The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Defense and Tactics => Topic started by: Ping on February 15, 2009, 08:32:48 PM
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I come from an age where Maglights were the main flashlight being utilized. I am curious about the different types of flashlights with LED and which is the best light for the price on the market? What would be best for a shotgun, AR or handgun?
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We had a very thorough thread on this before, I hope this link works, if not, go to forum and then search and type in flashlight, home defense. A huge amount of info, + a link to a guy who documented with pictures, many flashlights.
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I have a couple of torches from here
http://wolfeyes.com.au/
the Sniper 260 (http://wolfeyes.com.au/wolf-eyes-sniper-260-p-30.html?osCsid=4csehhmtef1jcsffnqak6tc766) is the most popular one the best torch I have (next to my LightForce 240 Blitz Spot Light :o ) I am guessing for you guys they would be very good price with the AU $$$ @.66c
199.00
AUSTRALIAN DOLLARS
=
131.68
US DOLLARS
1 AUD = 0.6617 USD 1USD = 1.5113 AUD ::)
have a look here (http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=4287.0) and here (http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=3102.0) though
HTH
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Are you willing to pay a little more for a US made product that may have higher quality?
Are you looking for something that mounts to your gun?
Right now, today, I'm impressed with Insight and Surefire. But, the flashlight game changes quickly, with LED lights purchased a few years ago being much dimmer and having a very short runtime. We're seeing exponential advancements in non-diode LEDs. Each company called them something different, but to make sure of the correct bulb type make sure the bulb is measured in watts. And make sure to get one that is at least 60 lumen.
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Go back through previous posts.... there has been a pretty good thread with a great deal of info about flashlights not too long ago.
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I have a non-led Surefire E2D and an LED E1L. The E2D is nice as it doubles as an impact weapon with a crenellated strike bezel, however the back end has a similar scalloped treatment which makes it a little more difficult.
The real star for me is the E1L. Runtime is pretty good, considering that it is a 1-cell flashlight and the LED is really white and focused. I've compared this light to some other lights that supposedly have a higher output and this light compares well. The best thing about it is that it's small enough to always be with me.
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If you love the E1L, take a look at the E1B Backup. A hair more expensive, but you get almost twice the brightness on high, and about the same on low, all in a smoother form factor with a clip than can be used tip up or tip down.
Perfect for EDC.
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If you love the E1L, take a look at the E1B Backup. A hair more expensive, but you get almost twice the brightness on high, and about the same on low, all in a smoother form factor with a clip than can be used tip up or tip down.
Perfect for EDC.
I like that too. You don't get very much runtime on the higher setting, but it would be a better tactical light than mine. I just like the E1L because of it's all-around usefulness. I also like that Surefire is just 10 minutes away, in case I ever have any problems. I've got a buddy at the police dept. that can get me 20% off.
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http://www.novatac.com/ (http://www.novatac.com/)
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During the production of season one of The Best Defense, I did a presentation on the basics of choosing a tactical flashlight, as well as a crash course in defensive tactics using the light as an impact weapon. I'm not sure if it will all make it on the air (we shot a lot more material than the format of the show allows), but if it does, it's a nice primer.
To save you the suspense, in my opinion, a good tactical light for everyday carry should have the following attributes:
• At least a 65-lumen output with a pre-focused beam
• An impact-resistant bulb—either an LED or a shock-isolated incandescent bulb
• Solid, high-quality construction that supports its use as an impact weapon
• Ergonomics that allow a solid grip and effective management of impact shock when used as a striking tool
• A large enough size to grasp firmly with at least a half-inch of the light protruding from each side of your fist
• A small enough size to be conveniently carried
• A pocket clip or carrier that allows an immediate access and draw
• A tail-mounted switch that allows momentary actuation of the light
I personally don't feel that a crenulated or "strike" bezel adds much and, for an everyday carry item, may cause it to be scrutinized as a weapon rather than dismissed as a flashlight.
Beyond these characteristics, a lot of the decision process boils down to personal preference, personal experience with different brands, and your particular level of "geekdom" when it comes to lights.
Mounting a light on a weapon introduces a lot of other considerations. Fuel for further discussion...
Stay safe,
Mike
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During the production of season one of The Best Defense, I did a presentation on the basics of choosing a tactical flashlight, as well as a crash course in defensive tactics using the light as an impact weapon. I'm not sure if it will all make it on the air (we shot a lot more material than the format of the show allows), but if it does, it's a nice primer.
If it doesn't make it, this would be perfect for Best Defense Uncut!
