Author Topic: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout  (Read 3801 times)

sledgemeister

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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #10 on: June 16, 2010, 11:05:14 PM »
Pardon moi for butting in, but havent you bloody yanks learnt anything from Australia and its BS gun laws?

The slippery slope of doing deals and back yard politics is what set about us losing our auto and high calibre firearms and a set of draconian laws that we may never recover from.
Our equivalent (although I am loathed to say it) the SSAA done deals with Howard in 96 and again in 2003 because they only cared about "their" members and the disciplines that they supported and the rest basically was told Go #$# yaselfs.
They were in the best position to force the hand of the governement of the time to consider the implications of its actions yet they cowered in the corner like a pack of pussies, instead of standing up and uniting all firearm owners in one common goal.

Be warned if this occurs it will be the beginning of a long and hard fight to get back what is rightfully yours!
I'm all in favor of keeping dangerous weapons out of the hands of fools. Let's start with typewriters. - Solomon Short

MikeBjerum

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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #11 on: June 17, 2010, 12:55:47 AM »
From reading other sources, and from trying to read the bill itself, this appears to be another one of those "selective anti-free speech" bill that have been popular with a certain political mind set over the last decade or so.  They have tried it with religious, or should I say Christian, broadcasters and churches, and they just keep trying and trying with anyone they don't like.  This one appears to read that it is gun "lobby" specific, and is designed to specifically shut the NRA out.

I'm sure someone much smarter than me will have insight, but that is what I understand as of this hour.
If I appear taller than other men it is because I am standing on the shoulders of others.

fightingquaker13

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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #12 on: June 17, 2010, 01:27:53 AM »
You are exactly right. Though those same "opressed" Christian broadcasters have gone after everything from Playboy to NPR. Its just another case of "free speech for me and not for thee". The NRA is trying to be part of the "Me" here. Honestly, I kind of admire them for it. They are sticking to their mission of defending the 2A,  and understand that we aren't paying them to be martyrs to the 1A, just the 2A. That said, grow a pair and see the bigger picture. The good news is that this bill, even if passed, because every lobbying group across the spectrum hates it, will die an ugly death in the Courts. What the NRA, and doubtless the Brady bunch are doing is seeking political advantage. They are trying to hobble their enemies and remain free. The statists are laughing. They see the sheep seeking to negotiate a "seperate peace". They are playing a game of divide and conquer and doing it well. Thing is, the odds of this passing judicial scrutiny are slim. No justice but Alito will like this bill, and it wouldn't surprise me if even he said enough. Still it shouldn't pass.  
FQ13

MikeBjerum

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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #13 on: June 17, 2010, 02:01:30 AM »
Damn ... I hate it when he agrees with me!
If I appear taller than other men it is because I am standing on the shoulders of others.

fightingquaker13

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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #14 on: June 17, 2010, 06:26:36 AM »
Damn ... I hate it when he agrees with me!
Sorry, it happens from time to time. But in Quaker's perfect world the NRA, the ACLU, the American Center for Law and Justice would all be fighting toghther (not seperately) against this thing. Unfortunately, the political system rewards short term thinking. Folks govern for the next election, not the next generation. So folks that should be natural allies on at least a few issues wind up being divided and weakened to the detriment of all. :'(
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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #15 on: Today at 07:45:28 PM »

Woody

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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #15 on: June 18, 2010, 03:00:54 PM »
I suggest the GOA, JPFO, SAF or CCRKBA. If only they had merged together as an unstoppable force for our rights. At this point, the NRA seems comprimised.

ratcatcher55

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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #16 on: June 18, 2010, 03:15:35 PM »
Sledge & Woody +1

It would appear the NRA would deal with the devil to protect it's interest (fundraising $$$) over the constitional rights of other groups to free speach.

Sad.

Gerry

twyacht

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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #17 on: June 20, 2010, 08:07:13 AM »
Received this from the NRA-ILA Should clear things up.

NRA-ILA GRASSROOTS ALERT
Vol. 17, No. 24      06/18/10
Statement From NRA-ILA Executive Director
Chris W. Cox On H.R. 5175, The "DISCLOSE Act"

Click here to vote in this week's poll.

I appreciate the concerns that some NRA members have raised regarding our position on H.R. 5175, the "DISCLOSE Act."  Regrettably, our position has been misstated by some and intentionally misrepresented by others.  I hope you'll allow me to provide the proper context.

The U.S. Supreme Court's Citizens United decision was a significant victory for free speech and the Constitution. The NRA filed a strong brief in that case, which the Court specifically cited several times in its opinion.  The DISCLOSE Act is an attempt to reverse that victory and that's why we told Congress we oppose it.

The NRA has never supported -- nor would we ever support -- any version of this bill.  Those who suggest otherwise are wrong.


The restrictions in this bill should not apply to anyone or to any organization. My job is to ensure they don't apply to the NRA and our members.  Without the NRA, the Second Amendment will be lost and I will do everything in my power to prevent that.


We believe that any restriction on political speech is repugnant. But some of our critics believe we should put the Second Amendment at risk over a First Amendment principle to protect other organizations. That's easy to say -- unless you have a sworn duty to protect the Second Amendment above all else, as I do. 

The NRA is a single-issue organization made up of millions of individual members dedicated to protecting the Second Amendment. We do not represent the interests of other organizations.  Nor do all groups fight all issues together.  For example, we didn't support the U.S. Chamber of Commerce when it backed amnesty for tens of millions of illegal aliens and we did not join the Chamber in its support of President Obama's stimulus bill.  And we've been in direct opposition when the Chamber has tried to restrict Second Amendment rights in publicly accessible parking lots.

