The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Tactical Rifle & Carbine => Topic started by: Galeth005 on January 11, 2009, 11:47:28 PM
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so i've been kicking the dust for to long now and have decided that i need to get an AR, now i know this is gonna open a can of worms, but i dont know anything about these sorts of things. i know i want it for recreational use as well as defense in situations that may require it. i know i want it in .223 but that about it. i dont like the ak platforms and i dont like the sks platforms. what should i be looking at? brands? guns? and gear?
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They are all pretty well made nowadays.
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I just received my JP-15 rifle...I have not gotten to shoot it yet, but it is really cool. I wanted to get a first rifle and checked around with everyone and I found this one to be the best. It is spendy, but I hope it is worth it. It sure is made well. I have fired many guns so I had a pretty good idea what to look for in my first rifle.
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so i've been kicking the dust for to long now and have decided that i need to get an AR, now i know this is gonna open a can of worms, but i dont know anything about these sorts of things. i know i want it for recreational use as well as defense in situations that may require it. i know i want it in .223 but that about it. i dont like the ak platforms and i dont like the sks platforms. what should i be looking at? brands? guns? and gear?
You don't say where you live, that could limit your options.
With home defense, you want a shorter barreled rifle, collapsible stock too I would think. The classic Viet Nam era rifle is called the A1, fixed stock, longer barrel, carry handle. Many of us use the modern look-alike to what''s called the M4 carbine with shorter barrel, collapsible stock, no carry handle, and lots of mounting rails for lights, lasers, optics, etc.
Beyond that is your preference, try 'em out at the local gun shop to see what's what. All brands are good - as most commentators say these days, companies don't dare put crap on the market, word-of-mouth on the internet will bring the crap to light very fast and sales will die. Price, as Thanos noted, is the primary determinant for the same basic rifle - colts are pricey, DPMS and Stag tend not to be. Stag makes the S&W M&P which is probably 25% more than the same thing from Stag (or used to be, have not compared prices lately)
Oh, one more thing, buy lots and lots of standard capacity (30-round) magazines, like those from Midway, Brownell's or Magpul.
Oh, and Thanos, post gun porn (pictures of your rifle). Goes for you too Galeth005 - it is expected when touting your own goodies.
And welcome to the site, both of you.
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(http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/4753/dsc00006bi2.jpg)
I'm a little partial to Bushmaster. These 5 all run great! Bill T.
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(http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=2179;type=avatar)
Is the girl with the long legs yours too?
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Yes. That's Melanie. The Carbon 15 21S Pistol is hers, and the heavy barreled M-4. Bill T.
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You don't say where you live, that could limit your options.
I live in Oregon and as far as the handgun regulations they tend to be very lenient... not sure about rifles, been looking into that, i'm looking at a stag model 2, or a Bushmaster Carbon 15 Model 4 Carbine. links to pages are such
http://www.stagarms.com/product_info.php?cPath=13_22&products_id=206 - stag
http://www.bushmaster.com/catalog_carbon15_AZ-C15M4PRE.asp - bushmaster
I'll be going down to the gun show later in the month to take a look and handle them in person. the local gun shop has the bushmaster but not the stag. both of these dont have very many rails, but i'm told i can put some on later if wish it. my budget is 1400, plus another 800 for the extra goodies like 30 rd mags, sights, lights, ect
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Has any one here had any experience with AR's from Armalite? I ask because they carry the AR10 in 7.62.
-Thanks
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Got 2 Stags...excellent guns.
Got a JP...beyond excellent!
mb
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No particular order, Colt, DPMS, Armalite, S&W, Rock River, Bushmaster, Olympic Arms, Stag, all work well, and there is probably a few I forgot.
(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/m25operator/100_1380.jpg)
Left to right, Colt SP1, DPMS shorty, Olympic lower with Colt upper, DPMS space gun, with Krieger barrel and Geiselle match trigger.
(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/m25operator/100_1744.jpg)
New DPMS I built for DCM shooting, rock river full float tube under the handguards, Shilen 8R barrel
(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/m25operator/100_1754.jpg)
Iron sights off the bench 100 yards. Needed one more click to the right.
(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/m25operator/100_1741-1.jpg)(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/m25operator/100_1743.jpg)
(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/m25operator/100_1742-1.jpg)
New 3 gun build on DPMS upper and lower, with Shilen 8R barrel.
(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/m25operator/100_1748.jpg)
100 yards off the bipod.
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There's one thing I really don't like about the current crop of M4 type carbines. It's the big groove that's turned into the barrel in front of the front sight. The military had skinny barrels on M16s and M16-A1s, then when they came out with the M16-A2 they made the part from the front sight out to the muzzle thicker to fix what they saw as a deficiency. Now the M4 carbine comes out and has a narrow weak spot in the barrel. Unless you're mounting an M203 grenade launcher it serves no purpose other than to make it look more like an M4, but it's still not the same thing since an M4 barrel is only 14.5". My 16" barrel doesn't have the groove cut into it. If I stick my bayonet in someone and give it a twist and it won't wreck my A2 style barrel. Some AR-15 makers offer their 16" barrels in your choice, with or without an M4 style groove, so you can get one for looks, or for strength and stiffness. Some even make a lightweight barrel that's skinny all the way to the muzzle instead of just that one spot.