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7/8 for the NovaTac 120T! 80mm long may be a wee short for some folk!
http://www.novatac.com/edc-t.html (http://www.novatac.com/edc-t.html)
;D
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Was in at Sam's club and picked up a package of 2 "Element K2" LED Flashlights. Pretty neat and really bright. A buddy of mine showed me a "Inova" and a Surefire. They were smaller than the K2 but the K2 was brighter. I would not trust the K2 outside the house and am looking into the two other lights I mentioned and willing to pay for quality. I want something I know will not fail me or my family if need be. Thanks for all the responses.
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Okay, so I splurged a little bit and bought a SureFire E2D LED Defender a couple of days ago. I have a regular G2, and I know a couple of people who have the G2 LED...which those things are stinkin' bright...but, HOLY CRAP!! This thing is insane. It's just about bright enough to x-ray the cat. Just for giggles...I flashed myself in the eyes with it. I won't do that again. :o As an added bonus...it makes a heck of an impact weapon.
Here's an article I found on using a SureFire flashlight as a self-defense weapon: http://www.karate-shotokan-kata.com/surefire-flashlight.html (http://www.karate-shotokan-kata.com/surefire-flashlight.html)
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"It's just about bright enough to x-ray the cat. Just for giggles...I flashed myself in the eyes with it. I won't do that again."
ROFL ;D
Reminds me of the story about the Guy who bought his wife a stun gun, It's ONLY 2 aa batteries, how bad can THAT be ? ;D
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Insight has the new HX series the 150 and the 200 http://www.insightlights.com/products-hx150.htm (http://www.insightlights.com/products-hx150.htm)...200 will definitely give you the ability to look for hairballs in the cat. In general this is the market of a lot of private labeled exact same thing items. I was looking at some in the gun shop yesterday and saw models from 3 different "manufacturers" that were only different in the silk screening or anodizing. I ended up buying a new Benchmade 943 instead.
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...flashlights with LED and which is the best light for the price on the market?
Have a look at the Fenix TK10. I'm generally not too keen on products made in China but like it or not, the Fenix lights have an outstanding price-performance ratio. It sells for something about $70,-.
* Cree Premium Q5 LED
* Two modes of output, selected by turning the bezel
Turbo mode: Constant 225 lumens, 1.5 hours
General Mode: Constant 60 lumens, 10 hours
* Highly efficient focusing head- throws beam over 200 meters
* Digitally regulated output - maintains constant brightness
* Low battery indication
* Uses two 3V CR123 Lithium batteries
* 135mm (length) x34mm (diameter)
* Waterproof to IPX-8 standard
* Ultra-clear glass lens with anti-reflective coating
* Tailcap switch with momentary-on function
* Removable grip ring
* Removable pocket clip
* Included accessories: holster, pocket clip, lanyard, two spare o-rings, and a spare rubber switch boot (orange)
(http://freenet-homepage.de/ultimaratio/fenixtk10_01.jpg)
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+ 1 on the Fenix lights - I have several. They have replaced my Surefires for daily carry and weapons mount duties.
https://www.4sevens.com/index.php?cPath=22
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I just bought an Ultrafire, and an MTE SSC P7 900 lumen flashlight. Both of them were just over $30 and use the 18650 Li-Ion battery. Doing run time tests on them right now to see how long the battery lasts. All of the items were bought off of http://www.dealextreme.com/
The http://www.candlepowerforums.com/ is a great place to learn about all those different types of flashlights.
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Have a look at the Fenix TK10. I'm generally not too keen on products made in China but like it or not, the Fenix lights have an outstanding price-performance ratio. It sells for something about $70,-.
Nice pointer. I question how many real "manufacturers" as opposed to packagers there are in this market. You find a producer in China, you order a container full of gear and off you go. You can line up a number of units from different "manufacturers" and they are identical. I haven't really done any deep digging but flashlights don't have "lasting" designs like an 1911 or a CZ etc. So, all I am really saying is while some portion of a company may be US it is not always clear now what that exactly means. After all, we continue to regulate most of the US manufacturers out of business otherwise so we ship it to China then of course the environmentalists get all up in arms about China and lack of regulation.
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Some things to think about:
1) Are you going to use the light primarily indoors(small rooms) or outdoors? If indoors then want a light with a lot of spill. The reflector will be textured. It produces a smooth beam from the center to the outer edges. If you want a light for outdoors then you would get a thrower. It has a smooth reflector. Most of the light is focused in a tight spot with little spill. This allows you so see objects at a greater distance. Indoors you have to scan the light more since it is concentrated in a smaller area than a different light with more spill. A light with a smooth reflector will also have dark rings. These dark rings are not helpful if you are trying to determine if that is a cell phone or gun in his hand. Unless you bounce the light off the roof.
