The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: rj112275 on November 12, 2012, 11:38:39 AM
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Okay, after watching all these end of the world shows and listening to Michael Bane...
I've decided to have a long gun in the truck with me, when I travel out of town. I always carry my pistol, but now y'all have me thinking that it's no longer ridiculous to have a long gun at my disposal.
So, here's my question. I have an 870 with a 20" slug barrel that is plenty short to stow in the truck... and I have my AR-15 with tactical gear.
Which do you think would be best to have? The 870 with buckshot and slugs, or the AR-15 with several mags of ammo?
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Both ;D
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Both ;D
Seriously, the AR15. Self defense and more range for game gathering. You lose out on bird hunting, but then again in a perfect world I would through in a Henry AR7 and a shotgun ... do you care to carry four or five guns?
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Agreed that multiple guns would be the ideal situation.
I don't fret too much about the hunting/gathering stuff at this point. My emphasis would be defending myself and family from other two-legged creatures trying to do me harm or take my stuff. Mobs and groups of bad people... something a handgun wouldn't defend against so well.
So, is more ammo (i.e. the AR15) better than bigger (12 gauge slugs and buckshot)?
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In the unknown TEOTWAWKI situation you are preparing for I would always choose a carbine rifle over a shotgun. As you refine the known you can get more specific, but I choose rifle for unknown.
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They can't be loaded and if you are crossing state lines they have to be in locked cases.
Talk to a lawyer.
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If you have a permit things change, and it all depends on the states.
Simple enough to check the laws!
Our only issue in Minnesota is the Department of Natural Resources and their laws on cased guns. However, that only pertains to hunting, and most law enforcement understands that.
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They can't be loaded and if you are crossing state lines they have to be in locked cases.
Talk to a lawyer.
In what states? A long gun isn't, by definition, a concealed weapon. Its not something that can be concealed, and you can't pull it on the cop who pulls you over. If its unloaded (again state laws may vary), its not a crime in any state I know of if the weapon itself is legal. That's one more argument for the AR over the shotty. You can carry it behind the seat and out of easy reach unloaded and be kosher, and all you have to do is slap a clip into it and you're good to go. (Just seeing if Haz is lurking ;)).
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Me and NH both have laws that specify no loaded long guns in vehicles.
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Read the post Tom, I said UNLOADED. That's the beauty of the AR. It takes about five seconds to slap a mag in.Until then, perfectly legal. Seriously, no one can deploy a long gun instantly in a vehicle, that's what pistols are for. But if you keep an unloaded rifle behind the seat in your truck, and a mag in the door panel or console, you can deploy it in less than a minute if you know trouble is coming. Until then, you are just transporting a perfectly legal weapon.
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Read the post Tom, I said UNLOADED. That's the beauty of the AR. It takes about five seconds to slap a mag in.Until then, perfectly legal. Seriously, no one can deploy a long gun instantly in a vehicle, that's what pistols are for. But if you keep an unloaded rifle behind the seat in your truck, and a mag in the door panel or console, you can deploy it in less than a minute if you know trouble is coming. Until then, you are just transporting a perfectly legal weapon.
You need to reread the post you're arguing with, the 1st 4 words you quoted were "they can't be loaded. (Like you apparently are.)
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At the risk of going against the prevailing wisdom here.. I'd have to go with the shotgun. A SAIGA, perhaps, mounted up against the headliner. (In a perfect world..)
This was an either/or question, wasn't it?
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. But if you keep an unloaded rifle behind the seat in your truck, and a mag in the door panel or console, you can deploy it in less than a minute if you know trouble is coming. Until then, you are just transporting a perfectly legal weapon.
FQ,I don't know about other states,but here in NY if you have an uncased long gun and ammo accessible in the passenger compartment you are transporting a "loaded" fire arm.There has to be 2 motions separating the firearm from the ammo to be legal.So the gun would have to be in a case and the ammo in the trunk or glovebox or an ammo box.
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Ok, in my console (middle seat divider), its a flip top box like the glove box. So, motion one, reach for the rifle. Motion two, get it out. Motion three, open the console (or glove box). Motion four, load the mag. Motion five, chamber the round. That seems to clear the hurdle with room to spare. Look, I am always in favor of erring on the side of caution where gun laws (even stupid ones) are concerned, as even if you win it will be an expensive victory. BUT, I don't see any law that requires a locked case or anything like that. My only point was that for road SD a rifle with a detachable mag can be transported unloaded and armed with a mag a lot quicker than an unloaded tube fed shotgun.
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Is there a reason for us getting bogged down in detailed squables here? Well, outside of the fact that we like to argue of course.
Let rj check out the laws as he travels from state to state, just like the rest of us check them out as we travel with our self defense tools.
Can we now go back to his original question, or at least a drift that is enjoyable?
