What's the deal with BB self defense 12 gauge loads

[garand4life]

Some some of Remingtons Ultimate Home Defense loads here yesterday and was curious, how does BB loads compare to 00 buck in terms of loads for self defense in a home environment? Does it tend to be less over penetrating?

[tombogan03884]

Some some of Remingtons Ultimate Home Defense loads here yesterday and was curious, how does BB loads compare to 00 buck in terms of loads for self defense in a home environment? Does it tend to be less over penetrating?

Yes, the smaller pellets individually have less inertia so are less likely to penetrate walls.
At indoor distances it could be thought of as being "shotgun frangible".

[billt]

Over penetration is a viable concern in today's over litigated society. You are responsible for whatever happens when you pull the trigger. Many of today's homes are horrible for stopping most any kind of round capable of penetrating. I know there are these forums that test these things out like "Box-O-Truth", and the like. But I personally wouldn't stake my chances legally on some of that stuff. If they are wrong it will be your ass in the legal ringer.

My home is a cookie cutter, stucco exterior frame model, like so many here in the southwest and California. I could literally kick my way through an exterior wall with a pair of steel toed combat boots. That is why I keep my house shotgun loaded with Trap loads. 1 1/8 ounce of #8's at 1,200 FPS. A lot of people say that is not sufficient. "Bird shot is for the birds", and all that crap. Indoors the longest shot I could possible be faced with is around 20 feet. In that distance 1 1/8 ounces of lead is going to hit like a freight train. Yet the possibility that it could over penetrate into someone else's home is quite remote. Slugs and 00 buck are simply not needed.

Some years back my wife and I were shooting a round of trap at our local gun club. I was at station 2, and my wife at station 3. The fellow at station 1 had an accidental discharge when he closed his action. (Beretta A-390 semi auto). Luckily the gun was pointed at some evergreen shrubs about 10 feet away, on the side of the field. It completely sawed off a small evergreen that had a trunk about 4 inches in diameter! Had someone been standing in that same spot, it would have sawed their leg completely off. This was load of 1-1/8th ounce of #8 shot at 1,200 FPS. A standard Winchester AA Trap Load.  Bill T.

[bafsu92]

I agree completely, birdshot inside of 20 yards is pretty nasty. I had an ambulance run about 15 years ago where a guy was packing up for a hunting trip and had a ND with a 12ga O/U. His roommate was sitting about 10 feet away on the other side of the room and took a direct hit to the foot through a heavy hunting boot. He had little to know foot left and there wasn't enough to put back together even if we would've scraped the wall. I don't know if they ended up doing an amputation or reconfigured him in some form of club foot but he went from a size 12 to a size 6 or less real fast. I ran a lot of nasty calls over the 10 years or so I worked as a field paramedic but that was one of the top 10 on the nasty list. That same shot center mass would be a guaranteed stop for sure. The thing is none of those pellets even made it into the room next door, interior walls. I've kept 7.5 or 8 shot in my HD 12ga's ever since. I have a mix of buckshot and slugs in the side shell carriers etc and some may even have them as the 3rd or 4th shot in the tube but my first couple shots are always birdshot in the house.

[Timothy]

#7 Hi Speed Steel in my 870 that's currently residing next to my bed!

Do your own comparison on a sheet of plywood.  At across the room distances, you'll be more than convinced of what it will do. 

I've been hit by shot at distance in the woods during the small game season.  It hurts like hell from fifty or sixty yards through a canvas hunting vest.  From bad breath distance, it will make a nice little hole completely through a human being...I have no doubt!

[Sponsor]

[mkm]

I live in a small apartment, and the farthest distance I could possibly shoot in it is maybe 20 feet (under 10ft would be a more likely range).  I keep my shotgun loaded with #8 shot.  I had complete confidence in it before, but it makes me even more confident after reading your posts.  Thanks for bringing up this topic.

[2HOW]

I agree in the bird shot for close up. Just dont ever go over those close distances, its like hitting someone with a BB gun at longer distances, the spread is very big as you well know.

[blackwolfe]

Somewhere I remember reading that No. 6 shot for self defense loads for in the house distances was optimal, but I can't find it now.  If I remember correctly it was suppose to be a very good balance between knock down and overpenetration.

I too was hit once with a pellet.  It was a ricochet, and I believe it was  No.6 shot with a total distance of about 15-20 yards.  The pellet penetrated my denim overshirt and untucked tee shirt and then struck my heavy leather belt.  It raised a pretty good welt and stung like the dickens, enough so, that I was a little afraid to look at first.  I have no doubt that had it been a little higher or lower and not struck my belt, that it would have penetrated.

[Solus]

Too much spread can be a problem in some situations. 

I don't have experience with smaller shot loads at shorter ranges...30 ft or under...

How wide a pattern does #6 or so shot throw at those ranges.

What I'm thinking of is a hostage situation where the gunman is holding the hostage in front of him.

With buck you can aim at the outside of his outer ear and make the shot, but dispersion might be less than buck than with bird shot?

[garand4life]

In home, I'm not all too worried having to make a shot like that. If I were to need pinpoint accuracy I wouldn't be using a shotgun. That's just the reality of my situation. My concern is still penetration or rather over-penetration more than the pattern not maintaining a tight pattern. At the longest distance in my house there is probably nothing more than a 10 yard distance if that.