2) I have a Fenix TK10 and Fenix P3D. My Surefire E2D-LED is better textured and the finish is not as "slippery" as the Fenix lights. This would be a concern if your hands sweat. The crenulations on the bezel of the Fenix TK10 remind me of the scissors designed for small children in comparison to the E2D. The selection of accessories with Surefire is also greater. If you plan on buying light mounts for your weapons or light pouches for carry this is important. Fenix accessories are almost non-existent. You can also buy a great variety of LEDS for the Surefire P6. Just using Fenix as an example on comparing lights. Comparing two lights on the internet is not the same as comparing them both in person.
3) If you plan to only use the light to only identify your target, get one with a switch that only has one setting. If you turn the light on and off and don't wait past the allotted time(usually one second) you willl be in a different light setting(usually a less intense one).
4) make sure the techniques you plan on using with you light work with the tailcap. IE Rogers-Surfire (cigar) technique.
5) If the LED is regulated, know how that works.
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great feedback Diverge.
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Great input and many things to be considered on tactical flashlights. I would want something that would really be diverse in a indoor and outdoor setting along with disaster preparedness. What I keep on the nightstand is also the same thing I would want to keep in my Jeep (Which in the past has always been a Maglight). I did check out the Fenix, Surefire and Nova. Brilliant flashlights but still rather pricey. I did look at a Smith and Wesson version that I just happened upon.
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Great input and many things to be considered on tactical flashlights. I would want something that would really be diverse in a indoor and outdoor setting along with disaster preparedness. What I keep on the nightstand is also the same thing I would want to keep in my Jeep (Which in the past has always been a Maglight). I did check out the Fenix, Surefire and Nova. Brilliant flashlights but still rather pricey. I did look at a Smith and Wesson version that I just happened upon.
Since you have maglites (I have a number of them also...that is my wife's primary weapon 4 d-cell to the skull) the little AA version does have 3rd party replacement tailcaps that give you push button on/off like the "tactical" lights. And you can "upgrade" from the little halogen to a 3 watt led but they all have the smooth reflector.
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I used to carry a cyclops light (which I got dirt cheap) and I carried it on duty for about a year. It was OK but I was buy 50 batteries a pop to get the price below $1.50 each. It was good and bright and worked well but It ate the batteries like tic-tac's. I eventually sold it and picked up a niteize conversion for LED and base switch. I found that I don't need an Uber-light, I just need to shine some light on the subject. Sure, a blinding light that you can use to beat your way through a cinder-block wall might be nice but I don't think that most of us need them. To say nothing of spending$200 or more for a good light that might get lost, broke or stolen.
http://www.niteize.com/ (http://www.niteize.com/)
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The stock LED MagLite 2AA is a great light for the cost. I'm not a fan of the variable focus head, as I can never get it focused well for throw (vs flood).
The niteize comment reminded me of this.
I carry a Photon Rex as it's rechargeable with any 1.5v battery, and bright enough for close in work. This is on my key-chain. If I carry a light, it's a Surefire E1B Backup (which I just saw in silver which is very handsome).
At home I use the Maglite LED 2AA, both variations of the Photon Proton, and a Pak-Lite (a tiny 9v, 2-led light and great runtime.
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With the bottom on/off switch you have to twist the lens in the mini-mag to be 'always on', I got the beam where I wanted it and used some electricians tape to keep it there. The LED conversion eliminates most of the focus anyway so it's not that big a deal. I am looking at the Fenix light, but I don't want all the adjustments, I just want light when and where I need it, messing around to get the right amount and type of light is a waste of time in an emergency.
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A friend of mine is our county's coroner and their office uses Energizer lights. He gave one to my son and I'm thinking of getting one myself. They actually sell them at Wally-World for around $46.00. It is aluminum and rechargeable and I think it will also use 3 regular CR123 batteries. It comes with several colored lenses (if that's your need). It is a very bright light and you can focus the beam. With the tightest beam, it will shine well into the trees 100 yards across the field next to the house.
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I've carried a surefire of some flavor every day for the past five or six years.
The E2e is nice (small and bright), but the bulb is somwhat fragile
The C3 is tough as nails, but too big
The E1b is perfect for me. As bright as the C3, and smaller than the E2e. Plus the battery lasts longer and the LED will never burn out.
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Looking forward to it.
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One thing I forgot to mention is that I do like the strobe effect on a flashlight. Did not realize that till watching the show how it made such a difference to the reciever of intermittent light.
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One thing I forgot to mention is that I do like the strobe effect on a flashlight. Did not realize that till watching the show how it made such a difference to the reciever of intermittent light.
You got that right.
I was the 'receiver' of the strobe light blast while helping a LEO friend who was teaching some private classes.
A strobe in the face is very disorienting.
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You got that right.
I was the 'receiver' of the strobe light blast while helping a LEO friend who was teaching some private classes.
