Terror Attack Stopped By Passengers On Detroit Flight

[tombogan03884]

 El Al also has armed "Sky Marshals" who WILL shoot you on most, if not all air craft. their planes are also equiped with flare dispensers and other counter measures.
TAB is dead right about the menace to refineries, while I lived in Ca. 2 of the 5 area refineries were down for repairs, when a third had an explosion that killed some maintenance workers it was forced to close for repairs. I don't know what the effect was nation wide but locally gas prices nearly doubled.

as for protecting against terrorist attacks, forget it, it can not be done, the best you can hope for is to complicate their planning to the point it is not worth it. however, suicide bombers are not concerned with escape so that eliminates half their problems.
As others have mentioned, if all your defenses are up front as TSA has theirs set up, even if they ARE to stupid to make their approach through the employee angle, you have still assembled a large tempting target for them, people still remember the Lod air port massacre after nearly 40 years. And yes, news reports are the terrorists friend as front page stories with photo's of torn and bleeding bodies stay in the memories of people who may find themselves in the same situation (standing in the Check in line during rush hour) 2 people stabbed on page one has terror value than a vaporized city covered as a 1 inch blurb on page 37B.

[philw]

http://www.news.com.au/world/al-qaeda-plot-to-blow-up-us-plane-fails/story-e6frfkyi-1225813733415

THE United States has reportedly known for years that the suspect in the attack could have terrorist ties.

AN official briefed on the attack on a Detroit airliner says the US has known for at least two years that the suspect in the attack could have terrorist ties.

The official said that the suspect, Umar Farouk Abdul Mutallab, has been on a list that includes people with known or suspected contact or ties to a terrorist or terrorist organisation.

He spoke on condition of anonymity because the investigation is ongoing.

The Terrorist Identities Datamart Environment list is maintained by the US National Counterterrorism Centre. It includes about 550,000 names.

People on that list are not necessarily on the no-fly list. US Representative Peter King said Mr Mutallab was not on the no-fly list, Associated Press has reported.

Mr King, a Republican on the House Homeland Security Committee, said no federal air marshals were on the flights from Nigeria to Amsterdam and from Amsterdam to Detroit. Mutallab did not go through full-body image screening at either airport, the congressman said.

Democratic Representative Bennie Thompson, the chairman of the House Homeland Security Committee, said Mr Mutallab would have been re-screened at the Amsterdam airport after his flight from Nigeria.

Mr Thompson and others say the Amsterdam airport has long had a good reputation for security.

He said he plans to hold a hearing in January about the incident.

"It's still safe to fly,'' Mr Thompson said.

The incident occurred as Northwest Airlines Flight 253, an Airbus 330 carrying 278 passengers, was making its final descent to the American city of Detroit.

It started with a noise, then a burst of flame, then a brave passenger rushed down the aisle and tackled a suspected terrorist as a packed airplane descended towards the airport on Christmas Day.

"There was a pop. And everybody got a little bit startled. And then we looked around and saw nothing," said Syed Jafry, who was sitting three rows behind the suspected terrorist.

"After a few seconds or so, then there was a little bit of light, a little bit of, kind of flame-ish light and there was fire. And people began to panic almost. And everybody was rushing towards that area and tried to get water, a blanket and fire extinguisher."

People nearby tried to put the flame out, but it went a bit higher.

A young man three or four rows behind Jafry did not panic, however.

"He took care of that suspect. He handled him pretty good," Mr Jafry told CNN.

"There was a little bit, obviously, of a struggle. And I think he took it under control."

The incident could have been "catastrophic," Mr King said.

US media, citing a federal security bulletin, said the man told investigators he had acquired the explosive d was conducting additional screening.

"All passengers de-planed and out of an abundance of caution the plane was moved to a remote area where the plane and all the baggage are currently being re-screened," the agency said in a statement.

 Incident an attempted terrorist attack - US

White House officials and US lawmakers said the incident was a terror attack and President Barack Obama, on vacation with his family in Hawaii, ordered increased security measures after being briefed on the attempt.

"We believe this was an attempted act of terrorism," a senior White House official said, speaking on condition of anonymity.

Mr Obama held a secure conference call with his Homeland Security and Counter-terrorism Advisor John Brennan, and National Security Council chief of staff Denis McDonough.

Mr Obama "instructed that all appropriate measures be taken to increase security for air travel," the White House said.

"The President is actively monitoring the situation and receiving regular updates," the statement read.

Delta co-operating with authorities

Susan Elliott, a spokeswoman for Delta, Northwest's parent company, said: "The passenger was immediately subdued and Delta is cooperating with authorities in the investigation."

Ms Elliott said that some passengers received minor injuries, including the person who sparked the incident.

She said the description of the item the passenger had tried to ignite came from other passengers, and was unable to comment on a report from ABC News that the item was a "powdery substance" rather than a firework.

The flight landed safely at Detroit Metropolitan Airport overnight and authorities were investigating.

"The passengers are being questioned as part of the investigation and the plane is being searched for similar reasons," Ms Elliott said.

[fullautovalmet76]

One observation and one comment:

NBC news reported tonight that the terrorist used PETN, an explosive used by the military. Is this explosive used exclusively by the military or is it readily available in other forms? I think it is curious he had an explosive that is normally used by the military(ies) with him.

