The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: RTFM on January 16, 2013, 12:51:52 PM
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http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/
1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system.
2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system.
3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system.
4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun.
6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers.
7. Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign.
8. Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission).
9. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations.
10. Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement.
11. Nominate an ATF director.
12. Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations.
13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
15. Direct the Attorney General to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
17. Release a letter to health-care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law-enforcement authorities.
18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.
19. Develop model emergency-response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education.
20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental-health services that Medicaid plans must cover.
21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges.
22. Commit to finalizing mental-health-parity regulations.
23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health.
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#24 Crown himself "Emperor" on Feb 3
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I'm going to get flamed for this but I want you guys to notice something about the proposals...
Almost all of them "on paper" are things we, as a comunity, have said need to happen:
Better mental health care, and reoprting so mentally unstable persons do not get access to firearms.
A better system for conducting backgound checks, again so criminals can't get them.
Better training for first responders in an emergency, along with more police in schools
Enforcement of existing laws concerning stolen firearms
I'm not saying they are not going to be pushed to the limit and abused, just on the surface they are what WE have asked for.
Now some go beyond what will really help, including 13-17, that are nothing more than ways to get the CDC to say guns are a health issue or to require "smart guns" or some other silly device that is not technologically feasable.
NO where in the 23 things listed do I read AWB or mag capacity limit, not that they won't try.
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13 us the 'catch all' for gun control
13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
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13 us the 'catch all' for gun control
13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
Correct, but unfortunately that is something else the gun community has asked for, better enforcement of existing laws, just how far they have pushed it.
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There are no fools in this forum. So let's be careful we don't assume the President is giving us what we asked for. The devil is in the details, not some descriptor sentence. The President knows that if he is to do some damage, it will have to occur through executive action and not via the lily-livered Congress. Pay attention to the fine print.
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I think that is what I'm getting at. They know that if they word it similar to what we've asked for they can slide it through without out a fight. Do they REALLY think we're that stupid? (I know, yes they do.)
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He has put the 2A under the jurisdiction of Obamacare. Guns are now a healthcare issue.
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14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
The "Affordable Care Act may allow the questions, but it specifically prohibits keeping such records .
Read it for yourself here :
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/01/09/this-is-how-a-secret-gun-provision-made-its-way-into-obamacare-legislation/
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14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
The "Affordable Care Act may allow the questions, but it specifically prohibits keeping such records .
Read it for yourself here :
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/01/09/this-is-how-a-secret-gun-provision-made-its-way-into-obamacare-legislation/
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
How much of a stretch is it to think the term "gun nut" means you have a disease or mental defect that requires treatment and confiscation of your firearms?
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14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
My understanding is that Congress has said CDC can't do this research. And a Presidential Memorandum can't change that. Does anyone know if this is the case.
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Mental health is really going to be one of the big problems with this, a lot of gun owner’s cried mental health after Newtown. Even though it is a problem, they failed to take into account who would be the people decided the issue and the unintended consequences.
1) Laws will most likely dictate that no guns are allowed in a home with anyone that has mental health issues, anyone in the home with diagnosed depression = Good buy guns. Children with ADD = Good Buy Guns. Veterans, Fire Fighters or retired cops with PTSD = Good Buy Guns, and the list continues.
2) Some people will not seek help with mental health problems because of this path.
3) With the Government likely to take over all health care, only the Government will decide who has mental health problems in the future and they already think we all have mental health issues.
This can of worms has only started to crack open, and BHO loves it because he knows how much power it will ultimately yield.
Expand your thinking with these 23 more of them give them a path to expand their power through creative regulation.
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4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
Look for an ever larger and growing class of prohibited person.
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I've been saying it for years, fixing America requires ropes and guns .
I've been called an extremist .
Look what a clusterf*ck comes from being reasonable.
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Rope
Tree
Politicians
Some assembly required.
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No one is going to like hearing it but the truth is we need a purge.
It's not just the politicians, we need to get rid of the ones who support them as well .
The ones Lenin called "useful idiots" .
All the "progressives", especially those in education, media and the bureaucracy must be jailed, exiled, or killed.
The "liberal agenda" is a cancer and the tumor needs to be cut out of society.
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Expect future problems where the CPSC and the CDC are involved. They've been reigned in before and will have to again.
Also seems like he caved to the NRA idea that more good guys with guns at school would help.
18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.
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Okay, Tom, after we get rid of all the "progressives", who's next? Italians? Jews? Conservative Blacks (you will find many of these during your progrom!) There is always someone next! Some survivors might even think that you should be next as your usefulness would be over, as Stalin found with Lenin and Trotsky. The Constitution calls for overthrow of tyranny and return to its basic tenets, not extermination. I'm not trying to be "reasonable" in these comments; I am trying to be sane in the conviction that our goal is freedom American style, not freedom Hitlerian, Stalinian and little red book style. Want to turn this into Kampuchea? Uganda? Those styles, once implemented, never stopped, killed millions until they failed miserably.