A strobe in the face is very disorienting.
Now I'm just the opposite, a strobeing light does nothing to disorient me. It just does not appear to effect me at all when flash bu a strobe, but then again when I was younger room filling strobe lights had no effect on me then either.
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The talk about lights is good, I have a Surefire 6P Defender, my issue is where and how to carry on body. I find it awkward to schlep the 6P - when I do it's inside pocket of a jeans jacket or back pocket of my pants.... not good either.
Thinking about a belt holster, but damn how much crap can one person put on their belt without it looking like a divers weight belt.
Thoughts on carry?
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I have an E2D LED and have it clipped to my belt. For the 6P...I would go with the SafariLand 306 belt holster.
http://www.safariland.com/product.aspx?pid=306 (http://www.safariland.com/product.aspx?pid=306)
http://www.google.com/products?hl=en&q=safariland+306&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=o1DCSfiYJo6vtwfQjfHoCg&sa=X&oi=product_result_group&resnum=1&ct=title (http://www.google.com/products?hl=en&q=safariland+306&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=o1DCSfiYJo6vtwfQjfHoCg&sa=X&oi=product_result_group&resnum=1&ct=title)
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I figured a strobe would disorient most? Especially coming from a dark to light environment but then again, mace does not really bother me. So different techniques and different angles should be utilized in different situations or scenarios?
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Yup -well said. Nothing is 100% - 100% of the time. There will always be data outside the normal.
Mace may not work on you well but may put me on my back longer than normal, while a strobe as no effect on me and place someone else in epithetic shock.
The important thing is to remember that it may not work on someone and always have a back up plan in place.
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I absolutely agree with the backup plan. ;)
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Do the Strobing capable flashlights really offer any higher level of tactical effectivness.... I have considered picking a Blackhawk Gladius up...... But I am somewhat concerned 1. is the strobing effect anymore effective than tapping the switch in rapid succession on any other tapcap switch light 2. When using in a sweeping or search pattern and target is aquired is strobing effect a disadvantage to you for lighted target illumination I think it would be a PIA to switch from strobe to solid illumination with one handed manipulation Any tips tricks or advice Mike J Whats the durability and effectivness on one of these I saw you used one last week on TBD during the non firearms session with Rob P on defensive tactics w/o a firearm
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Do the Strobing capable flashlights really offer any higher level of tactical effectivness....
I dunno, but I found this >>> http://science.howstuffworks.com/led-incapacitator1.htm (http://science.howstuffworks.com/led-incapacitator1.htm)
or you could practice this >>> http://www.bostonhand.com/thumbexercises.html (http://www.bostonhand.com/thumbexercises.html)
:o
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I dunno, but I found this >>> http://science.howstuffworks.com/led-incapacitator1.htm (http://science.howstuffworks.com/led-incapacitator1.htm)
or you could practice this >>> http://www.bostonhand.com/thumbexercises.html (http://www.bostonhand.com/thumbexercises.html)
:o
If I had a strobing flashlight...I would call it the "puke ray" ;D ;D ;D
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Strobe would really jack with people who have seizures. ::) Just kidding.
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I pulled the trigger ... pressed the button! I was in the Cities the other evening for a meeting and took advantage of larger stores to make my first purchase of a "tactical" flashlight. I've owned Maglights of all sizes for many years, and I've broken more of them than most will ever own. So, I've been looking for a flashlight designed for what I might put it through.
My first purchase is a Surefire6P LED Defender. I am still getting used to some of the simple features, but so far I love it.
This is a one strength beam (80 lumens), with a run time of 11 hours (till it is down to one lumen). It has momentary and constant on.
This light fits my had great for general illumination, defensive striking with its defender bezel (a nasty piece that tore a chunk right out of their oak demonstration board), and exact diameter as a quarter (for those of you that remember carrying rolled coins in the pocket ;)).
My only mistake was to not purchase extra batteries right away. I am surprised how much I use the light. I have always been cautious about where I park and where I wander, but having the light in my pocket keeps me aware of having the ability to check things in the dark, so I do everything with the full picture in mind. I think that I even sent a teenage kid straight to the restroom when I startled him. He and his friends were horsing around in the mall lot last night as I left with a small ammo purchase (not small by choice, but all they had). I first saw five kids, then on next look I only saw four. The light was already in my hand, and the bag shifted to my strong hand (but only a finger tip grip for easy drop on the draw move), I changed my course to another row in a wide clear spot, and immediately caught a shape in the shadows of a van. I believe that he was only trying to scare his friends, but I hit him square in the eyes with a momentary then constant 80 lumen beam. My shopping bag hit the ground, the jacket flew open with hand on grip ready for draw as he yelled what I think he just did and scampered around the other way to his friends who were trying to figure out what was happening. I just stood strong as they skirted my area very quietly. When they were gone ammo was picked up and I was on my way.
