Author Topic: arms control treaty  (Read 3023 times)

fightingquaker13

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arms control treaty
« on: April 16, 2009, 09:14:39 PM »
This is from todays NYT.
FQ13

Obama to Push to Ratify Treaty on Gun Trafficking

Published: April 16, 2009
MEXICO CITY — President Obama, vowing to confront drug cartels that are “sowing chaos in our communities,” called Thursday for the Senate to ratify a long-stalled treaty aimed at curbing illegal arms trafficking. But Mr. Obama also suggested that he would not press lawmakers to revive an expired ban on assault weapons.

On the first day of a four-day swing through Latin America, Mr. Obama arrived here on Thursday afternoon for a visit that was intended to demonstrate what he called “a new era” in United States-Mexican relations and to show support for his Mexican counterpart, President Felipe Calderón. Stemming the rising tide of drug violence was the centerpiece of their agenda.

But while the two pledged their “shared responsibility” in the drug wars, they seemed to diverge on the issue of the assault weapons ban, which expired in 2004. Mr. Calderón said 90 percent of the weapons seized in Mexico can be traced to the United States, adding that the flow of weapons increased after the ban expired.

Mr. Obama campaigned on a platform of renewing it, but he suggested Thursday that reviving the ban was politically impossible because of opposition from gun enthusiasts. During a news conference with Mr. Calderón, the president said he thought there were more immediate ways to curb the flow of arms.

“None of us are under any illusion that reinstating that ban would be easy,” Mr. Obama said, while insisting he was “not backing off at all” from his conviction that renewing the ban made sense. Instead, he said he was taking other steps, including sending more border agents to patrol the border with Mexico and more helicopters to Mexico. He also said he was pressing the Senate to ratify the long-stalled inter-American arms treaty, which the United States had a major hand in negotiating through the Organization of American States.

The treaty, signed by President Bill Clinton, languished in the Senate, but went into effect in 1998 after two dozen other nations ratified it. The treaty seeks to crack down on illicit firearms by, among other things, establishing a system for the import, export and transfer of firearms, and by fostering cooperation among law enforcement agencies investigating illegal trafficking.

“It makes good policy sense,” said Peter DeShazo, a former senior State Department official who has advocated ratifying the pact. “It’s very hard for the United States to call on other countries to cooperate on controlling the flow of illegal arms if we haven’t ratified a major inter-American convention.”

But it was unclear what type of reception the treaty would receive now in Washington. Aides to Mr. Obama said he was working closely with Senator Harry Reid, the Democratic leader, to get the treaty ratified, but Mr. Reid issued a statement that offered no commitment to bring the treaty up for a vote.

On Capitol Hill, a senior Democratic official said that despite the president’s urging, it would be difficult to move forward on the long-stalled treaty given the Senate’s already crowded agenda, as well as a continuing Democratic reluctance to engage in a politically charged debate over guns. The National Rifle Association said Thursday that it would “continue to vigorously oppose any international effort to restrict the constitutional rights of law-abiding American gun owners.”

Since taking office, Mr. Obama and his aides have been working assiduously to carve out a Mexico policy that talks of “shared responsibility” in combating the drug problem. On Wednesday, the Obama administration announced stiff financial sanctions against members of three more Mexican drug cartels, designating them “kingpins” under a law that allows the American government to seize their assets.

In words that resounded on both sides of the border, Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton said in Mexico City last month that America’s “insatiable demand” for illegal drugs fueled the trade and that America’s “inability” to stop weapons from being smuggled south fed the violence. It is a marked shift in tone from previous administrations, and Mr. Obama used his visit here to reiterate the sentiment.

“I will not pretend that this is Mexico’s responsibility alone,” he said. “The demand for these drugs inside the United States is keeping these cartels in business.”

As if to underscore his point, the Mexican authorities reported Thursday that at least 15 drug cartel gunmen had been killed in a gun battle with army troops. One soldier was also reported killed in the clash, which took place in San Miguel Totolapan, about 125 miles southwest of Mexico City.