Call me sheeple if you want. I'm not into destroying this republic and what it represents to recreate it in my own image. I want to recover this republic in the image of our founders and do it via the means they provided to us. If we aren't smart enough to convince the American people that the American Republic is being destroyed from within, then we are the problem. I think we are smart enough, but we haven't really applied ourselves. We tend to grumble a lot and act separately. It is time we acted in unison and stopped hiding behind the NRA, GOA and SAF but make them parts of our movement. We are in dire need of a recognized and respected leader. Find him or her and we are on our way.
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What I'll call you is "ignorant of your history" .
Where do you think the Tories went after the Revolution ?
That's how so many English speakers wound up in what had been exclusively French Eastern Canada .
Have you put so little thought into this that you think removing the provably "not to bright" politicians is enough without removing the underlying power structure that put those particular tools in power ?
It's no different than getting rid of bamboo or Kudzu grass .
Just cutting the plant is not enough, the supporting roots have to go as well or it will just come back again .
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Tom,
Your definition of removal is not mine. I'm not ignorant of "my" history; I am ignorant of yours! We are not talking about kudzu here; we are talking about people. If you don't know the difference...and your comments frequently say you don't...then there is nothing I can say to help you understand my position. Yes, I do think we can remove enough politicians supported by an insidious infrastructure to begin reversing the trend toward progressive tyranny. No I don't think that it will be necessary to kill all progressives to achieve that. I am not hellbent on civil war; I am hellbent on civil revolution... first. Who gives a damn about where the Tories went after the Revolution (although I suspect a good many of them hid right here in MD); the point is that indeed they did go and we didn't have to kill them all to "gitter done" . Seriously, our aims are the same; our methods are not.
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Two issues I had as listening to all of this on the radio yesterday - Mostly non talk show and no npr:
1. It is amazing how much Pres. BHO is putting on the medical profession to get involved with gun possession. All the way down to firearm safety instruction. I did not get home from work until 10:30 last night after two long days on the road, but I developed a plan while driving: I am going to craft a letter of proposal and send it to all of our doctors, clinics and hospitals within a 30 mile radius and offer basic firearm education and safety training. I am also going to revamp my brochure to an item they can hand to patients, so they can get a better quality education that a doctor's lecture;
2. In his speech he referenced it being foolish to work on violence without fully understanding the cause of the violence. This was the intro to funding research into what causes people to do this. This was the introductory statement to item 23 on his list. I need to find the transcript before I rant outside of our choir. The saddest thing is that right after this comment on needing scientific research and understanding prior to action he went into his rants on pushing legislation for limits and bans all while using incorrect terminology and banning items that do not have an affect on the issue.
While having coffee early yesterday (5:00 am) I heard a debate over how the Repbulicans have failed. What I have noticed over the last decade, since Reagan, is that the DFL is made up of personal communicators and the GOP an other conservatives are made up of people with business communication skills. My comparison is that while conservatives were in business, science, math and debate classes the DFL of the future were in drama, english lit, speech, and social work classes. They know how to speak in a feel good way, dumb themselves down to the lowest level, and be one of the guys. Yesterday we did not have a Vice President. If you listen to the speech all of these recommendations came from "Joe." No reference to Mr. Biden or V.P. Biden. Everything was Joe, Joe, Joe. I'm sorry, but he is your and our Vice President, and if I am going to show respect for the office I think it is correct for you to show the same basic respect for the Office and Nation you represent.
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Conservatives focus their programs on fact based information .
Liberals focus on emotion based propaganda .
Uninformed passion seems to be more effective than fact based reason because feeling doesn't require the effort needed for thinking.
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That is what I was saying, but I was doing it is a fact based informed message.
Another way to put it:
DFL are marketers, and Conservatives are writing business reports and executive summaries. Feelings and fluff vs. facts and truth.
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Facts don't fit into a 15 second sound bite like "It's for the children" .
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My message to the nation and our leaders:
We are not children! We are reasoning adults! I don't want headlines (Headline News), I don't want sound bites, and I don't want debates between opposing sides when the limits are determined by "hard breaks" and the next group coming in in five minutes.
We have the capability of grasping a full story and a full debate when we choose. Give us the full story, we will follow those we wish, and we will edit those that we don't wish to spend the time on, but quit deciding for us what is important and how much we should know!
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You'll never get your message across .
Keep it 10 words or less .
"If you try to take my guns I'll kill you ."
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Do contractions count Tom?
"If you try and take my guns you will die!"
10 words exactly! ;)
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A hole ;D
"I'll" is only one word .
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6 words: Take my guns, you will die
5 words: take my gun, you die
4 words: Take guns, you die
3 words: Take guns, die
2 words: Molon Labe
1 word: Wolverine