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m25operator,
LIke I said in an earlier post.... I'm gonna have to move out to Texas, and you and I are gonna have to become really good friends! :o
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so i've been kicking the dust for to long now and have decided that i need to get an AR, now i know this is gonna open a can of worms, but i dont know anything about these sorts of things. i know i want it for recreational use as well as defense in situations that may require it. i know i want it in .223 but that about it. i dont like the ak platforms and i dont like the sks platforms. what should i be looking at? brands? guns? and gear?
Well choices are vast. Umm, or maybe I should say ..use to be vast.. now it's hard to find stuff. However, I would get a good one if I could ..DPMS/Stag (which is one I want now)/Smith & Wesson M&P/Bushmaster/Rock River/ Colt.. to name a few. And they you have to decide on barrel length.. and stock style.. etc.. I would get whichever I liked the best.. but would try to get at least a 16in.-20in barrel for starters and go from there. I hope that helps some. Good luck.. I hope you get one.
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Got a JP...beyond excellent!
Here is mine.
(http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff272/thanoszx7r/BothViewsSmall.jpg)
(http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff272/thanoszx7r/Smallfromthefront.jpg)
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Thanos, What is that scope ? And how does that bad boy shoot ? ;D
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For defense I'd personally get an LMT, BCM or a *gasp* Colt. I would not depend on a Bushmaster for defense.
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Thanos, What is that scope ? And how does that bad boy shoot ? ;D
Tirjicon ACOG JP2
4X magnification, .223 adjusted reticle at 4 and 600 meters, with a JPoint red dot on top. Not cheap, but it was the one that I thought would work best for me.
You will be sickened, I have yet to shoot it. I am in school and there is not a rilfe range close to my home. I live in a big city and unlike where I grew up I can't just go out in the backyard. But I have a buddy who is going to let me sight it in on MLK day out on his property.
This gun and scope was a Christmas present from my wife. I sure love her. ;)
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Tirjicon ACOG JP2
4X magnification, .223 adjusted reticle at 4 and 600 meters, with a JPoint red dot on top. Not cheap, but it was the one that I thought would work best for me.
You will be sickened, I have yet to shoot it. I am in school and there is not a rilfe range close to my home. I live in a big city and unlike where I grew up I can't just go out in the backyard. But I have a buddy who is going to let me sight it in on MLK day out on his property.
This gun and scope was a Christmas present from my wife. I sure love her. ;)
Sweet set up you have. I bet it will shot as nice as it looks 8)
And your wife must feel the same about you ;D She's a KEEPER :D
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Sweet set up you have. I bet it will shot as nice as it looks 8)
And your wife must feel the same about you ;D She's a KEEPER :D
She also went to the Culinary Institute of America for baking and pastry...and neither of us are even slightly overweight. My life is so good. ;)
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She buys you guns AND she cooks GOODIES ?
I hate you ;D
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Not goodies, works of art that taste incredible. She is doing R&D for her future bakery and I am the Test Monkey. ;)
She is also pretty, more so than my guns.
Back to the thread. I think if I wasn't going to get a JP, I would have gone with DPMS. I have heard good things about it.
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Well, I can't speak as an AR owner, because I'm not one. However I do have clearance from the wife to spend our tax return on an evil black gun. After all of my looking around, I've decided to go with a del-ton 16", flat-top, mid-length upper with a del-ton lower. I know that I won't have the money for something nicer, but this will purely be a rec. gun. And I'd rather have one sooner than later given the current whitehouse occupant.
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Well, I can't speak as an AR owner, because I'm not one. However I do have clearance from the wife to spend our tax return on an evil black gun. After all of my looking around, I've decided to go with a del-ton 16", flat-top, mid-length upper with a del-ton lower. I know that I won't have the money for something nicer, but this will purely be a rec. gun. And I'd rather have one sooner than later given the current whitehouse occupant.
You can try looking into purchasing stripped lowers and complete uppers like I did. I'm learning, and it might be a cheaper path to getting top quality. Spike's Tactical has stripped lowers for $175; DSA has them for around $200, as does my local shop. Of course, there's an FFL charge if you order online. I got a 6.8 upper for less than $600 from Stag, and the DPMS lower I got was before the election, so waaaaay cheaper than they are now.
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You can try looking into purchasing stripped lowers and complete uppers like I did. I'm learning, and it might be a cheaper path to getting top quality. Spike's Tactical has stripped lowers for $175; DSA has them for around $200, as does my local shop. Of course, there's an FFL charge if you order online. I got a 6.8 upper for less than $600 from Stag, and the DPMS lower I got was before the election, so waaaaay cheaper than they are now.
I spent a fair amount of time exploring building a stripped lower and putting it on a complete upper, and it always turned out to be more expensive, though sometimes not by much. I the long run, I decided that it was easier on the wallet, and less of a hassle to get the assembled lower I wanted and the complete upper I wanted and slap 'em together.
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I just got a Charles Daly Defense m4 and really like it. It was $1050 at J&G Sales in Prescott AZ. I've run a few hundred rounds thru it so far so good. I put a low cost red dot scope on it and a vertical grip. It sure is fun to shoot.
(http://C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Documents\My Pictures\Kodak Pictures\2009-01-15[img])
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I have carried Colts. I have personally owned a Bushmaster and DPMS. All were very reliable when kept clean.
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I've got an Olympic Arms and shoots just fine with that red dot to 75 yards cause it jets hard to see to there with that.