We need to vote on this one

[tombogan03884]

I may get flamed for this but ya all know me and ya know I'll speak my mind.

When I was young (30 years ago) I believed (and so did my Dad) that the police were our friends.  I no longer believe this.  Too many young cops (30 and under) do not trust us to carry.  Too many of the young cops grew up in PC Government schools and were taught that 'big brother' knows best.

Sorry, but the police are now just another government force like those that carried out Waco.

I got Ratcatcher mad at me on this subject  . I see it like this, COPS, are the guys who help lost kids get home, look for missing children and are truly there to HELP their community. LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS, are the jack booted fascist thugs who do whatever their political bosses tell them regardless of anyones rights, like them a$$holes at Ruby Ridge or Waco or the gestapo. "Befeln ist befeln" (orders are orders) was not a legitimate defense at Nuremberg, and should not be a legitimate defense in todays America.

[tombogan03884]

+1 on that Haz. I've made similar posts on other threads here. I think Tombogan has a somewhat contrarian view, but hey, that's cool too. I think if (when?) the fecal debris hits the fan, we will witness an interesting shakeout in the PDs around the country, and it will be the black shirts who win, i.e., not the good guys.

 Along with my last post, there are enough Cops and former Cops on here to prove that while most badge toter's are LEO's (see previous post) not ALL are the enemy, just most.

[Pathfinder]

"Befeln ist befeln" (orders are orders) was not a legitimate defense at Nuremberg, and should not be a legitimate defense in todays America.

Nor in tomorrow's America. When people are being obnoxious bureaucrats and I cannot get the so-called customer service I was expecting, I sometimes take the gloves off and push them hard. If I get the "I'm just doing my job" line I remind them that we hung Nazis after WW2 for saying that, and that usually pisses them off about as much as I'm pissed at their lack of customer-focus.

 Along with my last post, there are enough Cops and former Cops on here to prove that while most badge toter's are LEO's (see previous post) not ALL are the enemy, just most.

Tombogan, thanks for the clarification. I don't recall reading what you wrote here before. I will keep that in mind, good perspective.

[DDMac]

Guys, I'm not sure I understand what you are expecting. Government is force, pure and simple. People, in striving to establish a civilization, establish rules to live by that apply to everybody in the "village". Government, and it's workings, is created and empowered by The People to carry out those rules, and, necessarily, must exercise FORCE when members of that society violate the rules. If not, it's back to every man for himself. Problem is, everybody does not agree on the rules, and The People are not as united in ways and means as they were a couple of hundred years ago. SOMEONE has to herd the sheep. I know a lot of good sheepdogs. Sorry you don't. What we need is better shepards.  My $.02
Mac.

[tombogan03884]

Mac, You may know alot of good "sheepdogs", but I bet they don't belong to the Black fatigue mafia that think because they have a badge they rule the world, I've know SOME good Cops over the years, Usually well over thirty, The majority of the younger ones seem to be a bunch of arogent little pr!<ks, who would get the snot slapped out of them if they DIDN'T have a badge.

[Sponsor]

[DDMac]

Most of the time, Tom, the "young" wears off after surviving being thrown through a few windows, and they become a little more centered and self-disciplined. The average kid today isn't going to volunteer to honorably protect and serve in any capacity, as you pointed out. But those who do are of a different generation. One that ours enabled by trying to "give them a better life". There will always be A-holes, but that's everywhere, now isn't it? Most people, especially LEOs, don't get old and smart without being young and stupid first. That's probably why you are more tolerant of the Old Dogs. Hey, we can still agree to disagree, and thats all good too.
Mac.

[tombogan03884]

Mac, It's the "Old dogs" are more tolerant of ME

[DDMac]

Respectful, I'd say. 'Nite friend.
Mac.