"Religion of Peace" continues it's reasonable dialog with the West

[Rastus]

NO FQ I will not let it slide, Rastus's crap has already cost this forum 1 good member in Desert Marine .
Any one who thinks they have all the only right answers to everything is a damned fool .
He is an even bigger damn fool if he makes these claims from amid a group that can't agree on 1911 or Glock.

Go get some and let's talk about it.  Nothing has changed.

[tombogan03884]

I have limited time during the week, but here are a couple that I found real quick.

http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=12532.msg162832#msg162832

http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=169;sa=showPosts;start=80

I don't have time to search any more as I have to take a dump and get ready for work, but the 2 I linked shows that your idea of religious tolerance is "Good for me but not for thee.

[Pathfinder]

Tom, you're going to need to do a lot better than that. The first post hardly shows Rastus to be of the mindset you claim. The second is a series of his posts, none of which address your point.

BTW, do you have personal communications from Desert Marine that is was specific to Rastus' comments that he left?

On second thought, let it go. This thread has gotten way too personal, way beyond what is called for. I think in the interest of calmness, camaraderie, or just plain manners, let it go. Disagree to disagree if you will. Back to the thread topic, OK?

The ad hominem attacks need to stop on this thread. If it continues the way it's been going, I will personally ask M'ette to lock the thread.

[tombogan03884]

Crap, I posted the wrong link.
Pathfinder, You can request anything your heart desires, these posts are directed at you as well.
I have not posted anything inaccurate OR OFFENSIVE to a clear conscience, I will not bother going to the abortion threads at this time to post links to some of the "religious tolerance" I've listened to here.
In short, some of us respect other peoples beliefs but are heartily sick of hearing about them.

[JC5123]

Tom, it's not often that I disagree with you, but in this case, I think you have crossed a line. One of the principle causes that we fight for, both in our daily lives, and here on this forum, is the freedom to say and believe what we wish. What you are doing is trying to stifle opinions with which you don't agree. While I may not agree with them we have to allow it. Remember the first amendment protects the speech that we DON'T agree with.

[Sponsor]

[twyacht]

Regardless of the "in-fighting" never forget WHO were the targets of

there is more we agree on than disagree, the hill to choose to die on is not this one.

We have a common threat and enemy. That would indiscriminately slaughter all of our children, parents, siblings, and spouses.

That is the true enemy. The demographics philw posted are correct, and my son, and his children will be facing the "stats" about the expansion of not just Muslims, but illegal immigrants as well.

Just my humble perspective, and one who is still stocking up on ammo.

[tombogan03884]

Tom, it's not often that I disagree with you, but in this case, I think you have crossed a line. One of the principle causes that we fight for, both in our daily lives, and here on this forum, is the freedom to say and believe what we wish. What you are doing is trying to stifle opinions with which you don't agree. While I may not agree with them we have to allow it. Remember the first amendment protects the speech that we DON'T agree with.

BS. I am simply pointing out that on a gun and politics forum I for one am sick of hearing these bible thumpers.( As opposed to those who simply worship as they see fit and allow others to do the same )

The part about "allowing others to do the same" is where these 2 fall short. There are many on here who have a very deep and sincere Faith, but they don't find it necessary to flaunt it in nearly every subject.

[Rastus]

BS. I am simply pointing out that on a gun and politics forum I for one am sick of hearing these bible thumpers.( As opposed to those who simply worship as they see fit and allow others to do the same )

The part about "allowing others to do the same" is where these 2 fall short. There are many on here who have a very deep and sincere Faith, but they don't find it necessary to flaunt it in nearly every subject.

I really would like to talk to you about this and discuss the things which you reference.  Cite them in context and we can discuss them. 

My unspoken request (perhaps the thing I do which annoys you) is that if one quotes the Bible (or some other document) when we disagree don't play it by memory.  You'll see many quotes I've made to make my point presented in the context I believe.   You can take it or leave it, but people should not say that such items do not exist and make a foundation on not knowing the document they claim to know.  Again, much of what people disagree about in the Bible (or Constitution, you're good with that one) which is allayed to interpretation is not interpretation but feeling.  Someone feels a particular way or sincerely believes a particular thing which is just not there.  Just acknowledge what's written and we can stop and continue to disagree on interpretation.  We can both agree that sincerity in a belief does not mean that belief has a foundation in fact supported by actual writing.

