weapons if you join the militia?
No, like if you DO not have weapons you are not an actual citizen, you are just a Taxpayer with no say in a society you are not participating in.
In fact, I would Prefer to see fines or other CRIMINAL penalties for appearing in public without arms. It would not REQUIRE open carry, but if a cop asks you if you are carrying, you better be able to produce.
Another requirement for the full rights of Citizenship would be that you be self supporting, Job, investments, earned pension, whatever. But if society has to support you you get no say in how society is managed since you obviously can't even manage yourself.
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No, Exactly like if you DO not have weapons you are not an actual citizen, you are just a Taxpayer mule with no say in a society you are not participating in.
Slight edit. Same idea.
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The 2nd A, being the shortest, is the only one I have gotten around to rewriting so far, the ideas I have been kicking around would however place far more draconian limits on the politicians ability to screw things up. Also other amendments would have responsibilities spelled out as well as "rights". For example the free press would require honest reporting and strict seperation between opinion and what you can prove with verified documentation or historical precedent.
Other modifications to the 1st A would be to phrase it so that there is true separation between Church and State, Politicians and Judges can not prevent Religious displays, but they also can not exempt Churches from taxes, Politicians and Judges are forbidden from showing preference for one Religion over the other, ( They would be allowed to state that they belong to X Church, but must leave it at that ) by the same token, Religious leaders would be forbidden from commenting on Political or Legal affairs the way Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton do. "Cobbler, stick to YOUR last".
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I think a modified version of a Swiss approach could be valid. All qualified citizens would be required to, be trained, keep, and maintain their firearm. There would have to be provisions for those stolen, or sold. Severe penalties for any abuses.
A rigorous screening process, would have to be in place, that might make many cry and whine. However, there could be some method that would work. I'm tellin ya', A Civilian Marksmanship Initiative is a way to go.
Except the "sheeple" would have to just be deemed "non-qualified" and become florists, interior decorators, fashionista's,etc,.... and they can all be sent to San Francisco.
Large sign would state; "This is a gun free zone. Welcome to San Francisco" ::)
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Can I nominate myself for a "Czar" in a new Civilian Marksmanship Initiative?
"The great body of our citizens shoot less as times goes on. We should encourage rifle practice among schoolboys, and indeed among all classes, as well as in the military services by every means in our power. Thus, and not otherwise, may we be able to assist in preserving peace in the world... The first step in the direction of preparation to avert war if possible, and to be fit for war if it should come is to teach men to shoot!"
Theodore Roosevelt
Just following another pro-gun POTUS... ;D
"There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass"
People say this is not an actual quote from the Japanese leadership but I'm sure it crossed their mind.
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http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Who_said_invasion_would_be_foolish_Gun_behind_every_blade_of_grass
"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass." is a quote by Isoroku Yamamoto, Commander-in-Chief of the Imperial Japanese Navy during World War II. Of course it was originally stated in Japanese, this is the English translation.
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I think a modified version of a Swiss approach could be valid. All qualified citizens would be required to, be trained, keep, and maintain their firearm. There would have to be provisions for those stolen, or sold. Severe penalties for any abuses.
A rigorous screening process, would have to be in place, that might make many cry and whine. However, there could be some method that would work. I'm tellin ya', A Civilian Marksmanship Initiative is a way to go.
Except the "sheeple" would have to just be deemed "non-qualified" and become florists, interior decorators, fashionista's,etc,.... and they can all be sent to San Francisco.
Large sign would state; "This is a gun free zone. Welcome to San Francisco" Don't forget your hockey helmet. ::)
Needed a SLIGHT addition ;D
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http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Who_said_invasion_would_be_foolish_Gun_behind_every_blade_of_grass
"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass." is a quote by Isoroku Yamamoto, Commander-in-Chief of the Imperial Japanese Navy during World War II. Of course it was originally stated in Japanese, this is the English translation.
from wikiquote
Misattributed
You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass.
This is generally accepted as a fabricated quote by historians, according to Brooks Jackson in "Misquoting Yamamoto" at Factcheck.org (11 May 2009)
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Someone said it. , BUT everyone knew it.
Thankfully, it still holds true today. Even our own gov't in the deep, dark, bastions of George Soros's, Rebeca Peter's, et, al,....
They know it.
Here's a definite one:
"As civil rulers, not having their duty to the people before them, may attempt to tyrannize, and as the military forces which must be occasionally raised to defend our country, might pervert their power to the injury of their fellow citizens, the people are confirmed by the article in their right to keep and bear their private arms."
(Tench Coxe in ‘Remarks on the First Part of the Amendments to the Federal Constitution' under the Pseudonym ‘A Pennsylvanian' in the Philadelphia Federal Gazette, June 18, 1789 at 2 col. 1)
Yamamoto knew this. (Goes in the same line as the awakening of a sleeping giant quote)......
Eric Holder, the UN, and the world, know this.... and they better not forget it.
They can try their tricks and backroom treaties, and AWB's, and ammo sanctions etc,...
The RIGHT to keep and bear arms SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.... They don't want to wake up THAT giant....
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Someone said it. , BUT everyone knew it.
Thankfully, it still holds true today. Even our own gov't in the deep, dark, bastions of George Soros's, Rebeca Peter's, et, al,....