I have spent the last 12 1/2 hours remembering similar situations and what I did. Did I need to scare the kid? Maybe and maybe not, but I'd rather do that than be sorry ... or have my family sorry.
Is it watching TBD, is it reading defensive articles, is it watching other defensive DVDs, is it the realization that that gun on the body is only a tool of last resort, is it all of the above, or is it something else? I don't know what continues to hone me over the years, but I hope I never quit learning, and I hope I never need to go all the way!
If you don't have a light ... GET ONE! If you can't afford a good one right away, Carry what you can afford while you save! I'll never be sorry for what I just bought!
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http://www.batteryjunction.com/cr123a-qty.html
You might as well buy a bunch. The shelf life is pretty good on these batteries so they shouldn't go bad.
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M58, you will love the Surefire ! I have an L2 model for a couple of years. One tip though...Saw Tiger McGee with a tac lite and on his he had a length of paracord on it, as a lanyard. Damm if that ain't a useful thing to do. I have one on mine and it greatly aids in holding and retaining the light...
I must admit that its main use is when I am on poops patrol walking my 14lb attack dog at night. It's my civic duty to pick up his bio fuel and the L2 is pretty good for finding it. A funny story that happened just the other week... Its around 11pm and I am bent over with plastic bag in hand retrieving the goods. Of course at 100 Lumens the freaking light on a dark street kinda stands out ! Well who pulls up at the corner just as I flick the light on? A patrol car...It held steady for a number of seconds, and I am sure they were asking themselves what the hell was I doing and what was that light ? :)
Also my vote for a battery supply for the Surefires is this place.
www.batterystation.com
You get your supply of batteries PLUS either an Otterbox or Pelican box included ! Just happens I took a couple of pics the other day of the L2 and ammo supply....
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3644/3386440214_dc9a0ba982_m.jpg)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3560/3385627055_4ee49259ed_m.jpg)
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Congrats, m58! You won't be dissapointed. FWIW...Lowe's sells the 2-pack of SureFire batteries for just under $5.
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I carry a Scorpion Streamlight. Like my gun, it's something I hope to never use outside of a training environment. But, who knows where a confrontation will start, move to/through, or end?
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Good input and welcome to the forum Angie.
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Ok. Ihave gone from skeptical to interested in terms of the surefire, particularly with the SD end plate. However the whole lumens thing is all greek. Can someone say how the brightness compares to a mini-mag?
FQ13
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Ok. Ihave gone from skeptical to interested in terms of the surefire, particularly with the SD end plate. However the whole lumens thing is all greek. Can someone say how the brightness compares to a mini-mag?
FQ13
I can't tell you how a lumen compares to candlepower, but my mini mag is like a candle next to the car headlight of a surefire! It is bright and crisp white, and even in a lit room or daylight it is disoriendating.
I know this is all subjective and not objective numbers, but it is real world observation ... and it doesn't even begin to touch on the sturdy structure of a tactical light as compared to a maglite.
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Do the Strobing capable flashlights really offer any higher level of tactical effectivness.... I have considered picking a Blackhawk Gladius up...... But I am somewhat concerned 1. is the strobing effect anymore effective than tapping the switch in rapid succession on any other tapcap switch light 2. When using in a sweeping or search pattern and target is aquired is strobing effect a disadvantage to you for lighted target illumination I think it would be a PIA to switch from strobe to solid illumination with one handed manipulation Any tips tricks or advice Mike J Whats the durability and effectivness on one of these I saw you used one last week on TBD during the non firearms session with Rob P on defensive tactics w/o a firearm
The strobing concept actually began with operators using standard lights and shaking or oscillating their hand to create a strobe effect. Initially, it was found to be somewhat disorienting, but really offered an advantage when it came to plotting the angles of shadows back to the user. When you think of "slicing the pie" with a light, the angle of the shadow points back toward you and will reveal when you break the edge of cover. Intermittent light helps mask this and makes it harder to figure a "reverse azimuth" on you.
Ken Good and Vaughn Baker then took the strobe concept and tested it scientifically on a broad range of test subjects. They used various frequencies of strobe and tested their effectiveness on affecting balance and reducing depth perception and peripheral vision. If the ambient light is low enough for the strobe to have a dominant presence, its effects are VERY real and offer a significant tactical advantage. I also teach the use of the strobe as a signaling device between members of security teams, since it's a great way of getting someone's attention from a distance.
I've personally used the Gladius in Strategos courses and FOF Simmunitions scenarios. I have also used it improvised-weapon (i.e. contact distance thumping) training. It works very well for me.
