might want to check this out about ammo

[GUNS-R-US]

And once again, all the links and cases came from Masaad Ayoob.

Tyler, I don't get what your issues are with Massad Ayoob?? He's a expert in the field of S.D. and has a lot of credentials to back up what he says. His name does come up a lot because it's a small field. Not to many other folks out their have put forth the kind of effort he has. I think I could understand your decent with him, if what he was saying didn't have some logical since to it, but it does make good logical since to me. I guess I can't figure why you seem to dislike someone who has done so much for the firearms community?

[Tyler Durden]

Okay. let me put it in a context...let's say you did a google search for say "global warming".

You went to one link, then another link and then another and all those links went back and cited Al Gore, what would you think then?

[Tyler Durden]

Not to mention that of those 3 or 4 cases mentioned or cited by Ayoob, only one was even close to a self-defense shooting.

By the attitude or tone of this widespread "don't use reloads for self-defense" myth, you would think that you couldn't swing a dead cat in any court house in the land and NOT hit a "defendant" who was implicated because he used his reloads in some self-defense shooting.

There are some other internet myths I would like to disspell too:

1.  you can't reload steel cased ammo

2.  the smoke from cast lead boolits is caused by the lube

3.  beretta slides will break in two and smack you in the mouth

4.  you can't shoot lead boolits out of Glocks

[fightingquaker13]

Not to mention that of those 3 or 4 cases mentioned or cited by Ayoob, only one was even close to a self-defense shooting.

By the attitude or tone of this widespread "don't use reloads for self-defense" myth, you would think that you couldn't swing a dead cat in any court house in the land and NOT hit a "defendant" who was implicated because he used his reloads in some self-defense shooting.

There are some other internet myths I would like to disspell too:

1.  you can't reload steel cased ammo

2.  the smoke from cast lead boolits is caused by the lube

3.  beretta slides will break in two and smack you in the mouth

4.  you can't shoot lead boolits out of Glocks

Tyler
I don't know whether you're trying to stir the pot (in which case good on you because its boring when we agree) or whether you actually believe this stuff. I will only address point 4. I have owned three Glocks and put multiple thousands of rounds through them over the years with failures measured at less than a dozen rounds. The manual says don't shoot lead and don't shoot reloads. I don't shoot lead and I don't shoot reloads and guess what? My failure rate is, over the 16 years I have owned Glocks, well less than one in 2,000 ronds, considering that is about my yearly average with one of my hand guns. You may use your lead boolits to your hearts content and I will not say you nay. However, before you stir the pot on technical stff, if you are going against the manual, you might want to provide some reason (empirical or theoretical) to support you. Its not my job to prove the manual is right (though I do offer anecdotal evidence), its yours to prove it wrong. I won't even get into a discussion of the Glock barrel rifling and how it effects lead as I'm sure Eric or someone else will make the theoretical case for me. All I state here is that I have sent an a#$load of factory jacketed ammo down range with near zero problems. Draw your own conclusions.
FQ13

[Tyler Durden]

FW wrote:

I don't know whether you're trying to stir the pot

Oh... I wouldn't call it so much stirring the pot.  I would call it seeking the truth or disspelling internet rumors/myths.

As far as the lead bullets in Glock things go, we have one local shooter at the steel matches who shoots a Glock with a factory barrel and he shoots lead bullets.  During the summer months when the weather is nice, we will shoot 8 stages.  About halfway through the match, he will run a boresnake through the gun a few times.  Then he will rejoin the squad and get back to shooting his lead bullets.

So...it is anectdotal.

[Sponsor]

[GUNS-R-US]

Okay. let me put it in a context...let's say you did a google search for say "global warming".

You went to one link, then another link and then another and all those links went back and cited Al Gore, what would you think then?

I think you can find plenty of info proving Al Gore to be an idiot. I don't think you'll find much calling Massad Ayoob anything of the sort!

[fightingquaker13]

I think you can find plenty of info proving Al Gore to be an idiot. I don't think you'll find much calling Massad Ayoob anything of the sort!

ROFL! +10 Guns
FQ13

[1911 Junkie]

I think you can find plenty of info proving Al Gore to be an idiot. I don't think you'll find much calling Massad Ayoob anything of the sort!

Didn't take long. 

http://www.firearmstactical.com/tacticalbriefs/2006/04/03/0604-03a.htm

[tt11758]

Here, I think, is the bottom line.  Tyler, shoot whatever you want, for whatever you want.  As for me, I'll find other ways and places to cut expenses that does NOT involve the defense of me and mine.  Hopefully I'll never use it, much like I'll hopefully never use my car or homeowner's insurance.  Doesn't mean I don't buy any.

I'm more comfortable with factory loads for SD.  And if it comes down to accepting the expertise of Mas Ayoob vs that of Tyler Durdan, I think I'll stick with Mas, thank you very much.     YMMV

[Tyler Durden]

You didn't click on the link 1911 Junkie posted, did you?

 

As far as the car insurance thing goes, well, that is a red herring or specious argument because by law you have to have insurance to drive legally.

As far as homeowner's insurance goes, unless you paid cold hard cash on the barrel head, then yeah, the bank or the mortgage company is going to force you to have some sort of insurance.

Another specious argument.