“For the last 30 years the United States has come down with the big sticks of eradication and helicopters, and the elephant in the room of our own consumption, and the tough proliferation of arms, were just never addressed,” said Julia E. Sweig, director of the Latin America program at the Council on Foreign Relations. “I think just beginning to talk about those things is going to buy him a lot of space down there.”

The drug violence is so intense here that in December, a Pentagon report warned that Mexico could be on the verge of becoming a failed state. Mr. Calderón dismissed that assertion in an interview on Wednesday with the ABC News program “Nightline.”

Mr. Obama comes here fresh from a much-publicized swing through Europe that put him squarely on the world stage. The Latin America trip, which will include a visit to Trinidad and Tobago, may not be as high profile; for one thing, the first lady, Michelle Obama, who added a touch of pizzazz to the Europe trip, stayed in Washington. But the president has made repairing relations with world leaders a signature of his foreign policy, and the visit is designed to give him a chance to do that in a region with which he is less familiar.

Mr. Obama was spending the night in Mexico before leaving for Port of Spain, Trinidad, to attend a gathering of leaders of Western Hemisphere nations.

Cuba is likely to be high on the agenda there. The White House announced this week that Mr. Obama was lifting longstanding restrictions on travel and remittances to the island, but some Latin American leaders want him to do more, and would like to see the United States lift its 47-year-old trade embargo with Cuba.

Mr. Obama said he had made a good faith effort to improve relations and was now looking for Cuba to demonstrate its willingness to make democratic reforms.

Larry Rohter contributed reporting.


PegLeg45

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Re: arms control treaty
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2009, 10:10:36 PM »

But while the two pledged their “shared responsibility” in the drug wars, they seemed to diverge on the issue of the assault weapons ban, which expired in 2004. Mr. Calderón said 90 percent of the weapons seized in Mexico can be traced to the United States, adding that the flow of weapons increased after the ban expired.


Yeah?

90% of illegals seized in the US can be traced back to Mexico....so I guess we're even.
"I expect perdition, I always have. I keep this building at my back, and several guns handy, in case perdition arrives in a form that's susceptible to bullets. I expect it will come in the disease form, though. I'm susceptible to diseases, and you can't shoot a damned disease." ~ Judge Roy Bean, Streets of Laredo

For the Patriots of this country, the Constitution is second only to the Bible for most. For those who love this country, but do not share my personal beliefs, it is their Bible. To them nothing comes before the Constitution of these United States of America. For this we are all labeled potential terrorists. ~ Dean Garrison

"When it comes to the enemy, just because they ain't pullin' a trigger, doesn't mean they ain't totin' ammo for those that are."~PegLeg

1911 Junkie

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Re: arms control treaty
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2009, 10:11:46 PM »
Yeah?

90% of illegals seized in the US can be traced back to Mexico....so I guess we're even.

Not a very fair trade.  :(
"I'd love to spit some Beechnut in that dudes eye and shoot him with my old .45"  Hank Jr.

fightingquaker13

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Re: arms control treaty
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2009, 10:12:21 PM »
Yeah?

90% of illegals seized in the US can be traced back to Mexico....so I guess we're even.
Can we trade?
FQ13

PegLeg45

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Re: arms control treaty
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2009, 10:14:43 PM »
Not a very fair trade.  :(

You got that right, I want the guns back.....the neighbors can mow their own grass.
"I expect perdition, I always have. I keep this building at my back, and several guns handy, in case perdition arrives in a form that's susceptible to bullets. I expect it will come in the disease form, though. I'm susceptible to diseases, and you can't shoot a damned disease." ~ Judge Roy Bean, Streets of Laredo

For the Patriots of this country, the Constitution is second only to the Bible for most. For those who love this country, but do not share my personal beliefs, it is their Bible. To them nothing comes before the Constitution of these United States of America. For this we are all labeled potential terrorists. ~ Dean Garrison

"When it comes to the enemy, just because they ain't pullin' a trigger, doesn't mean they ain't totin' ammo for those that are."~PegLeg

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Re: arms control treaty
« Reply #5 on: Today at 04:12:50 AM »

Steyr M40A1

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Re: arms control treaty
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2009, 11:39:08 PM »
Sorry but the 90% is a myth. Just ask the BATF.