The only drawback I've found with the Gladius is that it lacks a pocket clip and requires a carrier or dedicated pocket. I'm trying to correct that with the next generation of the light for 2010.
I hope this helps.
Stay safe,
Mike
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Ok. Ihave gone from skeptical to interested in terms of the surefire, particularly with the SD end plate. However the whole lumens thing is all greek. Can someone say how the brightness compares to a mini-mag?
FQ13
Maglights list their brightness in candlepower. This is different from lumens. Here is the best explanation I've seen of why there is no direct conversion between the two, especially when it comes to focusable lights like the Maglight. I borrowed it from Candlepower forums:
There is no conversion or direct comparison between Lumens and candlepower. Candlepower is the measure of the brightest spot in the light beam. However this can vary depending on the focus of the beam, and the distance it is measured. No manufacturer lists the distance at which they measure the cp rating. Also they don't state the size of the hot spot they are measuring. It could only be a 1 inch bright spot in the edge of the beam. Lumens is the measurement of the total light output of a bulb, but not it's brightness. Most 60 watt incandescent light bulbs are rated at 800 lumens. This is more than even the brightest SureFire light, but compare the brightness of even the dimmest SureFire light to a desk lamp and the SureFire will be much brighter. Candlepower also changes by the focus of the beam, and the size of the reflector.
The best thing to do is to find a well-stocked store and compare the lights side by side. The difference will be obvious.
Stay safe,
Mike
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To confuse us even further!
Candlepower is a rating of light output at the source, using English measurements.
Foot-candles are a measurement of light at an illuminated object.
Lumens are a metric equivalent to foot-candles in that they are measured at an object you want to illuminate.
Divide the number of lumens you have produced, or are capable of producing, by 12.57 and you get the candlepower equivalent of that light source.
So, that one candlepower equivalent equals 12.57 lumens.
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Has anyone seen the Bushnell HD square light up close? I just wondered if this thing has any solid force multiplier tactical value, or if it is just a light.
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When I bought my SureFire I tried a light with strobe. The strobe made me so nauseous that I decided I'd be better off without a light than with a strobe, so I saved the extra money and went without.
Maybe I'm just a queezy wuss, but taking a timeout to puke during an attack does not sound like effective self defense to me ... unless the attacker is as week stomached as me.
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A good tac light doesn't have to come from a high priced specialty company. I've got a recommendation that meet's all of Mike's requirements and you can get it at Wal Mart for about 30 bucks.
It's the Coleman Max. It's LED, puts out 115 lumens, has a momentary tail cap switch, has a lanyard to drop and recover when changing clips, it's the right size and easy to carry and it has an 8 hour run time on 3 standard AAA batteries. It does not have a case or clip, but I easily found a belt case for 3 bucks at our last gun show.
Not bad Huh?
If anyone else has tried one I'd love to hear your thoughts. Especially regarding the long run time on low cost batteries. Most of the high dollar Tac Lights that I have checked specs on can't run at 115 lumens for anywhere near as long and require more expensive lithium batteries.
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A good tac light doesn't have to come from a high priced specialty company. I've got a recommendation that meet's all of Mike's requirements and you can get it at Wal Mart for about 30 bucks.
It's the Coleman Max. It's LED, puts out 115 lumens, has a momentary tail cap switch, has a lanyard to drop and recover when changing clips, it's the right size and easy to carry and it has an 8 hour run time on 3 standard AAA batteries. It does not have a case or clip, but I easily found a belt case for 3 bucks at our last gun show.
Not bad Huh?
If anyone else has tried one I'd love to hear your thoughts. Especially regarding the long run time on low cost batteries. Most of the high dollar Tac Lights that I have checked specs on can't run at 115 lumens for anywhere near as long and require more expensive lithium batteries.
Great tip Kid, and welcome aboard. (Although you shouldn't talk to me because I'm bad. I'm one of those libertarian people, not that there's anything wrong with that. Too much time in Austin dont'cha know.) ;D
FQ13
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A good tac light doesn't have to come from a high priced specialty company. I've got a recommendation that meet's all of Mike's requirements and you can get it at Wal Mart for about 30 bucks.
It's the Coleman Max. It's LED, puts out 115 lumens, has a momentary tail cap switch, has a lanyard to drop and recover when changing clips, it's the right size and easy to carry and it has an 8 hour run time on 3 standard AAA batteries. It does not have a case or clip, but I easily found a belt case for 3 bucks at our last gun show.
Not bad Huh?
If anyone else has tried one I'd love to hear your thoughts. Especially regarding the long run time on low cost batteries. Most of the high dollar Tac Lights that I have checked specs on can't run at 115 lumens for anywhere near as long and require more expensive lithium batteries.
