The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: pioneer on June 24, 2008, 06:36:00 PM
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I've recently received some advice from a trusted friend, about the situation we gun owners and shooters find ourselves in, with respect to the political situation. There is a very real chance that we may prevail in the Heller decision pending from the SCOTUS, but just what that decision will entail is impossible to say. Many scholars and court watchers think the 2nd Amendment will be ruled as an individual right, but that government should retain the power to place restrictions on that right. If that becomes the case, and IF Barack Hussein Obama is elected as our 44th POTUS, we may be in some deep doo-doo. We are under the threat of a new, "improved" and permanent Assault Weapons Ban in congress if the Democrats win more seats. Last go-round, congress allowed a sunset provision into the bill. They will NOT make that same "mistake" again.
If congress can't pass a ban bill, by executive action the president can order federal officers to find and confiscate certain classifications of firearms. On April 6, 1998 Bill Clinton signed an order that permanently banned the importation of more than 50 semiautomatic "assault weapons." In 2001 Clinton also used executive orders to ban the importation of "assault pistols" and tighten licensing rules on gun dealers. Many accused Clinton of overuse of the executive power on gun control issues. In 1999 White House domestic policy chief Bruce D. Reed said, "The country is tired of waiting for Congress to respond to the tragedy in Littleton. The administration is going to do every thing in its power to make progress on guns."
"Many accused Clinton of overuse of the executive power on gun control issues." Big deal, he did it anyway.
The advice I received was to place at least one of my semi-automatic pistols, rifles, ammo and magazines in a hiding place. I'm giving this some very serious thought. It should be somewhere other than where you live, but close enough for relatively quick access.
Has anyone else considered this, and if so, I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on the subject?
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You are going to need a pelican case:
(http://us.st12.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/pelican-flashlights_2004_783558)
http://www.pelican-case.com/1120.html
....and a shovel.
They are unbreakable, watertight, airtight, dustproof, chemical resistant and corrosion proof.
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Scalia is writing the final paper, all is well .
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I remember the last days of the USSR, the Red Dawn mindset, the PVC tubes that were airtight, watertight, and designed to be buried like something out of Terminator II, with all your firearms inside. Stockpiling canned goods and ammo like it was going out of style and moving to North Dakota or Alaska.
ITS NOT THAT BAD,.... keyword YET!
If Scalia is writing the final ruling, that is a positive thing.
Even if Barack is elected, it will be a Carter redo. It will suck, and maybe the Republican party will stop being impotent and stand on the steps of the Capitol, and start confronting the far left for what they are.
Yes, Clinton really screwed up some things, and the Republicans better wake up and be ready to fight for every BS Exec. order BHO can sign. Hopefully my dues to the NRA can make a bigger impression on the polidiots in DC, but I'll go to DC and stand at that black iron fence at the White House, and let Barack know; he can't F*** with the 2nd Amend.
Don't get a pelican case just yet. ::)
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Wrong! Get it before the prices soar. ;)
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Heller goes the way we want it … but that won’t stop a Dem controlled Congress and President from doing things worse than Wild Bill Clinton ever _______ing thought of doing.
Here’s what B-Ho will say ….
“You have the right to keep and bear arms BUT we will tell you what arms and what caliber. We will tell you how much ammo and we will tax the living crap out of you for buying it. We will also control where and when you can shoot. We are going to enforce my no gun store law so there will be no gun stores within 50 miles of any school, public park or post office. And no one, absolutely no one will be allowed to shoot on May 5th … because that is going to be our national holiday celebrating the birthday of our beloved friend and comrade, Karl Marx.”
Obama is dangerous.
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Wrong! Get it before the prices soar. ;)
Okay, get one now, Haz your right, I have to go in the attic and dig out some "stuff", and order another 1.
Get more dessicant packs too,...
Sam's club; need those 5 lb cans of beans. 8)
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Wrong! Get it before the prices soar. ;)
Hell, I'm gonna buy a couple. Maybe I can trade one for some gas when the price goes up ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Even the boys at Mossberg (http://www.mossberg.com/products/default.asp?id=28§ion=products) know what's coming down the pike.
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Sound advice. Reloading is another good idea.
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Just think of all the break ins and stolen guns in one night if the ban "assault weapons" ;D
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Wrong! Get it before the prices soar. ;)
Already have one. Thanx.
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I would not worry about it. It won't happen. Atleast not anytime soon.
The sky has been falling for as long as I can remember... one group or another has said this or that.
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do it your self with some large PVC pipe. ;)
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do it your self with some large PVC pipe. ;)
Any experience with long term storage using PVC?
I guess you could just forget the PVC and pelican case altogether and just go bury a Glock out in the middle of the woods (torture test indeed).
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Bet it work's when dug up.
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Any experience with long term storage using PVC?
Pack it with dessicant, seal it up. Or "just go bury a Glock out in the middle of the woods (torture test indeed)." ::)
Hawkfish should reply; PVC? We don't need no stinkin' PVC! 8) 8) 8)
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Any experience with long term storage using PVC?
