The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Politics & RKBA => Topic started by: Rastus on March 13, 2014, 06:18:38 AM
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Sadly, yesterday the Oklahoma Legislature passed HJR 1082 which reads "HJR 1082, as introduced, puts to a vote of the people a proposal for a state Constitutional Convention to convene in 2015 and provides for the selection of delegates.".
Oklahoma, if this passes the OK Senate, will be the 19th state calling for a state Constitutional Convention.
What is bad about this is that when a sufficient number of states have Constitutional Conventions for their state they can continue and effortlessly call for a U.S. Constitutional Convention without consulting the people. MAKE NO MISTAKE, THIS IS A COORDINATED EFFORT by our "government leaders" to back door a Constitutional Convention on a federal level that is supported by dems and RINOS.
My own legislator, Sean Roberts, voted for this despite being warned. His response and reasoning is to pass laws to fix the bad things happening in government....how naïve he is. If they won't respect the laws we have now why later?
FACT IS that we may be about to massively lose our rights and U.S. Constitution. This has been a quiet movement that you guys need to know about...we got blindsided about a week ago.
When a Constitutional Convention is called "We the people" have no control. Period. The delegates can do what they want and don't be so silly as to think you control them or that they will do the right thing.
Our God given rights may lose their Constitutional protections. If a Constitutional Convention is called do you not imagine what the liberal/progressive/socialists will do? We can, legally by vehicle of our current U.S. Constitution, become a Communist nation or legally sanctioned Oligarchy at the extreme.
We're fighting with what we have left now to keep this from happening. You guys need to be aware to help stop or repeal it in your states.
This is Colorado, New York and Connecticut on a truly nuclear scale when it comes to the right to bear arms, have free speech, personal ownership of home and property, being innocent until proven guilty, etc.
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I don't think this is bad at all. Look at Mark Levin's book he wrote last year, The Liberty Amendments. The states will not give more power to the Fed, it isn't in their own selfish interests. The Federal government has overstepped its bounds for decades and it is going to take a drastic step to hem them in and this is a LOT better than another civil war. We just need to be involved, like being one of the delegates selected or at least have some input on the selection, so that we can make the intelligent, CLEAR changes that will defund the fed and return the power to the individual states where it belongs.
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Matthew Bracken's "Domestic Enemies: The Reconquista" takes a different approach than the book Magoo mentioned. I know it's fiction, but it could happen.
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Matthew Bracken's "Domestic Enemies: The Reconquista" takes a different approach than the book Magoo mentioned. I know it's fiction, but it could happen.
I know I've read the books, but given the choice between Braken and Levin-I'm sorry-Levin's brain is bigger.
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I don't think this is bad at all. Look at Mark Levin's book he wrote last year, The Liberty Amendments. The states will not give more power to the Fed, it isn't in their own selfish interests. The Federal government has overstepped its bounds for decades and it is going to take a drastic step to hem them in and this is a LOT better than another civil war. We just need to be involved, like being one of the delegates selected or at least have some input on the selection, so that we can make the intelligent, CLEAR changes that will defund the fed and return the power to the individual states where it belongs.
If you honestly believe this, then you have not been paying attention. States will move heaven and earth to get more Fed $$$$$$$$$$.
For example, my own, normally reasonable former state of ND - you know, the one of 2 maybe with a positive cashflow and even a budget surplus every year? - took stimulus money from the Feds, and then had to jump through all sorts of hoops because of it.
I agree with Rastus, this is bad, we will lose the few "protections" that we currently enjoy.
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We don't have enough
conservatives honest people in office to make people follow the law now. Dems are assaulting conservatives using the IRS and the Repubs are allowing it because the conservative movement threatens their power....and people honestly think it can be fixed with these snakes in control?
Levine is totally off base thinking this can be fixed with a Constitutional Convention.
I mean really, the people who will be selecting those who will attend these conventions are the same ones that put Obama in two times....and someone like Levine thinks this will change things in a positive way?
It's that simple. To believe that "liberty will rise up" from this is a fantasy.
There is nothing but downside given the current condition of the Republic.
Think...use your head....we've had a "conservative" Republican House, Senate and President back during Bush II and what did that do to "fix" things? In light of this can anyone honestly believe Levine's dream is legitimate?
Guys this is for all of the marbles. It has to be gotten right...which right now means no convention.
Is anyone naïve to think that 18 states approval for a "state" constitutional convention is not driven by someone's agenda? This wasn't a spontaneous happenstance. It ain't Levine driving it....it's the socialist/liberal/progressives in the dem party steering this thing and the hapless repubs are falling for it hook, line and sinker.
Hapless Republicans....it's what they are...either partner's in crime or dupes.
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"We the people" have all the say we have guts enough to enforce .
Mao told you the secret decades ago.
"All political power comes from the barrel of a gun."
And in case people haven't figured it out yet, "We the people" have a hell of a lot more of them than any one else.
If we are "oppressed" it is because we either want to be, or are cowards and deserve it regardless of our wants.
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If you honestly believe this, then you have not been paying attention. States will move heaven and earth to get more Fed $$$$$$$$$$.
