Author Topic: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight  (Read 8356 times)

Badgersmilk

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Re: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight
« Reply #30 on: October 12, 2009, 02:59:07 PM »
I carried an AR for three months in the sand hole, trained with different ones 6 times (each FTF several times), and THANK GOD IN HEAVEN, NEVER had to use the turd to save my life!!!  Carried an AK in combat?  Oh, if you only knew how bad I would have liked to (in place of McNamara's curse).

My point is what POSSIBLE right does any of you have to blame our troops when YOU aren't there?!?  If ANY troop says he needs a different tool to save YOUR life and freedom what kind of half wit is going to tell him.  "Nope, your just to dumb to baby the piece of  $H#@ we gave you." ::)

So worried about bruising your own pride because you over paid for a poser POS that you'd have our troops loosing their lives to keep you from embarasment...   ::)

Between political payoff's and attitudes like this, little wonder Afganistan will be our third loss in a row, and UK newspapers talk about how the US continually makes fools of themselves in the world theater.

Not to worry, the military still has plenty of men to give their lives for you.  On your marry way.


tombogan03884

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Re: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight
« Reply #31 on: October 12, 2009, 04:24:59 PM »
 Another BM knows it all post, He finds it ridiculously easy to overlook the fact that "knower of all things, the great and infallible " BadgersMilk wasn't there either.    ::)

You carried an M16 for 3 whole months WOWWIE !  :o  Try 3 years. And you even TRAINED with it 6 times, GOLLY GOSH !   :o
 Try training others, every month for another 3 years.
You ask " what POSSIBLE right does any of you have to blame our troops when YOU aren't there?!?   '
        How about experience with both Marine Corps Marksmanship training, and Army "weapons familiarization" training.

Badgersmilk

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Re: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight
« Reply #32 on: October 12, 2009, 05:00:51 PM »
Really just to slow to get it huh?

It has nothing to do with me ::).  It has to do with ANYONE telling the guys doing the fighting that they can't have the right tools to do it with...  

Soooo, when your wrong, best thing to do is try to spin things and change the subject?  That's what's going on?   I refuse to believe anyone is just this hammer headed.   :-\  

So fine...  "Clearly the AR is the finest machine God has ever graced the earth with!  We are lucky to die at the hands of it's malfunctions and short comings!  Thank goodness so many of us have wasted spent thousands of dollars buying these wonderfull, wonderfull, pieces of...  Art!"  :)

Brain washing complete:  HEIL THE AR!



I'm now off to write:  "I will follow the herd, no matter how mindless and misled they may be." 1,000 times.

tombogan03884

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Re: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight
« Reply #33 on: October 12, 2009, 06:06:48 PM »
 Another factless tirade from the BM.

Ho Hum.

Are you SURE your not a liberal ?   ::)

Matthew Carberry

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Re: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight
« Reply #34 on: October 12, 2009, 07:10:25 PM »
A two hour fight by a platoon-sized element?

Where was the air and arty support and where was the reaction force?   

Who left those guys out there to swing in the breeze?

That's the question that needs answering, not "why aren't we issuing impossible fantasy guns".

Matthew Carberry

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Re: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight
« Reply #35 on: Today at 12:11:25 AM »

ratcatcher55

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Re: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight
« Reply #35 on: October 13, 2009, 08:54:53 AM »
From John Farnam DTI Quips:

11 Oct 09

The problem that won't go away!

Despite the Pentagon's, and the Administration's, best efforts to quash it, news leaked from Afghanistan yesterday about issue-M4s failing their users.  These unhappy first-hand reports see the light of day every so often, only to be promptly denied, dismissed, and quickly buried by a gaggle of star-wearers and politicians alike.  From wherever they started their career, star-wearers of today teethed on the M16 and its succeeding variants  (like the current M4).  Most have never known another rifle, nor another cartridge.

The autochthonous inadequacy of the 5.56X45 (223) round, in its current role at a main-battle cartridge, has been well known, and generally acknowledged, for over forty years.  Every conceivable attempt has been made to "upgrade" this cartridge.  None have been successful enough to justify retaining it.  Yes, it is still with us.

The maintenance-sensitive Stoner System is light, but that attribute is one of the few to recommend it.  Gas-piston systems, as embodied in the SIG/556, XCR, and others, albeit heavier, have demonstrated themselves to be significantly superior in terms of both reliability and durability.

Unfortunately, adopting a new rifle, chambered for the same, tired 223 round, only solves half the problem.  We must have a new cartridge, with range and penetration worthy of a main-battle weapon, combined with a new, gas-piston rifle.

The worn-out argument of "re-training" on a new rifle doesn't stand up. During the M16's tenure, we've gone through several generations of vehicles, anti-tank weapons, pistols, field-rations, and a host of other personal gear.  And yet, acquiring the next generation of main-battle rifles has somehow become an interminable, impenetrable barrier!

For the cost of a single F22, we could re-arm, and re-train, the entire Corps of Infantry!

Maybe this time?

/John


Badgersmilk

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Re: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight
« Reply #36 on: October 13, 2009, 08:18:47 PM »
Git'em Tom!  Clearly a non-conformist!!!  :o

Anybody notice we've lost every military conflict since the AR was introduced?  I know, I know,   ::)  Just saying!  ;D

Pretty sweet track record for down the road "best and worst weapons ever" type reviews.   ;D ;D ;D

long762range

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Re: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight
« Reply #37 on: October 13, 2009, 08:35:22 PM »
I talked to my son who returned from Iraq about 6 weeks ago.  He carried a Colt m-4 so I asked him why he thought the M-249 and the M-4s failed.   He believed that probably the men in the platoon had not been doing their weapons upkeep adequately.
The fine dust impregnates everything.  If the weapon is not correctly cleaned, daily, the system will gum up and fail.  He said the no M-4 should fail after 12 magazines fired in a 30 minute time period.  That is only 12 rounds per minute. 

A second reason he believe the weapons may have failed was damaged magazines.   Many of the magazines he used were in very poor shape.
"If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous.  If I have a gun, what in the hell do I have to be paranoid for."

twyacht

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Re: Weapons failed US troops during Afghan firefight
« Reply #38 on: October 13, 2009, 08:42:37 PM »
FWIW has anyone reviewed the ARES Shrike?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiVoEL5Z4Go&NR=1

The Ares Defense Shrike 5.56 is an air cooled, dual-feed weapon that fires the 5.56x45mm NATO cartridge. The Shrike 5.56 can be supplied as a complete weapon.

The music is the new S*** , will it make a difference???

Thomas Jefferson: The strongest reason for the people to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against the tyranny of government. That is why our masters in Washington are so anxious to disarm us. They are not afraid of criminals. They are afraid of a populace which cannot be subdued by tyrants."
Col. Jeff Cooper.

Harmony Hermit

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