They know it.
Here's a definite one:
"As civil rulers, not having their duty to the people before them, may attempt to tyrannize, and as the military forces which must be occasionally raised to defend our country, might pervert their power to the injury of their fellow citizens, the people are confirmed by the article in their right to keep and bear their private arms."
(Tench Coxe in Remarks on the First Part of the Amendments to the Federal Constitution' under the Pseudonym A Pennsylvanian' in the Philadelphia Federal Gazette, June 18, 1789 at 2 col. 1)
Yamamoto knew this. (Goes in the same line as the awakening of a sleeping giant quote)......
Eric Holder, the UN, and the world, know this.... and they better not forget it.
They can try their tricks and backroom treaties, and AWB's, and ammo sanctions etc,...
The RIGHT to keep and bear arms SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.... They don't want to wake up THAT giant....
+1.1
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In fact, I would Prefer to see fines or other CRIMINAL penalties for appearing in public without arms. It would not REQUIRE open carry, but if a cop asks you if you are carrying, you better be able to produce.
I like that.
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from wikiquote
Misattributed
You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass.
This is generally accepted as a fabricated quote by historians, according to Brooks Jackson in "Misquoting Yamamoto" at Factcheck.org (11 May 2009)
Don't believe "factcheck" I have seen them print inaccuracies as gospel and a couple of outright lies about Obama. I forget the specific Items but there were a couple things they claimed he never said that are on video at YOUTUBE.
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from wikiquote
Misattributed
You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass.
This is generally accepted as a fabricated quote by historians, according to Brooks Jackson in "Misquoting Yamamoto" at Factcheck.org (11 May 2009)
I first heard the "blade of grass" quote as part of an article describing the meeting of US and Japanese WWII vets some time after the war.
When the US vets asked why the Japanese, knowing our naval forces in the Pacific were crippled that our military was not at all prepared to defend the country, the Japanese answered something like We were aware that, in your country, you actually had civilians competing in shooting matches using military rifles and that civilian ownership of firearms was high. We would find a rifle behind every blade of grass. We knew not to step into that quicksand.
So, yes, it was the presence of arms in civilian hands AND the fact that we had a strong Civilian Marksmanship Program at that time that caused the Japanese to forgo invasion of the US even though our Military forces were in disarray.
So, when the CMP CZAR is appointed, be sure to put in some mandatory hours in Grade School, Junior High and High School on the safe handling, cleaning and maintenance, and marksmanship of the standard issue military weapons of the day. I doubt every student will have the calling to be a Warrior, but they will have a jump start on what it takes to be a soldier.
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I think that NUMBERS had a really big part to play in the Japanese decision as well, ( this is just thinking off the top of my head, not based on any documentation ) The primary objective of the Japanese was to acquire natural resources, they may have beaten the Russians in 1905 but they were still a small country with a limited pool of manpower. This manpower was already committed in China and south Asia which gave them access to all the resources they they needed. It did not make strategic sense for them to spread themselves even thinner by attempting to invade a far more advanced nation where they would be HUGELY out numbered and gain nothing that they could not get in the area they already controlled.
Even the Aleutian landings were never pressed and were never intended to be anything more than a diversion from the Midway campaign.
On the logistical side of the equation the tonnages and distances involved when compared to shipping available also made such a project impossible and also applies to the idea of an invasion by modern China.
We had enough trouble with the short distances in the English Channel involved at Normandy, to launch a similar or larger effort across 3,000 miles of open ocean is just not feasible .
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Well said. 2,000+ miles coast to coast (depending on how you measure) and 300 million people with (not enough, but a lot) of fire arms and at the wrong end of a very long logistics train. Not going to happen. Red Dawn was a great movie, but don't expect it in real life. Its the damn zombies we need to worry about. ;D
FQ13
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Well said. 2,000+ miles coast to coast (depending on how you measure) and 300 million people with (not enough, but a lot) of fire arms and at the wrong end of a very long logistics train. Not going to happen. Red Dawn was a great movie, but don't expect it in real life. Its the damn zombies liberals we need to worry about. ;D
FQ13
;D
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Our greatest enemies, are from within our own borders. Oh, and it's been mention before.
"I am concerned for the security of our great Nation; not so much because of any threat from without, but because of the insidious forces working from within."
General MacArthur
"There are only two things we should fight for. One is the defense of our homes, and the other is the Bill of Rights."
Major General Smedley Butler, US Marine Corps 1930
"We must always remember that, as Americans, we all have a common enemy -- an enemy that is dangerous, powerful, and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government."
Dave Barry
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From TW
There are only two things we should fight for. One is the defense of our homes, and the other is the Bill of Rights."
Major General Smedley Butler, US Marine Corps 1930
The original fighting Quaker! ;D
FQ13
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FQ, You are WRONG AGAIN ;D America's "Original Fighting Quaker" was a Revolutionary war Gen.
Nathaniel Greene
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Can I be on the Supreme Court?
Where do I get my bumber sticker?
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Can I be on the Supreme Court?
Where do I get my bumber sticker?
Since I know you are not a Lawyer, and can read simple English without getting all confused, I will be happy to appoint you .
Have to talk to TT about the Bumper stickers.