Pack it with dessicant, seal it up. Or "just go bury a Glock out in the middle of the woods (torture test indeed)." ::)
Hawkfish should reply; PVC? We don't need no stinkin' PVC! 8) 8) 8)
Where is Hawkfish any way ? Haven't heard from him lately, or Don Worsham, or Warhawk.
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PVC is not UV stable, it also does not like warm temps. Also in larger sizes its very costly( over 4"), it is also very hard to find. So if you intent is to hide something...special ordering somethig to hide to an object in is not a good idea.
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PVC is not UV stable, it also does not like warm temps. Also in larger sizes its very costly( over 4"), it is also very hard to find. So if you intent is to hide something...special ordering somethig to hide to an object in is not a good idea.
PVC is being buried, so UV not an issue. Can also get stabilized PVC, it's used a lot out here for various ground pipes.
And, actually, there are a number of plumbing supply yards around here with tons of pipes in all sizes including 12" plus. Look for a shop that specializes in septic systems, they'll have the pipe on hand.
If you're in an urban area, with lots of city water/sewer, cast iron and copper used, you may have to take a trip to the country to get the PVC you need. But it is out there.
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Stablized PVC can not be used for waste or pottable plumbing in the us. In the contstuction industry its mainly used as electrical conduit. It also has a limited role in irragation, but poly has pretty much killed that market.
Larger PVC pipes are used in water run off/ drainage. Generally speaking, they are not designed to be water tight.
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If it gets to the point in this country that you decide it is necessary to bury your tools of liberty, as the only recourse to confiscation, then the opportunity to effectively use them will have already been lost. Forever!
Mac.
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If it gets to the point in this country that you decide it is necessary to bury your tools of liberty, as the only recourse to confiscation, then the opportunity to effectively use them will have already been lost. Forever!
Mac.
Mac, I have to disagree TO A POINT. That was pretty much how the VC operated, and they were pretty effective AS GUERRILLAS. While it is true that it required the NVA to actually CONQUER South Vietnam, it was the irregular warfare, an ambush here, a mine there, and a sniper somewhere else, that was most effective, in the hands of the media, in raising the anti war sentiment among the American public that led to our Govt. leaving S. Vn in the lurch. The endless low level conflict led to frustration on the part of an American public, uneducated about this type of warfare, that eventually led to our withdrawal
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I agree with that set of facts regarding the VC brand of warfare, but who would EVER come to the aid of the 2A patriots? The Canadians ?, Mexicans? Obama voters? No. There would be no reserves to hold out for. The time would never be right to dig'em up and restore freedoms (they would ALL be taken in relentless portions) that had been long lost.
That being said, since Heller is out, we can save time and money on glue, pipe and rented backhoes, and put in some quality blender time. For a while anyway. I think we all deserve a little time off. Especially M&M&M!
Mac.
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Stablized PVC can not be used for waste or pottable plumbing in the us. In the contstuction industry its mainly used as electrical conduit. It also has a limited role in irragation, but poly has pretty much killed that market.
Larger PVC pipes are used in water run off/ drainage. Generally speaking, they are not designed to be water tight.
I have to disagree, our wonderful city employees are connecting 8" stabilized baby blue PVC pipe into our adjoining neighborhood for potable city water. I will take pics tomorrow and be glad to show you the progress in watertight connections here.
They seal, they bury, and for "storage", its not a time capsule to be opened 50 years from now. It works, and I'll bet there's some hardcore survivalists in this country with a "stash" in PVC buried in the back country with redundant GPS waypoints and topographical maps to go get later if needed. OOOOPPs revealed too much about myself. 8)
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The blue PVC pipe is something completly diffrent the UV stablized PVC... ( it also comes in green for street drains and purple for reclaim)
They also use rubber gaskets for connections rather then solvents.
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Most plumbing in new home construction is done with PVC pipe and fittings (tee's elbows etc.)glued together including larger diameter septic/sewer runs ( last I knew, copper was still used for HOT water). If water and sh...stuff doesn't come out, it probanbly will not get in.
Got to agree with Mac though, enough survivalism for a while, time for some BLENDERISM ;D
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PVC is not UV stable, it also does not like warm temps. Also in larger sizes its very costly( over 4"), it is also very hard to find. So if you intent is to hide something...special ordering somethig to hide to an object in is not a good idea.
I have to dissagree, in FLA. they make lawn furniture out of it and it lasts for a long time, although it will get brittle in the sum. Just look at your cable guy or any worker who keeps stuff on the top of his truck, you will find a pvc pipe filled with a screw on end, its reasonably cheap and buried will last forever, like land fill plastic bottles.
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Larger PVC pipes are used in water run off/ drainage. Generally speaking, they are not designed to be water tight.
Alright Tab, as the professional dissenter, I know your opinion won't change regardless of facts or experiences from anyone.