People can have a deep and sincere faith that the Bible says anyone that believes in any god or does good things and is not a rapist-murder makes them a Christian, but that does not mean it is in the Bible and is true.  I am offended whenever someone claims to know something that is not there...not an interpretation...and passes themselves off as a type of person they directly contradict and then refuses to acknowledge they are at total odds with wrtings.  Sort of like someone passing themselves of as an American when they support communism or a "living" Constitution, or "from each according to his ability and to each according to his need".

If you don't want to hear "Bible thumping", then fine block me out.  Don't expect me to do any less than you would do when you see someone claiming to know the Constitution who is not even acknowledging the document as it was written and that it is a living document with any part up for contemporary interpretation. 

You backed me up with Desert Marine and so did a lot of people.  Why are you angry at me about Desert Marine if you backed me up?  Do I need to look up that quote?

I don't want to be at odds with you and I won't if you'll let me.  If you want me to call and talk about it I'll call you.  What is it I have specifically done to you that has offended you and how can I fix it?  If you want me to leave you alone and never reference you here on the board or quote you...I'll do what you ask.  I am not picking, nor do I want to get into some flaming fight with you.  I've spoken my peace and it is finished at this point.

[tombogan03884]

 I have no real beef, I'm just sick of hearing you and Pathfinder using your particular version of Christianity as an argument in nearly every thread lately.
You are basing these arguments on a book written by men, and in the case of the KJV PAID for by men, based on documents held by an Organization of questionable integrity for several hundred years.
If you went to court with that "Chain of evidence" you would be laughed out of town.
And the fact that you can quote the Bible is meaningless as well, I can to, Chapter and verse, and I haven't been in a church in 40 years.
The attitude shown by you 2 is exactly why the "new age" religions, (Which mostly have their roots far earlier than Christianity) are doing so well at the expense of Christian Sects.

[Teresa Heilevang]

Well~~ 
 Haven't we got ourselves in a few pots of boiling water.. 
I've been gone ( I guess for too long) and several have ask that I "just peek in " and see whats going on in here with this thread..
**Taking a deep slow breath**.
 Lets see... I try really hard to stay out of any type of "Christina religious" talk...as personally I think it is..well... personal. And I tend to go overboard and get too heated up when it never accomplishes anything in the long run but hurtfulness. ..
and it always seems that everyone can argue and cuss and holler about the difference in clips and magazines.. 1911's and Glocks... difference in ammo etc.. and even some's more liberal vs conservative views on issues. and everyone is ok with that..
But just as soon as it touches on Religion (aka Bible Christianity etc).. the intolerance hackles start standing up. ( I have to be honest and tell you that mine do too)
But I just mentally at that time remove myself from the thread. Trust me.. I could jump in with both feet and write pages on rebuttals and my views etc.. but for what? Am I going to change anyone's religious views? And do I care? No and No. I know the people in here who share my views.. and I know the people who do not. I don't like or dislike them any more or any less on either end of the coin.

I guess my point is.. ( I've sat here 5 minutes and well.....I don't know what my point is I guess)
I don't have the answers but bear with me here please and you don't have to agree with me but just hear me out.

We all use "tools" that help us cope and deal with life's issues. Rastus and Pathfinder and many others use and look towards  the Book of the Bible to help them with their daily issues and their personal journey while they are here on Earth.
Others use other "tools" and guidance.
What works for one doesn't work for another. And in fact might actually have a negative effect.
I think everyone in here has every right to say what they want to ( IF they want to) but do not expect others to agree and think that what you write and believe will help them as it helps you.

I refuse to get in a bible debate with anyone.. unless the thread is specifically about that subject.. and also... I can argue facts all day long about it.. but ..again.................
. in the long run.. will I have really changed anyone's mind and does it really matter?... when their path and life chart is their own and mine is my own?

Politics is politics.... and religion is religion..
Lets all try to not sling out the names and adjectives to those who we vehemently disagree with. Disagree yes.. passionately  yes.. but lets try to leave the name calling alone..It doesn't accomplish anything.
Pleaseeeee??