Path, you're a NoDaker. You should know better than any of us that your state is the most productive and fastest growing the nation. DESPITE the Fed. Your state is making it's own money hand over fist right now. Do you think that they are going to give any of that up to the Fed? Makes far more sense that they would just take over the Fed land in the state and open up more drilling.
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The whole state doesn't have a say in it...just those who are chosen to run the convention and if anyone thinks the appointments will be done in a fair and constitutional way, you are naive at best.
They are working to get the future of the constitution into the hands of a very small group of people and that deck will have been stacked from way before before the start of the selection process.
Of course our staunch conservative officials will put a stop to all the shenanigans....just like we have seen them doing with all of BHO's actions in flagrant disregard of the constitution.
Of course with the media spotlight that will be on the selection proceedings, all will be kept open and above board and any misstep will be plastered all over the headlines and evening news.....similar to the in depth and watch dog coverage that the Fast And Furious debacle received.
And Tom is only right. The power is in the hands of the people ... and that power was manufactures by Colt, Winchester, Remington, Glock :D, and all the rest.
The question is: Do we have the backbone to use our power and keep our freedoms?
A good preview of that answer will become evident with the outcome of the situation on Connecticut.
And as far as the state's self interest goes, their conventions could pass every positive measure the true conservatives want...the only compromise they need to make is calling for a federal constitutional convention.
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And as far as the state's self interest goes, their conventions could pass every positive measure the true conservatives want...the only compromise they need to make is calling for a federal constitutional convention.
But that is the whole point of this being a STATE convention. The feds don't get a say.
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But that is the whole point of this being a STATE convention. The feds don't get a say.
That is true.....but one of the functions of the state convention is to request a federal convention and THAT is when the Feds...and only the selected Feds have all the say.
Of course, if you can't trust the Feds, who can you trust.
We don't care about what happens at the state convention EXCEPT for their ability to trigger a Federal Constitution Convention and that is where every freedom we have protected by the constitution is in dire jeopardy.
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As far as Federal money goes. Hard core liberal blue states require far more of it than conservative red states do. Just look at California, Illinois, and Mass. Their entire form of government would crumble without the constant infusion of Federal money. Democrats are the party who believe there is not a problem in existence that cannot be solved by throwing money at it.
That alone will keep them enslaved to what will ultimately destroy them, along with the bogus form of government they so love to embrace. The best example you have of this is Detroit. It collapsed like a financial house of cards. Chicago and California are next. They will eat themselves alive with government.
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A state convention can turn into a federal convention if the state conventions so desire and if enough states are on board. This is the plan...why do you think 18 states are having a convention called and in previous years there were zero scheduled conventions? This is not happenstance, this is cold calculation to backdoor the people...you are not supposed to see the end game...."state conventions" are the smoke and mirrors to confuse you.
When a convention is called "We the people" have no say. Period. The delegates are free to do what they want. For now, states must adhere to the US Constitution but if 41 (or 42?) state conventions decide to get together they can trash that old worn out document and give us something new and shiney.
And it can legally be anything the delegates want it to be. They can legally start a kingdom if they want with Barack as the King and Harry Reid (a little dis here...) as the queen. "Mr. and Mrs. America....turn in those guns....stop talking bad about the president and news media you don't have the right to talk irresponsibly like that and oh, by the way, you are really only renting the land you are on from the government, you don't own a thing because we all know that everything flows from government down to the people." They could also decide, for instance, to include Mexico and Canada as part of the new nation if those nations were so inclined..
Things are not as they appear my friend. There is no end to the damage we could incur from this.
But that is the whole point of this being a STATE convention. The feds don't get a say.
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But that is the whole point of this being a STATE convention. The feds don't get a say.
If that were only true. This is an organized movement. At mid-March when Oklahoma was falling for this "under the radar nationalist movement" disguised as a "State Constitutional Convention" there we only 18 states calling for this. Now there are 34 states.
Please read this excerpt from my initial post: "What is bad about this is that when a sufficient number of states have Constitutional Conventions for their state they can continue and effortlessly call for a U.S. Constitutional Convention without consulting the people. MAKE NO MISTAKE, THIS IS A COORDINATED EFFORT by our "government leaders" to back door a Constitutional Convention on a federal level that is supported by dems and RINOS."
This is not a movement to fix states, it is a movement to use that guise to modify or delete the current U.S. Constitution.
I know you are sincere, but if you believe this is just a thing about STATES you are plain wrong....maybe because it feels good, maybe because someone lied to you, maybe because you aren't thinking clearly...or who knows....I don't care. And I AM trying to piss you off a bit so you'll pay attention to this.
This unrelated call for many State Constitutional Conventions IS NOT for the purpose you think it is; it is a coordinated and targeted attempt to use the mechanism of unrelated State Constitutions to legally come together for a US Constitutional Convention without a pending Constitutional Amendment that is wholly legal and sanctioned by our current U.S. Constitution as a vehicle to change or eliminate the U.S. Constitution. This is because this power, despite our immersion in a "federal government" is held by the states themselves.
You are not supposed to see the end game. That's the point of this tactic to strip you of your freedoms.