And what rights are we willing to give up now to be "secure"? Is it time for the mother of all "Patriot Acts"? In the same broadcast they mentioned the terrorist was on a "terrorist watch list", not the no-fly list. He was considered to very low level, but their assessment was wrong, I suppose.

I believe we will be told in the coming days that more screening and aggressive intelligence gathering techniques need to be authorized so they make sure this kind of thing doesn't happen again. It's time to get rid of this police state that has been constructed over the past 70 years. It's time to get our freedoms back. The price we are paying is not worth it to me.

[tombogan03884]

I agree completely, if some one is determined to hit a target and does not care about escape then it doesn't matter if you have guards shoulder to shoulder all the way around it, it can be hit.
I'm not positive but I think PETN is also used in commercial blasting, there are also huge quantities of military ordnance of every description floating around since the fall of the Soviet Union, good Commanders were selling equipment to feed their troops, the majority were getting rich while the troops went with out payback in the late 90's there were news reports about American intelligence tracking a Soviet nuke from it's storage location into Iran, No reports of it being intercepted.
The last attack I heard of on an El Al airliner was a few years ago 2 Palistinians launched a Soviet SA7 surface to air missile at one on its approach to Romes airport.
That doesn't take into account leftovers from the tons of stuff we supplied the Afghans with in the 80's, or what China or N Korea will sell to any one with cash. Military equipment , from ammo to aircraft, tanks, and even ships, are one of the 3 most common types of contraband on the international black market, the other 2 being women and drugs.

[twyacht]

People nearby tried to put the flame out, but it went a bit higher.

A young man three or four rows behind Jafry did not panic, however.

"He took care of that suspect. He handled him pretty good," Mr Jafry told CNN.

"There was a little bit, obviously, of a struggle. And I think he took it under control."

The future of hijacking American Flights in a post 9/11 world. We will put you out and kick your ass as we do so.

The shoebomber, boxcutter , terrorist approach won't work anymore. Too many pissed off passengers, delayed, missed their connection, and a punk with an IED or blade, is going to get what he deserves.

[Sponsor]

[TAB]

Pentaerythritoltetranitrate ( PETN) can be made at home with chemicals that can be found in just about any chem lab.

you only need 6 things to make it

nitric acid
sulpheric acid
actone
Pentaerythritol
water
bicarb of soda


I'm sure a quick google search and you could get exact spects and proceedures.



Yeah its another one of those things the US goverment, payed for me to learn.  you would be amazed at what you can make explosives from.

[fightingquaker13]

Pentaerythritoltetranitrate ( PETN) can be made at home with chemicals that can be found in just about any chem lab.

you only need 6 things to make it

nitric acid
sulpheric acid
actone
Pentaerythritol
water
bicarb of soda


I'm sure a quick google search and you could get exact spects and proceedures.



Yeah its another one of those things the US goverment, payed for me to learn.  you would be amazed at what you can make explosives from.

Who the hell names this stuff? Is it like some geek macho thing to see if you can actually pronounce it? I get the utility of putting the compound in the title but sheesh.
FQ13

[TAB]

Who the hell names this stuff? Is it like some geek macho thing to see if you can actually prounce it? I get the utility of putting the compound in the title but sheesh.
FQ13

I just call it PETN.  Chemistry is just like that.

[Tyler Durden]

TAB wrote:

Pentaerythritoltetranitrate ( PETN) can be made at home with chemicals that can be found in just about any chem lab.

you only need 6 things to make it

nitric acid
sulpheric acid
actone
Pentaerythritol
water
bicarb of soda

The last I had heard was that google does keep  track of which IP addresses are searching for whatever key words.

Just an FYI....

That bicarb of soda...MAN!...that is some handy stuff to keep around....

[gixxer1974]

One observation and one comment:

NBC news reported tonight that the terrorist used PETN, an explosive used by the military. Is this explosive used exclusively by the military or is it readily available in other forms? I think it is curious he had an explosive that is normally used by the military(ies) with him.

And what rights are we willing to give up now to be "secure"? Is it time for the mother of all "Patriot Acts"? In the same broadcast they mentioned the terrorist was on a "terrorist watch list", not the no-fly list. He was considered to very low level, but their assessment was wrong, I suppose.

I believe we will be told in the coming days that more screening and aggressive intelligence gathering techniques need to be authorized so they make sure this kind of thing doesn't happen again. It's time to get rid of this police state that has been constructed over the past 70 years. It's time to get our freedoms back. The price we are paying is not worth it to me.

I for one Am not willing to give up any rights  in the name of "nanny state" style safety. I understand that certin things pose risk and am willing to accept that risk for my freedoms. I understand that 1 in a million flights are subject to attempts at terrorism and accept te risk when I chose to fly. instead of giving 18 and 19 year old kids the job of bottlenecking me at a checkpoint and "looking for suspects without profileing anybody" let the people with cwp carry guns on flights and see how fast a hijacker ends up dead and the plane lands just fine. I accept the risk eveytime I  get in a car and drive, every time I pick up a gun, evey time I put my boat in water and head to the middle of a river or lake, and every time I put a leg over my motorcycle and head out. I don't need a bunch of my freedoms revoked to protect me then and I don't need more freedom revoked to fly tolas vegas or to arizona either.