Anyway, here's an expert from the Free State Project in New Hampshire named Cope Reynolds, regarding long-term gun storage.
LONG-TERM GUN STORAGE
A question I get asked frequently is, “How do you suggest I store firearms and ammunition in such a way that I would not lose them in the event my house burned down or was broken into or Uncle Sugar wanted to come get them for one reason or another?”
One way is to buy one of the waterproof containers available almost everywhere (and cost too much), slide your gun into a rust-proof storage bag, put it in the container, then bury it somewhere. The method I recommend, however, works just as well and will protect your guns indefinitely.
Buy as much 8-inch PVC pipe as you need from a water/sewer materials distributor. Eight inches in diameter is larger than you will find at any hardware store. Get the kind of pipe designed for handling sewer water rather than fresh water (ask for SDR35). The water pipe works fine, but is unnecessarily heavy and expensive. There are three kinds of caps you can get to seal the ends. One kind is glued on and is permanent, but if you’ve never installed pipe before, it’s easy to miss a spot with your glue and thus allow for leakage. Another kind of cap is rubber gasketed. To use these, bevel the pipe back about 3/4 of an inch with a rasp or grinder, smear an even coat of lubricant on the pipe end (any kind of liquid soap will work), then slip the cap on. If done correctly, the seal will be absolutely 100% air and water tight. The third kind of cap uses a glue-on adaptor with a screw-type plug. You just glue the adaptor to the pipe end and the plug screws in to it. But these are unnecessarily expensive and just about impossible to remove without a BIG wrench. In my opinion, the gasketed caps are the best choice because to remove them, you can hold the pipe between your legs and kick them off or use a rock. No tools are required. To put them back on the pipe, just use a little liquid soap as you did the first time. You should have room for two long guns, a couple of handguns, and a little ammo for each in a 4-foot section of 8-inch pipe. Since scoped rifles, rifles with fixed mags, and even some open-sighted rifles with a lot of drop in the stock may not fit into a 6-inch pipe, spend just a little more and buy the bigger 8-inch stuff.
Now that you have your pipe prepared, clean your guns as you normally would, leaving a very light film of oil on them. Forget cosmoline or heavy grease; Break-Free is my preference. Slip each gun into a breathable case, then put it into your pipe. To make an effective dessicant, put some crushed sheetrock or kitty litter on a cookie sheet and bake it at 300 degrees for about 30 minutes. Fill a sock half full with your homemade dessicant, tie it off, and put it in the pipe. (If you don’t like the homemade method, you can always go spend a bunch of money on special dessicants that some people say you just can’t live without.) Before sealing, keep the pipe in the house for a day or two to make absolutely sure that the interior is as dry as it can be. This is especially important if you live in a humid climate.
Bury the sealed pipe somewhere away from your house, preferably half a mile or more depending on the population close at hand. If possible, bury it vertically in order to present a smaller target for metal detectors and ground penetrating radar. If you must bury it close to your home, try to place it parallel to metal pipelines, under the edge of a metal-reinforced concrete slab, under a fence post, etc.
He provides three options for sealing, and gasketed are better, but the PVC works fine.
Have a good one Tab, can't have everyone agree all the time, than things become monotonous. ;D
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did you read that ? he actually tells you exactly what pipe to get. Even going as far as listing a spec. Not all PVC pipe is the same...
If you read it he says gaskets are easier to install for some one that does not have exp, which is true. Most municipalitys also tend to favor gaskets/ bands, Its not for thier sealing abilty, its that they can be disasymboled easly when you have a prob. It awhole lot easier to un bolt something then it is to cut and regule.
I know nothing, its not like I do this type of thing for a living... oh wait, I do.
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Very civill argument I like it . Better watch for more ZOMBIE's.LURK 8) 8) 8)
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TAB, I acknowledge there are different types of PVC, and you are the "Man" when it comes to different types of PVC.
I think to keep it simple, one has to factor in a very important consideration: "How Long is to be Buried?"
Few Weeks? Few months? Few Years? A Decade? If its short term, and done correctly, Good 'ol PVC works, that's all I'm saying.
Although the big picture answer we "might" both agree on is, if we really have to start burying our guns, it might be time to start using them, because a Revolution will be underway again.
Although, "Some" Californians could have trouble with that type of thing.
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Tab, that was great of you to give some recognition to those who add to your post. Sorry if you are ill informed. As a matter of fact I think you may be just a little off track.
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TAB, I acknowledge there are different types of PVC, and you are the "Man" when it comes to different types of PVC.
I think to keep it simple, one has to factor in a very important consideration: "How Long is to be Buried?"
Few Weeks? Few months? Few Years? A Decade? If its short term, and done correctly, Good 'ol PVC works, that's all I'm saying.
Although the big picture answer we "might" both agree on is, if we really have to start burying our guns, it might be time to start using them, because a Revolution will be underway again.
Although, "Some" Californians could have trouble with that type of thing.
Now thats Match Grade right there.