(http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p78/hazcater/Fun%20Stuff/TigerFace.jpg)
(http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p78/hazcater/clipMag.jpg)
(http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p78/hazcater/Fun%20Stuff/iCanyouhear.jpg)
Pet peeve
;D
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[
Pet peeve
;D
Nice welcome to the group Haz. I take it you were never voted Miss Congeniality. ;D Ignore Haz, he's more ot less ok as long as he gets his catnip and keeps his shoes on ;D ;D ;D.
FQ13
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Great tip Kid, and welcome aboard. (Although you shouldn't talk to me because I'm bad. I'm one of those libertarian people, not that there's anything wrong with that. Too much time in Austin dont'cha know.) ;D
FQ13
Thanks for the welcome. Austin is a great town. As for being a Libertarian we all should begin to think that way. As I understand it Libertarians believe in more personal rights and in minimal interference from the Federal government. With President Obama pushing us toward Socialism we should all become Libertarians to counteract him. Either that or Texas should take our Governor's advice to heart and consider seceding from the Union.
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If you really want to make your head hurt, try reading through all of the information on this site....
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/
...I thought I knew what i was talking about when it came to CCW lighting.....
I had no idea!!! Great information here, to make a good, solid choice in a tactical light.
Now for my take....for regular, everyday lighting needs, a light with multiple brightness levels, and complicated UI, will work fine, but IMHO, if you're going to use this for the serious task we're all talking about here, then the 'KISS' principal should be followed to the letter! The simpler the better...
My EDC lights, (yes I carry two!), are a Surefire C2 with a Malkoff M60 drop-in, for about 230 lumens of light. This light is the primary CCW unit. It's interface is simple, bright, and efficent. Battery life is about 1.5 hours of contiunous 230 lumen range light, which lasts somewhere around a month or more before battery changes, as it doesn't get used as much as the other light.
The other is a Surefire E2DL. It is nearly as bright as the Malkoff drop-in, though it is only rated at 120 lumens on it's high setting, (independent testing of a couple of the E2DL's show it to be closer to 170 to 210.... http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=229135) but a low of 5 lumens.
This is the more utilitarian light for me, because of the switching between high and low settings. The light comes on high, but if you turn it off and then back on in a strobing action or to illuminate a dark area, if you don't wait long enough it will come back on in the low mode which does little more than give away your position. So, while it may not be ideal for CCW, it is one heck of a general purpose light. This light is used more in low mode than any other light I have in the house.
For an idea of output, see below....
Surefire/Malkoff M60(LED) Combo
(http://i733.photobucket.com/albums/ww338/jac2001/042.jpg)
6D MagLite (incan)
(http://i733.photobucket.com/albums/ww338/jac2001/002-2.jpg)
The Surefire/Malkoff combo is noticably brighter in person, and is a fraction of the 6D's size and weight!
And there are less expensive hosts that will accomodate the Malkoff drop-in, including the Cabela's models listed earlier in his thread.
Hope this helps....
J.
oh, almost forgot...
http://www.malkoffdevices.com/shop2/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_14_18
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Great tip Kid, and welcome aboard. (Although you shouldn't talk to me because I'm bad. I'm one of those libertarian people, not that there's anything wrong with that. Too much time in Austin dont'cha know.) ;D
FQ13
It's not that he's a "Libertarian" that makes him bad, it's because he's a "College Educator" ( I don't remember if he Piles Higher and Deeper or not) specializing in history and political Science. in other words he's part of the system turning out all those A holes we have to deal with.
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It's not that he's a "Libertarian" that makes him bad, it's because he's a "College Educator" ( I don't remember if he Piles Higher and Deeper or not) specializing in history and political Science. in other words he's part of the system turning out all those A holes we have to deal with.
And here I thought you loved me Tom. After all Vermont's only an hours drive from your house. :P ;D
FQ13
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And here I thought you loved me Tom. After all Vermont's only an hours drive from your house. :P ;D
FQ13
So's Mass ,I don't go to either one, whats your point ?
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Great tip Kid, and welcome aboard. (Although you shouldn't talk to me because I'm bad. I'm one of those libertarian people, not that there's anything wrong with that. Too much time in Austin dont'cha know.) ;D
FQ13
Thanks for the welcome. Austin is a great town. As for being a Libertarian we all should begin to think that way. As I understand it Libertarians believe in more personal rights and in minimal interference from the Federal government. With President Obama pushing us toward Socialism we should all become Libertarians to counteract him. Either that or Texas should take our Governor's advice to heart and consider seceding from the Union.
He's also BAD because he decided BHO would be his next president. That and most of his comments are so full of sh!t I can smell them over a full corral at my ranch.