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+10.
FQ
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It's what we do ;D
Is this a more enjoyable thread drift?
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d19/Majer357/kaley-cuoco-01.jpg)
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Back to the OP,I would go with a Scoutrifle with detachable mags,You can have different types of ammo in the extra mags and less likelihood of raising questions should anyone see it.
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It's what we do ;D
Is this a more enjoyable thread drift?
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d19/Majer357/kaley-cuoco-01.jpg)
:P
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I choose to take the ar when I go. It won't be an immediate access weapon, but it will be there. If things go bad, I can make it ready and not give a crap about laws. I choose it over a shotgun for several reasons.
1) I'm envisioning an urban/suburban setting more than a rural one.
2) I'm planning mostly for riots, large crowds, etc. and want increased capacity and speed.
3) I want increased accuracy at moderate ranges to keep crowds at bay farther.
4) Although not very comfortable, it is wearable (single point sling with stock collapsed) while I drive.
If I were located in a more rural setting where wildlife and/or wilderness survival was a priority, I would probably opt for the shotgun.
With the above said, what I really want is a Kel-tec sub2000 9mm carbine. I really like the idea of being able to fold it up in a small inconspicuous package, use the same mags and ammo as my pistols, and still have increased range and accuracy. It would probably become my primary truck gun, and the ar would only go if I was going somewhere with a known history of being dangerous (i.e. Memphis).
Also, briefly continuing the laws drift, a loaded magazine is considered a loaded weapon in some places, California I think.
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While I was serious with my initial post of both, I have to be honest. I don't keep the ar in the car. I haven't been able to come up with a workable rack mount for it yet. I do have a 10-22 takedown in the back (best gun of the year) and a takedown shotgun is in the works, and the g26 is on the hip. Our state finally got their heads on right and changed the laws to allow unloaded uncased long arms in a motor vehicle. My only real problem is my ccw permit is not recognized by MN so to be legal I have to disarm and unload when traveling through that state. IL just requires a long travel reroute.
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With the exception of IL (in-laws live there), all the other states I travel to are gun friendly. I live in Tennessee and surrounding states honor CCW from TN.
If I'm on the road when all hell breaks loose, I'd like to have more than my CCW pistol. When I go camping, I've always carried larger pistol or shotgun.
As mentioned, I think the mob/riot is the scenario that worries me the most.
So, anyone carry food supply with them? Is that paranoid too?
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My $.02. I would take a gun you don't care about losing and leave it in the trunk. there is no real way to carry a long gun in and out of a hotel room with out beening seen. I don't like the idea of letting people know I have a gun and I also dislike leaving anything in the car.
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My $.02. I would take a gun you don't care about losing and leave it in the trunk. there is no real way to carry a long gun in and out of a hotel room with out beening seen. I don't like the idea of letting people know I have a gun and I also dislike leaving anything in the car.
Buy a peli-case, tell them it's a guitar.
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Ok, in my console (middle seat divider), its a flip top box like the glove box. So, motion one, reach for the rifle. Motion two, get it out. Motion three, open the console (or glove box). Motion four, load the mag. Motion five, chamber the round. That seems to clear the hurdle with room to spare. Look, I am always in favor of erring on the side of caution where gun laws (even stupid ones) are concerned, as even if you win it will be an expensive victory. BUT, I don't see any law that requires a locked case or anything like that. My only point was that for road SD a rifle with a detachable mag can be transported unloaded and armed with a mag a lot quicker than an unloaded tube fed shotgun.
Then you'll like this, FQ:
;D
VVVVVVVVVV
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Saiga or AK, now..
All in favor of returning to thread drift, say Oooo..
It's what we do ;D
Is this a more enjoyable thread drift?
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d19/Majer357/kaley-cuoco-01.jpg)
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I don't think I want them to think I have a gutiar with me either. I would like to stand out as little as I can.
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My only real problem is my ccw permit is not recognized by MN so to be legal I have to disarm and unload when traveling through that state. IL just requires a long travel reroute.
I just traveled across 11 states and the only place my permit wasn't recognized was my final destination - MN.
(I won't go to IL for anything. I might make a mistake and spend a nickel there which could be used to support the MF'ers that run the place.)
As to the OP question, I'd take the AR. Shotguns have little advantage over handguns as far as range is concerned.
The carbine gives you hundreds of yards of influence. If you want to be more low key in the eyes of LEOs, take a lever action.
BTW, AR10s make great deer rifles! That 8 point buck never stood a chance against the 168gr Berger VLD. ;D
So, anyone carry food supply with them? Is that paranoid too?
Lots of food, water, ammo. It's not paranoid, it's being prepared.
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No food, but water, blanket, basic hand tools, first aid kit.. etc
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Dan,
Pick up a Utah permit. I got mine so I could because I travel North Dakota.