In an unprecedented move, it seems our officials aren't being entirely truthful with the "facts and figures" that are being tossed around these days... http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/04/02/myth-percent-guns-mexico-fraction-number-claimed/

The short and sweet version:
Quote:
In 2007-2008, according to ATF Special Agent William Newell, Mexico submitted 11,000 guns to the ATF for tracing. Close to 6,000 were successfully traced -- and of those, 90 percent -- 5,114 to be exact, according to testimony in Congress by William Hoover -- were found to have come from the U.S.

But in those same two years, according to the Mexican government, 29,000 guns were recovered at crime scenes.

In other words, 68 percent of the guns that were recovered were never submitted for tracing. And when you weed out the roughly 6,000 guns that could not be traced from the remaining 32 percent, it means 83 percent of the guns found at crime scenes in Mexico could not be traced to the U.S.
But someone please think of the children! I don't care if only 17% of the guns in recovered in Mexico have US origins - Republicans need to get onboard for a ConCon so we can get this arcane 2nd Amendment abomination buried with the Founders...
Richard Cook

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"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well-armed lamb." Benjamin Franklin

Conagher 45

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Re: arms control treaty
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2009, 07:21:42 PM »
Sorry but the 90% is a myth. Just ask the BATF.

In an unprecedented move, it seems our officials aren't being entirely truthful with the "facts and figures" that are being tossed around these days... http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/04/02/myth-percent-guns-mexico-fraction-number-claimed/

The short and sweet version:
Quote:
In 2007-2008, according to ATF Special Agent William Newell, Mexico submitted 11,000 guns to the ATF for tracing. Close to 6,000 were successfully traced -- and of those, 90 percent -- 5,114 to be exact, according to testimony in Congress by William Hoover -- were found to have come from the U.S.

But in those same two years, according to the Mexican government, 29,000 guns were recovered at crime scenes.

In other words, 68 percent of the guns that were recovered were never submitted for tracing. And when you weed out the roughly 6,000 guns that could not be traced from the remaining 32 percent, it means 83 percent of the guns found at crime scenes in Mexico could not be traced to the U.S.
But someone please think of the children! I don't care if only 17% of the guns in recovered in Mexico have US origins - Republicans need to get onboard for a ConCon so we can get this arcane 2nd Amendment abomination buried with the Founders...
You mean our politicians have lied to us?  :o
There is room for all of God's creatures ....., That would be on my plate right next to the taters and gravy.

Steyr M40A1

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Re: arms control treaty
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2009, 08:07:43 PM »
You mean our politicians have lied to us?  :o

Scary I know. Now my whole world is upside down. :o
Richard Cook

"Keep your booger hook off the bang switch" -Babj615 Steyrclub.com

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well-armed lamb." Benjamin Franklin

tombogan03884

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Re: arms control treaty
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2009, 11:18:00 PM »
Oh gee , I'm really shocked, shocked I say, that a scumbag socialist from the Chicago dem machine (one of the 2 most corrupt party organizations in the country) who made his political name with weaseling and BS should engage in sneaking and encroaching on our rights, JUST LIKE ANYONE WITH HALF A BRAIN SAID HE WOULD. It's just amazing   ::)

Bet them Obamites (rhymes with sodomites ) are REAL proud of their boy now.

MikeBjerum

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Re: arms control treaty
« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2009, 05:15:20 PM »
How about we keep our PIF's and they send the drug cartel to talk to us  ;)  Or better yet - let them go talk to my neighbor and I'll send 165 grains of happiness their way.

I'd like an answer from down south concerning the illegal that was deported after getting caught in a traffic violation; damn near beat the green bus back; and then ran a stop sign, hit a school bus, and killed four students.  Or maybe the group that murdered a young man five miles from our home ... They had been arguing in front of our place minutes earlier and I didn't know what I could have been walking into when I went out with "big bertha" the spotting light and some other "toys" only to be seconds behind their departure from our driveway. (we live out of town, so voices on the yard are not only unexpected but unacceptable)

We're dieing at the hands of illegals up here!  I'm keeping my guns and willing to share ammo one bullet at a time!
If I appear taller than other men it is because I am standing on the shoulders of others.

 

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