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He's also BAD because he decided BHO would be his next president. That and most of his comments are so full of sh!t I can smell them over a full corral at my ranch.
Take a midol Tex.I wasn't the one filling that corral. ;D Honestly, the bottom line is that you're a social conservative, I'm a social liberal and we both support the 2A. Isn't that enough? Because anyone who turns down an ally in a fire fight (and we've been in one for 40 years, ever since the Gun Control Act of 1968) is a damn fool. I'll watch your six, but if you spit in my face while I'm doing it, you, sir, are a moron.
FQ13
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He's also BAD because he decided BHO would be his next president. That and most of his comments are so full of sh!t I can smell them over a full corral at my ranch.
Like I said above, "It's not that he's a "Libertarian" that makes him bad, it's because he's a "College Educator" ( I don't remember if he Piles Higher and Deeper or not) specializing in history and political Science. in other words he's part of the system turning out all those A holes we have to deal with."
I'll watch your six, but if you spit in my face while I'm doing it, you, sir, are a moron.
Or at least built oddly
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I've got a new Tac light that might interest you guys. To begin with it is chocked full of features.
Now the specs: It has an aircraft grade annodized aluminum body. It has a LED bulb. It has a polycarbonate lens and vacuum plated reflector. It has adjustable focus. It puts out 160 lumens on the 3 AAA batteries that come with each of the two lights. It is water resistant for 30 minutes at 1 meter. It is shockproff. It has a striking bezel. It has 4 settings; 160 lumen full power, 80 lumen half power, strobe and momentary switch, all tail cap operated. It has a low battery indicator in the tail switch that illuminates at 20 % power. It also has an electronic optimizer to maintain constant lumen output for the life of the batteries. It comes with an attached lanyard.
I tested the battery life on the 160 lumen full power setting. The 3 AAA batteries lasted for a 1 1/2 hours at full output. I shut the light off and I was surprised to see that it came back on and operated at half power. Pretty good for a 160 lumen light on cheap AAAs.
Now the price. They come in a package of 2 for 19.99. You can pick them up at your local Costco. Item # 406343 FLASHLIGHT. I sent a set to Kid Shelleen for his evaluation.
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Like the Element K2?
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I've got a new Tac light that might interest you guys. To begin with it is chocked full of features.
Now the specs: It has an aircraft grade annodized aluminum body. It has a LED bulb. It has a polycarbonate lens and vacuum plated reflector. It has adjustable focus. It puts out 160 lumens on the 3 AAA batteries that come with each of the two lights. It is water resistant for 30 minutes at 1 meter. It is shockproff. It has a striking bezel. It has 4 settings; 160 lumen full power, 80 lumen half power, strobe and momentary switch, all tail cap operated. It has a low battery indicator in the tail switch that illuminates at 20 % power. It also has an electronic optimizer to maintain constant lumen output for the life of the batteries. It comes with an attached lanyard.
I tested the battery life on the 160 lumen full power setting. The 3 AAA batteries lasted for a 1 1/2 hours at full output. I shut the light off and I was surprised to see that it came back on and operated at half power. Pretty good for a 160 lumen light on cheap AAAs.
Now the price. They come in a package of 2 for 19.99. You can pick them up at your local Costco. Item # 406343 FLASHLIGHT. I sent a set to Kid Shelleen for his evaluation.
What the hell, Johnny, bringing us back on topic? What's up with that? And on your very first post here too!!!! Don't let that happen again, hear? ? ? ;D
Seriously - welcome to the site, and a great post, I will have to go to Sam's and see if they carry it to - no Costco's anywhere near here in ND. Although I am generally leary of 3-battery anything - none fo the bulk packs come in multiple of 3 IIRC. However, I am migrating to pre-charged, slow-discharge lithiums for almost everything that will take them, so that may not matter.
Head on over to the New Member forum and write yourself up so we can haze harass welcome you properly.
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7/8 for the NovaTac 120T! 80mm long may be a wee short for some folk!
http://www.novatac.com/edc-t.html (http://www.novatac.com/edc-t.html)
;D
+1 on the Nova Tac 120-T. This light came with my LWRC CSAT Edition Rifle. This is a good video of how all of the features work. Pretty amazing light. Bill T.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-NKC4dQXnQ&feature=channel_page
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Fenis LD20 is what I ended up with earlier this year to replace a lost Surfire. 180 lumens on turbo strobe mode, takes AA batteries, is light, and very solidly made. Best of all, it cost almost half of what I paid for the Surefire.
Here's a link http://fenixgear.com/store/viewItem.asp?idProduct=37&gclid=CLj545j_mZ0CFR0SagodlhGX_w#catalog/img/ld20.jpg