Rather than focusing on opposing this bill, some have encouraged people to blame the NRA for this Congress's unconstitutional attack on free speech. That's a shame. If you oppose this bill, I hope you will contact your Member of Congress and Senators so they can hear from you.

Statement From David Keene, NRA First
Vice-President On H.R. 5175, The "DISCLOSE Act"


I have been an NRA Board member for some years and currently serve as NRA's First Vice-President -- that you may know.  What you may not know is that I have been in the forefront of the fight against liberal attempts to tilt the political playing field their way for decades through what they like to call campaign finance reform.  This is a battle that began in the seventies when I put together the case that went to the United States Supreme Court known as Buckley v. Valeo.  I was a vocal opponent of the so-called McCain-Feingold "reforms" that shackled groups like the NRA in recent years, and I have served as a First Amendment Fellow at Vanderbilt University's Freedom Forum.

I can assure you that I would never countenance a "deal" of the sort you think the NRA made with Congress to further Democratic attempts to restrict political speech.  I consider such restrictions to be not only repugnant, but blatantly unconstitutional, an opinion shared by NRA Executive Vice President Wayne LaPierre and Institute for Legislative Action Executive Director Chris Cox.


The so-called "DISCLOSE ACT" is a horrible piece of legislation designed to do exactly what you suggest.  It would require advocacy groups to run a regulatory gauntlet designed to make it very difficult for many of them to play the role for which they were formed and is both bad policy and flies in the face of recent Supreme Court decisions.


But I'm afraid there's more . particularly how it would affect the NRA.  When you think of the NRA you no doubt think mostly about the NRA's advocacy on Second Amendment issues, but the NRA also provides training to its members, law enforcement and military personnel, works with states, counties and private organizations to build ranges and runs competitive events such as those at Camp Perry in Ohio.  Since Camp Perry is a military base, public monies go into range development and federal funds go to training military and police personnel, the NRA would be classed with government contractors and TARP recipients under the DISCLOSE ACT as originally written and effectively prohibited from engaging in any meaningful political activity.

Last week Democratic leadership in the House capitulated by agreeing to exempt the NRA from the act -- not in return for NRA support, but to avoid a political war that might cost them even more seats this fall.


I have to tell you that I never thought the Democrats would agree to this -- not because they have much regard for constitutional rights -- because I didn't believe their left wing would allow it.  The events since their capitulation convince me that their fear of NRA retaliation forced them to take steps that split their coalition and could easily doom the whole bill.

Consider this: on Thursday night, California Senator Diane Feinstein, one of the most anti-Second Amendment members of the Senate, announced that she wouldn't support the DISCLOSE ACT if it exempted the NRA.  By Friday some two-dozen left wing activist groups that had previously been pressing Congress to pass the bill announced that now they wanted it defeated.


The bottom line is that in refusing to risk its members' rights and the very survival of the Second Amendment, the NRA has also made it less rather than more likely that support for this terrible legislation will collapse and the free speech rights of every one of us will benefit.

*****

I think that should about clarify things, and those that rushed to judgement, well get all the facts before making a knee jerk reaction.

IMHO.

Thomas Jefferson: The strongest reason for the people to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against the tyranny of government. That is why our masters in Washington are so anxious to disarm us. They are not afraid of criminals. They are afraid of a populace which cannot be subdued by tyrants."
Col. Jeff Cooper.

PegLeg45

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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #18 on: June 20, 2010, 07:04:31 PM »
Thanks TW.
The way the OP article was written seemed vague, and even writings by NRA reps made it appear that they were poised on the fence. I'm glad that my first gut feeling was right. I wish the NRA-ILA had made this issue more clear in the beginning.
Now I feel like a dirty liberal flip-flopper................I should have stuck to my guns............  ;) ;D
"I expect perdition, I always have. I keep this building at my back, and several guns handy, in case perdition arrives in a form that's susceptible to bullets. I expect it will come in the disease form, though. I'm susceptible to diseases, and you can't shoot a damned disease." ~ Judge Roy Bean, Streets of Laredo

For the Patriots of this country, the Constitution is second only to the Bible for most. For those who love this country, but do not share my personal beliefs, it is their Bible. To them nothing comes before the Constitution of these United States of America. For this we are all labeled potential terrorists. ~ Dean Garrison

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Fatman

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Re: Statement From The National Rifle on H.R. 5175 Sellout
« Reply #19 on: June 22, 2010, 05:46:46 PM »
Quote
Efforts to curb special interests in elections fizzle
June 21, 2010    Byline: Fredreka Schouten      USA TODAY

WASHINGTON - A high-profile effort by President Obama and top Democrats to clamp down on special ­interest spending in elections has faltered, nearly six months after a Supreme Court ruling cleared the way for unlimited corporate and union spending on independent campaign ads.

Action on a bill in Congress that aims to shine more light on such spending stalled after top House Democrats agreed to exempt the powerful National Rifle Association and other large non-profits from new disclosure rules.

"All restriction on political speech is repugnant," Wayne LaPierre, executive vice president of the gun owners' group, told USA TODAY.

"Am I happy that the NRA's tongue is not cut for the 2010 ... elections? Absolutely," he said. "Do we still think this bill is unconstitutional? Absolutely."

To read the full story click here
Anti: I think some of you gentleman would choose to apply a gun shaped remedy to any problem or potential problem that presented itself? Your reverance (sic) for firearms is maintained with an almost religious zeal. The mind boggles! it really does...

Me: Naw, we just apply a gun-shaped remedy to those extreme life threatening situations that call for it. All the less urgent problems we're willing to discuss.

 

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